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Well I finished Voyager, season 1, episode 8: "Emanations" It's one of the worst ones yet. The concept is like, kind of trekish, since it explores a culture learning that their religion is bullshit. But it doesn't actually explore anything. Basically nothing happens in the episode. The whole thing is super wishy-washy. The best part is that they revive the one alien chick that they find who just died, and she freaks out but eventually they explain to her what's going on and she calms down. They get her to go along with this plan to find where the subspace bullshits or whatever go to so they can find Harry Kim (why?) and they are beaming her into it and it doesn't work and she dies. That's it. Just, whoops, she's dead. Oh well. I think it would have been pretty cool if the aliens were really in another dimension and the reality that all of star trek takes place in was their legit afterlife. It would have been way more interesting than "oh no, they have religious beliefs that aren't true, but maybe they are in a way because 'mysterious energy signatures'"
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Jul 10, 2014 04:32
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Nessus posted:Hey the mafia planet episode loving ruled. They should've made one of the people from that planet a recurring character elsewhere. To be fair, I love those three episodes I mentioned. They are all hilarious and enjoyable. But they are nowhere near approaching objectively good television.
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Jul 10, 2014 04:35
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But the first season of TNG was legitimately cringeworthy.
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Jul 10, 2014 04:36
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Nothus Infelix posted:Google Groups is kind of annoying to search, but there is heming and hawing to be had. Excerpts from a 1987 thread: Good lord. Considering this came out the year U2 released Joshua Tree, long before the Internet really even was close to what it is today. It's passable as a post even 
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Jul 10, 2014 04:38
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Arglebargle III posted:But the first season of TNG was legitimately cringeworthy. I can say from first-hand experience that it was much, much less so in 1987. TNG was like nothing else on television at that point, much like TOS had been in the sixties.
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Jul 10, 2014 04:41
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R-Type posted:Good lord. Considering this came out the year U2 released Joshua Tree, long before the Internet really even was close to what it is today. It's passable as a post even Yeah, that 1987 post is amazeballs.  I mean, it even ends on the guy saying "I give it one season, tops"! It could've been made yesterday on these very forums!EDIT: Ahahaha! quote:Well, I seem to be the only one in Ontario saying that I liked DrSunshine fucked around with this message at 05:12 on Jul 10, 2014 |
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Jul 10, 2014 05:08
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Yeah these rule.
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Jul 10, 2014 05:24
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Was any of TNG effectively kept secret until it premiered? Like, did they manage to keep the Ent-D under wraps until people saw it on TV and went  , or was it a "shout it from the rooftops as soon as we have something that looks halfway done in photos" sort of thing?
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Jul 10, 2014 05:48
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Cythereal posted:And just to round things out, have the Klingon dyson tech ship. I thought this said "Klingon discotheque ship" and now I'm sad.
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Jul 10, 2014 05:54
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Vagabundo posted:I thought this said "Klingon discotheque ship" and now I'm sad.
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Jul 10, 2014 05:55
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Nessus posted:There is an inexpensive item available in STO that makes anywhere a disco. But can you listen to the Bee Gees in its original Klingon?
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Jul 10, 2014 05:57
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Old grog is great. Just finished Voyager, season 1 episode 9: "Prime Factors" This is the first good, nay great episode. This episode is amazing, and belongs up there with the best of TOS, TNG, and DS9. Well maybe not DS9... DS9 had a continuity of characters and stories that is unique in trek. This is the 'sode where Voyager comes across a civilization of super-advanced hedonists. They have spacefolding technology which can transport people forty thousand lightyears in the blink of an eye. Unfortunately for Voyager, this civilization has very strict laws that prohibit sharing their technology. After Janeway's negotiations fail, and she doesn't put out, the former Maquis crew is aided by Tuvok in making an illicit trade for the tech anyway, against Janeway's explicit orders. Then it turns out that the technology isn't compatible with "federation tech" and it ends on a down note as Janeway chews Tuvok a new rear end in a top hat. Seska is named in this episode for the first time since (I assume) the pilot. She's been in about half the episodes so far, but this is the first time I've heard her name. This is both because I skipped the pilot and I drink excessively while watching this show. The only criticism I have of this episode is that the really over-do it in the scene where the main alien guy shows his true selfish hedonistic colors and Janeway calls him out on it. It's really hamfisted. Then again, this is trek, morality is always super hamfisted. Props for this show continuing to be aware of the issues of getting home vs. exploring and loving around. It's a common criticism that Janeway is terrible at staying on task about getting home, but so far every episode has actually brought this up and made it an issue. So far, this is the episode to watch in season one. Very reminiscent of classic trek in all the best ways. Karry Kim still gets screentime, for some reason. In fact, weird note, they really played up the relationship between Harry and B'Elonna this 'sode. I wonder if there was ever a plan to go with that pairing, because it felt like foreshadowing of that...
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Jul 10, 2014 06:01
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Snak posted:In fact, weird note, they really played up the relationship between Harry and B'Elonna this 'sode. I wonder if there was ever a plan to go with that pairing, because it felt like foreshadowing of that... I feel like they were planning to make something of it, or at least make them close friends, simply due to their introduction to each other in the pilot. But that kinda fell by the wayside.
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Jul 10, 2014 06:05
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Data Graham posted:Was any of TNG effectively kept secret until it premiered? Like, did they manage to keep the Ent-D under wraps until people saw it on TV and went There was a run of cheezy advance promos (link below), which gave a fast-paced peek at the cast and the ship. (Also, these ads liberally used filler clips from the TOS films that had nothing to do with TNG.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeMF32tLw8U
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Jul 10, 2014 06:31
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Snak posted:Harry and B'Elonna I thought that "Star Trek characters posting on SA" photoshop was clever, with Torres posting as user "BLT", but now I'm thinking B'Elogna is an even better food name.
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Jul 10, 2014 07:04
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Number_6 posted:There was a run of cheezy advance promos (link below), which gave a fast-paced peek at the cast and the ship. (Also, these ads liberally used filler clips from the TOS films that had nothing to do with TNG.) I wouldn't say liberally, but yeah I saw the genesis device go off a few times... One thing I love about the Galaxy class is that it feels big. It really conveys the feeling of "here is this giant technological marvel flying through space" like here is this thing that is made by humans but it's so advanced it's like nothing we've ever seen before on the big or small screen, and it is HUGE. Just finished Voyager, season 1, episode 10: "State of Flux" It was no accident that Seska was namedropped last episode, this is the one where she is revealed to have been a Cardassian agent all along. It's funny, when I watched this as a child, I hadn't seen DS9 at all, so I had no concept of Cardassians really. Watching it now, she portrays Cardassian behavior perfectly. It's also great foreshadowing of Dukat's final covert mission in DS9. Cardassians are so loving awesome. This episode also reintroduces the Kazon for the first time since the pilot. Meh. The best part of this episode is that the writers bothered to address that Chakotay, as a Maquis captain had not one, but two, members of his crew who were actually undercover spies for anti-Maquis factions... side note, I think it's hilarious that Tom Paris, whose name is Paris and is obsessed with France, joined the Maquis (named after the French Resistance cell) and immediately hosed it up and went to prison. Could he be more of a half-rear end fanboy? It's extra funny that when the Hirogin take over the ship and force everyone to cosplay WWII, he plays an American soldier... This episode is pretty meh. I guess props for having continuity and for taking a recurring character and making them turn out to be a villain out of nowhere. I guess it kind of gets turned into a season or two long arc. That run contrary to the "reset button" criticism that usually gets lobbied against Voyager, but if memory serves, it's not really worth a poo poo. I'll see how I feel about it during this watchthrough. I remember "Basics" pts 1 and 2 being good because of Brad Dourif's character Lon Sudor, and that episode where Nog is a Kazon and Chakotay talks him into killing him for honor or whatever, but otherwise, I think I'll be waiting on bated breath for Seven to show up. I have probably seen almost the entire series of Voyager three times already, but this is my first time watching it as an adult. I haven't seen most of these episodes in over ten years. edit: The Dark One posted:I thought that "Star Trek characters posting on SA" photoshop was clever, with Torres posting as user "BLT", but now I'm thinking B'Elogna is an even better food name. I hate to be an even bigger nerd, but "BLT" as a food-themed nickname is actually from the show. I don't remember the episode, but I remember the BLT improves "Turkey Platter" for Tom Paris on the spot when he gives her poo poo for it.
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Jul 10, 2014 07:18
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Snak posted:One thing I love about the Galaxy class is that it feels big. It really conveys the feeling of "here is this giant technological marvel flying through space" like here is this thing that is made by humans but it's so advanced it's like nothing we've ever seen before on the big or small screen, and it is HUGE. It always kinda saddens me they didn't have the tech back then to do close shots to use perspective to make it seem really huge. There are a couple of great shots on BSG where shuttles or fighters are flying out of the ship and alongside its hull where it really does feel a mile long, as they zoom past the hull ribs and the thing is stretching off into the distance.
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Jul 10, 2014 07:26
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MikeJF posted:It always kinda saddens me they didn't have the tech back then to do close shots to use perspective to make it seem really huge. There are a couple of great shots on BSG where shuttles or fighters are flying out of the ship and alongside its hull where it really does feel a mile long, as they zoom past the hull ribs and the thing is stretching off into the distance. http://youtube.com/watch?v=1dZveoBfiww
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Jul 10, 2014 07:58
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Watched Voyager Season 1, episode 11: "Heroes and Demons" People always roll their eyes at holodeck episodes. I understand why, they are a forced departure from the established setting. And a lot of them are bad. But I think that holodeck episodes are the post TOS conterpart to "theme planets" such as "Nazi Planet" (Patterns of Force), "Gangster Planet" (A Piece of the Action), or "Cowboy Planet" (Whichever one it was where they had to re-enact the OK Corral shootout). This episode specifically is more meaningful than other holodeck 'sodes because the protagonist is himself a hologram. This is the first time that the Doctor leaves sickbay. We see him touch a tree for the first time, eat food for the first time, kiss someone for the first time. And all off these things aren't even "real", they are just holograms. But they are as real as he is, and he knows it. He knows that they are just programs and he doesn't want to give a poo poo, but he also thinks that he is just a program and not a person. The fact that his responses are emotional and not logical makes it work. It shows his "humanity" even in the fact that he is having feelings for things that aren't real. That is emotion. This whole theme is supported overtly by the fact that the aliens of the week are "Photonic Energy" beings. Which is what holograms are made of. It's kind of funny that they choose such a term because it leads to scenes where the Doctor is in the holodeck with a tricorder saying that he's picking up readings of photonic energy when really, that should be normal for the holodeck, but whatever.
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Jul 10, 2014 08:33
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My personal favorite holodeck episodes are the Moriarty ones because Moriarty is such an interesting concept and character. Also A Fistful of Datas because it's awesome.  fake edit: my phone corrected "holodeck" to "homosexual" and I almost didn't catch it 
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Jul 10, 2014 08:38
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razorrozar posted:My personal favorite holodeck episodes are the Moriarty ones because Moriarty is such an interesting concept and character. I just made a really dumb post about Moriarty in one of the other trek threads. It is the best holodeck plot. edit: I decided while watching VOY "Heroes and Demons" that the holodeck was designed by a super-genius to be a god. Like, even with safety protocols on, there are reasons it would be unsafe to deactivate it with someone in it. Say you're hanging upside-down, three meters from the floor, and your captain comes in and says "end program". Dead as gently caress. That's why Tuvok and Chakotay can't turn off the holodeck when it's malfunctioning: safety protocols aren't just "don't let people get shot" they are "the 'deck knows better than some idiot who just walked in". Holodecks simulate incredibly complex systems, including supervillains. In the case of a malfunction, the holodeck has a better idea what is going on than main characters do at the beginning of the episode. It's such an advanced system that it's power source is unique and can't interface with the rest of the ship. I wouldn't be surprise if it was actually the case that holodecks were the dominant species of the federation and they built ships and installed organic life on them to go out and explore the galaxy. Like how would people know? Did all their good ideas come to them when they were relaxing on the holodeck? Snak fucked around with this message at 08:49 on Jul 10, 2014 |
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Jul 10, 2014 08:42
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The Dark One posted:I thought that "Star Trek characters posting on SA" photoshop was clever
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Jul 10, 2014 11:43
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Nothus Infelix posted:Google Groups is kind of annoying to search, but there is heming and hawing to be had. Excerpts from a 1987 thread: Reading old Usenet posts are pretty entertaining at times. Found a few of mine that I made back in the mid 90s and felt old.
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Jul 10, 2014 14:47
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Found in the F-35 thread:KoRMaK posted:Look at this loving thing Terrible Trek really inspires terrible design
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Jul 10, 2014 18:45
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Kazy posted:Found in the F-35 thread: Drop "Supplies"
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Jul 10, 2014 19:21
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Kazy posted:Found in the F-35 thread: Why have a plane that can split into three planes when you can just bring 3 regular planes? Multi Vector Assault Mode, that's why.
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Jul 10, 2014 20:17
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Subyng posted:Why have a plane that can split into three planes when you can just bring 3 regular planes? They aren't wrong that it could theoretically save on fuel, but I can't imagine that if saving fuel was your priority that it wouldn't be better served by not having to design around all of the voltron bullshit.
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Jul 10, 2014 20:21
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That plane is the worst idea ever, you just know the Romulans are going to end up stealing it. Why bother?
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Jul 10, 2014 20:31
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Crosscontaminant posted:Anyone happen to have it? http://i.imgur.com/IF7Jn.png
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Jul 10, 2014 20:44
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I just found out about attack wing today. Anyone have any experience with it? I just want to buy a reliant and replay star trek 2
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Jul 10, 2014 20:50
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Zesty Mordant posted:Seasons 1 and 2 are much easier to take if you've spent a few good seasons getting to know the characters. It's really what makes the series, for me at least. The plots in seasons 1 and 2 range from really bad, especially if you're clued into the idea that's been discussed on these forums before about how the show really takes on a weird racist perspective in regard to othering alien races, not to mention predictable and goofy plots. Season 1 basically is just: meet new aliens, they suck, figure out how to untangle the situation, Picard says "Engage!" and that's that. Alcoholic space Irishmen and tribal-Africans-in-space are the most provocative examples I can think of. The Ferengi were basically "covetous Jew" caricatures with alien masks. Then there were those "perfect" space Aryans (although one of the guys had a spare tire) who spent their time killing minor rule breakers, getting massages, and jogging. There's certainly a theme to each alien race in TNG that tends to simplify them for the most part.
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Jul 10, 2014 20:58
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The design/execution might have been bad but I'm totally fine with a one-note culture designed to do nothing but take a huge steamy poo poo on capitalism at every turn.
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Jul 10, 2014 22:15
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LLCoolJD posted:Alcoholic space Irishmen and tribal-Africans-in-space are the most provocative examples I can think of. The Ferengi were basically "covetous Jew" caricatures with alien masks. Then there were those "perfect" space Aryans (although one of the guys had a spare tire) who spent their time killing minor rule breakers, getting massages, and jogging. There's certainly a theme to each alien race in TNG that tends to simplify them for the most part. Yeah, basically it says "people who are different can definitely be reduced to a single inherent trait" plus the fact that basically 100% of the time the alien races don't do anything as right as the humans do. It isn't nearly as bad in the later seasons, although I'm struggling to come up with examples. How about the race of people who suicide at 60, to the dismay of Lwuxanna Troi? I forget how that came to be resolved. One of my favorite episodes was a S5 one where Picard attempts to work with an alien race who speak in metaphor. They are just significantly different from humans but not to any degree "lesser" or backwards, and in the end it's Picard's failing to understand in time that gets the other guy killed. The Federation (or someone) was said to have given up attempting to talk to these people in an example of the extreme hubris, and because of it they miss out on a valuable experience. That's the problem with writing the humans in TNG as a sort of awakened, ascended people wholly unlike the barbaric, unenlightened folks of the 21st century. While it is fun to backhandedly bash at the failings of today in this detached way, it's a vain optimism to say that yes, in the future our socialistic paradise will come about because we finally get Smart Enough to abandon selfishness. It's more interesting, I think, to write the Federation as having this pretense, but still anchored by what are undyingly human traits. I also just watched DS9 s1e5, the one with the aphasia virus. That is such a cool concept, and it's too bad they hosed it up. The aphasia turns out to be just a freaky symptom of the virus, and the fact that everyone is unable to connect words to ideas meaningfully is nothing more than a curiosity, and it turns out it's going to kill them anyway. I was waiting hopefully for the moment when the entire station (unless Odo was immune, it's never said but he is in the Other role that Data and Spock played, and so I assume sometimes because of his strange nature he's exempt from certain things) becomes affected, and they have to find a way to fix themselves without actually linguistically communicating. Like, from what I know about aphasia, both sign and verbal languages are affected, but there's no reason that a binary communication, yes/no on/off thumbs up/down would be misconstrued. It's a tough corner to write out of, but way more interesting.
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Jul 10, 2014 22:42
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I feel bad responding to all this with just "the next episode is fun", but the next episode is fun. Also, DS9 hits its stride in the 3rd season BUT I feel like it begins to form its identity in late season 1. Progress, Duet, and In the Hands of the Prophets are all good stories [Duet is excellent] that start building the setting more.
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Jul 10, 2014 23:12
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Why would Garak use his real name?
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Jul 10, 2014 23:25
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Zesty Mordant posted:Yeah, basically it says "people who are different can definitely be reduced to a single inherent trait" plus the fact that basically 100% of the time the alien races don't do anything as right as the humans do. It isn't nearly as bad in the later seasons, although I'm struggling to come up with examples. How about the race of people who suicide at 60, to the dismay of Lwuxanna Troi? I forget how that came to be resolved. One of my favorite episodes was a S5 one where Picard attempts to work with an alien race who speak in metaphor. They are just significantly different from humans but not to any degree "lesser" or backwards, and in the end it's Picard's failing to understand in time that gets the other guy killed. The Federation (or someone) was said to have given up attempting to talk to these people in an example of the extreme hubris, and because of it they miss out on a valuable experience. 
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Jul 10, 2014 23:38
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Mike the TV posted:Drop "Supplies" An unmanned stealth drone that can resupply special forces in the field is like having a magical wish granting unicorn Farmer Crack-rear end posted:The design/execution might have been bad but I'm totally fine with a one-note culture designed to do nothing but take a huge steamy poo poo on capitalism at every turn. Its moronic to bite the hand that feeds you.
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Jul 11, 2014 00:07
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Sash! posted:An unmanned stealth drone that can resupply special forces in the field is like having a magical wish granting unicorn It's not like with America's air superiority needing a stealth drone is that important to resupply troops. However it is more useful to blow poo poo up in enemy territory and get away before anyone can retaliate. Which I think is Mike's point. Sash! posted:Its moronic to bite the hand that feeds you. Meh, political-commentary/critiquing-the-status-quo is kinda Star Trek's thing.
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Jul 11, 2014 00:24
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Sgt. Anime Pederast posted:I just found out about attack wing today. Anyone have any experience with it? I just want to buy a reliant and replay star trek 2 I wasn't impressed. The Wings of War system upon which Star Trek: Attack Wing and Star Wars: X-Wing are based is a World War I fighter combat game. It translated brilliantly to Star Wars which is all about fighters swooping around and trying to get behind one another. For Star Trek, which is supposed to be about capital ships banging away at one another? Not so much. For instance, in Attack Wing most ships can only fire in their forward arc. Now, okay, that works for some of the light and fast stuff like a Klingon B'rel or Federation Defiant class ship, but we drat well know that most Fed ships can fire in every direction. The Galaxy class Enterprise -D has omni-directional phasers as as special ability, but if you take any other Galaxy class ship? Sorry, no aft phasers or torpedoes for you! Oh, also Attack Wing has a stupid rule that allows you to buy any commander for any ship of any faction for a slight penalty in points. Since Picard happens to be one of the best commanders in the game, anytime you get into a tournament situation, or even casual pick up games, expect to see Captain Jean-Luc Picard aboard a Romulan Warbird fighting against Captain Jean-Luc Picard aboard a Cardassian Galor class. Why? Because he's the best captain, duh!  Attack Wing just doesn't model what we see in the Trek shows and movies nearly as well as X-Wing does for Star Wars. What's worse, though, is that unlike the lovingly detailed miniatures that Fantasy Flight puts out for X-Wing, WizKids doesn't do nearly as nice a job for Attack Wing. The minis lack detail and are made from a flimsy plastic that breaks easily. Annoyingly, they're also way out of scale with one another, with the Defiant mini being nearly as big as a Galaxy. Compare that to X-Wing where they put out a Corvette that's the size of a brick compared to the fighters in the rest of the game! In short, the Wings of War system isn't the right one for Star Trek, the minis aren't great, and pretty much anything Attack Wing does, X-Wing does better. I'd recommend that if you like Trek and Wars equally, go buy X-Wing instead. If you're hardcore into Trek, ask around first. Find out if there's anyone else playing Attack Wing in your area before investing heavily in it. Because its been months since I saw anyone playing Attack Wing at my FLGS1, but there still seems to be an active X-Wing community. 1 = Friendly Neighborhood Game Store
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Jul 11, 2014 00:32
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I love reading old angry Internet posts. Now I want to go dig up the old Babylon 5 newsgroup and see where people thought the show was going back then.
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Jul 11, 2014 01:37
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