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Corbeau posted:So are link teams a crutch? I feel pretty confident saying that a vanilla faction is stronger than a sectorial during the active turn, simply because of the sheer variety of threats it can bring, so if you can mitigate the defensive disadvantage of lacking a link team... I disagree, I don't think either is stronger, per say. Sectorials allow you to gain board control, placing cheap linked units in a way that is hard to respond to. Vanilla lists can put more tools into the toolbox. Ultimately, a link team is just another type of tool. The thing is, certain sectorial armies have toolboxes AND cheap links. PanO can field a pretty wide array of types of units, for example, and field very cheap links. 59 points for a BS 12 (+3 range band +3 5 man link) or BS 18, 5 man fusileer link with 1 HMG (B5 in the link) is amazing in the active turn for the points cost. Tohaa, with their 3 man links, can run 14 point heavy flamers up the board with zero-vis smoke cover, and create real problems for the active-turn's player's advancement with B2 heavy flamers, while also being a completely credible threat in the active turn. Pretas are too strong because they can be in the Combined Army vanilla and give you the advantage of a link team, with all of the rest of the toys, for very, very few points. So I regard a link team as just that; its a "crutch" in that it is a powerful option which shapes your play style. But there are many "crutches" in infinity - 360 total reaction HMG turrets, camo and TO camo, TAGs, etc, can all be variably described as a crutch since they are a strong option you can lean on to support you.
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Jul 11, 2014 18:46
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Flipswitch posted:Hey guys, I've finished the second OP post but I'm a little unsure on my Tohaa write up, they're still a very strange faction sitting in a new design space and I felt it a bit tricky to summarize them because to be honest, we've only seen one Tohaa here in Cardiff and he doesn't get to play very much. What do you guys think of the write up? any changes? I have only played 5 games vs. Tohaa, so take this with a grain of salt - also, our boards that I play against them on were HEAVILY terrain-ed, so it was like warband mazes of doom. We realized after week 5 of the store map campaign that we were using too much terrain, and cut it down a good bit; template weapons are supposed to be good, but fire lanes are supposed to cut down on their effectiveness. The Tohaa have really, really few unit options compared to other armies. Their current army size is like the size of other armies sectorials. In my 5 games, I've seen every trick of the Tohaa, but there are many variations inside of that. If anything, I'd say the Tohaa are lacking a really big offensive punch. I've never played against the Tohaa tag though. Weirdly, I think the Tohaa faction is strongest against... other Tohaa factions. There is like a price premium you pay on each unit for Fireteam Tohaa. I think that premium is roughly 20% of the unit's cost.
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Jul 11, 2014 19:09
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Great, sounds like I missed nothing then. I've played against Tohaa at least a dozen times, but only with the one individual so I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything vital that neither of us had seen.S.W.O.R.D. Agent posted:I think it looks pretty solid. We've only got one player here, and what you posted seems to sums them up pretty well. If you added anything I might say something about the fact that the fireteams can be reformed on the fly, and that the durability of the symbiote armor comes at a price in the form of weakness to weapons with fire ammo.
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Jul 11, 2014 20:26
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Gotcha, that makes sense.
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Jul 11, 2014 20:55
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For the newbies here, what does a link team actually do beyond the share order thing?
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Jul 11, 2014 21:56
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S.W.O.R.D. Agent posted:
Thanks for the help. I'll be grabbing some on the weekend! P.S. Any reason to avoid the ninja?
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Jul 11, 2014 22:00
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DJ Dizzy posted:For the newbies here, what does a link team actually do beyond the share order thing? 3 Man Link (min. size) +1 Burst 4 Man Link - Sixth Sense L2 5 Man Link - +3 BS In the ARO, every member of the link team gains those bonuses. So, for 50 points, you could take 5 linked Fusileers, put them in the an area on the board where they are all within 8" of the designated link team leader, and maintain a fair bit of board control - since they can't be combat camo'ed, they are B2 instead of B1, and they all have +3 BS. People generally try to kill link teams because they can be super dangerous.
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Jul 11, 2014 22:13
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^ fuckin snipers man!DJ Dizzy posted:For the newbies here, what does a link team actually do beyond the share order thing? 3 Members - +1B(urst) 4 Members - Sixth Sense Level 2 5 Members - +3 BS. All members get the bonus in the reactive turn, active miniature gets them in your turn.
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Jul 11, 2014 22:14
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Flipswitch posted:^ fuckin snipers man! I'm assuming that the bonuses drop as linked members die?
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Jul 11, 2014 22:22
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Yeah, they do. 
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Jul 11, 2014 22:24
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While it's certainly really good to have, I think that the +3 BS is actually the least of the link team bonuses. It's the +1 burst that makes link teams powerful in ARO, and it's the free SSL2 that makes them difficult to break. Those are the tools you can't often get in any other way. You can almost always pay extra for an elite unit if you want to field higher BS, but + burst ARO units with SSL2? That's hard, if not impossible, to duplicate otherwise.
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Jul 11, 2014 22:30
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We've finally started getting regular games in with the starter boxes we bought last gencon. So far my shasvastii have absolutely dominated every game even adjusting the points to even them out, but I feel like as soon as we start adding stuff I'm going to have a tough road to walk. Also, the experienced players in our group say shas is all about gwailos. I haven't seen them mentioned yet, and I don't really see the appeal either yet.
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Jul 11, 2014 23:48
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They're all about the Asswangs, especially with that name. Asswangs.
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Jul 11, 2014 23:57
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I mean getting to say rear end wang constantly is like 85% of why you play shasvastii right?
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Jul 12, 2014 00:00
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DesoUK posted:P.S. Any reason to avoid the ninja? Ninjas are generally considered too expensive for the points you pay. The Ninja hacker is a fairly solid addition to an ITS list. It's problem is that it's double the cost of the Celestial Guard hacker which is excellent in an of itself. Just play lots of things and find out what works for you. You could swap the Wu Ming or Pheasant for a Ninja pretty easily in the lists you've made. You don't even have to buy the model. Just use the Wu Ming or Pheasant as the Ninja Proxy to see if you like it.
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Jul 12, 2014 00:30
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Gareth Gobulcoque posted:We've finally started getting regular games in with the starter boxes we bought last gencon. Gareth Gobulcoque posted:Also, the experienced players in our group say shas is all about gwailos.  Gareth Gobulcoque posted:I mean getting to say rear end wang constantly is like 85% of why you play shasvastii right? Pierzak fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Jul 12, 2014 |
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Jul 12, 2014 01:05
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Our local Shas player is all about the Speculo. Sadly, a typical activation for the Speculo will go like this: 1: Move into combat with TAG 2: Miss Mono-filament Attack/TAG Passes Save 3: TAG turns Speculo into paste. OR 1: Fire at valuable target/Cheerleader 2: Everything misses/Target passes saves 3: Get crit in return. OR 1: Engage Cheerleader in Close Combat 2: Miss 3: Receive rifle butt to head
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Jul 12, 2014 01:21
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Pierzak posted:Wait wait wait, like "starter box vs starter box"? Those aren't even remotely points-balanced. It's more like 150/125 point games using models from the starter boxes, so we can pretend there is some semblance of balance. Yes we're using swc. Even with the points adjustment it's still painfully obvious that they are really imbalanced. We're looking to move into real games quickly. Just using these to get to know the rules. I came for the models. Stayed for the trolling. Gareth Gobulcoque fucked around with this message at 03:11 on Jul 12, 2014 |
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Jul 12, 2014 02:53
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DJ Dizzy posted:I'm assuming that the bonuses drop as linked members die? Yes. I usually try to whittle down link teams with grenades tossed from out of LOS (the Marut and other Tags with high BS can do it quite well) in the case of cheaper links, and smoke-shrouded MSV2 snipers in the case of heavy infantry like haramakis. Reducing the link by even a single member can be very powerful. If you are getting on for an assault with combat camo, the 6th sense is a huge issue. And if you need to clear a fire lane, -3 BS and one less aro can mean the different between a living or dead specialist.
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Jul 12, 2014 03:57
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Germ posted:I've played a very similar list in the past, and it's tons of fun. Instead of Morans I took a Tomcat and an Alguacil, though (and my weapon and skill load out was different). That HMG Intruder is going to own. I love the variety of list types that the Nomads can take. Basically I've gone to this list (after playing nothing but Corregidor for a long time) because I came up against a very camo-heavy ariadna list, and it was terrifying. Especially since 1 of my intruders died immediately in an aro, and the other wasn't in a good position to help! S.W.O.R.D. Agent posted:Ninjas are generally considered too expensive for the points you pay. The Ninja hacker is a fairly solid addition to an ITS list. It's problem is that it's double the cost of the Celestial Guard hacker which is excellent in an of itself. The thing I found playing against yu jing is that ninjas, like all TO camo infiltrators, are a finesse unit. Quite expensive so you should be using them over your more basic models. If they are deployed hidden you are not getting the order till the turn after they activate, so have a definite plan before making that play. For objectives, having a TO infiltrator is one of the best solutions, just analyse at the start of your turn if it is a good move, then unmask and go straight to work. For that reason even an expensive hacker is a good choice. If they have FO it might be better (cheaper) though. Anyway I played twice against JSA last night, with 250 corregidor:  JURISDICTIONAL COMMAND OF CORREGIDOR────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1   10  0  0 ALGUACIL HMG / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 19)ALGUACIL (Forward Observer, Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (14)ALGUACIL (Forward Observer, Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (14)ALGUACIL (Forward Observer, Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (14)ALGUACIL (Forward Observer, Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (14) INTRUDER (Lieutenant) Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (36)INTRUDER HMG, Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 44)INTRUDER (X Visor) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 52) MORAN Boarding Shotgun, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)MORAN Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)5 SWC | 249 Points A very straightforward and pretty hard list IMO, given that we were playing no-objectives kill 'em all. My oppo was quite new, used several bikes including their tit-monster looking special character, some line infantry, a chain rifle samurai HI, a special character ninja and a chain of command unit. The first game, slightly open terrain and his inexperience (he went first) got him crippled by AROs. I gave him some advice, added more terrain and we played again. This time I went first, I didn't play quite as hard, but then because of bad luck and an incautiously overstretched attack with my link team, he managed to bring himself back into that game. We ended up both in retreat and LoL, so we both had a decent time.
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Jul 12, 2014 14:39
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Why won't the iOS app store find the Aleph toolbox? I can't search for it and any direct links end up on a blank page E: thanks! Not a viking fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Jul 13, 2014 |
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Jul 12, 2014 23:37
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It's not on iOS. it's Mayanet for iPad, or Ops: Infinity for phone.
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Jul 12, 2014 23:56
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The first of my NCA army.  
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Jul 13, 2014 08:00
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Awesome, really good blue there. The Bolts are terrific models, are they getting anything new in the 3rd edition rules? Currently they're a little plain, but maybe they are just supposed to be like wildcats - straightforward, simple MI.
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Jul 13, 2014 12:53
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Genghis Cohen posted:Awesome, really good blue there. The Bolts are terrific models, are they getting anything new in the 3rd edition rules? Currently they're a little plain, but maybe they are just supposed to be like wildcats - straightforward, simple MI. They are getting new stuff with N3 - I don't think we even know what their currently-printed Bioimmunity does.
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Jul 13, 2014 18:00
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Yes we do. quote:BIOIMMUNITY
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Jul 13, 2014 18:14
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One of the things I believe could be cleared up about infinity: all those weird compound skills. Currently the wiki is the only place (AFAIK) that consolidates all those overlapping rules about the types of special ammo and the effects immunities have on them. Personally I would love it if the new rulebook had all the game rules - profiles, special rules, weapons, equipment, army lists, etc - in one place. The announced decision to keep human sphere and paradiso stuff out is mystifying to me. Hopefully they only mean scenario/spec ops/campaign stuff? But even something like link teams, which are a big part of the game rules. How would it hurt to have those in the main rulebook?
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Jul 14, 2014 00:58
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Flipswitch posted:Yes we do. Are there more changes in the works though? To make them as attractive as a linked fusilier team?
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Jul 14, 2014 03:02
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Genghis Cohen posted:One of the things I believe could be cleared up about infinity: all those weird compound skills. Currently the wiki is the only place (AFAIK) that consolidates all those overlapping rules about the types of special ammo and the effects immunities have on them. Personally I would love it if the new rulebook had all the game rules - profiles, special rules, weapons, equipment, army lists, etc - in one place. The announced decision to keep human sphere and paradiso stuff out is mystifying to me. Hopefully they only mean scenario/spec ops/campaign stuff? But even something like link teams, which are a big part of the game rules. How would it hurt to have those in the main rulebook? Money basically. While I would prefer they include rules like Link Teams and all the gear from those books in N3 I totally understand why they wouldn't. I mean they already give out all the rules for free in .pdf form as well as having a free army builder program and a searchable online database for every rule with related rules hotlinked in the entry. I can't think of a single other game that does this so I'll happily keep purchasing the books to support them despite them seeing little use for me besides bathroom reading. When I go to a tournament or even just play with friends I just use a tablet to reference the rules. Hell I even use a second tablet for my army list. It's so much nicer than lugging around and thumbing through a bunch of heavy rear end books. Get with the 21st century brother.
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Jul 14, 2014 06:48
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Work is slow as gently caress today, so I am suddenly in the early stages of planning out a real terrain board for my group. How big should a real Infinity board be? I forget. I also really don't want to go to the official forums. Thanks in advance! Edit: 4' x 4' sounds about perfect, considering that's what I already have to work with, table-wise. Condoleezza Nice! fucked around with this message at 09:47 on Jul 14, 2014 |
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Jul 14, 2014 09:44
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Sephyr posted:Yes. I usually try to whittle down link teams with grenades tossed from out of LOS (the Marut and other Tags with high BS can do it quite well) in the case of cheaper links, and smoke-shrouded MSV2 snipers in the case of heavy infantry like haramakis. How do smoke-shrouded MSV2 snipers help vs. a 4 man link with SSL2? Its a normal face to face roll and the only penalties the link takes is the (probably) range increment vs. the sniper rifle, and possibly cover vs. lack thereof.
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Jul 14, 2014 15:30
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As a follow-up to my earlier post I picked up the Haqq support box and a Barids Hacker blister. How does this list look: HAQQISLAM────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 8 0 0 GHULAM Lieutenant Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (13)GHULAM Doctor Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (17)GHULAM Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (13) HUSAM (BS13, Doctor, Natural Born Warrior) Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (13 | 12XP) DJANBAZAN HMG / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 36) NAFFATÛN Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (10)NAFFATÛN Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (10)NAFFATÛN Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (10)GROUP 2 3 0 0 NAJJARUN Engineer Rifle + Light Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (17) LASIQ Viral Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 29) BARID Hacker (Hacking Device) Rifle + Marker / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 26) NASMAT Electric Pulse. (3)NASMAT Electric Pulse. (3)3.5 SWC | 200 Points Open with Army 4
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Jul 14, 2014 16:52
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James Woods posted:Money basically. While I would prefer they include rules like Link Teams and all the gear from those books in N3 I totally understand why they wouldn't. I mean they already give out all the rules for free in .pdf form as well as having a free army builder program and a searchable online database for every rule with related rules hotlinked in the entry. I can't think of a single other game that does this so I'll happily keep purchasing the books to support them despite them seeing little use for me besides bathroom reading. When I go to a tournament or even just play with friends I just use a tablet to reference the rules. Hell I even use a second tablet for my army list. It's so much nicer than lugging around and thumbing through a bunch of heavy rear end books. Get with the 21st century brother. Oh, I've never actually bought any of the rulebooks. I was just going to pick up the Paradiso one for the campaign rules (could be handy for the new group, those rules as far as I know haven't been released digitally) and I may well buy the new core book. But I have no problem with using download only rules on a screen. I am a big fan of the wiki system since it essentially incorporates FAQs (the bane of any rules system) as things go along. It's just something about having new and updates rules in one source, while others haven't been touched, irritates me. It's an arbitrary distinction to adjust/rebalance some rules and not others. Purely practically, they will need to adjust points costs and other options for most profiles in the game, less than half of which are in the core rulebook. I repeat this is not a problem for me as I get weapon/special/profile rules off the wiki or an army builder. It just seems weird that the HS and Paradiso rules will be at least partly redundant, and yet not replaced. Playing again in a few hours. Painted another model or two, gonna bring the pain.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:02
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TKIY posted:As a follow-up to my earlier post I picked up the Haqq support box and a Barids Hacker blister. How does this list look:
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Jul 14, 2014 17:03
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TKIY posted:As a follow-up to my earlier post I picked up the Haqq support box and a Barids Hacker blister. How does this list look: I think 13 is too few for 2 combat groups. Hackers especially are order-intensive models, why is that one in a 3-man group where it will be starved of orders? Ditto for the lasiq, a powerfully mobile sniper. I would find some way to cut it to 10. Engineers are a bit pointless in this list unless you are using the ITS/paradiso missions. Take heavy flamer naffatuns over the light version, always.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:05
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The official Infinity forums will disappear soon, so if you need something from there, like old painting/modeling/rules threads, be sure to grab it.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:16
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And nothing of value was lost. (Just kidding, I should probably
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Jul 14, 2014 17:29
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I like(d) the official forums. Is Data-Sphere good?
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Jul 14, 2014 17:34
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Genghis Cohen posted:I think 13 is too few for 2 combat groups. Hackers especially are order-intensive models, why is that one in a 3-man group where it will be starved of orders? Ditto for the lasiq, a powerfully mobile sniper. I would find some way to cut it to 10. Engineers are a bit pointless in this list unless you are using the ITS/paradiso missions. Take heavy flamer naffatuns over the light version, always. Yeah we are doing Spec-Ops missions or something. I've only had two games so far so I am taking advice from the organizer, and was told to bring a number of specialists, a Spec-Ops with 12XP, and someone with D-Charges. With limited knowledge, I'm kind of winging it as far as list building. quote:Format: I'll take another crack at it.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:48
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Laphroaig posted:I like(d) the official forums. Is Data-Sphere good?
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Jul 14, 2014 17:50
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