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ImpAtom posted:It is completely ending the arc though. The first film begins with Tony Stark becoming Iron Man because of his trauma and the last film is him getting over his trauma and giving up his safety blanket. The end of Iron Man three is about him being a human being again. The second he was kidnapped, he was on this roller coaster ride. First film, he looks at who he was and decides he needs to change and undo the damage. By the end of the first film he thinks the whole this is cool and gets cocky. Film two, he is feeling like a rock star living up behind iron man even though it is having intense adverse effects in his life. Even when he fixes the problem, he may have calmed down a bit but he is still cocky and in rock star mode. Film three he is a mess after the avengers because he finally recognizes that being cocky rock star man isn't as fun when poo poo gets real. Being iron man is no longer a lark, it's serious business with real consequences. While not perfect, I took the end as Tony Stark realizes he needs to stop loving around and get serious. He is not indestructible and his work isn't a game for cocky rock star man. At the end, his priorities have started to change. I didn't get the impression he was done with iron man, but that he would need to move forward with a new Vision of what iron man should be. That being said I hope that ultron is a tony stark screw up. At least not directly. I can accept tony building the thing, but I'd hope third party intervention is what makes it go ultron.
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Jul 18, 2014 02:17
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At the end of Iron Man 3, Tony overcame his addiction to armor; it ambiguously implies he has learned that armor can now fulfill a balanced, healthy role in his life, based on how cool and useful it is. The armor is not Iron Man. The Avengers 2 is a corollary to Iron Man 3, based on "What if that epiphany were incomplete?" He destroyed the armor because he wanted an end to the power that the armor had over him. He liberated himself from the need for armor, but not from the fear of the need for armor. He will try to renounce the armor for good, but when he sees that his attitude toward it is still harmful (as symbolized by the robotic destruction, etc.), he will work to overcome that overcorrection. The result will be that he has attained a more complete understanding of the idea of Iron Man, which was created in that cave. It's okay for it to Tony to need to learn a similar lesson a second time, because overcoming alcoholism is not easy. It's also okay because Iron Man is kind of dialectical.
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Jul 18, 2014 02:27
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I really don't understand how so many people took the ending of IM3 to mean he'd given up being Iron Man forever.
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Jul 18, 2014 03:29
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ImpAtom posted:The ending of the film is literally him fixing Extremis and then saying he's going to use it for himself. Like he has to fix it for Pepper first. Nope. You see he used Dr. Wu or whatever his name was to preform heart surgery. Now, who is this character? Where did he come from? He was right there in the beginning. Tony is introduced to this heart surgeon during the opening scene and that is who he calls upon years later. Why? So they can sell the movie to china. There was a whole extra scene with that character because he was famous in China or something. So the pieces are all there. They're just a little buried. But I love the ending for Iron Man 3 because it made the fanboys cringe when they saw pieces of metal explode. Seriously, he's Tony Stark. He could poo poo out Iron Man suits all drat day like it was nothing. I don't know why people didn't get that.
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Jul 18, 2014 05:46
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Unmature posted:I really don't understand how so many people took the ending of IM3 to mean he'd given up being Iron Man forever. Because he did. Heck, the concept of Ultron in The Avengers 2 is it is replacing him in The Avengers. The entire movie is about how he is more than his iron suit and can do more for the world if he stops trying to create increasingly better iron suits all the time and ends with him removing his Arc Reactor and blowing up all his suits. He obviously was going to return as Iron Man in the next film because MONEY but within the confines of the actual film it was the clear end to his superhero role and a move into his Inventor role instead.
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Jul 18, 2014 05:51
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Then why is the last line of the film "But there's one thing they can't take away from me...I am Iron Man." That goes against what you're saying. Tony is only saying he doesn't need any of this poo poo to be Iron Man. He is Iron Man. Like that one Batman line about it's not who you are or some poo poo.
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Jul 18, 2014 05:54
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CelticPredator posted:Then why is the last line of the film "But there's one thing they can't take away from me...I am Iron Man." Tony Stark is Iron Man, not the suit. When we're saying "he won't be Iron Man anymore" it's referring to being the suited-up superhero Iron Man. He is still the person who was inside of that suit and who was capable of doing all those things. It's a direct parallel to the first movie where his final line is "I am Iron Man." Here the emphasis is moved from "Iron Man" to "I." He is still the guy who did all that stuff but the suit is completely unimportant except as something he created. It was his cocoon and he has left it behind and is a changed man. I mean as far as a butterfly metaphor would go, it doesn't make much sense for him to return to the armor. He literally calls the armor his cocoon and talks about how he has emerged from it a changed man. The butterfly imagery doesn't work if it is followed by "and then I get right back in the cocoon." ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Jul 18, 2014 |
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Jul 18, 2014 05:58
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Yes. Now we are on the same page.
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Jul 18, 2014 06:02
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I forgot Tony helped design project insight, at least the helicarrier component. Maybe his idea with Ultron is humans can't be trusted with that kind of power and he needs an AI making decisions.
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Jul 18, 2014 11:12
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greatn posted:I forgot Tony helped design project insight, at least the helicarrier component. Maybe his idea with Ultron is humans can't be trusted with that kind of power and he needs an AI making decisions. According to the EW article, Yeah, pretty much this. Basically, SHIELD has been broken, because it was run by people, and people are full of flaws and bad decision making. If we want to keep people safe, we can't rely on people to make the important decisions, so let's instead rely on an unfeeling AI. But that would take too long to build from scratch, so I'm just going to use my own brain as a blueprint because, hey, smartest loving guy on the planet right here. What could go wrong? I think this was kind of the plot to MGS Peace Walker, too.
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Jul 18, 2014 15:40
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New GotG spot with lots of new footage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRlfIhic_Es Apparently Ronan is just going to be a straight up bad guy.
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Jul 18, 2014 15:49
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So I read a thing about Captain America today.. http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/28340644
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Jul 18, 2014 15:55
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Apparently the best way to get massive media coverage for your comic book is to make a white man character not that.
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Jul 18, 2014 15:56
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Making him the other guy from the movie helps.
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Jul 18, 2014 15:58
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What happened to Bucky-Cap?
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Jul 18, 2014 16:19
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Kingtheninja posted:What happened to Bucky-Cap? That was just a phase. Though if I'm reading speculation right, Bucky's going to be the new Nick Fury.
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Jul 18, 2014 16:29
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Bucky Cap gave the shield back to Steve Rogers when he came back alive.
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Jul 18, 2014 16:30
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zoux posted:New GotG spot with lots of new footage. This makes me think Drax is going to be a lot of fun.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:20
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Kingtheninja posted:What happened to Bucky-Cap? Baron Zemo leaked that the new Captain America was the winter soldier and was responsible for a bunch of assassinations and terrorist acts. He was brought to trial and while he got off in America Russia extradited him. There he was sent to a gulag and fought for the wardens entertainment. He was able to escape, but his rep made it so he could no longer carry the shield. Soon after Fear Itself happened and Red Skull's daughter killed him. However, he was holding on and he faced his death with Fury and Black Widow's help. Steve was later told, but due to his death he picked the shield up again.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:30
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bobkatt013 posted:Baron Zemo leaked that the new Captain America was the winter soldier and was responsible for a bunch of assassinations and terrorist acts. He was brought to trial and while he got off in America Russia extradited him. There he was sent to a gulag and fought for the wardens entertainment. He was able to escape, but his rep made it so he could no longer carry the shield. Soon after Fear Itself happened and Red Skull's daughter killed him. However, he was holding on and he faced his death with Fury and Black Widow's help. Steve was later told, but due to his death he picked the shield up again. I really liked Bucky-Cap because it was all about how difficult it was to be Captain America. It was hard to throw the shield right, it was hard to get the shield to come back to him, guys like Batroc were major challenges. In a world where Cap looks like a "normal human" in comparison to guys like Thor, it was cool to see how difficult his job really was for a non-super soldier.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:34
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zoux posted:New GotG spot with lots of new footage. He won't be. Its just Marvel trying to hide that Thanos is the villain of the film.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:34
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:So I read a thing about Captain America today.. Anthony Mackie has to be totally hoping that this has implications for his future career.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:41
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theflyingorc posted:Anthony Mackie has to be totally hoping that this has implications for his future career. Since the comics pretty much exist as marketing tools these days, it probably has.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:44
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Waterhaul posted:He won't be. Its just Marvel trying to hide that Thanos is the villain of the film. Not "the" I mean "a". Ronan never struck me as a villain as much as a loyal soldier of the opposition.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:46
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e X posted:Since the comics pretty much exist as marketing tools these days, it probably has. Sure, wasn't Chris Evans completely disinterested in doing more Cap movies after Avengers 2?
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Jul 18, 2014 17:47
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zoux posted:Not "the" I mean "a". Ronan never struck me as a villain as much as a loyal soldier of the opposition. He was a complete villain in many of his early appearances.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:48
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Hakkesshu posted:Sure, wasn't Chris Evans completely disinterested in doing more Cap movies after Avengers 2? That's the rumor that's going around. I really, really, really hope that they turn Falcon into Cap in the movies. Both for how angry it will make racists and how awesome it will be for black youth. It's basically the perfect move for minority representation in comics - he's a popular hero, his powers aren't wacky, he's mostly known for his brain, and his role is basically embodying all the good things about America. It also doesn't feel forced because Captain America is more of a title than a person anyway, unlike if, say, you made Wonder Woman black.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:52
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I got nothing against Falcon or him being Cap for a while but I just don't feel it has as much pathos as Bucky Cap or Miles Morales Spidey. It just feels like a friend filling in for Steve's shift. Although it does explain why Falcon made the big save in the last storyline.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:55
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theflyingorc posted:Anthony Mackie has to be totally hoping that this has implications for his future career. Sure. But Anthony Mackie like a lot if the good actors there will do fine in their careers because they are good at what they do. They'd find success anyday. What they hope is for the payday blockbusters bring. Okay maybe some noteriety.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:00
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Lurdiak posted:I got nothing against Falcon or him being Cap for a while but I just don't feel it has as much pathos as Bucky Cap or Miles Morales Spidey. It just feels like a friend filling in for Steve's shift. Although it does explain why Falcon made the big save in the last storyline. Well, there's no question that Steve's coming back. Although we all KNEW he was coming back after Bucky, it was at least permanent to the characters in the story. And for Miles, Peter almost certainly isn't coming back (that would be the worst possible revival ever, ugh). Since Steve isn't even dead right now, there's a lot less "I hope I can live up to his legacy" because you could just, y'know, ask him.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:02
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Sarchasm posted:Yeah, that always seemed like an obvious answer to me. He can't be peak Spider-man without the webs, and he wouldn't trade financial security for his ability to fight crime and save lives. Getting off Iron Man chat and moving to a previous discussion in the thread: I've always viewed Peter as genious derailed. He's definitely no Reed Richards/Tony Stark, but there's little doubt that he'd have a Dr. attached to his name at the very least if he didn't fill his life with heroics. If you sat down Peter and Reed Richards and asked each what their primary vocation is: Peter would say "Super Hero" and Reed would say "Scientist" and their priorities show in the books.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:04
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Rhymenoserous posted:If you sat down Peter and Reed Richards and asked each what their primary vocation is: Peter would say "Super Hero" and Reed would say "Scientist" and their priorities show in the books.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:09
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a couple full clips from Guardians have come out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8jIM9OPYao https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bFmqO7IF_A Im loving the dialogue already.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:16
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So. loving. Hype.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:19
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Love everything about that second scene.
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Jul 18, 2014 18:34
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theflyingorc posted:That's the rumor that's going around. I agree with this 100%, and I hope it all happens. At least in the comics, Steve is going to stick around to help Sam out as he transitions into the role of Cap, probably like a less gruff version of old Bruce Wayne mentoring Terry McGinnis. But in the movies, if Chris Evans wants to retire the costume after Cap 3 and Avengers 3, I can't think of a better solution than Anthony Mackie. Mackie's star is on the rise, he was awesome in Cap 2, and his character was shown as a decorated veteran soldier who helps other veterans, and he was quick to rise to the occasion and join up with more heroes to do the right thing. While I wouldn't be surprised if Cap 3 includes a redemption arc for Bucky, I'd rather they not turn him into Cap, but keep him as Winter Soldier for black ops missions that tie into darker corners of the MCU. Sam Wilson has already proven to be a brave, patriotic badass who also smiles and has fun, and I think it would be amazing for children of color to have one of the most prominent and respected superheroes look like them. And there's precedent, since Steve Rogers has stepped aside and been replaced before, so it won't come from out of nowhere. (And the Fox News crowd will lose their minds, which I'm already gleefully anticipating.)
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Jul 18, 2014 19:03
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Do you think they need to make Wilson superhuman in some way to take on the role?
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Jul 18, 2014 19:15
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greatn posted:Do you think they need to make Wilson superhuman in some way to take on the role? I think it can work either way, but either one would be a very different film from the other. A non-powered Cap would almost have to have his arc be about how he can be powerless and still be Captain America.
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Jul 18, 2014 19:19
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Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:(And the Fox News crowd will lose their minds, which I'm already gleefully anticipating.) I remember how they suddenly gave a poo poo about Ms. Marvel for just long enough to get outraged over Kamala Khan.
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Jul 18, 2014 19:21
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Captain Obama's America
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Jul 18, 2014 19:22
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