Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

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HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

Still, a unit of Grey Hunters wouldn't really be willing to have Coteaz walking among them as if he was one of the boys, no matter what enemy they're facing. They'd set aside their differences against a great threat, but I doubt they'd be best pals during the fight and it's stuff like that which isn't represented at all in the fluff anymore. Also, traitor IG AM have big restrictions placed on them since they dropped to Come the Apocalypse with CSM which really sucks. I get them not being battle bros with Chaos, but allies of convenience at least means a Leman Russ squadron won't do nothing for a turn just because a cultist walked a little too close to them.

Edit: It also leads to all Imperium armies having like 10 battle-brothers whereas Eldar, DEldar, CSM and Daemons have one and Tau, Tyranids, Orks and Necrons have none.

HiveCommander fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Jul 22, 2014

# ? Jul 22, 2014 06:03

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# ? May 13, 2024 21:52

DJ Dizzy: Feb 11, 2009; Real men don't use bolters.

Karandras posted:

What is Helfrost even good against? Why multi wound models have low S? I guess eat poo poo battlesuits?

Tau, multiwound eldar models I guess?

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:01

DJ Dizzy: Feb 11, 2009; Real men don't use bolters.

HiveCommander posted:

Still, a unit of Grey Hunters wouldn't really be willing to have Coteaz walking among them as if he was one of the boys, no matter what enemy they're facing. They'd set aside their differences against a great threat, but I doubt they'd be best pals during the fight and it's stuff like that which isn't represented at all in the fluff anymore. Also, traitor IG AM have big restrictions placed on them since they dropped to Come the Apocalypse with CSM which really sucks. I get them not being battle bros with Chaos, but allies of convenience at least means a Leman Russ squadron won't do nothing for a turn just because a cultist walked a little too close to them.

Edit: It also leads to all Imperium armies having like 10 battle-brothers whereas Eldar, DEldar, CSM and Daemons have one and Tau, Tyranids, Orks and Necrons have none.

Sounds like you don't know the Space Wolves :v:

The Inquisition has basically branded them heretics, Grimnar gives no fucks about that however.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:02

DO IT TO IT: Mar 3, 2008; I know "mon" means man, but I don't think "Och" means anything.

Crisis suits are Str 5 so even they only fail on a 6, like every other high Str model out there. I have no clue what the point of helfrost is.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:04

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

DJ Dizzy posted:

Sounds like you don't know the Space Wolves The Inquisition has basically branded them heretics, Grimnar gives no fucks about that however.

Space Wolves hate the poo poo out of the Inquisition because they don't even blink at the thought of sacrificing billions of Imperial citizens during the second(?) war or Armageddon just because there was a chance they could be tainted by Chaos. There's also the lack of Inquisitors ever making a return trip when they decide to poke their heads around on Fenris to see what's going on over there.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:09

Von Humboldt: Jan 13, 2009

DO IT TO IT posted:

Crisis suits are Str 5 so even they only fail on a 6, like every other high Str model out there. I have no clue what the point of helfrost is.

To make your opponent rage out when they fail a test on said Suit, some Spawn, or a Carnifex. It's a bonus that will - once handful of games - snipe of an extra model instead of having it fart around with a single wound. I think it's supposed to be a cool (or infuriating, depending on perspective,) bonus to the weapon.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:09

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

Von Humboldt posted:

To make your opponent rage out when they fail a test on said Suit, some Spawn, or a Carnifex. It's a bonus that will - once handful of games - snipe of an extra model instead of having it fart around with a single wound. I think it's supposed to be a cool (or infuriating, depending on perspective,) bonus to the weapon.

It's probably more for getting around Eternal Warrior on characters since it's an RFP effect.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:15

SRM: Jul 10, 2009; ~*FeElIn' AweS0mE*~

high six posted:

I wish Relic made the Ultramarines movie.

In any case, I am still learning how to do line highlights decently. My marines are all metallic silver. White highlights seem too bold, but toning the white down some seems to make said highlights invisible against the silver/grey. Any suggestions?

Relic didn't make that cinematic, Plastic Wax did. They're an animation studio that specifically makes cutscenes like that and the one from Dawn of War II: Retribution. They've also done everything from Fallout games to Darksiders, and while a whole movie of that quality would be awesome, it would be HORRENDOUSLY expensive. Animation ain't cheap!

Karandras posted:

What is Helfrost even good against? Why multi wound models have low S? I guess eat poo poo battlesuits?

I mean, that'll still ID Nobz and Tyranid Warriors a third of the time provided you hit a bunch. It'll still inflict instant death on a target 1/6th of the time.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:33

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

SRM posted:

Relic didn't make that cinematic, Plastic Wax did. They're an animation studio that specifically makes cutscenes like that and the one from Dawn of War II: Retribution. They've also done everything from Fallout games to Darksiders, and while a whole movie of that quality would be awesome, it would be HORRENDOUSLY expensive. Animation ain't cheap!

I mean, that'll still ID Nobz and Tyranid Warriors a third of the time provided you hit a bunch. It'll still inflict instant death on a target 1/6th of the time.

That's just the thing; it's not ID. It removes from play like the old Brotherhood Champion psychic power which makes it even better.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:35

SRM: Jul 10, 2009; ~*FeElIn' AweS0mE*~

HiveCommander posted:

That's just the thing; it's not ID. It removes from play like the old Brotherhood Champion psychic power which makes it even better.

I have the feeling that'll get FAQ'd away since that's not really a thing that's in the game anymore. I remember rules arguments over "removed outright" and "instant death" in 4th edition and they were a loving headache.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:39

The Sisko: Jan 9, 2009; "Whenever there's injustice, wrongs to be righted, innocents to be defended, The Sisko will be there, delivering ass-whooppings."

HiveCommander posted:

Space Wolves hate the poo poo out of the Inquisition because they don't even blink at the thought of sacrificing billions of Imperial citizens during the second(?) war or Armageddon just because there was a chance they could be tainted by Chaos. There's also the lack of Inquisitors ever making a return trip when they decide to poke their heads around on Fenris to see what's going on over there.

My favorite part of the Emperors Gift is when Bjorn is talking to an inquisitor and at some point the Inquisitor says something about the God-Emperor and Bjorn basically says "God-Emperor?! You realize that is how all this poo poo started. "

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:41

AbusePuppy: Nov 1, 2012; BEST DAY OF MY LIFE!!!!!! so far.

HiveCommander posted:

...yet Eldar are willing to bro-fist their outcast kin whom are responsible for making Slaanesh stronger by the day.
I miss the times where fluff reasons were a big contributing factor to different aspects of the game, such as Space Wolves hating the Inquisition and Black Templars refusing to fight alongside any non-Grey Knight psykers because they're not pure enough.

The thing is, you have to keep it all in perspective. Do the Space Woofs and Dark Angels loathe each other? Sure, they got a millenia-long rivary going there. But you know what's worse than that guy you hate at work? Genocidal monsters from beyond space and time that will devour you both, body and soul. The Imperium has a lot of poo poo on the table, and while they might be fragmented and bickering, when it hits the fan even they are smart enough to realize that they have bigger things to worry about.

Similarly, the Eldar and Dark Eldar, while rather different in outlook in most things, can at least agree on one important point: the survival of their race takes precedence over the existence of all of the filthy lesser species. And they even have a specific faction (Harlequins) whose job may as well be "convince these two idiots to work together for their own good."

In 40K, "hate" is a very relative term. There's all kinds of ways and degrees of hate, and some of them are more important than others. It is 100% plausible that SW and DA or Eld and DE are entirely willing to work together against outsiders.

Karandras posted:

What is Helfrost even good against? Why multi wound models have low S? I guess eat poo poo battlesuits?

Not a lot of them have low Strength, but that's not the point- it's a 1/3 or 1/6 chance of removing those tough multiwound models if you push a wound through. Are you chances of instagibbing a Carnifex or Hive Tyrant particularly high? No, not really, but their having to roll that "save or die" on them gives you that little bit of extra chance of taking out a tough threat more easily.

SRM posted:

I have the feeling that'll get FAQ'd away since that's not really a thing that's in the game anymore. I remember rules arguments over "removed outright" and "instant death" in 4th edition and they were a loving headache.

Except that it is. There are lots of "removed as a casualty with no saves of any kind allowed" effects still in the game. If they meant Instant Death, they would've given it Instant Death. The "arguments" were pretty much always just people who didn't want those sort of things to work trying to rationalize reasons that they shouldn't- there has never been any real rules support for Eternal Warrior protecting you from that sort of thing, because (in this case at least) the rules are rather clear.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:50

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

AbusePuppy posted:

Except that it is. There are lots of "removed as a casualty with no saves of any kind allowed" effects still in the game. If they meant Instant Death, they would've given it Instant Death. The "arguments" were pretty much always just people who didn't want those sort of things to work trying to rationalize reasons that they shouldn't- there has never been any real rules support for Eternal Warrior protecting you from that sort of thing, because (in this case at least) the rules are rather clear.

I loved that with the 3rd ed GK codex in 4th/early 5th. Yes, my Grand Master can force weapon your Eternal Warrior models. Got a problem with it? Tell it to the 4++ melee-only against a single enemy model Storm Shield. That usually shut them up :smug:

# ? Jul 22, 2014 07:55

Fix: Jul 26, 2005; NEWT THE MOON

Was cleaning out my PM inbox. Found this:

Posted it.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 08:01

Improbable Lobster: Jan 6, 2012; "From each according to his ability" said Ares. It sounded like a quotation.; Buglord

Blue Horrors are neato

# ? Jul 22, 2014 08:24

xtothez: Jan 4, 2004; College Slice

Two Feet From Bread posted:

So, the new nid can be fantasitc as a vehicle breaker. If it hits a vehicle on a 6 then it does an automatic S10 AP1 attack. Does AP1 still give +2 to the Damage Roll?

Unfortunately that attack only hits Infantry without Extremely Bulky. At best it'll kill Terminators and the like, although anyone without an invuln is toast.

Strength of Many posted:

edit: updated my army list! managed to trim it down to 1850 and squeeze in another unit.

If you can squeeze an extra 20pts (probably by dropping guants or TS on the Trygon), give adrenals to the Gargoyles. Not only does it give them Fleet, but they become S4 on the charge, making them more effective against infantry and able to glance down rear AV10 vehicles.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 08:44

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

AbusePuppy posted:

Except that it is. There are lots of "removed as a casualty with no saves of any kind allowed" effects still in the game. If they meant Instant Death, they would've given it Instant Death. The "arguments" were pretty much always just people who didn't want those sort of things to work trying to rationalize reasons that they shouldn't- there has never been any real rules support for Eternal Warrior protecting you from that sort of thing, because (in this case at least) the rules are rather clear.

Yes indeed. I've sucked draigo into a monolith.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 08:49

DJ Dizzy: Feb 11, 2009; Real men don't use bolters.

But hey, you can still "We'll be back" against Lukas' stasisbomb!

# ? Jul 22, 2014 10:51

ijyt: Apr 10, 2012

Fix posted:

Was cleaning out my PM inbox. Found this:

Posted it.

Man, the old models were much more terrifying/twisted than the new ones.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 11:05

my kinda ape: Sep 15, 2008; Everything's gonna be A-OK; Oven Wrangler

Hollismason posted:

I don't get the reference. What is it referencing?

For real you really need to play Homeworld. Fortunately an HD version is in the works so assuming Gearbox doesn't gently caress it up somehow there'll be a shiny new version to play within like 6 months! People aren't kidding when they say it has some of the best storytelling of any game and they don't mean "for an RTS".

# ? Jul 22, 2014 11:43

Lungboy: Aug 23, 2002; NEED SQUAT FORM HELP

Karandras posted:

What is Helfrost even good against? Why multi wound models have low S?

Ripper Swarms!

# ? Jul 22, 2014 12:05

Exinos: Mar 1, 2009; OSHA approved squiq

Lungboy posted:

Ripper Swarms!

We have finally found the counter to bring them under control.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 12:17

LordAba: Oct 22, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

DO IT TO IT posted:

Crisis suits are Str 5 so even they only fail on a 6, like every other high Str model out there. I have no clue what the point of helfrost is.

S6 Ap3 blast? S8 Ap1 shot? A 1/6 chance of completely removing a monstrous creature? A 1/3 chance of removing something that is S4 (nobs, a lot of ICs)? Completely useless!

# ? Jul 22, 2014 12:34

Karandras: Apr 27, 2006

LordAba posted:

S6 Ap3 blast? S8 Ap1 shot? A 1/6 chance of completely removing a monstrous creature? A 1/3 chance of removing something that is S4 (nobs, a lot of ICs)? Completely useless!

Keeping in mind if it's T3 or lower it'll be Instant Death'd anyway, and if it's T4 then the lance will ID as well. It's not that it's useless, it's more that it's almost functionally identical to the myriad of "Instant Death on a 6" mechanics already out there. It's just mechanically uninspiring.

I get that they thought a S test is neat and thematic but it's basically just fail on a six all but exclusively.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 13:44

drgnvale: Apr 30, 2004; A sword is not cutlery!

Well, I guess my space wolves opponent will be getting one (or more) of these for sure; he hates my biker chapter master's ability to tank his vindicators with a passion (to the point where I've been thinking of leaving him at home, even though I love the dawn of war 2 feeling I get using him).

Did someone in this thread post the actual text of the helfrost rule and I just missed it, or are we all trying to read under the lovely MS paint obscuring of the leaked images? Is it a strength test on unsaved wounds? Do wounds prevented by feel no pain still count as unsaved?

Edit: If he does start bringing these, I guess I won't feel bad at all about bringing the biker CM, and maybe I'll grab him a biker command squad (with a token librarian or chaplain to unlock them) to run around with.

drgnvale fucked around with this message at 14:12 on Jul 22, 2014

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:10

Keeku: Jun 3, 2005

Only just got back into wargaming about a month or two back after a few years out, and I'm wondering about how new releases are handled these days: Does anyone know much about the Red Waaagh book? Is it a limited time only thing or is it likely to still be available in a year or two?

I've noticed it's not available much on ebay or in independent stockists. Is this normal for a new release? Is it expected to become more widely available from other places other than GW direct?

Edit: If it helps, I'm in Australia. GW direct wants $83 for it, which is a wee bit silly.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:25

CyberLord XP: Oct 18, 2005; Goldie...She says her name is Goldie

Now Ork warbuggies are temporarily out of stock on GW's website. FFFFFFFF.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:36

NTRabbit: Aug 15, 2012; i wear this armour to protect myself from the histrionics of hysterical women

bitches

Keeku posted:

Is this normal for a new release? Is it expected to become more widely available from other places other than GW direct?

Edit: If it helps, I'm in Australia. GW direct wants $83 for it, which is a wee bit silly.

You mean the Waaagh! Ghazghkull Ork supplement? Yes, and eventually, but you're still going to be paying about $69 for it with retail discount, which is still silly.

Alternatively you can drop $50 on the interactive ibook, or $40 on the ebook

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:42

Sykic: Feb 9, 2004; Resist! Humanity demands it! Resist!

Slimnoid posted:

that purple is loving swag-a-licious.

Post 9-11 User posted:

gently caress drat, that's a good looking paintjob.

DJ Dizzy posted:

that ballsout amazing paintjob

You guys

. My only regret is that I went with the giant power fist thing and then, after it was finished, realised I should have used a blood talon instead. Anyone complaining about WYSIWYG can shove it :colbert:

DJ Dizzy, do you have any close up macro shots of those models? I admire anyone who has the balls to paint white.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:48

A 50S RAYGUN: Aug 22, 2011

drgnvale posted:

Well, I guess my space wolves opponent will be getting one (or more) of these for sure; he hates my biker chapter master's ability to tank his vindicators with a passion (to the point where I've been thinking of leaving him at home, even though I love the dawn of war 2 feeling I get using him).

Did someone in this thread post the actual text of the helfrost rule and I just missed it, or are we all trying to read under the lovely MS paint obscuring of the leaked images? Is it a strength test on unsaved wounds? Do wounds prevented by feel no pain still count as unsaved?

Edit: If he does start bringing these, I guess I won't feel bad at all about bringing the biker CM, and maybe I'll grab him a biker command squad (with a token librarian or chaplain to unlock them) to run around with.

We know the rule (well, we have a leaked version of the rule). It's a strength test per unsaved wounds. A feel no pain is an attempt to negate an unsaved wound and as such even wounds saved by a FNP trigger a S test.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:49

drgnvale: Apr 30, 2004; A sword is not cutlery!

Yeah, that'll gently caress up my chapter master good on the times it manages to get through, but it'll be fairly easy to avoid given how fliers move. I like that it'll force me to make decisions on whether to get stuck in CC or try to move and hide, whereas right now my CM just kinda goes where he wants and acts like an rear end in a top hat to any units he feels like. God drat I love that unit.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 14:58

Keeku: Jun 3, 2005

NTRabbit posted:

You mean the Waaagh! Ghazghkull Ork supplement? Yes, and eventually, but you're still going to be paying about $69 for it with retail discount, which is still silly.

Alternatively you can drop $50 on the interactive ibook, or $40 on the ebook

Nah not the Waaagh Ghazghkull book, the Sanctus Reach campaign book: 'The Red Waaagh'. Campaigns like that are right up my gaming group's alley. I don't want to miss out on it, but also don't want to spend GW's asking price. Hoping for at least a little bit of the price off but just unsure if this particular book is limited and will be gone for good in a month or two.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 15:36

SRM: Jul 10, 2009; ~*FeElIn' AweS0mE*~

Keeku posted:

Nah not the Waaagh Ghazghkull book, the Sanctus Reach campaign book: 'The Red Waaagh'. Campaigns like that are right up my gaming group's alley. I don't want to miss out on it, but also don't want to spend GW's asking price. Hoping for at least a little bit of the price off but just unsure if this particular book is limited and will be gone for good in a month or two.

I don't think it's limited; it's at least not advertised that way, and GW's pretty explicit about that these days. There's a mini campaign supplement in the Stormclaw box set, but it's only 32 pages. I don't know if it takes stuff from the Red Waaagh campaign book or not. I can see that as the one thing from the Stormclaw set that goes for a cheapish price since it's not as useful to everybody.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 15:40

Proletariat Beowulf: Jan 7, 2007; I wish meat screamed as I ate it.

WhiteOutMouse posted:

It has already been said that the rulebook allies matrix has been streamlined to make it easier.

If you don't want they to ally then don't ally them. But there are plenty of situations where Eldar of both types will work with each other to spit on a bunch of mortal apes. It allows the many people who want to do it the pathway, and it makes sense anyway.

They also removed the worst part of the 'come the apocalypse' barrier as well, since awesome Count-as people like Buffalo Chicken can make amazing conversions. Oh, and 40k basically is already the apocalypse so I guess the chaos daemons fight the tryanids in a battle that happens to include some Imperial guard, wha'daya know.

http://www.bartertown.com/trading/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=237687&sid=29e42c95c5ae9a23491c2906b6d11f73

Speak of the devil: a "Deff Wing" army. This thing rules.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 15:50

Enentol: Jul 16, 2005; Middle Class Gangster

Proletariat Beowulf posted:

http://www.bartertown.com/trading/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=237687&sid=29e42c95c5ae9a23491c2906b6d11f73

Speak of the devil: a "Deff Wing" army. This thing rules.

This guy. This guy understands 40k.

Possibly the best "counts-as" army I've ever seen. :black101:

# ? Jul 22, 2014 16:11

Moola: Aug 16, 2006

Rules question because FW is weird at writing rules sometimes:

Can Commander R'Alai leave his drones if he wants to?

quote:

Lone Warrior:
Shas'O R'alai can not leave or join units other than the unit he forms with his Blacklight Drones...

I'm not sure if the intention is that he can leave his drones and become a unit of 1, or they meant to write 'he cannot leave or join units, but he and his drones form a unit'.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 18:50

Raphus C: Feb 17, 2011

CyberLord XP posted:

Now Ork warbuggies are temporarily out of stock on GW's website. FFFFFFFF.

Yeah but they look like poo poo so don't buy them.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 19:09

CyberLord XP: Oct 18, 2005; Goldie...She says her name is Goldie

Raphus C posted:

Yeah but they look like poo poo so don't buy them.

I want one for comparison for the fifteen or so I'm converting up.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 19:19

PierreTheMime: Dec 9, 2004; Hero of hormagaunts everywhere!; Buglord

Tuesday afternoon status:
Spent the morning with layering colors. Just finished up applying shade across the whole Exocrine, now I'm onto doing skin and carapace touch-ups before final detailing.

It's almost done. I both love and hate painting big bugs.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 19:22

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# ? May 13, 2024 21:52

TKIY: Nov 6, 2012; Grimey Drawer

Looks great! I still have to decide on a colour scheme for my Nids but the escalation league I am in starting September has points for painting so I better hurry up.

# ? Jul 22, 2014 19:33

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

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