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AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!
Jesus Christ.

Knyteguy, your grip on reality just got questionable. Do yourself a favor and stop counting piles of money you haven't even begun to make with raises you do not have. You don't even get to have visions of where your finances will be in 2-5 years because right now your head is in the clouds and you are having an orgasm about how the money you haven't yet saved next month is going to magically set you free from wage slavery in 10 year or someshit.

Buckle the gently caress down and get some discipline. Your categories are sloppy and you spend on a whim. God damnit I can smell an unplanned purchase of $300 dollars worth of bath products because your pregger wife needs to be pampered and hey, those supplies will last 6 months, after this, we swear no more breaking the budget.

I'm pulling for you, bud. But at the moment, you are like that kid in karate that is thinking about how they are going to beat up the world as soon as they have their 6th degree like sensei except here you don't have piss for baby savings and you are already going to beat the system and retire before 40.

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Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Aristotle Animes posted:

Jesus Christ.

Knyteguy, your grip on reality just got questionable. Do yourself a favor and stop counting piles of money you haven't even begun to make with raises you do not have. You don't even get to have visions of where your finances will be in 2-5 years because right now your head is in the clouds and you are having an orgasm about how the money you haven't yet saved next month is going to magically set you free from wage slavery in 10 year or someshit.

Buckle the gently caress down and get some discipline. Your categories are sloppy and you spend on a whim. God damnit I can smell an unplanned purchase of $300 dollars worth of bath products because your pregger wife needs to be pampered and hey, those supplies will last 6 months, after this, we swear no more breaking the budget.

I'm pulling for you, bud. But at the moment, you are like that kid in karate that is thinking about how they are going to beat up the world as soon as they have their 6th degree like sensei except here you don't have piss for baby savings and you are already going to beat the system and retire before 40.

I may stop posting here except to post budget updates. It's totally unhelpful.

quote:

To clarify:
My short term goal for tomorrow (and the next day ad infinitum until we get to budget more in the categories) is to not spend any money on restaurants, alcohol, clothing, or entertainment. Just because I didn't post that in the thread doesn't mean it's not a goal. It has been a goal every day since we hit our discretionary budget. This thread would be really boring to read if I said that same thing every day for the next 100 days (I try to keep it a little interesting), but it is still a goal.

I don't know what more I can say about how we are focusing on the present.

in_cahoots posted:

I think it would be useful for you to post your household purchases in August. I've harped on you before for your pet care costs, but your 'necessary' monthly expenses seem extremely high on a regular basis. You might be able to save just by switching to generics/ shopping on Amazon or Costco. Even lumping your errands together on a weekly or biweekly basis would save on gas.

Will do.

Kiwi Ghost Chips
Feb 19, 2011

Start using the best desktop environment now!
Choose KDE!

Do you have a business plan for your side gig?

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Kiwi Ghost Chips posted:

Do you have a business plan for your side gig?

Yes but it is entirely unorthodox. At the moment it is keep billing my current client until they stop paying. I'll probably retire almost everything to do with it and start over later when that finally happens. There isn't a lot of goodwill associated with the name beyond my local clients anymore, since I was unable to continue focusing on it.

Droo
Jun 25, 2003

Knyteguy posted:

I may stop posting here except to post budget updates. It's totally unhelpful.

You said you could retire early at 40 on $600,000 with a 4% withdrawal rate. If you can live easily on $2000 a month, why have you been unable to save more than a $1000 emergency fund? Especially considering you don't have a child yet.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Droo posted:

You said you could retire early at 40 on $600,000 with a 4% withdrawal rate. If you can live easily on $2000 a month, why have you been unable to save more than a $1000 emergency fund? Especially considering you don't have a child yet.

Think about this while completely discounting the age in the equation. Also assume this isn't me. This is some couple who has a stellar record with money and is naturally very frugal. They have the same income as us right now.

Assume this couple had a paid off house and no car payment (which I qualified this with) they could definitely retire on that.

In fact according to our expense outflow we (who aren't as frugal as example couple) lived on $1791.00 this month assuming a paid off house and no car payment. If we didn't have to move it would be $1691.00 this month. Add in some property taxes on a very modest home and there is still some wiggle room there. Add another 5 years of work at even 50% savings and that's $2667.00/mo. That should be enough to take care of the kid too.

Also it's safe to assume the example couple could live more frugally if they didn't have to worry about going to work. They could live somewhere where almost everything was within walking distance. Car maintenance would go down because less miles would be driven, gas would go down, etc. They would be older, so car insurance would likely go down.

Is this couple us? No. At least not yet.

Is the 4% withdrawal completely safe? No. Nothing is ever completely safe. I could get hit by a car while out walking with my wife, but I still go out and walk. The goal is to minimize risks of course. The model also doesn't take into account that social security will increase livable income.

Where are some of the other financial independence guys on this forum?

Anyway Aristotle said it right that we shouldn't even think about our financial future 2-5 years from now. OK then can we stop saying I'm delusional for quoting a respected authority? I won't bring it up again until we have $100,000 sitting cush in the bank and we have no debt (though the thread won't be around then I assume). If we cannot achieve this goal then obviously it won't get brought up again. Fair?

Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Jul 22, 2014

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Droo posted:

You said you could retire early at 40 on $600,000 with a 4% withdrawal rate. If you can live easily on $2000 a month, why have you been unable to save more than a $1000 emergency fund? Especially considering you don't have a child yet.

And sorry I didn't even fully address your point in the last post ($1000.00 emergency fund): you're right. That's why my attention is what we can do today and tomorrow (literally tomorrow not 10 years in the future) and etc etc I feel like a broken record here.

In fact I've been contemplating the past couple of days whether I can hire just 1 mover tomorrow to help save money.

Droo
Jun 25, 2003

I was trying to get you to realize why everyone is saying you are delusional. Honestly, no one reading this thread understands why you can't see it the same way we all do.

As far as your hypothetical early retired couple:

* Health insurance and out of pocket costs for a family of 3 will easily be $500 per month
* I have found that my expenses go up when I'm not working because you have 50 extra hours in the week to do stuff
* 4% isn't really considered to be "ALMOST BULLETPROOF BUT OBVIOUSLY NOT ENTIRELY LOL". 4% is considered too high for a 50 year draw

Veskit
Mar 2, 2005

I love capitalism!! DM me for the best investing advice!
Why is everyone talking about how to climb Mount Everest when he can barely get carried by a sherpa.

Droo
Jun 25, 2003

Well, I'm talking about it because I feel that having well defined, realistic and achievable future goals is the only way most people can motivate themselves to make sacrifices in lifestyle now.

A lot of people I know who have extra monthly income end up wasting it on stupid poo poo, and I feel like they do it because they just don't know what else to do with their money and they don't have a good vision of their possible future.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Droo posted:

I was trying to get you to realize why everyone is saying you are delusional. Honestly, no one reading this thread understands why you can't see it the same way we all do.

As far as your hypothetical early retired couple:

* Health insurance and out of pocket costs for a family of 3 will easily be $500 per month
* I have found that my expenses go up when I'm not working because you have 50 extra hours in the week to do stuff
* 4% isn't really considered to be "ALMOST BULLETPROOF BUT OBVIOUSLY NOT ENTIRELY LOL". 4% is considered too high for a 50 year draw

* Health insurance beyond disaster would be unnecessary because you could self insure. My uncle self insures just fine and I don't think he has even $600k in the bank. He's a natural saver and always has been. But you're right that health costs aren't really considered in that equation and it would need to be thought out extensively. An HSA building interest might be safe bet.
* You're probably right. A hard baseline would need to be set to absolutely ensure you don't spend a dollar more. It would take years of disciplined behavior.
* Again this assumes you never make a single dollar more in your life. Seriously read the MMM 4% article and then argue the flaws? It makes sense to me at least. Also http://www.firecalc.com/ can test any 30 year period. 20,000/yr with a $600,000 portfolio has a historical 100% success rate for 30 years even through the worst stock market drops in history. 30 years after my retirement I'll be well into social security to help offset costs. poo poo I might even be dead if I retire at 65.

Anyway that's all I have to say about that. I didn't realize there was so much controversy.

With that said I will give an earnest attempt to start seeing myself in this thread as everyone else is. Who knows maybe I've isolated my thinking reading too much financial independence stuff or something.

Droo posted:

Well, I'm talking about it because I feel that having well defined, realistic and achievable future goals is the only way most people can motivate themselves to make sacrifices in lifestyle now.

A lot of people I know who have extra monthly income end up wasting it on stupid poo poo, and I feel like they do it because they just don't know what else to do with their money and they don't have a good vision of their possible future.

Saw this after I posted. Right I'm just trying to set goals so I realize why I'm sacrificing buying stupid gadgets and stuff. Please help me adjust my goals if they seem stupid or ignorant. I'm entirely open to things beyond people saying "that's stupid" if there is some ideas on how to adjust my goals.

Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Jul 22, 2014

Inept
Jul 8, 2003

Droo posted:

I was trying to get you to realize why everyone is saying you are delusional. Honestly, no one reading this thread understands why you can't see it the same way we all do.

As far as your hypothetical early retired couple:

* Health insurance and out of pocket costs for a family of 3 will easily be $500 per month
* I have found that my expenses go up when I'm not working because you have 50 extra hours in the week to do stuff
* 4% isn't really considered to be "ALMOST BULLETPROOF BUT OBVIOUSLY NOT ENTIRELY LOL". 4% is considered too high for a 50 year draw

Also I don't think his savings goal of $560,000 is inflation adjusted. At 4% withdrawal, that's $1866 a month. Even assuming a very low average inflation rate of 2%, that $1866 will be worth less than $1500 in 10 years. You might be able to live, but you won't be doing anything at all ever.

I don't think the attacks on his wife are warranted at all though. She seems to be the sane spender in the relationship.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Inept posted:

Also I don't think his savings goal of $560,000 is inflation adjusted. At 4% withdrawal, that's $1866 a month. Even assuming a very low average inflation rate of 2%, that $1866 will be worth less than $1500 in 10 years. You might be able to live, but you won't be doing anything at all ever.

I don't think the attacks on his wife are warranted at all though. She seems to be the sane spender in the relationship.

Inept first thank you for saying that. My wife is truly my better half, and you're completely right that she is a sane spender. She contemplates spending $1.00 like it is the hardest decision of her life sometimes (seriously she'll call and ask me if it's alright if she gets a pack of gum sometimes).

I want to reiterate that my goal is not $560,000.00. Right now it's $4,500 by the end of August, although I hope we can save more.

I made the mistake of bringing hypotheticals in here, because I was getting excited about saving money and how much better our lives could be.

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X
Knyte, I think it's time to buckle down on the expenditures for a few months, bump savings up, and then once you know you can handle it, use Excel to do some projections. Otherwise everyone is going to jump down your throat being you haven't stuck with your goals for very long any one time in the past. That's my take on it, at least. I'm also rooting for you to win.

Knyteguy posted:

Yes but it is entirely unorthodox. At the moment it is keep billing my current client until they stop paying. I'll probably retire almost everything to do with it and start over later when that finally happens. There isn't a lot of goodwill associated with the name beyond my local clients anymore, since I was unable to continue focusing on it.
I think he means a business plan. A written document you can hand to someone and they would understand what you're doing and how you're operating your company. We have one for my 'shop', and it's 2 of us doing a few hundred in biz per year.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

SiGmA_X posted:

Knyte, I think it's time to buckle down on the expenditures for a few months, bump savings up, and then once you know you can handle it, use Excel to do some projections. Otherwise everyone is going to jump down your throat being you haven't stuck with your goals for very long any one time in the past. That's my take on it, at least. I'm also rooting for you to win.

Agreed. I'm confident we can save money in August... and we'll have to go from there. One step at a time I suppose.

SiGmA_X posted:

I think he means a business plan. A written document you can hand to someone and they would understand what you're doing and how you're operating your company. We have one for my 'shop', and it's 2 of us doing a few hundred in biz per year.

I know; I was trying to be a little bit of a smart rear end :). The answer to the question is no. I don't have any written document or anything like that.


Edit and also there's a couple people I want to apologize to for being kind of a dick: Aristotle Animes, and Aagar. Sorry.

Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 01:42 on Jul 23, 2014

Slow Motion
Jul 19, 2004

My favorite things in life are sex, drugs, feeling like a baller, and being $30,000 in debt.
Hold tough buddy. You're going to be just fine even if you don't retire at 37.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Slow Motion posted:

Hold tough buddy. You're going to be just fine even if you don't retire at 37.

I know dude that's not even a big deal. I'll take the well wishes though. Thanks.

Edit: can't tell if you're being genuine here.

Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jul 23, 2014

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal
So I'm a little bored at work waiting for my ride, so I decided to flesh out the budget for August using recent YNAB data. Plus there has been a little too much arguing in the thread (I'll take responsibility for that) and I'd appreciate getting back to business.

code:
Misc Expenses:      $30.00
Business:           $38.00
Optional Expenses:  $200.00 (Entertainment, clothes, restaurants, alcohol) - $100.00 ea
Monthly Bills:      $165.69 - Rent & Internet paid in July
Debt:               $609.04
Mandatory Expenses: $760
{
    Groceries:       $350.00
    Fuel:            $150.00
    Medical:         $60.00
    Pets:            $200.00 - Dog is getting spayed so it will be more than this month
    Household Goods: $20.00 - May reallocate to grooming
}

Total Expenses: $1803.00
------------------------

Net Income: $6150 (conservative)
    Me:  $4200
    Her: $1800 - paid 3 times August
    Biz: $150 - July's invoice will be paid in August

Savings Goal: $3,800.00
Leftover: $547.00
Mandatory is low since we'll be front loading the payments for internet and rent this month. This may be a little higher if we keep our renter's insurance.

Note: See this bottom of this post for categorization explanations:
http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3586966&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=13#post432393777

I'm giving us a little padding for the savings goal (all that leftover) in case I've missed something. I used this month's expenses to come up with the numbers. I also lowballed our incomes just in case (maybe $100-$200).

What do you guys think? Unrealistic, balanced, or does it need some work?

Edit: updated according to suggestions

Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 02:38 on Jul 23, 2014

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

Knyteguy posted:

So I'm a little bored at work waiting for my ride, so I decided to flesh out the budget for August using recent YNAB data. Plus there has been a little too much arguing in the thread and I'd appreciate getting back to business. I'll take responsibility for that.

code:

Misc Expenses:      $30.00
Business:           $38.00
Optional Expenses:  $55.00 (Entertainment, clothes, restaurants, alcohol)
Monthly Bills:      $165.69 - Rent & Internet paid in July
Debt:               $609.04
Mandatory Expenses: $760
{
    Groceries:       $350.00
    Fuel:            $150.00
    Medical:         $60.00
    Pets:            $200.00 - Dog is getting spayed so it will be more than this month
    Household Goods: $20.00 - May reallocate to grooming
}

Total Expenses: $1674.00
--------------------------------
Net Income: $6150 (conservative)
    Me:  $4200
    Her: $1800 - paid 3 times August
    Biz: $150 - July's invoice will be paid in August

Savings Goal: $3,800.00
Leftover: $646.00

Mandatory is low since we'll be front loading the payments for internet and rent this month. This may be a little higher if we keep our renter's insurance.

Note: See this bottom of this post for categorization explanations:
http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3586966&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=13#post432393777

I'm giving us a little padding for the savings goal (all that leftover) in case I've missed something. I used this month's expenses to come up with the numbers. I also lowballed our incomes just in case (maybe $100-$200).

What do you guys think? Unrealistic, balanced, or does it need some work?
In all honesty, too little in entertainment I'm guessing. If obtainable, FTMFW.

I think you can get a month ahead now, no? May be a good idea.

Hawkperson
Jun 20, 2003

Is the $30 misc expenses something random you know you're doing, or a catchall for unknown quantities?

Optional expenses at $55 is REALLY low. It is awesome that you are determined to spend wisely, and you have done a good job this month too. BUT your average spending in that category is like $800, right? And this month you spent $200 in optional expenses. Now, $800 is obviously too much, but reducing it to $200 I feel is pretty cool, and I doubt there would be many people in the thread complaining about a two-person family spending $200 total in restaurants/fun stuff in a month.

In my experience, when I cut my fun money that severely, I do okay for a weekend, maybe two. But heading towards the middle of the month, I start getting really antsy, maybe a little depressed even, because I feel so restricted. That makes me start looking at my leftover money - in your case, $646 - and start rationalizing why it's okay to spend that money. I mean, it's not even assigned to a category, right? Anyhow, basically what happens to me is I end up spending way more than if I had just reserved myself $200 (or $100/person, whatever) to spend on what I wanted in the first place.

That said, if you have a plan for the month where you know exactly what you're going to do for fun, and it fits into $55, go for it. Like maybe you're going to go hiking or camping or something else cheap but fulfilling and time-consuming (so that you're not sitting at home bored looking at things you could buy off the internet). But if you don't, I would seriously recommend raising your discretionary cap to $200 just so that you don't feel choked.

Nocheez
Sep 5, 2000

Can you spare a little cheddar?
Nap Ghost
I agree. I would allocate $100 to each person, in cash, and that's it for the month. That's still enough to have a little fun, and go out to eat an extra time or buy a little something you want.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal
OK all three of you would be tough to argue with :). I upped optional to $200.00. We don't usually divy up stuff between us but my wife wants to try it (each getting some blow money). I'm jealous because she will probably save it for 5 years without spending it, and I'll probably spend it dry every month. Nah I'm gonna try to compete with her actually.

I think it will be really cool to do it with cash because then I can do guilt free spending on something like an energy drink without screwing up grocery.

Hawkgirl posted:

Is the $30 misc expenses something random you know you're doing, or a catchall for unknown quantities?

Optional expenses at $55 is REALLY low. It is awesome that you are determined to spend wisely, and you have done a good job this month too. BUT your average spending in that category is like $800, right? And this month you spent $200 in optional expenses. Now, $800 is obviously too much, but reducing it to $200 I feel is pretty cool, and I doubt there would be many people in the thread complaining about a two-person family spending $200 total in restaurants/fun stuff in a month.

In my experience, when I cut my fun money that severely, I do okay for a weekend, maybe two. But heading towards the middle of the month, I start getting really antsy, maybe a little depressed even, because I feel so restricted. That makes me start looking at my leftover money - in your case, $646 - and start rationalizing why it's okay to spend that money. I mean, it's not even assigned to a category, right? Anyhow, basically what happens to me is I end up spending way more than if I had just reserved myself $200 (or $100/person, whatever) to spend on what I wanted in the first place.

That said, if you have a plan for the month where you know exactly what you're going to do for fun, and it fits into $55, go for it. Like maybe you're going to go hiking or camping or something else cheap but fulfilling and time-consuming (so that you're not sitting at home bored looking at things you could buy off the internet). But if you don't, I would seriously recommend raising your discretionary cap to $200 just so that you don't feel choked.

Hawkgirl yes miscellaneous is pretty much the odd stuff we can't find a better fit for. I paid a friend commission on a gun sale so I put that money in there for example. I also put a random fee I got from paying a bill with a debit card.

I can totally understand that logic of the leftover money looking really tempting (I hadn't thought about that). When the money actually hits the account I will make sure to categorize it immediately with YNAB.

Nocheez
Sep 5, 2000

Can you spare a little cheddar?
Nap Ghost
Good choice! It will be hard the first month, but you'll eventually realize the true value of the things you buy.

Old Fart
Jul 25, 2013

SiGmA_X posted:

I think you can get a month ahead now, no? May be a good idea.
Getting a month ahead in our budget was the best thing we ever did. Our savings graph started skyrocketing from that point and has only slowed down once (pet and computer crisis in the same month, but still didn't dip into e-fund).

It may seem like a small technicality, but it's really not. Get a month ahead. Budget only the money that you've made the previous month. Prioritize savings before you budget for anything else. Pick a percentage, put it away, and never ever justify deviating. Don't break that seal.

Veskit
Mar 2, 2005

I love capitalism!! DM me for the best investing advice!
Knyte have you checked your local animal shelter for spaying deals? Our city has a heavy discount to spaying if you do it through the county system instead of going private. I've seen a lot of incentive programs for that.

spwrozek
Sep 4, 2006

Sail when it's windy

I think you need more categories or are missing some important ones (granted I don't remember all the details of what you have going on):

Home: Rent, Electric, Gas, Water, Trash, Cable/Internet, Home Supplies, Lawn/Garden, Cell Phone

Daily Living: Groceries, Personal Supplies (soap, TP, etc), Clothing, Alcohol, Eating Out, Salon/Barber

Transportation: Car Payment, Fuel, Parking, Repairs, License/Registration, Car Wash, Insurance

Health care: Out of pocket costs (not sure how you account for this, mine is off budget in an HSA that I don't track)

Loans: I don't know if you have any of these left or not

Business expenses: Broken down by whatever you need for your thing

Entertainment: Movies, Books, Sports, Her Spend, You Spend, any other thing you like to do (Or you just give each of you $100 and call it good...)

Pets: Food, Medical, toys, etc

Vacation: Flights, Food, Car Rental

The big thing you are not accounting for it seems is things that come up every 6 months or a year. You need to put away the money for those each month or oops, you don't have enough (pay day loans sound familiar?)

Even on stuff like household goods, you are going to put $0 this month but then you need $40 say next month. You can put $20 this month and then another $20 next month and be good.

Are your numbers and categories based on past spending? Did you analyze CC statements or are you using Mint?

I just feel like you are going to go 'yes $3000 saved' only to have a bunch of stuff you could have planned for and only save $500 next month or have to go into the negative.

I am also confused how you are paying 0 rent in August. If you pay August's in July you will pay September's in August right?

You have an aggressive plan, especially as your wife gets more and more pregnant (eats more, more doctors visits, needs new clothes, etc.). You have a plan though so you are at least on the path.

AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!

Knyteguy posted:

Aristotle Animes,
I didn't need to be so rough. I'm sorry. I'm glad you are excited about saving! And I'm actually glad to see you've eased up on the austerity as well. 3,800 is still a lofty goal.

Colin Mockery
Jun 24, 2007
Rawr



Knyteguy posted:

So I'm a little bored at work waiting for my ride, so I decided to flesh out the budget for August using recent YNAB data. Plus there has been a little too much arguing in the thread (I'll take responsibility for that) and I'd appreciate getting back to business.

What do you guys think? Unrealistic, balanced, or does it need some work?

Edit: updated according to suggestions

I think the general consensus is that it's better to have a slightly more relaxed budget that you can consistently meet versus a strict budget that you fail to meet.

So honestly, since you've had spending trouble in the past, I'd even go so far as to increase your misc expenses to 200/mo. That can cover some of the extra necessities that you inevitably forgot about.

DON'T spend up to that amount if you have some left over -- instead, roll any eventual extra amount into a separate tracked bucket so that you can spend, say, 250 next month if you only spent 150 this month (only spending the surplus you currently have, obviously).

People don't want you to be miserable and only eating rice and beans for six months in a row or stealing toilet paper from work to save twenty bucks a month or anything extreme like that, and with your income, you aren't in such dire straights that you need to do that.

You just need to control of your spending and you think you do, but you really don't, because you promise yourself one thing and then two weeks later future Knyteguy is like "gently caress it, I'd rather have instant gratification" and suddenly, 600 dollars spent on restaurants in a month.


Hell, for a starter month (whichever month you aren't in a contest with slomo), looking at your past expenditures, I'd even consider going something like

500 groceries (high to encourage cooking or date nights at home instead of eating out)
400 entertainment (includes clothing/grooming and alcohol, where you normally spend ~1000 on)
200 medical
200 misc expenses (moving the "household goods" category into this one)
200 pet


And then aim to get as far under those budget numbers as you can comfortably (ie without feeling sad about how few nice things you're getting) get, and if you can successfully meet those much more generous numbers, then you can tighten the belt even further and feel good about doing so.

Colin Mockery fucked around with this message at 06:31 on Jul 23, 2014

facey fred
Sep 17, 2007
quite facey

Knyteguy posted:

Mandatory is low since we'll be front loading the payments for internet and rent this month. This may be a little higher if we keep our renter's insurance.
Please keep your renter's insurance. It is both cheap and useful.

Bugamol
Aug 2, 2006
Well Knyteguy at least you're not as silly as this guy who thinks that his car situation is better because he rolled over his loan + expected interest into a new loan with interest. That logic escapes me.

HonorableTB posted:

1. My car situation is actually a lot better than it used to be. My old car had severe engine problems (was struggling to make it up moderately big hills), the tires were completely shot, was coming up on 185,000 miles, and a whole host of other problems. The repairs were more expensive than the car. So I did a dumb thing and traded it in, got $3000, put a $1500 lien on the new(er) car (2013 Corolla) and the Toyota dealership slapped me with a $13,000 loan at 24% INTEREST. I called USAA, they took over the loan for me, and negotiated a 4.5% interest loan but Toyota wouldn't let go of it unless they paid the entire amount + expected interest at once so that's how I ended up with a $19,000 car loan. I was stupid and got bent over on account of it.

I think at this point what may be best for you, rather than everyone berating you for past mistakes, is to make a weekly spending post. That way if people are berating you it's at least for the actions you're currently making. Not ones in the past that you can't change. Knowing you're going to be reporting your weekly spending to SA may also give you a mental double check when you go to spend money as well.

Bugamol fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Jul 23, 2014

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal
I apologize for the delayed responses - we've been moving.

Veskit posted:

Knyte have you checked your local animal shelter for spaying deals? Our city has a heavy discount to spaying if you do it through the county system instead of going private. I've seen a lot of incentive programs for that.

Yes. Actually when I made the $200.00 budget that was with the price of local animal shelter. However it turns out they're only doing spays and neuters for pit bulls in the foreseeable future, so we'll have to try SPCA.

spwrozek posted:

categories

Are your numbers and categories based on past spending? Did you analyze CC statements or are you using Mint?

I just feel like you are going to go 'yes $3000 saved' only to have a bunch of stuff you could have planned for and only save $500 next month or have to go into the negative.

I am also confused how you are paying 0 rent in August. If you pay August's in July you will pay September's in August right?

You have an aggressive plan, especially as your wife gets more and more pregnant (eats more, more doctors visits, needs new clothes, etc.). You have a plan though so you are at least on the path.

Numbers and categories are based on past spending yes. More accurately it is based on this month's spending. We'll need to go through and categorize a little more I've just been a little lazy and haven't found the time to do so yet.

Rent we had to pay for August and the last 8 days of July up front to move in (first months rent required to move in). So we're just frontloading the cost and September's rent will come out as usual. We pretty much always pay rent the night of the 5th since my paycheck comes in on the 7th. That's just enough time for a check to clear.

Sigma / Old Fart: We should be one month ahead if all goes according to plan in August, but I probably don't want to budget for that until October. Maybe earlier but we'll see.

Horking Delight posted:

I think the general consensus is that it's better to have a slightly more relaxed budget that you can consistently meet versus a strict budget that you fail to meet.

So honestly, since you've had spending trouble in the past, I'd even go so far as to increase your misc expenses to 200/mo. That can cover some of the extra necessities that you inevitably forgot about.

DON'T spend up to that amount if you have some left over -- instead, roll any eventual extra amount into a separate tracked bucket so that you can spend, say, 250 next month if you only spent 150 this month (only spending the surplus you currently have, obviously).

People don't want you to be miserable and only eating rice and beans for six months in a row or stealing toilet paper from work to save twenty bucks a month or anything extreme like that, and with your income, you aren't in such dire straights that you need to do that.

You just need to control of your spending and you think you do, but you really don't, because you promise yourself one thing and then two weeks later future Knyteguy is like "gently caress it, I'd rather have instant gratification" and suddenly, 600 dollars spent on restaurants in a month.


Hell, for a starter month (whichever month you aren't in a contest with slomo), looking at your past expenditures, I'd even consider going something like

500 groceries (high to encourage cooking or date nights at home instead of eating out)
400 entertainment (includes clothing/grooming and alcohol, where you normally spend ~1000 on)
200 medical
200 misc expenses (moving the "household goods" category into this one)
200 pet

And then aim to get as far under those budget numbers as you can comfortably (ie without feeling sad about how few nice things you're getting) get, and if you can successfully meet those much more generous numbers, then you can tighten the belt even further and feel good about doing so.

Ok yes I'm definitely willing to reevaluate after the Slo Mo competition is over. The $500.00 groceries could be especially important I think.

facey fred posted:

Please keep your renter's insurance. It is both cheap and useful.
OK will do. You're right the benefits it gives makes up for the sub $15.00/mo.

Bugamol posted:

I think at this point what may be best for you, rather than everyone berating you for past mistakes, is to make a weekly spending post. That way if people are berating you it's at least for the actions you're currently making. Not ones in the past that you can't change. Knowing you're going to be reporting your weekly spending to SA may also give you a mental double check when you go to spend money as well.

Ok I don't want to promise I can definitely do it it every week but I'll give it my best go. I'll post the first one shortly.

Bugamol
Aug 2, 2006
I think you should be able to relatively easily just clip your YNAB screenshot once a week for month to date. It might help create some more accountability even though we're just internet strangers. At the end of the day you're somewhat like Slow Motion. You talk a big game. However over the past almost year of this thread OR the past 3 years from your last thread, you've yet to actually back it up long term.

I truly hope it works out for you because you really do seem to want it, especially more than Slow Motion. Every time you try and justify an expense just think about where you would be today if you'd gotten your poo poo together when you made your last post in 2011.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal



So here's what is going on:
Rent/Mortgage - we paid rent twice this month (July and August) since we moved. The excess in the red is already accounted for in August since we forwarded money.

Moving - We came out about $110.00 under budget from what I was thinking because the truck was so cheap. But only not really because we still don't have everything moved so multiple car trips (costing gas) will still need to be accounted for somewhere.

Groceries - We went over our grocery budget because it was either that or eat at restaurants for every meal during the move. We bought food that will make meals though so it should offset August's costs anyway. We have groceries at the old place but we haven't been able to move them yet (higher priorities/exhausted).

Cable - We didn't get cable TV. This meant there was no install fee for internet. I rolled the savings into buying a router. Gonna order a better router off Amazon then take this router back for another $20.00 saved.


So that's it. We ended up a little overbudgeted a bit from moving. I am going to attempt to take back our hand truck to home depot because the wheels won't hold air. That will give us $54.00 back which should help cover the costs. I'm not counting on them taking it back however.

I will also need to adjust the budget a bit more because we absolutely need some household goods (explained below). I think this is why we need to listen to Horking Delight's advice to give ourselves a little more room so we can make sure we hit our stated goals.

I will readjust August's budget a little bit more to try to account for some things we don't know we'll need. Luckily there's a leftover category that will make this easier.

I think we should have budgeted $800.00 to move. It wasn't the standard fees of moving that killed us like the rental truck or labor or whatever, it was the things we had at our old place that we don't have now, like the microwave, shower curtain, we need some privacy lattice because kids look into our sliding glass window because they climb a tree right outside our balcony, etc etc. We'll hold off as long as possible on most of it, but stuff like a shower curtain is pretty vital.

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Bugamol posted:

I think you should be able to relatively easily just clip your YNAB screenshot once a week for month to date. It might help create some more accountability even though we're just internet strangers. At the end of the day you're somewhat like Slow Motion. You talk a big game. However over the past almost year of this thread OR the past 3 years from your last thread, you've yet to actually back it up long term.

I truly hope it works out for you because you really do seem to want it, especially more than Slow Motion. Every time you try and justify an expense just think about where you would be today if you'd gotten your poo poo together when you made your last post in 2011.

Well what I mean by I don't want to promise is it may be every 2 weeks or something, especially when the baby is born. Agreed on the rest, but I'm doing my best to learn. The budgeting stuff is what I'm finding the hardest - and mostly just predicting expenses.

Bugamol
Aug 2, 2006
As was mentioned in another thread. Do you have GAP insurance on your car? It's something you might want to look into because if you were to total your car you could be looking at a $7,000 loan balance still.

Rurutia
Jun 11, 2009

Knyteguy posted:

I think we should have budgeted $800.00 to move. It wasn't the standard fees of moving that killed us like the rental truck or labor or whatever, it was the things we had at our old place that we don't have now, like the microwave, shower curtain, we need some privacy lattice because kids look into our sliding glass window because they climb a tree right outside our balcony, etc etc. We'll hold off as long as possible on most of it, but stuff like a shower curtain is pretty vital.

I haven't looked over your budget yet, but I do want to say that I think you should post here what you feel are vital and see if goons can brainstorm/help you out with deals. I agree with the shower curtain btw. :)

Knyteguy
Jul 6, 2005

YES to love
NO to shirts


Toilet Rascal

Bugamol posted:

As was mentioned in another thread. Do you have GAP insurance on your car? It's something you might want to look into because if you were to total your car you could be looking at a $7,000 loan balance still.

No gap insurance - when we were offered it at loan signing it was something like an additional $40-$50/mo so I decided to take the gamble.

Do you know offhand if there is private gap insurance out there?

Rurutia posted:

I haven't looked over your budget yet, but I do want to say that I think you should post here what you feel are vital and see if goons can brainstorm/help you out with deals. I agree with the shower curtain btw. :)

Sure right now the vital ones I'm think of are a 1,000+ watt microwave (and I'll wait until we can get a 1,000 watt one), and the shower curtain pretty much.

The privacy lattice is pretty high up there also. There's the issue with the kids looking into our apartment indiscriminately, and we have a truck tonneau bed cover that I don't know what to do with from our F150 we sold, and the neighbors could report us since it's sticking out above the porch. The neighborhood isn't the nicest or anything either, so having our stuff better hidden from people casually passing by would be nice as well.

Rurutia
Jun 11, 2009

Knyteguy posted:

No gap insurance - when we were offered it at loan signing it was something like an additional $40-$50/mo so I decided to take the gamble.

Do you know offhand if there is private gap insurance out there?


Sure right now the vital ones I'm think of are a 1,000+ watt microwave (and I'll wait until we can get a 1,000 watt one), and the shower curtain pretty much.

The privacy lattice is pretty high up there also. There's the issue with the kids looking into our apartment indiscriminately, and we have a truck tonneau bed cover that I don't know what to do with from our F150 we sold, and the neighbors could report us since it's sticking out above the porch. The neighborhood isn't the nicest or anything either, so having our stuff better hidden from people casually passing by would be nice as well.

If you have an oven/stove, a microwave is honestly not important. We lived in an apartment without a microwave for a year in downtown Seattle, and it didn't bother us enough to even think of getting one. This isn't to say that you shouldn't get one, but I wouldn't blow your budget to get one.

As for the privacy lattice, think about just taping up some newspaper or whatever until you can buy it without blowing your budget.

If I see either cheap on sale, I'll post it here though. :)

edit Can you explain to me why you have categories with balance 0 but no expenditures? I'm assuming you just remade your budgets without putting in transactions?

Engineer Lenk
Aug 28, 2003

Mnogo losho e!

Knyteguy posted:

Sure right now the vital ones I'm think of are a 1,000+ watt microwave (and I'll wait until we can get a 1,000 watt one), and the shower curtain pretty much.

The privacy lattice is pretty high up there also. There's the issue with the kids looking into our apartment indiscriminately, and we have a truck tonneau bed cover that I don't know what to do with from our F150 we sold, and the neighbors could report us since it's sticking out above the porch. The neighborhood isn't the nicest or anything either, so having our stuff better hidden from people casually passing by would be nice as well.

Don't forget to look at craigslist for stuff like this.

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imabanana
May 26, 2006
Knyteguy, I'm just going to throw this out there, other people in the thread may think it's ridiculous but after reading about your hosting company and some other things I think it might hit you in the right spot.

Check out "The Millionaire Fastlane" on Amazon. If you can, ignore the ridiculous title and goofy cover. Just marketing. There's also a message board that you can Google. Like I said, I think it might be something to which you'd be receptive.

It's a book I recently read, and it didn't do me that much good because I've already incorporated most of the salient points into my life, but if I'd read it 10 years ago it would have saved me some time figuring some things out.

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