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Xeom posted:Despite all the hub-bub about the ChE boom or whatever it is mostly talk. Competition amongst ChemE's is fierce. I'd say close to 40% of my graduating class still doesn't have a job, and a lot of those that do couldn't even secure engineering jobs. Be completely aware of what you are stepping into. You will be going into a lot of debt and studying for three years, and you may not come out any better. There is a boom in chemical engineering at the moment, at least in Europe, but it's all upstream which is a difficult field to break into as a graduate. In the UK where I used to work the typical route was to spend two to three years at a refinery / petrochem plant and these transition across.
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Jul 21, 2014 00:44
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Xeom posted:Despite all the hub-bub about the ChE boom or whatever it is mostly talk. Competition amongst ChemE's is fierce. I'd say close to 40% of my graduating class still doesn't have a job, and a lot of those that do couldn't even secure engineering jobs. Be completely aware of what you are stepping into. You will be going into a lot of debt and studying for three years, and you may not come out any better. Any tips to help make employment more likely? My adviser claims a 98% placement right into a job/graduate school. I'm not entirely sure why she'd lie if I'm already here, but not sure how to fact check that. I'm at NCSU if you/anyone else knows how to check that sort of thing. I'm a green chemistry & sustainability concentration with a minor in computer programming (mostly just because I took a C++ class earlier and enjoyed it and didn't seem like it could hurt). I have a 3.5, and of course hope to keep that, and will start doing research with a professor here this fall as well as hopefully starting the first rotation of coop this upcoming spring. And I plan on getting a masters afterwards because I'd prefer to work closer towards the research end of the spectrum, i.e. the sort of 'prototype' phase as my adviser explained it (though I don't expect this after some time and experience on the other end, just a long term goal). I knew it wasn't as if it was a guaranteed job, but now you've got me worried 
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Jul 26, 2014 04:02
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Graduated with a ChemE degree this May and just accepted an offer for a job in the paper industry. I had a 3.6 GPA with an internship and a co-op. I'd say at least 80% of my graduating class either had a job at graduation or was accepted into grad school. It was pretty frustrating to go almost a year seeing people with less experience and worse grades get jobs while getting rejected. I'd say the best way to find a job is to try to get to know your professors especially people like your department head who are in close contact with people in industry. A few weeks before graduation I went and talked to mine about being jobless and he introduced me to the company that eventually hired me as well a few others that I have interview with recently. Side Note: My new job is as a process controls engineer which is not something I saw myself doing initially but after taking a class on it junior year I really grew to like it. Ethiser fucked around with this message at 04:37 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 04:30
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Ethiser posted:I'd say the best way to find a job is to try to get to know your professors especially people like your department head who are in close contact with people in industry. A few weeks before graduation I went and talked to mine about being jobless and he introduced me to the company that eventually hired me as well a few others that I have interview with recently. Star War Sex Parrot fucked around with this message at 05:20 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 04:35
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98% placement sounds like pure b.s. unless your program has some amazing industry connections, and the most bad rear end career fair. Unless that 98% is for graduate school which sounds a bit more believable. Just know competition is fierce. Yesterday I had an phone interview with a company in the middle of no where Kentucky, and the guy was telling me how he could have never guess the amount of qualified resumes he received. Ethiser posted:ChemE degree this May ... It was pretty frustrating to go almost a year ... Xeom fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 05:18
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Karl Sharks posted:Any tips to help make employment more likely? My adviser claims a 98% placement right into a job/graduate school. I'm not entirely sure why she'd lie if I'm already here, but not sure how to fact check that. I'm at NCSU if you/anyone else knows how to check that sort of thing. The key is internships/co-op and make connections like crazy or of those. When there beg for more work and real engineering work. Being able to kill it on the resume and interviews with things you made happen is huge. Career fairs are great if your school has a good one. Personally I would go work for a few years, see if work will pay for a masters, you lose a lot of earnings potential while spending 2-3 years doing the masters. It can even be harder to find a job (not always true though) because you are over qualified. Good luck man. The jobs are out there, just got to find them.
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Jul 26, 2014 05:19
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Xeom posted:
It was not and I started looking for a job last Fall. Star War Sex Parrot posted:Generalize this to "be sociable and network" and you've got some good advice. Yeah that's really what it boils down to. A lot of the people that didn't get jobs were those that never showed up for things like career fairs and never spoke to anybody so it was easy to forget they were even in the major.
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Jul 26, 2014 05:38
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Xeom posted:98% placement sounds like pure b.s. unless your program has some amazing industry connections, and the most bad rear end career fair. Unless that 98% is for graduate school which sounds a bit more believable. It was for a year after graduation, actually. Forgot that part. spwrozek posted:The key is internships/co-op and make connections like crazy or of those. When there beg for more work and real engineering work. Being able to kill it on the resume and interviews with things you made happen is huge. Career fairs are great if your school has a good one. Yeah, the engineering fair we have is pretty huge, or seems that way at least. ~300 companies signed up so far, and 33 looking for chemEs. Plus a nice coop fair that had 2 or 3 dozen companies. quote:Personally I would go work for a few years, see if work will pay for a masters, you lose a lot of earnings potential while spending 2-3 years doing the masters. It can even be harder to find a job (not always true though) because you are over qualified. Actually, the university has an accelerated bachelors/masters program that I hope I could get into. If so, it's only an extra year for a (non-thesis) master (I think another 6 months for a thesis one). Or would a company see that as negative? I have mentioned it when talking to companies and I can't recall the person reacting to it negatively. Though of course they're just one rep, so can't guarantee anything from that.
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Jul 26, 2014 05:56
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I took an paper that lightly went over some Controls (EE based) but the paper wasn't very good. Are there any books that are recommended reading for that field?
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Jul 26, 2014 05:57
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Odette posted:I took an paper that lightly went over some Controls (EE based) but the paper wasn't very good. Are there any books that are recommended reading for that field? Nise is the undergrad textbook that everyone I know likes.
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Jul 26, 2014 07:19
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Karl Sharks posted:It was for a year after graduation, actually. Forgot that part. I personally don't give much credit to a non-thesis master's on paper. Basically at the outset it's kind of a "if you aren't going to push the field in an interesting way, why are you sticking around in school?" But the way around this is to talk about whatever your project or classes were and why it was exciting / awesome. Also, I'm just one guy who generally hires STEM people for consulting in my niche. Basically ask yourself what a Master's buys you to potential employers. Will highly depend on what you want to do and who is looking for you.
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Jul 26, 2014 14:51
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All the M.Eng (terminal professional master's) programs I'm familiar with either have an industry co-op component or a multi-semester capstone project. Both of those are good networking/resume building opportunities and ways to demonstrate your specialization in a field (as well as differentiating you from B.S. graduates who've only ever seen the inside of a classroom).
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Jul 26, 2014 16:13
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For what it's worth, my company will treat an engineering master's degree as 2-5 years of experience on resumes, depending on the job level being applied for.
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Jul 26, 2014 16:58
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Karl Sharks posted:It was for a year after graduation, actually. Forgot that part. I just cant believe that number, unless you school is counting any employment as "placement", which I wouldn't doubt. 98% is effectively saying that 100% of those who wanted a job in a engineering related field got one. The other two percent could account for nearly anything such as not pursuing a career because you had a child and are going to be stay at home mom/dad. Its just such an unbelievable number in today's world.
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Jul 26, 2014 18:38
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Background: I'm an older student (36) in my first year of an Engineering AS at a local community college. My GPA after 20 hours here is 3.1, but I have a lower overall GPA (est 2.0) from spending my teens and early 20s as a fuckwit. The summer courses I just finished made me eligible for finanical aid again. After community college, my plan is to transfer to Missouri S&T (formerly UM-Rolla) to complete my BS in EnvE. If I want to take the PE (and I probably do), I'll need to get my MS as well, since the requirements change in 2020 and I wouldn't have four years post-baccalaureate work experience until at least 2022. My question is: what classes will I need to demonstrate to a potential employer that I'm worth hiring as a "not-yet-an-engineer"? I can't really afford an unpaid internship or even to be paid near-minimum wage. Barring a miracle, I'll be working full-time and going to class full-time for the next 4-5 years. I did already speak with one of the instructors at my community college, who said that completing Statics (which I plan to take next summer semester) would be about the bare minimum for getting hired on somewhere and that I probably couldn't expect to make more than $12/hour (Kansas City area) until I at least completed my Associates.
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Jul 26, 2014 19:31
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Xeom posted:I just cant believe that number, unless you school is counting any employment as "placement", which I wouldn't doubt. 98% is effectively saying that 100% of those who wanted a job in a engineering related field got one. The other two percent could account for nearly anything such as not pursuing a career because you had a child and are going to be stay at home mom/dad. Its just such an unbelievable number in today's world. My school consistently has a 100 percent job placement rate for EEs. It probably helps that our dept head is very proactive about making sure we all get hired. Hello Sailor posted:My question is: what classes will I need to demonstrate to a potential employer that I'm worth hiring as a "not-yet-an-engineer"? I can't really afford an unpaid internship or even to be paid near-minimum wage. Barring a miracle, I'll be working full-time and going to class full-time for the next 4-5 years. You can usually get more than that as an engineering intern. You may even be able to nearly double that, depending on where you work. KetTarma fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 20:05
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Hello Sailor posted:I'll need to get my MS as well, since the requirements change in 2020 and I wouldn't have four years post-baccalaureate work experience until at least 2022. This is actually going to happen? gently caress we engineers need to fight this poo poo. Just a stupid money grab by universities and government agencies (via student loans and state engineering boards). Here is an actual article about it: http://www.usnews.com/education/bes...ngineering-game I am curious where you can get an engineering degree with only 120 hours though. It was 134 for me (plus 6 grad credits I took for fun during my last semester). quote:
If you aren't making at least $14/hr as an intern then that is one lovely company. Just take a few engineering courses and hammer the career fair. spwrozek fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 22:56
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spwrozek posted:This is actually going to happen? gently caress we engineers need to fight this poo poo. Just a stupid money grab by universities and government agencies (via student loans and state engineering boards). Apparently so: http://ncees.org/about-ncees/news/at-annual-meeting-ncees-continues-to-address-additional-education-requirements/ That's a crock of poo poo. I better get my PE before it's too late.
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Jul 26, 2014 23:05
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The Experiment posted:Apparently so: http://ncees.org/about-ncees/news/at-annual-meeting-ncees-continues-to-address-additional-education-requirements/ Yeah I have mine in Colorado and Texas so I am not too worried for myself but mostly for the rest of the new engineers. There is literally zero need for a masters with what I do.
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Jul 26, 2014 23:09
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spwrozek posted:If you aren't making at least $14/hr as an intern then that is one lovely company. Just take a few engineering courses and hammer the career fair. I'm getting $12/hr in a place with a high cost of living (not SF high but SoCal), as a rising ChemE junior. Really, the part that gets me is that mine is supposed to be an engineering internship yet everything I do is hands-on technician level work without anything I'd expect from an engineering internship (I have yet to do any of the stereotypical paper-pushing people feel is useless, nor have I used any actual knowledge from the engineering classes I have taken yet, and I've been here since April). It's better than nothing, but I feel like I'm not learning enough for it to be a worthy addition to the resume for future jobs. They also wanted someone who could work at the same job until graduation (part-time during the year) and get hired on afterwards, but I'm worried working at the same place for multiple summers would prevent me from expanding my horizons and learning new things. It's also a small company. What's the verdict on doing internships at small companies versus larger ones with more concrete training programs for interns?
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Jul 27, 2014 00:14
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Karl Sharks posted:Any tips to help make employment more likely? My adviser claims a 98% placement right into a job/graduate school. I'm not entirely sure why she'd lie if I'm already here, but not sure how to fact check that. I'm at NCSU if you/anyone else knows how to check that sort of thing. You're doing everything you need to get a job when you graduate. NC State is a good school, you're doing research with a professor, and doing professional internships (or coops) to get experience. As long as you're not a complete wierdo during interviews, you'll be fine. And seeing as how you already have an industrial coop lined up (which I presume you had to interview for), you're probably fine at interviewing as well. Now, if you want to get into research after you graduate (either industrial or academic), you'll need to reconsider your idea of getting a masters. Unlike other fields, A Masters of Science, in general, is not a terminal degree in Chemical Engineering. It is the booby prize for those who had to leave graduate school early for whatever reason. If you were referring to a masters of engineering program, those are typically short term (~1 year), and more a continuation of undergraduate-type education than something thats put you on the research track. Ultimately, if you want to do research as a career, you will want a PhD (unless you are content being a technician, in which case a bachelors would suffice). I went through the ChemE PhD recruiting process a few years ago. All the major industrial research labs were looking for PhDs for their PI positions.
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Jul 27, 2014 00:43
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BigBobio posted:You're doing everything you need to get a job when you graduate. NC State is a good school, you're doing research with a professor, and doing professional internships (or coops) to get experience. As long as you're not a complete wierdo during interviews, you'll be fine. And seeing as how you already have an industrial coop lined up (which I presume you had to interview for), you're probably fine at interviewing as well. Well, haven't lined one up yet, but I hope to for this spring. quote:Now, if you want to get into research after you graduate (either industrial or academic), you'll need to reconsider your idea of getting a masters. Unlike other fields, A Masters of Science, in general, is not a terminal degree in Chemical Engineering. It is the booby prize for those who had to leave graduate school early for whatever reason. If you were referring to a masters of engineering program, those are typically short term (~1 year), and more a continuation of undergraduate-type education than something thats put you on the research track. Ultimately, if you want to do research as a career, you will want a PhD (unless you are content being a technician, in which case a bachelors would suffice). I went through the ChemE PhD recruiting process a few years ago. All the major industrial research labs were looking for PhDs for their PI positions. Oh I don't think anything less than a PhD will let me do research, but I figured it would get me closer to that end of the spectrum. Obviously I have no idea myself, but as I understood it you need people to take something those with the PhDs have discovered and create a 'prototype' of sorts before you can just build a full sized system for it, which sounds really interesting. I had thought grab masters, get a few years working and then consider going for the PhD. Feelings may change by then and all that. And thanks to everyone replying, I appreciate it 
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Jul 27, 2014 01:14
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Shipon posted:I'm getting $12/hr in a place with a high cost of living (not SF high but SoCal), as a rising ChemE junior. Really, the part that gets me is that mine is supposed to be an engineering internship yet everything I do is hands-on technician level work without anything I'd expect from an engineering internship (I have yet to do any of the stereotypical paper-pushing people feel is useless, nor have I used any actual knowledge from the engineering classes I have taken yet, and I've been here since April). It's better than nothing, but I feel like I'm not learning enough for it to be a worthy addition to the resume for future jobs. I would honestly do this through the summer, part time during school, and find another internship that gets you better experience. I did one at a big and a small company and luckily both my bosses were awesome and I was running my own projects. Multiple internships will allow you to see more of what you can do with the degree. It is worth it. Plus it doesn't sound like you are learning much or liking the job really.
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Jul 27, 2014 02:32
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Shipon posted:I'm getting $12/hr in a place with a high cost of living (not SF high but SoCal), as a rising ChemE junior. Really, the part that gets me is that mine is supposed to be an engineering internship yet everything I do is hands-on technician level work without anything I'd expect from an engineering internship (I have yet to do any of the stereotypical paper-pushing people feel is useless, nor have I used any actual knowledge from the engineering classes I have taken yet, and I've been here since April). It's better than nothing, but I feel like I'm not learning enough for it to be a worthy addition to the resume for future jobs. Is this your first internship? IMO it's good to start out hands-on like that and really understand what's going on. One of my coworkers is fresh out of school and is pretty awful at his job, and the techs don't respect him at all because he's utterly clueless about how to practically get things done. Not saying that you're clueless or anything, but some hands-on experience like that is great, as long as there's an understanding that you'll be moving onto more engineering tasks.
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Jul 27, 2014 07:44
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Karl Sharks posted:Well, haven't lined one up yet, but I hope to for this spring. Most good graduate programs will not accept you if you're applying for only an MS degree. They want PhD students
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Jul 27, 2014 14:42
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As someone who went through a program that didn't push you to get a PhD (I did an MS right after undergrad and it was the best decision I've ever made, career wise), it really depends on the program/the research you're doing and what you're there for. My masters degree had me doing very applied projects in addition to my masters research and let me take classes that were in my desired field (robotics) that I couldn't fully take advantage of as an undergrad. The department is top 20 in the country for mechanical engineering, so I'd say it qualifies as "good". The graduate program you're interested in will have an staff member who's sole job is to advise grad students, ask them.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:00
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BigBobio posted:Most good graduate programs will not accept you if you're applying for only an MS degree. They want PhD students I found this to be untrue.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:15
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When I applied for grad school I found it to be true 100% of the time. Maybe you skipped over the word "good"?
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Jul 27, 2014 15:21
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BigBobio posted:Most good graduate programs will not accept you if you're applying for only an MS degree. They want PhD students Corla Plankun posted:When I applied for grad school I found it to be true 100% of the time. Maybe you skipped over the word "good"? In what field? In civil, there are plenty of good programs that offer terminal MS/M.Eng degrees. If a program only offers a thesis MS, then yeah maybe they'll be reluctant to take on students who just want a master's before they go to industry, but standalone master's programs with co-op/project components exist at good schools.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:24
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Corla Plankun posted:When I applied for grad school I found it to be true 100% of the time. Maybe you skipped over the word "good"? It's like anecdotal evidence is crap or something.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:35
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BigBobio posted:Most good graduate programs will not accept you if you're applying for only an MS degree. They want PhD students Corla Plankun posted:When I applied for grad school I found it to be true 100% of the time. Maybe you skipped over the word "good"? Rankings aren't gospel, but apparently one says our's is top 20 in the nation, so I think that qualifies as "good"  And they explicitly have an accelerated master's degree.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:47
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I'm sorry I thought we were talking about applying to grad schools for an MS only. If you count BS-to-MS then sure, lots of good schools do that.
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Jul 27, 2014 15:52
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Hello Sailor posted:Background: I'm an older student (36) in my first year of an Engineering AS at a local community college. My GPA after 20 hours here is 3.1, but I have a lower overall GPA (est 2.0) from spending my teens and early 20s as a fuckwit. The summer courses I just finished made me eligible for finanical aid again. After community college, my plan is to transfer to Missouri S&T (formerly UM-Rolla) to complete my BS in EnvE. If I want to take the PE (and I probably do), I'll need to get my MS as well, since the requirements change in 2020 and I wouldn't have four years post-baccalaureate work experience until at least 2022. Honestly, I think getting whatever drafting/CAD programs you can under your belt early would go along way to getting you hired through school as an engineering technician. Especially in the Kansas City area where its like an engineering mecca. Firms are constantly looking for good engineering techs as opposed to part time "summer" interns. Civil firms pretty much use interns and engineering techs interchangeably anyways, its just one is more permanent than the other. I'm not sure what you want to do as an environmental engineer but I know civil and environmental have a ton of overlap so I would not hesitate to apply to either. If your passion is water/wastewater treatment or hydrology you'll fit right in the civil world.
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Jul 27, 2014 16:13
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fishhooked posted:Honestly, I think getting whatever drafting/CAD programs you can under your belt early would go along way to getting you hired through school as an engineering technician. Especially in the Kansas City area where its like an engineering mecca. Firms are constantly looking for good engineering techs as opposed to part time "summer" interns. Civil firms pretty much use interns and engineering techs interchangeably anyways, its just one is more permanent than the other. I'm not sure what you want to do as an environmental engineer but I know civil and environmental have a ton of overlap so I would not hesitate to apply to either. If your passion is water/wastewater treatment or hydrology you'll fit right in the civil world. I'd have to step outside of my degree plan (which wouldn't be covered by financial aid) to take any ETEC courses. They're not a requirement for the associates where I'm at now nor for the EnvE degree at the school I'll be transferring to. The only thing I'll be taking close to it is "Engineering Design Microcomputer Applications" this fall semester; the course description says it includes some form of CAD drafting. As far as my eventual career in EnvE, my original idea was outdoor air pollution control and remediation, but I'd be open to anything that would have me designing implementations of solutions for preventing and mitigating the effects of climate change. Hello Sailor fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Jul 27, 2014 |
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Jul 27, 2014 18:00
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movax posted:Is this your first internship? IMO it's good to start out hands-on like that and really understand what's going on. One of my coworkers is fresh out of school and is pretty awful at his job, and the techs don't respect him at all because he's utterly clueless about how to practically get things done. Not saying that you're clueless or anything, but some hands-on experience like that is great, as long as there's an understanding that you'll be moving onto more engineering tasks.
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Jul 27, 2014 19:00
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Uncle Jam posted:I found this to be untrue. There's my anecdote for the day! The Chairman posted:In what field? In civil, there are plenty of good programs that offer terminal MS/M.Eng degrees. Star War Sex Parrot fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Jul 27, 2014 |
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Jul 27, 2014 19:10
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Like the other posters, my experience was that top engineering departments are very happy to admit students for an MS only but part of that is they want you or your company's money; paid tuition, stipends and research positions only get doled out to the PhD students.
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Jul 27, 2014 19:50
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Shear Modulus posted:Like the other posters, my experience was that top engineering departments are very happy to admit students for an MS only but part of that is they want you or your company's money; paid tuition, stipends and research positions only get doled out to the PhD students.
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Jul 27, 2014 19:52
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Star War Sex Parrot posted:Same. Stanford has no problem accepting Master's-only graduate students for Civil and Environmental. Uncle Jam posted:I found this to be untrue. The Chairman posted:In what field? In civil, there are plenty of good programs that offer terminal MS/M.Eng degrees. My comments were only about Chemical Engineering, not engineering in general. Karl Sharks said he was in a ChemE program. Also, I was referring to traditional, stand alone MS degrees, not continuation programs (which I don't think are that common in ChemE, but I could be wrong) or 1-year M. Eng. type programs Shear Modulus posted:Like the other posters, my experience was that top engineering departments are very happy to admit students for an MS only but part of that is they want you or your company's money; paid tuition, stipends and research positions only get doled out to the PhD students. In ChemE, a masters of science is not a terminal degree This. And from everything I've seen from the top programs in ChemE, the former rarely occurs, if at all
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Jul 27, 2014 19:53
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Shear Modulus posted:Like the other posters, my experience was that top engineering departments are very happy to admit students for an MS only but part of that is they want you or your company's money; paid tuition, stipends and research positions only get doled out to the PhD students. BigBobio posted:This. And from everything I've seen from the top programs in ChemE, the former rarely occurs, if at all What is the exact meaning of 'research position' in this context? It seems like every graduate student, regardless of whether they want to go for an MS or PhD, is placed into a research group. See: http://www.che.ncsu.edu/academics/grads.html and http://www.che.ncsu.edu/people/grad-students.html And hell, if they're willing to pay undergraduates, surely they wouldn't suddenly get stingy once you become a graduate student? I know if I do well/don't blow up anything (that I'm not supposed to) for my research 'class' the professor can keep me on for pay. A friend of mine is already doing that even, so I know it's not a unicorn sort of thing. Can anyone speak to employment rates of MS vs PhD in the chemical engineering field? Think I'll be scheduling an appointment with my adviser soon as well after all this talk.
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Jul 27, 2014 20:27
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