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That 1st column, 3rd row one looks an awful lot like Captain America's shield too.
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Jul 23, 2014 23:06
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3peat posted:REMOVE PASTA remove pasta I didn't know the Iron Sheik was THAT old!
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Jul 23, 2014 23:18
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3peat posted:REMOVE PASTA remove pasta The ancient equivalent of the French in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.
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Jul 24, 2014 00:51
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How far did Roman laws extend throughout the empire? You hear alot about, at least in Western Europe, how great of an influence Romans were to our civilization partly because of the judicial system they had. But at the same time Rome ruled with what seems to me with a pretty soft hand in many provinces, like with local nobility having some form of local power as long as taxes were paid and they towed Roman line. So, what i wonder is, how far did Roman laws extend and where did it and didn't tromp local laws or customs?
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Jul 28, 2014 06:16
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If it was an actual province, Roman law always trumped local if there was a conflict. If it was some sort of local regulation that didn't affect the empire in any way, they usually left it alone. The Roman courts would be the final arbiters. Clients were a different story, they were still theoretically sovereign but in practice if they tried to use that sovereignty to push against Roman law too much they might find out how you can turn a client kingdom into a province. Generally Roman law was fair and people seem to have liked it a great deal, judging by how deeply embedded it became everywhere the Romans ruled. It's easy to understand, imagine going from a law system of "dude in charge decides whatever the gently caress he wants" to having clear laws written down and arbitrated by courts, and generally applied equally to everyone.
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Jul 28, 2014 08:38
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So I borrowed a book from the library by a pretty well renowned ancient historian and someone from god only knows when was angry enough at the guy to write inside the cover 'old pretentious fool!'.
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Jul 28, 2014 10:10
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Grand Fromage posted:If it was an actual province, Roman law always trumped local if there was a conflict. If it was some sort of local regulation that didn't affect the empire in any way, they usually left it alone. The Roman courts would be the final arbiters. Clients were a different story, they were still theoretically sovereign but in practice if they tried to use that sovereignty to push against Roman law too much they might find out how you can turn a client kingdom into a province I'm not sure it's that easy, it changed over time, but the first thing to consider is that in Antiquity the main principle was that every nation/city/people applied to it's members their own law, it didn't matter where they were. In fact, nearly all pre-classic and classic Roman law was applied only to Roman citizens. Of course, when Rome started expanding through the world it's laws changed to deal with new everyday problems. In 242 B.C a new praetor is created, the praetor peregrinus, it's mission was administer justice between foreigners or foreigners and roman citizens. With the passage of time they developed a roman law (ius gentium) to deal with this situations and a new legal process for it, more flexible and modern, which ended being broadly used. Take a look to the first part of the Gaius Institutes, which was reproduced exactly in the Justinian Institutes and the Digest. quote:(1) All peoples who are ruled by laws and customs partly make use of their own ius, and partly have recourse to to the ius which are common to all men; for what every people establishes as ius is their own and is called the ius civile, just as the ius of their own city; and what natural reason establishes among all men and is observed by all peoples alike, is called the ius gentium, as being the ius which all nations employ. Therefore the Roman people partly make use of their own ius, and partly avail themselves of the ius common to all men, which matters we shall explain separately in their proper place. Personal jurisdiction should have ended with the Edict of Caracalla in 212 AD, because if all inhabitants turned into full-fledged Roman citizens, the same Roman law should have been used for everyone. Strangely enough, the local laws (vulgar law) still resisted in many places, we can find proof of this struggle in the rescripts of Diocletian. As far as I know, the basic book about this matter is the "Law of the Empire and Vulgar Law in the Eastern Provinces of the Roman Empire" by Ludwig Mitteis. (I'm pretty sure I botched some terms, been awhile since I studied Roman Law and did it in a different language on top of that).
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Jul 28, 2014 12:46
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You're right, you definitely have to specify a time and there was different law for citizens and non-citizens. I never specifically studied the law, if you want to do an effortpost that'd be awesome.
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Jul 28, 2014 13:06
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Sure, I'll do it, but it'll take some time because I need to retrieve my old books from my parents house and refresh some parts, especially the late Empire, which is a massive clusterfuck. Probably going to wait for the new thread.
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Jul 28, 2014 14:39
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There is no new thread. It never ends. 
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Jul 28, 2014 14:42
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We'll split it into two threads, that's always a good idea!
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Jul 28, 2014 14:48
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La Acia Eterna
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Jul 28, 2014 14:50
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Agean90 posted:We'll split it into two threads, that's always a good idea! Inevitably, one thread would Rome all over, while the other went positively Byzantine.
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Jul 28, 2014 14:52
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Ok, it seems my brain misfired or I'm crazier than I thought. I was under the impression there will be a new thread soon, I'm glad to see that Rome still resists. On an unrelated note, I was reading some poo poo about the roman legal system when I stumbled on one of my favorite judicial roman anecdotes: Marcus Licinius Crassus is accused of defiling a vestal virgin (a sacrilege crime), to which he responds "It's true that I am shagging her, but I don't have any sacrilegious intentions, I'm only after her properties". Of course, being the greedy bastard he was, the judges believed him, was acquitted and still got her properties in the end 
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Jul 28, 2014 15:17
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Octy posted:The ancient equivalent of the French in Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Mater tua acinis sambuci olet.
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Jul 28, 2014 17:23
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Agean90 posted:We'll split it into two threads, that's always a good idea! But we'll need to find an OP for each thread, really better to have a senior and junior OP for each thread, but often times OPs just mysteriously disappear, and then we'll have to decide how to chose a new one. I don't like it; better to just have the one thread, and we'll all argue ad infinitum about what our scope should be.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:29
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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When was the first thread closed? Did people posting in it know it had closed?
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Jul 28, 2014 19:41
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euphronius posted:When was the first thread closed? Did people posting in it know it had closed? i think it closed a couple years ago, around the time the OP left.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:46
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NOT when the majority of posters left, that was just a decline.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:46
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The thread was never closed, it was just given a new name arbitrarily by historians and still lives on as the medieval history thread.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:49
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Just close this thread when it gets to 1453 pages, sometime in 2024.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:50
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We can briefly move it to another forum around page 1204.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:51
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cheerfullydrab posted:Just close this thread when it gets to 1453 pages, sometime in 2024. Merge it with the Islam thread.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:52
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This is why we are not invited to parties.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:54
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Our problem is that we spend too much time talking about Christianity.
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Jul 28, 2014 19:56
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euphronius posted:This is why we are not invited to parties. Get better friends.
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Jul 28, 2014 20:02
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Falukorv posted:How far did Roman laws extend throughout the empire? You hear alot about, at least in Western Europe, how great of an influence Romans were to our civilization partly because of the judicial system they had. The really big factor here is not a direct inheritance from Roman law, but the Corpus Iuris Civilis, a codification of late Roman law drawn up for the Emperor Justinian. It was rediscovered in the late mediaeval period at a time when states were trying to harmonise and codify their legal systems and had a big influence on that effort; most of continental Europe (and Louisiana, being an ex-French colony!) have a legal system based on it as opposed to Anglo-American common law.
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Jul 28, 2014 20:13
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This page is the most delightfully spergy historical thing I have ever read. Never change.
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Jul 29, 2014 10:15
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No, no merger with that medieval history thread please. I went to it for the history, I found neverending discussions about blade width and sharpness.
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Jul 29, 2014 10:30
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If pages are years then we are currently in 502 BCE. The monarchy was overthrown five pages ago and replaced with the Republic. The wars with the Sabines are drawing to a close, and we just put down a revolt attempt.
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Jul 29, 2014 11:04
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It's 251AD, let's talk about Persia since they're about to invade.
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Jul 29, 2014 12:18
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Excuse me sir I think you forgot about Rome's
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Jul 29, 2014 12:20
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Jeoh posted:It's 251AD, let's talk about Persia since they're about to invade. Only 33 pages until this thread is marginally more stable with the good and the glorious Diocletian.
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Jul 29, 2014 12:24
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Grand Fromage posted:If pages are years then we are currently in 502 BCE. The monarchy was overthrown five pages ago and replaced with the Republic. The wars with the Sabines are drawing to a close, and we just put down a revolt attempt. Per hunc castissimum ante regiam iniuriam sanguinem iuro, vosque, di, testes facio me G. Fromagium Superbum cum scelerata icone et omni oratorum stirpe ferro igni quacumque dehinc vi possim exsecuturum, nec illos nec alium quemquam regnare lineae Romanorum passurum.  
Jazerus fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Jul 29, 2014 |
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Jul 29, 2014 14:50
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I totally saw a weird comet in the sky (don't ask anybody else they were looking in the wrong place) so we need to shut down the thread for the rest of the year so I can think about what it could mean. Sorry guys but that's just the way it goes, history will judge that I made the right call.
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Jul 30, 2014 00:43
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Jerusalem posted:I totally saw a weird comet in the sky (don't ask anybody else they were looking in the wrong place) so we need to shut down the thread for the rest of the year so I can think about what it could mean. [Lose 1 stability]
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Jul 30, 2014 00:50
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Evil Omens? The state treasury has to pay 20 talents and all rolls suffer -1 until next turn.
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Jul 30, 2014 03:43
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It's a shame Paradox's Rome game was so poo poo, it's a great era for one of their autism simulators.
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Jul 30, 2014 03:47
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Paradox games being broken poo poo heaps is a blessing from on high. The day they make a game that just works my marriage, career, and health will fall apart in about that order until I'm just an over-educated loser living in his mom's basement trying to un-gently caress the Holy Roman Empire before my kidneys fail.
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Jul 30, 2014 18:09
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Cyrano4747 posted:Paradox games being broken poo poo heaps is a blessing from on high. The day they make a game that just works my marriage, career, and health will fall apart in about that order until I'm just an over-educated loser living in his mom's basement trying to un-gently caress the Holy Roman Empire before my kidneys fail. Enjoy it while you can, Rome 2 is gonna come out before 2020
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Jul 30, 2014 19:52
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