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What is the best version of El? This poll is closed. |
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| Elminster |
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20 | 6.45% |
| Elmara |
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20 | 6.45% |
| Entwine |
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13 | 4.19% |
| GURPS |
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99 | 31.94% |
| El Kabong |
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153 | 49.35% |
| Elves |
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5 | 1.61% |
| Total: | 310 votes | ||
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Arivia posted:Haha thanks. Mystra probably fits me better since I'm a girl and we both know how feminine she's played up to be :P Oh, sorry for the incorrect pronoun.  And you gotta feel for Mystra. Poor lady helps rescue her boyfriend from eternal torment inside a magic sword that's actually a god, and in thanks he goes off and becomes the most boring god of death and leaves her with the pack of old men who drooled over her predecessor. 
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Aug 1, 2014 23:59
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For PeterWeller and Arivia: So, which god is the most boring god of the entire Forgotten Realms?
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Aug 2, 2014 00:01
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Kelemvor is not the most boring death god ever. 
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Aug 2, 2014 00:02
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The most boring god in FR is Ed Greenwood.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:05
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I'd quote all of you, but it makes the post fairly large, but, thanks for the advice Kemper Boyd, potatocubed, Raenir K. Artemi, Mimir, and A Catastrophe.  Appreciate it.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:13
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Libertad! posted:For PeterWeller and Arivia: So, which god is the most boring god of the entire Forgotten Realms? I think it's Torm. He's just generic paladin god and doesn't cover anything not already covered by a whole host of more interesting gods.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:19
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Wasn't Torm the god responsible for the terrible faux-conquistadors going buckwild in Maztica, or was that Helm the other boring law god.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:22
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e: ignore, misrembered my decade+ old rpg npcs
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Aug 2, 2014 00:36
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PeterWeller posted:I think it's Torm. He's just generic paladin god and doesn't cover anything not already covered by a whole host of more interesting gods. Paladin gods are almost always uninteresting, because they are invariably perfectly good and squeaky clean. 4E made a Good Decision by making Bahamut the default LG dude, because even if he ends up being boring, at least he's a dragon while doing it. Only fun Paladin I've ever played was a sandworm-riding Paladin of the Red Knight. Mr. Maltose posted:Wasn't Torm the god responsible for the terrible faux-conquistadors going buckwild in Maztica, or was that Helm the other boring law god. That was Helm, who I think is dead now?
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Aug 2, 2014 00:36
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PeterWeller posted:I think it's Torm. He's just generic paladin god and doesn't cover anything not already covered by a whole host of more interesting gods. It's Torm or Tyr or Helm, mostly because they all kinda do the same thing just with varying degrees of how much of a stick they shove up their rear end (all of them have at least a medium sized one).
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Aug 2, 2014 00:37
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they should just get comic books with it and instead of having a paladin god have like, a Paladin Force
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Aug 2, 2014 00:38
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i guess that would be kind of like jedi except hopefully less dickish and static
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Aug 2, 2014 00:39
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Philly fans are entirely the worst, us Boston fans are just arrogant and spoiled
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Aug 2, 2014 00:42
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Captain Foo posted:
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Aug 2, 2014 00:43
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Wasn't Torm the one who fought with uh...Bane(?) during the Time of Troubles and was killed? Did he come back to life somehow?
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Aug 2, 2014 00:44
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Nope
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Aug 2, 2014 00:52
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Tollymain posted:they should just get comic books with it and instead of having a paladin god have like, a Paladin Force They did something like that in Burning Crusade on WoW, but as usual for WoW, it was loving terrible.
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Aug 2, 2014 00:58
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Helm is probably CANON the most boring god, because he is the one who was so dishwater dull that God god the god of gods let him sit at the door to the god house during the Time Of Troubles so no one could get back in while actually doing things.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:06
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Nah, Ao makes Helm guardian of the Celestial Stairways because Helm is literally the god of guarding something no matter what.Mr. Maltose posted:Wasn't Torm the god responsible for the terrible faux-conquistadors going buckwild in Maztica, or was that Helm the other boring law god. As others have said, that's Helm. And it's not that he is responsible so much as one crazy rear end cleric of his is responsible. The fallout of the Maztican conquest leads to a schism in his church and a decline in his standing amongst most decent people in Faerun. Night10194 posted:It's Torm or Tyr or Helm, mostly because they all kinda do the same thing just with varying degrees of how much of a stick they shove up their rear end (all of them have at least a medium sized one). Tyr and Helm actually have roles beyond just being lame paladin gods. Tyr is explicitly a god of legal justice, so he's not about setting out to right wrongs, but instead about creating legal frameworks that promote the greater good. Helm is a god of guardians and protection, so in addition to clerics and paladins, he's worshiped by bodyguards, city watches, and bankers. So both have explicit societal roles that they watch over instead of just being generically good (and Helm isn't even Good). The guardian part is what causes the post-Maztica schism. The eastern Helmites rightly argue that invading and subjugating people is anathema to their god's teachings. Krabkolash posted:Wasn't Torm the one who fought with uh...Bane(?) during the Time of Troubles and was killed? Did he come back to life somehow? Torm and Bane both died. Ao brought Torm back because he had died fulfilling his divine duty: protecting the innocent against evil. Helm also died. Cyric tricked Tyr into killing him in a duel over a lesser goddess. Tyr then banished himself for failing to uphold his own divine precepts and handed his portfolio over to Torm. And that is why 4E Torm is basically Tyr. PeterWeller fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Aug 2, 2014 |
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Aug 2, 2014 01:09
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I'm gonna be honest, I read a every one of those FR novels that I could find that were basically just Cyric being a poo poo because I looooove divine Days of Our Lives.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:12
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Tollymain posted:they should just get comic books with it and instead of having a paladin god have like, a Paladin Force This is already (pretty much) the default though, except in settings where Paladins explicitly gain power from some kind of deity. Paladins answer to the Everpresent Cosmic Force of Law and Good and only to them (and judging by the CoC the ECFoLaG is an enormous pain in the rear end stickler). Deity worship is a choice, typically, and has no bearing on a Paladin's powers, excepting Paladins worshiping an Evil deity of some kind for some reason, which is probably enough to earn them a fall.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:15
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neongrey posted:I'm gonna be honest, I read a every one of those FR novels that I could find that were basically just Cyric being a poo poo because I looooove divine Days of Our Lives. I feel like divine days of our lives is a good reason for atropols to exist
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Aug 2, 2014 01:16
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Evil Mastermind posted:Torg is the 90's-est game ever made, about modern earth being invaded by a bunch of But when one of my Goon buddies put together a TORG D20 game using everything from the Grimm Fairytales book to Resident Evil D20 to EverQuest D20 and whatever the Matrix-ripoff D20 was, well, it by all accounts was one of the greatest uses of D20 ever. And this gets back to why we should be excited about a potential TORG resurgence, because if someone actually wrote some good rules it would be an amazing system again. Even though I know my opinions are rightfully suspect as I have probably never played a system made after 2008, though I hope to change that soon.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:16
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neongrey posted:I'm gonna be honest, I read a every one of those FR novels that I could find that were basically just Cyric being a poo poo because I looooove divine Days of Our Lives. I really enjoyed the two Avatar sequels about Cyric and his poor idiot chosen. The way Cyric weasels out of it all at the end is great. Mystra and the other gods put him on trial for being insane and causing strife for his worshipers (specifically when he has an army of monster and dragons destroy Zhentil Keep). And he shocks them all by pleading guilty to all charges because insanity and strife are his job. As a bonus, Ao basically says it's totally cool for him to keep trying to kill Mystra because doing so would bring insanity and strife to the land.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:20
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Libertad! posted:For PeterWeller and Arivia: So, which god is the most boring god of the entire Forgotten Realms? Okay, you asked this question. You get the answer. All your fault. So as PeterWeller and a couple of other people pointed out above, there are a LOT of Forgotten Realms deities, and a lot of them cover similar territories. So why does this exist? To answer that question, we have to go all the way back to 1e. You see, the original release of the Forgotten Realms - the Forgotten Realms Campaign Set - didn't put all the gods on even footing. It actually separates them out, with many being common faiths across large parts of the Realms, and others being more minor faiths common in specific areas or in very small areas of influence. The minor faiths were of course expanded on in time, but they were also flattened: 2e, and especially 3e, had very strict rules about organizing deities where and when and how. As a result you have someone like Nobanion - a very specific deity about the power of animalism in the Vilhon Reach, Dragon Reach, and southern parts of the Sea of Fallen Stars - being placed on an even level with a god like Finder Wyvernspur, who has global if minor reach. So the differentiation between okay here we pray to Azuth and here's why in contrast to worshiping Mystra over here or Shar in this next place (because they're all "comparables" in terms of being god about magic) can really be lost. So someone who's an easy pick for boring - like Gwaeron Windstrom, god of tracking, how often is that going to come up - is conversely really interesting in focus, where Gwaeron tells us about how specific people live with and on the land and so on. I can subjectively pick out someone, but picking someone makes them seem superfluous, and I don't think that's appropriate - that way lies blowing up Tyr and Helm to fit into Torm, or adding Talos to Gruumsh or whatever the gently caress. Boring bad stuff that makes the Realms objectively less alive, less diverse, less interesting, less cool, and solely for people who aren't interested in actually exploring the setting or its strengths. All that said, the god I personally find the most boring is probably the entirety of the Mulhorandi pantheon. The entirety of Mulhorand as not-Egypt and the Mulhorandi gods just being the Egyptian gods was added by a bad developer and doesn't fit the Realms at all. It doesn't even work as well as the Untheric pantheon (originally the Babylonian) where Hoar actually connects interestingly with the rest of the Realms, there's tension with Chessenta and other areas and so on. [i[Golarion[/i]'s version is better, for crying out loud. Everything else is fun and then oh hey it's egypt go awayyyyyyyyyy
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Aug 2, 2014 01:26
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NachtSieger posted:This is already (pretty much) the default though, except in settings where Paladins explicitly gain power from some kind of deity. Paladins answer to the Everpresent Cosmic Force of Law and Good and only to them (and judging by the CoC the ECFoLaG is an enormous pain in the rear end stickler). Deity worship is a choice, typically, and has no bearing on a Paladin's powers, excepting Paladins worshiping an Evil deity of some kind for some reason, which is probably enough to earn them a fall. This isn't true in the Forgotten Realms, for the record - it just hasn't been touched on much since 2e (the first chapter of Champions of Valor being the only printed discussion, and there's also a little bit in the best web enhancement: Deity Dos and Don'ts, for Faiths and Pantheons.)
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Aug 2, 2014 01:29
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Ao's also pretty boring. I guess you could make the case for him being a sort of 'poo poo happens around me, works out for me' overgod like Mesopotamian myth, but he's mostly just not there.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:32
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I had Plutonis roll a saving throw and he got a 16, so I'm lifting the chat thread ban. He is still going to cat jail if he goes back to picking fights or whatever but cool posts are okay. 
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Aug 2, 2014 01:40
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I still think it should be called the Kitty Probation Prison.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:42
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Well Plut, congrats on all that free rope you got. Try not to wrap it around your neck and all.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:46
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Hey, anyone have any experience running The One Ring (Adventures Over the Edge of the Wild)? My friend lent me his copy and it's really, well, I think I'm gonna need some surgery, because this poo poo is extremely my heartbreaker.
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Aug 2, 2014 01:49
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Also a question for our mod emeritus: why isn't it Winston? Who the gently caress is Winson Paine anyway? IS YOUR FORUMS NAME YOUR ELFGAME DUDE LIKE US
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Aug 2, 2014 01:58
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Arivia posted:All that said, the god I personally find the most boring is probably the entirety of the Mulhorandi pantheon. The entirety of Mulhorand as not-Egypt and the Mulhorandi gods just being the Egyptian gods was added by a bad developer and doesn't fit the Realms at all. It doesn't even work as well as the Untheric pantheon (originally the Babylonian) where Hoar actually connects interestingly with the rest of the Realms, there's tension with Chessenta and other areas and so on. [i[Golarion[/i]'s version is better, for crying out loud. Everything else is fun and then oh hey it's egypt go awayyyyyyyyyy I wanna stick up for the Mulhorandi pantheon some. While they are just straight up Egyptian deities statted for D&D, they have a couple things going for them. First, like you said, one has to go all the way back to 1E to really understand their place in the setting. Early FR was full of interloper "real world" gods. Tyr is a great example. He is literally Norse God Tyr come to Faerun leading an army of valkyries to restore justice to the Vilhon Reach and later the world. Loviatar is another example. She is from the Finnish gods listed in the original Deities and Demigods IIRC. And another neat example is in the 1E Bloodstone Lands sourcebook written by Salvatore, the most powerful up and coming faith in the region is that of Dionysus (later retconned into a saint of Ilmater of all deities!?!). So the point of all that is to say that transplanted Egyptian gods are in keeping with the setting. Second, and this is the part that I think makes them interesting at least as a group, is they are literally transplanted Egyptian gods. In Faerun's distant past, the Imaskari empire, needing workers, opened up giant portals to other worlds and kidnapped millions of people. This, incidentally, is what brought many orcs to FR. One of those worlds was our own, and the people kidnapped were from ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia. The Imaskari erected a magical barrier to prevent these people's gods from helping them. But the Egyptian and Mesopotamian gods got around this barrier by sending physical manifestations of themselves flying through space to Toril, where they saved their enslaved people and took over as god kings. Night10194 posted:Ao's also pretty boring. I guess you could make the case for him being a sort of 'poo poo happens around me, works out for me' overgod like Mesopotamian myth, but he's mostly just not there. Ao is an interesting case. He's the overgod and doesn't grant spells to worshipers. He came about for the same reasons as Dragonlance's seldom mentioned Overgod, as a sort of panacea to the Satanic Panic. Here was the Abrahamic God just under a different alias. But Ao, through the way he has been used in the various events, has kinda transformed into this deity of designer fiat, which can be interesting on a meta level.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:02
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Arivia posted:Also a question for our mod emeritus: why isn't it Winston? Who the gently caress is Winson Paine anyway? Are you really this bad at puns
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Aug 2, 2014 02:03
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I always wondered why there's always a totally out of place YHVH in every goddamn D&D setting. I'm too young to have been in the real Satanic Panic so it doesn't come up as reflexively for me.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:03
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fatherdog posted:Are you really this bad at puns Winston Paine is also a pun.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:04
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fatherdog posted:Are you really this bad at puns yes
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Aug 2, 2014 02:06
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PeterWeller posted:Ao is an interesting case. He's the overgod and doesn't grant spells to worshipers. He came about for the same reasons as Dragonlance's seldom mentioned Overgod, as a sort of panacea to the Satanic Panic. Here was the Abrahamic God just under a different alias. But Ao, through the way he has been used in the various events, has kinda transformed into this deity of designer fiat, which can be interesting on a meta level. Going off of vague recollections here, but weren't there some sort of sources that implied that there was another step up the ladder for even Ao? It may or may not have been implied to be TSR/WotC.
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Aug 2, 2014 02:11
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Arivia posted:Also a question for our mod emeritus: why isn't it Winston? Who the gently caress is Winson Paine anyway? Winston Paine is the name of a character in esteemed vidya game Phoenix Attorneyman, and we can't have mods that are violating copyright right in their names, now, can we?
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Aug 2, 2014 02:12
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LightWarden posted:Going off of vague recollections here, but weren't there some sort of sources that implied that there was another step up the ladder for even Ao? It may or may not have been implied to be TSR/WotC. In the Time of Troubles books he reports to a higher god at the end, so yeah, he's just a middle management sort of god
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Aug 2, 2014 02:22
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