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Full Battle Rattle posted:The drop in quality between GAoTG and EMDM is astounding. We had a listening party for it after it came out and within 30 minutes some other album was on. I couldn't name a single track off it, just garbage. I can name one track but the only reason I remember it is because of how offensively terrible it was. Heart Shaped Glasses.
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Aug 9, 2014 03:32
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For anyone who's not sure why Eat Me Drink Me sounds the way it does, all the music is by Tim Skold. This was Tim Skold's pre-Marilyn Manson band: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXgeGlMGxTA
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Aug 9, 2014 04:02
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Masonic Youth posted:For anyone who's not sure why Eat Me Drink Me sounds the way it does, all the music is by Tim Skold. This was Tim Skold's pre-Marilyn Manson band: If EMDM sounded like a Motley Crue/Scorpions cover album I would probably like it more.
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Aug 9, 2014 04:21
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Masonic Youth posted:For anyone who's not sure why Eat Me Drink Me sounds the way it does, all the music is by Tim Skold. This was Tim Skold's pre-Marilyn Manson band: At least this is kinda catchy. Nothing on EMDM stays with you for more than ten seconds.
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Aug 9, 2014 09:04
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Are you the rabbit is sorta good, putting holes in happiness too.
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Aug 9, 2014 09:12
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N/A
BobbyHeenanTinyHat fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Aug 27, 2018 |
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Aug 9, 2014 12:47
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CAPT. Rainbowbeard posted:I agree with you there. I think GOAG's schtick was heavily produced music (see: Ka-Boom Ka-Boom and This Is The New poo poo, and, well, most of the album) so even the songs that flat out told you Manson wasn't even trying at this point sounded pretty good. It's funny you mention that, because yeah I'm kind of the same way. I guess I'm just lucky because I can easily ignore lyrics that are just dated or silly, but I get REALLY into ones that are strange just for the sake of it. Like, I don't really like death metal at all, but I have a weird appreciation for how many ways those bands can describe the things they describe.
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Aug 9, 2014 15:09
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He really needs something in his rider that says he only performs at night. Henry Rollins was right, it does look like a barbecue with a bunch of dead guys.
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Aug 9, 2014 15:54
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sethsez posted:I pretty much agree with you, his lyrics were garbage by the time Mechanical Animals rolled around and I'd argue that "sporadically interesting" was the best they ever got. I mostly just love MA because it's clearly his big love letter to Scary Monsters and, as you said, he surrounded himself with people who could pull that off. For me it was the blatant attempt to re-capture ACS with Holywood that turned me off forever, but I'll always stick up for the music of MA. Wow. I mean, I'm not gonna poo poo on your opinion, but I have to say I can't get behind that at all because I thought Holy Wood pulled off ACS better than ACS did, and with a lot more self-awareness. And a lot less Nine Inch Nails. The band really had to stand on their own two feet at that point and I thought they did it really well. Then again, I may be the biggest Holy Wood apologist on the internet.
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Aug 9, 2014 22:13
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Fenrir posted:Wow. I mean, I'm not gonna poo poo on your opinion, but I have to say I can't get behind that at all because I thought Holy Wood pulled off ACS better than ACS did, and with a lot more self-awareness. And a lot less Nine Inch Nails. The band really had to stand on their own two feet at that point and I thought they did it really well. Well, I was a huge fan of the glam sound Mechanical Animals had going for it, and thought it fit Manson's inherent goofiness like a glove. It was a really interesting change from ACS and had me interested in where he was going to go next. Holy Wood felt like a retreat to his comfort zone, and although the music itself was fine, it was the album that made me realize MA was the last time he'd try to surprise anyone. By the time I heard he had covered Personal Jesus and I knew what it sounded like before even listening to it, I had fully checked out.
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Aug 10, 2014 05:05
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I wish he'd just give up and become a recluse at this point honestly, because it's painful to a good band in an almost 2 decade long decline.
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Aug 10, 2014 06:25
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sethsez posted:Holy Wood felt like a retreat to his comfort zone, and although the music itself was fine, it was the album that made me realize MA was the last time he'd try to surprise anyone. For me, it was watching "Disposable Teens" on Much Loud. That is the exact moment I checked out. Both the guitar riffs and the video just seemed a complete and utter rehash. Also his singles always had me searching through abstract interpretation. Beautiful People, Tourniquet, Dope Show.. people always found similar yet different meanings. I could tolerate the blatant I Don't Like The Drugs just because it was him as this Bowie-esque fantasy character (plus a fun song). But Disposable Teens? It just seemed so.. pandering. Almost nu-metal lyrically, carefully packaged for angry 14-year-old boys. I mean perhaps that's what he was doing all along, but at least he hid it under a lot of clever abstraction up to that point.
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Aug 10, 2014 07:30
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I liked Holy Wood. There were still enough people around him to put out a good album.
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Aug 10, 2014 14:48
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Yeah any album with John 5 is good at least. That guy knew what he was doing.
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Aug 10, 2014 15:49
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The Cleaner posted:For me, it was watching "Disposable Teens" on Much Loud. That is the exact moment I checked out. I maintain that that is the whole point of Golden Age Of Grotesque. That is exactly what the New poo poo is, and most people lap it up. Not Manson, specifically, but what they are fed by Top 40.
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Aug 10, 2014 20:02
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Bown posted:The lyrics are pretty funny now though, like when you really consider how shocking he was considered to be and then half of them are just about sticking your middle fingers up It wasn't just the lyrics, he was specifically selecting imagery and ideas that were antagonistic to the "moral majority" at the time, and he was enormously popular for it. I mean, he literally called his breakout album "Antichrist Superstar". In his stage show, he ripped up a bible on stage. He was specifically playing into fundamentalist fears about satanism and moral decay. You have to remember that all of this followed the Satanic Ritual Abuse scares of the 80's and early 90's. Conservative Christianity had far more influence over the public discourse, and the idea that there were practicing Satanic cults, that Goth kids were really practicing black magic, or that Dungeons and Dragons was a tool for Satanic recruitment were ideas that got mainstream play at the time. The idea that he was shocking is ridiculous, which was sort of the point. He was able to act as a lightning rod for the all the ridiculous fears of fundamentalist Christianity. His image was specifically designed to provoke a particularly ridiculous sect of America, and he succeeded enormously. He deserves credit for being so good at it.
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Aug 10, 2014 22:21
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Beyond that, it was one time when the moral majority was like "this person is the antichrist" and they were obviously, hilariously, wrong. Marilyn Manson was at his best when he was surrounded by talented people. By GAotG there was almost nobody left. With Eat Me drink me they were all gone, his physique was garbage (which doesn't seem important, but when you watch his early videos it's clear that his lanky build plays into the persona - the vamping just isn't as effective from a chubby guy), and the music was trash. The remarkable innovation in the sound of his first four or five albums were the result of the talents around him being ciphered through him. When they all left we've just got uncut Manson, who honestly seems like a shlub. There have been a few albums since then but his scatterbrained ideas and failed projects (celbritarian whatever, the book of holy wood/adom kadmon/whatever) it's clear that whatever he had he doesn't have it anymore.
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Aug 10, 2014 23:04
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Just have to say that Skold is the motherfucker contrary to popular opinion.
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Aug 11, 2014 13:57
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I thought the word was that Skold's more of a child fucker. 
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Aug 13, 2014 06:52
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The Singing Chav posted:I thought the word was that Skold's more of a child fucker. Where does this come from? I think someone said that in the industrial thread but he was thinking of that dude from Stabbing Westward.
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Aug 23, 2014 06:23
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The Cleaner posted:For me, it was watching "Disposable Teens" on Much Loud. That is the exact moment I checked out. Disposable Teens is easily the worst song on HW, and even being as much of a HW apologist as I am, I'll be the first one to encourage people to just skip it.
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Aug 24, 2014 02:24
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This thread inspired me to give these albums a listen again... Portrait of an American Family still stands up. I do kinda wish they had run with this style for a little longer; it's fairly unique. Listening to the pre-Reznor mixes really drives home how much they needed him to break through. In high school I considered MM (possibly somewhat unfairly) to be a Reznor sideproject. It's pretty clear that Daisy Berkowitz was talented, but I'm still on the fence on the rest of those guys. When the Spawn soundtrack came out, I heard a rumor that the Sneaker Pimps hated working with MM because they could barely play their instruments. Smells Like Children - This was fairly dire. One or two half-decent remixes, some covers, and a poo poo-ton of moronic filler. I'm embarrassed to own this. Even when I bought this I didn't think it was all that great. For any music I bought in high school, it's really hard to separate the actual music from all the baggage of how I felt at the time. Why did I buy this album in the first place? One conversation, around the time AS came out: "You listen to Marilyn Manson?" "Yeah, I have all his albums." There. That one answer justified the purchase. Ugh. Antichrist Superstar - This seems to have been when he was at his provocative peak and I remember all the hysteria at the time when they came by during turing. The show was reportedly a let down, but the hype from all the local TV news stations about HARDCORE HORROR BAND MARILYN MANSON surely helped their ticket sales. I think the album still holds up. At the time it was my favorite, but I think I might like Portrait better now. Mechanical Animals - This is where I jumped off the bandwagon the first time around. The people I hung out with at the time were metalheads and this album seemed to have resonated far more with all the stoner kids (which there were more of). We all thought it was a lame sellout album, swapping a ghost-writing Reznor for Billy Corgan and an attempt to sell more albums with a less extreme, more mainstream sound. High school nonsense aside, it was pretty remarkable that they pulled off another image swap and also managed to put out a decent album. I would never buy a MM album in 2014, but there are clearly some good songs on there. I don't know that I will ever listen to them enough for it to grow on me, but if I had been more open minded in HS I would have probably liked this one as well. Holy Wood - Pretty much what I expected; a diluted, warmed-over version of AS. In fairness, I don't know how he could have made a proper sequel to AS, especially without Reznor.
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Aug 24, 2014 21:10
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RE: the ACS-era shows - I had the top of my fifteen year old head blown off at the one I saw. I don't think his concerts started to get bad until the post Guns God & Government tours. Even if his voice was always really rough live, there was soooooo much energy blasting off the stage and in the crowd that they were crazy awesome shows.
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Aug 24, 2014 23:34
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david_a posted:I heard a rumor that the Sneaker Pimps hated working with MM because they could barely play their instruments. The Sneaker Pimps were mad because the version of the song that ended up on the soundtrack was drastically different than the version they were wanting them to use. So basically there's a trip hop version of the song that never saw the light of day and the Critter remix doesn't use her vocals at all because of their slap fight.
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Aug 25, 2014 02:18
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I remember hearing at the time that Manson turned what was supposed to be a collaboration into a Marilyn Manson track.
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Aug 25, 2014 02:24
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samurai slowdown posted:The Sneaker Pimps were mad because the version of the song that ended up on the soundtrack was drastically different than the version they were wanting them to use. So basically there's a trip hop version of the song that never saw the light of day and the Critter remix doesn't use her vocals at all because of their slap fight. So they've never leaked it onto the internet or anything? That seems like something that should have popped up at some point.
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Aug 25, 2014 03:25
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Platypus Farm posted:RE: the ACS-era shows - I had the top of my fifteen year old head blown off at the one I saw. I don't think his concerts started to get bad until the post Guns God & Government tours. samurai slowdown posted:The Sneaker Pimps were mad because the version of the song that ended up on the soundtrack was drastically different than the version they were wanting them to use. So basically there's a trip hop version of the song that never saw the light of day and the Critter remix doesn't use her vocals at all because of their slap fight. But man, the Spawn soundtrack really was a textbook gimmick, wasn't it? Hey look kids, double the bands you like! As far as one-sided collaborations on that album goes, I always figured Slayer's input on No Remorse was them recording 60 seconds of chugging and sending it to some German dude to do what the gently caress ever those keyboard kids do. Or maybe Alec Empire just sampled an existing song and the label sent them a royalty check because 
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Aug 25, 2014 03:33
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The Sneaker Pimps turned into IAMX, and IAMX is quite good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPNmc71b7iE
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Aug 25, 2014 04:46
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Becoming X is a solid (90's) album, but it is telling that after the album came out the guys in the band fired Kelli Dayton because (supposedly) she was getting all the attention and people keep comparing them to Garbage, Curve and Portishead. I haven't really heard of their stuff post Dayton but my friend swears by them. I always wondered about their input in Long Hard Road as it sounds completely like a MM song, which is a shame because a trip hop version would kick arse, and I trust SP to produce something solid. edit: as far as the Spawn soundtrack goes Crystal Method and Filter's Trip like I do is loving dope.
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Aug 29, 2014 04:18
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Madkal posted:edit: as far as the Spawn soundtrack goes Crystal Method and Filter's Trip like I do is loving dope. That was far and away the best thing to come from that album, and probably the best thing to ever come from Filter as well (though I do have a bit of nostalgia for Short Bus and Title of Record).
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Aug 29, 2014 10:38
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"dope"
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Aug 29, 2014 10:39
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david_a posted:I always figured Slayer's input on No Remorse was them recording 60 seconds of chugging and sending it to some German dude to do what the gently caress ever those keyboard kids do. Or maybe Alec Empire just sampled an existing song and the label sent them a royalty check because Alec Empire's remixes/output of the time tended to be "Alec Empire and his one song". A distorted 909 bass drum and maybe something from the original track, Akai timestretching and lots of tuneless shouting. I loved ATR in the 90's.
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Aug 29, 2014 15:27
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The new ATR record is the most disappointing thing all year.
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Aug 29, 2014 16:07
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Four pages and people have already started discussing better music. Manson really is a has-been.
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Aug 29, 2014 19:45
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Bown posted:Despite the terrible title, I quite enjoy "Doll-Dagga Buzz-Buzz Ziggety-Zag" from GAOG. Also the title track This is all I like from that album as well. My main issue with it is that those sngs are really the only ones that deliver on the premise of the Manson-ized Cabaret sound in any way. I sometimes wonder if he came up with the concept first and then gave up on it mid-writing.
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Aug 30, 2014 02:20
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Full Battle Rattle posted:Four pages and people have already started discussing better music. Manson really is a has-been. Does that surprise you? Manson hasn't been relevant in 15 years. It's a shame we'll never get re-releases of the original albums since Manson alleges Trent erased the master tapes.
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Aug 30, 2014 02:25
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TOOT BOOT posted:Does that surprise you? Manson hasn't been relevant in 15 years. Given how remasters and re-releases generally go, this is perfectly fine. The original albums are all really well produced so I don't know what good it would do anyhow
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Aug 30, 2014 05:53
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A 5.1 mix of ACS would be the most relevant thing he's done in a decade. I also allege it would (or could, at least) be hella sweet.
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Aug 30, 2014 18:03
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I've had a long and disapointing history with Manson's music. I was happy up till Holywood (as much as some people check out on it, I quite like the riffs in disposable teens and the fight song and will easy lift my mood if heard). Golden Age was a slight let down, the later tracks on the album just sounded like Manson kind of gave up trying anything new like Doll-Dagga. EMDM was an atrocious waste of time and HEOL wasn't much better (apart from We're From America, I heard that on the radio and though "hey Mansons back" but whatever) Born Villian is an odd piece, on some respects I like that his lyrical ability has changed and become somewhat more conservative (less rambling around the dictionary and more thought into pacing) however there is still alot about that album that doesn't click well for me. I just wish he would do something like Trent did with Hesitation Marks and go in a completely different direction. Or stop...
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Sep 1, 2014 15:13
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 Also, Daisy Berkowitz is doing a solo show -- his first ever performing Marilyn Manson material -- at the Bowery in NYC on October 14. This Is the Zodiac fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Sep 2, 2014 |
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Sep 2, 2014 17:19
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