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Party Boat posted:There was a Simpsons Treehouse of Horror short that cast Comic Book Guy as a villain called the Collector. It's a pretty obvious riff. Also, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQ71Bwtu0RE
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Aug 12, 2014 09:52
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AnonSpore posted:Norse God in Full Armor, Man Literally Made of Fire, Technological Genius in Insanely Advanced Suit, and "Do not be concerned, Namor is fluent in a language all life forms understand." 
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Aug 12, 2014 11:56
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Just saw this today, though I missed the start because I was eating chicken. Didn't mind it, though the constant "all us misfits are friends!" pandering got old. The ending bugged me the ragtag group of misfits just give the Infinity Gem to the government? Reminds me of this essay: http://flag.blackened.net/liberty/moorcock.html "It was Alfred Bester who first attracted me to science fiction. I'd read some fantasy and Edgar Rice Burroughs before that, but I thought that if The Stars My Destination (also called Tiger! Tiger!) was sf, then this was the fiction for me. It took me some years to realise that Bester was one of the few exceptions. At the ending of The Stars My Destination the self-educated, working class, 'scum of the spaceways', Gully Foyle, comes into possession of the substance known as PyrE, capable of detonating at a thought and probably destroying the solar system at very least. The plot has revolved around the attempts of various powerful people to get hold of the stuff. Foyle has it. Moral arguments or forceful persuasions are brought against him to make him give PyrE up to a 'responsible' agency. In the end he scatters the stuff to 'the mob' of the solar system. Here you are, he says, it's yours. Its your destiny. Do with it how you see fit." Or M John Harrison's The Centauri Device, where the heroes destroy the corrupt universe.
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Aug 12, 2014 14:33
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Count Chocula posted:Just saw this today, though I missed the start because I was eating chicken. Didn't mind it, though the constant "all us misfits are friends!" pandering got old. The ending bugged me the ragtag group of misfits just give the Infinity Gem to the government? Reminds me of this essay: http://flag.blackened.net/liberty/moorcock.html "It was Alfred Bester who first attracted me to science fiction. I'd read some fantasy and Edgar Rice Burroughs before that, but I thought that if The Stars My Destination (also called Tiger! Tiger!) was sf, then this was the fiction for me. It took me some years to realise that Bester was one of the few exceptions. At the ending of The Stars My Destination the self-educated, working class, 'scum of the spaceways', Gully Foyle, comes into possession of the substance known as PyrE, capable of detonating at a thought and probably destroying the solar system at very least. The plot has revolved around the attempts of various powerful people to get hold of the stuff. Foyle has it. Moral arguments or forceful persuasions are brought against him to make him give PyrE up to a 'responsible' agency. In the end he scatters the stuff to 'the mob' of the solar system. Here you are, he says, it's yours. Its your destiny. Do with it how you see fit." I'm going to assume this is high praise coming from someone like you. Also pandering to who?
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Aug 12, 2014 15:16
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I knew I could hear the Ice King in that dude's voice.
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Aug 12, 2014 15:26
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Question for people who are knowledgeable about the comics, could Ronan have actually killed Thanos with the aid of an Infinity Stone as he threatened in the film?
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Aug 12, 2014 16:38
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Ape Gone Insane posted:Question for people who are knowledgeable about the comics, could Ronan have actually killed Thanos with the aid of an Infinity Stone as he threatened in the film? Characters like Thanos are depicted in variant ways depending on what the story needs, but I think the answer is "almost certainly yes." Thanos is as strong as Superman at some times but he's not immortal and the stone is clearly depicted in the movie as being able to destroy anything it touches. I'm guessing we're meant to read Thanos's smirk at Ronan's plan as him thinking Ronan is too stupid and unambitious to keep the gem under control, and not worrying about it for that reason, rather than because five people Thanos has never heard of succeeded in stopping him. The sort of loose continuity on crazy nonsense things like "Thanos can tear a planet apart with his bare hands" is a strength in a way, since you can define the terms of the conflict at the start of each narrative and go from there. One thing that has made comics stultifying and the movies are trying to get away from is the obsession that nerds have with defining things like "power levels" and who could kill whom -- the answer is ultimately, whatever makes sense for the plot and the themes.
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Aug 12, 2014 16:51
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Ape Gone Insane posted:Question for people who are knowledgeable about the comics, could Ronan have actually killed Thanos with the aid of an Infinity Stone as he threatened in the film? The answer is a reassuring 'maybe?'. I mean, what character wins in the end, be it by cunning, fate or just plain old beat down, is always determined by the narrative, so all waxing about who could beat who is always kinda moot without the context of the story they appear in. Thanos whole deal was his mad quest for absolute power, which he almost always succeeds in, so he very rarely faced off against others on equal footing, but even in newer stories, where he is, while not really a good guy, not the antagonist anymore, he has a tendency to walk over everybody until he runs into another space god. Ronan on the other hand was really only the chief justice of a powerful alien empire, but he has the two most powerful comic weapons with him, conviction and a cool look. Plus, he is overall much more heroic than Thanos even at his best. There is also the thing that the gems are actually never used in the comics, outside of the titular gauntlet, so, who knows.
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Aug 12, 2014 16:55
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meat sweats posted:Thanos is as strong as Superman at some times but he's not immortal He's an Eternal, a group of people who are defined by living forever and capable of reconstituting after getting hit by a nuclear bomb, and Death has specifically ditched him as a creepy stalker ex-boyfriend insuring that he is, in fact, immortal. 
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Aug 12, 2014 17:06
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e X posted:There is also the thing that the gems are actually never used in the comics, outside of the titular gauntlet, so, who knows. Pretty sure this is wrong, as Adam Warlock had the Soul Gem for a long time and uses it at one point to steal his own soul to prevent himself from turning into evil future himself.
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Aug 12, 2014 17:27
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Random Stranger posted:He's an Eternal, a group of people who are defined by living forever and capable of reconstituting after getting hit by a nuclear bomb, and Death has specifically ditched him as a creepy stalker ex-boyfriend insuring that he is, in fact, immortal. Yeah, I'm assuming this hasn't happened yet in the movie continuity. Admittedly, though, I don't know a lot about cosmic Marvel characters. I read thousands of comic books as a kid but one of the cool parts of the audacity Marvel has in making movies out of fourth-tier franchises like Guardians of the Galaxy is even most comics nerds don't know a whole lot about them, so the characters and plots come across as fresh and surprising in a way that you can't really do as easily with Spider-Man.
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Aug 12, 2014 17:36
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e X posted:There is also the thing that the gems are actually never used in the comics, outside of the titular gauntlet, so, who knows. The Power Gem was the basis of several She-Hulk books. In fact, this guy has used it a ton: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champion_of_the_Universe
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Aug 12, 2014 18:16
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The Puppy Bowl posted:I'm going to agree with you but "better than Fifth Element" is incredibly high praise coming from me. Not all of the jokes landed, the introduction and back-story of some of the Guardians was severely rushed (out of necessity) , and Pace's Ronan was a ham-fisted caricature that only worked because of how all the other characters reacted to him. I don't get why people like Fifth Element so much. It's so hokey. The Fifth Element is luuuurrrrvveeee. I mean, 5th Element is a fun summer popcorn SF flick but it never rises above its cornball summer-fun roots. I feel like what really sets GotG apart from other prior summer-fun blockbusters is Chris Pratt's performance. I think there's a parallel with Pratt's performance here and what Harrison Ford did with the Indiana Jones movies. Just like Indiana Jones transitioned from the Humphrey Bogart stone-cold badass action hero to something a little more comic and vulnerable (you see Indy get hurt; you see Indy fail to comic effect; you see Indy shoot the badass sword guy; you see Indy scared of snakes), Pratt's taken the action-movie superhero trope and broken that poo poo wide open in a goofball explosion, funny and vulnerable and sensitive and silly and kinda dumb and still badass despite all of that. I dunno, I don't want to overstate this. It's too early to say anything like "Pratt is the next Harrison Ford," etc. I do feel like GotG is tapping into the zeitgeist though. It seems like a movie that's going to set trends and be influential.
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Aug 12, 2014 19:06
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Count Chocula posted:Just saw this today, though I missed the start because I was eating chicken. Didn't mind it, though the constant "all us misfits are friends!" pandering got old. The ending bugged me the ragtag group of misfits just give the Infinity Gem to the government? Reminds me of this essay: http://flag.blackened.net/liberty/moorcock.html "It was Alfred Bester who first attracted me to science fiction. I'd read some fantasy and Edgar Rice Burroughs before that, but I thought that if The Stars My Destination (also called Tiger! Tiger!) was sf, then this was the fiction for me. It took me some years to realise that Bester was one of the few exceptions. At the ending of The Stars My Destination the self-educated, working class, 'scum of the spaceways', Gully Foyle, comes into possession of the substance known as PyrE, capable of detonating at a thought and probably destroying the solar system at very least. The plot has revolved around the attempts of various powerful people to get hold of the stuff. Foyle has it. Moral arguments or forceful persuasions are brought against him to make him give PyrE up to a 'responsible' agency. In the end he scatters the stuff to 'the mob' of the solar system. Here you are, he says, it's yours. Its your destiny. Do with it how you see fit." Not that I'm saying it'd be necessarily bad but it'd be absolutely fascinating to see a comic book hero movie try to jibe any kind of halfway considered antiauthoritarian politics with the basic genre premise that the people you're intended to root for are just straight-up inherently superior to everyone else in every way that matters, and aren't hateful sociopathic monsters. Like, try to picture selling Chris Pratt as a sympathetic goofball if his shootouts were written like Gully Foyle tearing through a mob of squatters like they're damp Kleenex. "What right have I to place myself above my brother?" *mows down 50,000 faceless mooks on way to crystal chamber, hair gets mussed* Tubgirl Cosplay fucked around with this message at 20:06 on Aug 12, 2014 |
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Aug 12, 2014 19:48
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Random Stranger posted:He's an Eternal, a group of people who are defined by living forever and capable of reconstituting after getting hit by a nuclear bomb, and Death has specifically ditched him as a creepy stalker ex-boyfriend insuring that he is, in fact, immortal. Actually he's a Titan, not an Eternal.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:20
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TheJoker138 posted:Actually he's a Titan, not an Eternal. I'm old and out of the loop, are celestials dudes like Galactus who survived the creation of our current universe or are they a different thing also? I was real into X-Men like everyone else, but throughout my childhood my favorite Marvel things ever were this sixties and seventies out-there-ness of dudes flying around chatting with space gods and celestials and these huge spiritual, mythical life forms being approachable things in the world and all the crazy sci-fi outfits, robots, alien societies, etc. So this is basically going to be my favorite Marvel movie ever until Guardians of the Galaxy 2 comes out. Even when Iron Man came out and was mega-huge I would never have believed this movie would get made. And while I don't think it's as good as Star Wars, it comes real close, if I was like ten or whatever it totally would have been my Star Wars though. Like just the idea that someone was like "I know let's take these unknown sixties guys and make a flick that's basically Star Wars but more comedic" and it actually happened blows me away. There were so many moments in the film that felt and looked exactly as they would in those old comics. Like the reveal of Knowhere, the little memory of that celestial blowing away that planet with one of the gems. The way Drax the Destroyer looks at the camera taking up half the screen, holds out is hand to the background and says "BEHOLD." as Quill is floating back to them is like like literally how like every Silver Surfer or The Eternals' splash pages would open up each issue. The amount of "BEHOLD."s in this flick in general is definitely worthy of Stan Lee and Ditko at that time, I love it). The way Gamora switches to super flowery formal speak whenever she's confused or angry, it's awesome. The way that, even more so than Thor they were just like gently caress it, we have a movie with talking trees, Rocket and necro-cyborg dudes. Drax explaining in his own way what a metaphor is while ripping out pieces of Djimon Hounsou's head. Ronan the Accuser's giant stone room of space skype. Ronan the Accuser's dystopian sci-fi wimple that is so serious he needs like three people to help him put it on. Ronan the Accuser's smirk and hammer turn to attack people. I love how ridiculous this guy is in the movie. I also love how at the end he is destroyed by a dance off and the power of friendship. The way the movie was so much more character focused was great, and for a team of ragtag guys from wildly different walks of life I appreciated that they made the movie squarely about how your real family is the people you're able to depend on rather than your literal family. The entire cast of this movie was outstanding and having a lot of fun with it. I basically had a huge grin on my face for this entire movie. Which makes it even more impressive that they sold most of the characters too. I'm glad they didn't do an origin story for anyone and just gave us the broad strokes so we could see them develop through their actions instead. I've been real sick of the super hero origin model where the hero sucks, gets into a fight halfway through and gets owned, then figures out whatever they need to do and walks all over the bad guy at the end. This did a great job of having everyone able to improvise and work together as a team more and more effectively as the movie went on, and it was also great at not making anything too easy for our heroes as well, though I do think it was dumb that Ronan completely lays out Drax in their first brawl, it seemed weirdly pointless and a missed opportunity to add more character to Ronan if, pre-gem obtainment, he literally HAD TO ESCAPE ASAP AND GET THE gently caress AWAY FROM THIS DRAX DUDE or if he had to punk out and called some of those ships back to divert him instead or, more appropriately, if he respected Drax for, exactly like Ronan is, respecting the old ways of revenge that the Kree used to be all about. The movie is already pretty long so I can understand wanting to keep this brief though, and I do appreciate Drax basically doing what we know the character of Drax would have done at that point in the film. Still though, it was the only fight in the movie that felt forced and pointless to me once it actually got started. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Aug 12, 2014 |
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Aug 12, 2014 20:42
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TheJoker138 posted:Actually he's a Titan, not an Eternal. Titans are Eternals.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:43
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Neo Rasa posted:movie stuff The great thing is that the space theme of the movie really works as a great meta origin to explain way most question about these characters. They are aliens. The only time it doesn't work is with Thanos, since he is portrayed as exceptional, even in this weird universe.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:49
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e X posted:The great thing is that the space theme of the movie really works as a great meta origin to explain way most question about these characters. They are aliens. The only time it doesn't work is with Thanos, since he is portrayed as exceptional, even in this weird universe. I kind of like that though, since they don't have him doing anything yet reputation is all he's got to go on. Especially in a setting where even these other super powerful dudes aren't exactly falling all over themselves to step to him.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:51
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Deadpool posted:Titans are Eternals. They're an offshoot of them but aren't as powerful or immortal.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:53
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't get why people like Fifth Element so much. It's so hokey. The Fifth Element is luuuurrrrvveeee. I mean, 5th Element is a fun summer popcorn SF flick but it never rises above its cornball summer-fun roots. The production design alone puts The Fifth Element in its own class compared to similar genre films.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:53
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Mechafunkzilla posted:The production design alone puts The Fifth Element in its own class compared to similar genre films. I wish more movies would plagiarized Moebius and Jodorowsky (but then actually pay out). It's impressive though how even in the mid to late nineties movies and tv shows like that would have some straight up Moebius thing in them. Like I even remember a couple of later episodes of Next Generation where it's clear.
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Aug 12, 2014 20:58
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Fifth element did "hokey" perfectly. It's such a good movie
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Aug 12, 2014 21:10
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Zzulu posted:Fifth element did "hokey" perfectly. It's such a good movie This and GotG actually hit the same category as Pacific Rim for me; they are movies that were exactly what they advertised themselves to be, and despite trivial (or trivial in the context of their own absurdity) flaws, were fun as hell. I wish the women had better characterization, I wish Ronan hadn't been a cut-out, and I kind of wish the Howard the Duck end-credit bit had been something other than Howard--it takes serious balls to do a call-back to an indisputably garbage, unloved movie but I didn't see anyone leave that theatre unhappy.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:17
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Pixelante posted:This and GotG actually hit the same category as Pacific Rim for me; they are movies that were exactly what they advertised themselves to be, and despite trivial (or trivial in the context of their own absurdity) flaws, were fun as hell. I wish the women had better characterization, I wish Ronan hadn't been a cut-out, and I kind of wish the Howard the Duck end-credit bit had been something other than Howard--it takes serious balls to do a call-back to an indisputably garbage, unloved movie but I didn't see anyone leave that theatre unhappy. That thing in your spoiler, to be fair, was a comic long before it was a movie.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:18
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Neo Rasa posted:I wish more movies would plagiarized Moebius and Jodorowsky (but then actually pay out). It's impressive though how even in the mid to late nineties movies and tv shows like that would have some straight up Moebius thing in them. Like I even remember a couple of later episodes of Next Generation where it's clear. What's up fellow Jodorowsky's Dune watcher 
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Aug 12, 2014 21:21
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Steve Yun posted:What's up fellow Jodorowsky's Dune watcher He's talking about The Incal. There was a lawsuit.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:24
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Steve Yun posted:What's up fellow Jodorowsky's Dune watcher  I just saw that about a month ago and it's amazing, but even before seeing it, Next Generation has some dudes that are like "Wait a minute I saw this guy in Heavy Metal" towards the end. The episode where Picard is undercover with some scumbag pirates, the one where they have to trace where some ship came from or something to. The manager of the shipyards is literally some fat techno priest dude out of nowhere.That book man, holy poo poo. That Dune production book he has, I'm cheap as hell but I'm surprised they didn't print a few for general purchase when the movie came out. I would totally pay like $200 for a copy of that.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:30
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Crappy Jack posted:That thing in your spoiler, to be fair, was a comic long before it was a movie. Hm. Didn't know that. I read heaps of comics in my teens, but never really ventured out of my X-Men/Sandman/Warren Ellis comfort zone.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:32
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Guardians is a good film but it can't even touch Fifth Element.
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Aug 12, 2014 21:42
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Guardians is a good film but it can't even touch Fifth Element. The Orb in this movie is an allegory for the Fifth Element. The movie can touch it for a little while, but if it holds on too long, it'll explode.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:14
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TheJoker138 posted:They're an offshoot of them but aren't as powerful or immortal. I thought the current origin has him being born to Titan parents but he's closer to a genetic throwback to a Deviant.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:16
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Mechafunkzilla posted:He's talking about The Incal. There was a lawsuit.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:16
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Steve Yun posted:I know, they talked about Incal in the documentary I still can't believe the production collapsed because they were short just $5 million. I mean obviously inflation but it's so unreal to read that amount today in a Hollywood context.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:36
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Guardians is a good film but it can't even touch Fifth Element. Of course not, Guardians is too far above it.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:44
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Guardians of the Galaxy is really good, great even. The only problem I have is the storytelling in some places. It doesn't seem to trust it's own sense of humour, and is way too, I dunno quite how to describe it, “quippy”? Some of those jokes were poorly timed, and the sheer amount of them is not gonna stand up to repeated viewings. Some of the exposition was unnecessary as well, but I was honestly worried it would be worse, since it is a Marvel movie. And I think my favourite thing about it (beyond the love of pop music defeating evil!  ) was how it treated the obsession with canon-continuity: it's antagonist straight-up dismisses the Marvel Avenger tie-in as the weak-rear end bullshit that it is! I fist pumped every time Ronan disrespected Thanos.Ok, some of these posts are old, but I wanna respond to them anyways so whatever: suddenlyissoon posted:I just couldn't believe they didn't try to tie it back to the rest of the movies. Outside of Thanos there was zero connection. I was cringing going in, since I expected a lot more of that stuff. Honestly, the build-up of Thanos as a threat just does not work in these movies. It was his threats that were empty, not Ronans. BravestOfTheLamps posted:Just got back from watching it, and have to echo previous comments. The exposition was stilted, and the more emotional scenes felt a bit forced at times, Gamora wasn't as fun as the rest, but otherwise its one of the few pieces of entertainment I found to be worth the hype. The only niggling thing is that I can't help but to feel that the Xandar-Ronan conflict was allegorical of Islamic terrorism. I know that's probably not the intent, but that's how it came across. I thought Gamora was great – she's basically the most well-meaning character in the movie; the Guardians coming together is because her noble quest rubs off on and inspires Starlord and the others. She's basically a green Leia Skywalker! Ronan does represent Islamic terrorists, as well as other elements of the Other (the concept, not the character), but I will get into him more later. jivjov posted:So this is a pedantic question of the highest order...but I'm curious...does Rocket actually understand what Groot is saying, like he's Han to the tree's Chewie? Or is he just filling in whatever he wants Groot to be saying? Yes. Naet posted:The movie reminded me of some strange combination of Avengers, Star Wars, and that American Dad! episode with Jeff in space. LOVE that episode. The references and inspirations this film draws from really made it fun to watch. DrakePegasus posted:We needed to see SOMEBODY get annihilate by Thanos at the end as recompense for the betrayal. At this point Mr. T is 2 for 2 on wasted sub-villain investments. All casual viewers have to register him as a threat is other peoples' word, we need to see proof that he could've taken Stoned Ronan after that empty brag ShoogaSlim posted:Comic book fans, even very casual ones, understand that Thanos is an evil bad-rear end motherfucker. But as has been brought up multiple times in the thread, we need to be shown, not just told of the implication. That's the thing, Ronan is clearly his superior in every way. Thanos knows this, which is why he flees from the Kree. I don't see it as a problem though, cuz Ronan is awesome and Thanos looks lame and is clearly a coward who hires out his killings and enjoys little to no loyalty from his subjects. He just plain sucks, the movies are making this very clear. DNS posted:Cuz he woulda gotten his rear end kicked by gem-powered Ronan. Even before that Ronan could have taken him. The Accuser was certainly not impressed by that “i'll get out of my chair and stomp you” threat. He has the measure of this mad titan, which is why he treats the ugly doofus with such disdain and slight regard. Omnomnomnivore posted:So Xandar just sends people to prison without a trial, huh? Yeah, to a prison system where they are in severe risk of torture and rape. The NovaCorps/Xandar are basically the Old Republic (trans: the modern Western world). The fancy city looks like one of those in Qatar or the UAE, their authority figures are presented as mostly useless and corrupt, with only a couple redeeming moments. Plus the only aliens who are not lower class in their world are the jeweler and pretty pink girls, every one else is a pirate, miner, bounty hunter or convict. Ronan is not 100% off in his judgement. kater posted:I don't think Ronan is dead. Was there a corpse? I think the dude is living in the gem. Oh I hope so! If/when Thanos gets ahold of the gauntlet, I want the Accuser to wraith out and wreak the his poo poo! That would actually make thematic sense. “You desire to be a god? Well gods can still be judged motherfuckerrrr” - something along those lines. Of course I doubt any one at Marvel studios has the wit to see it or the balls to do it, but I can dream on. XboxPants posted:They probably could have given Ronan a motivation, though. He lost his father and his honour in the war with Xandar, and he hates them for it. He says this at least twice. Davros1 posted:Seriously, people seem to be under the impression that I have some intense hatred for this film. I don't Ah don't let the nerd-group-think get to ya, I think your criticisms are valid. And I understand people's reactions, I'm usually really excited right after I've seen a good movie. That is why I try to wait a bit to calm down before discussing a film though, since no one wants to read reactionary hype. Pander posted:I thought power was referencing not only the 'typical' metrics of power, but also power of will, which Star Lord and crew have in spades by the end. Yes, absolutely! The whole “ancient alien dna” the Novas claim is false, it's just they have no other explanation, cuz like the Jedi they're too dumb to understand the power of love. And this explains why Ronan could grab the orb bare-handed and alone, to Thanos' horror (cuz he can't cuz he's a bitch who needs gloves) – unlike the love of the guardians, his will is strong through his hatred. Uncle Boogeyman posted:-Some people have been throwing around "Best Star Wars movie since 1980." It's a fun movie, but I don't agree. It's not as good as Return of the Jedi. Hell, I'm not even sure it's as good as Serenity or John Carter. That reminds me I need to see John Carter. Serenity sucked, but I have never watched Firefly so I may have approached it wrong, and it was a long time ago, so I probably should give it another shot. Anyways, Guardians is about Gamora redeeming the rest of the crew. By the time the film begins, she's clearly already had her own redemption moment. Starlord was always a good person, but hides his trauma behind space-pirate roguishness: she's the catalyst he needs to move beyond that! And she needs him too, as he is the first person to ever believe/trust/actually like her. I was really disappointed they didn't kiss.  The Thanos scenes were great, but I think I liked them for different reasons than most. Ronan never cowers, he judges, and when he tells the titan he's coming for him, it's not a hollow threat. Thanos knows it too, that's why he looks like bile has just shot up into his throat, and why he hangs up his video-phone: so the audience cannot witness him running away on his chubby toddler legs! Davros1 posted:If the film can give us the motivation for a character who's in two or three scenes The Collector's . . . assistant? I don't how you'd classify her. But the pink girl who the Collector threatens with imprisonment, who then tries to kill him by taking the Infinity Gem. The character's motivation is shown, while most of the main character's aren't? There's something wrong about that. I mostly agree with you on this issue, although I don't think full-on flashback scenes would be necessary for Drax and Gamora, just proper imagery (like the lighting or colours or something) for when they speak about themselves. Rocket's drunken breakdown was a little redundant, cuz we see his scarred back in prison. I think the motivations for the heroes and villains are fairly clear, but some of them are definitely presented awkwardly. The characters who really could have benefited with a little more time are Groot and Korath the Hunter, I feel they both get short-changed in spite of being really interesting conception/aesthetic-wise. Alfred P. Pseudonym posted:So are the Kree supposed to be space Native Americans or what's the deal with that? I don't read comics so I don't know the background but Ronan kept talking about getting revenge on Xandar for loving them over for a thousand years and he wears face paint so I kind of got that impression. Also, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cree mr. mephistopheles posted:Ronan is a religious fanatic and there's a bit where they criticize the rest of his race/religion for not doing more to stop/condemn his actions. The only way they could make the Muslim parallel more obvious would be to have Ronan's followers suicide bomb during the final battle... oh, wait, they totally do that. I suppose you could see Japanese influence between the kamikaze ships and his name/appearance, but I think the Muslim subtext is more supported. They are a combination of Western fears, so yes, the villains are a mix of indigenous and oriental images, or rather our propaganda about them. Ex: “They hate our culture of freedoms because they are savages! Don't think about our centuries-long military occupations or economic exploitations that can't be it!” The Accuser and his army are wonderful in their visual/thematic cues: first obviously the Frost Giants and other Marvel bad guys, but also the villains from Chronicles of Riddick and Immortals. Ronan himself is like a Zod/Dredd who emerges from beyond the black rainbow! And his relationship with Drax reminds of Batman and Bane. Drax, despite his nickname and early blustering, is not willing to totally abandon his humanity to achieve his vengeance, Ronan is. That is eventually revealed as a strength in the hand-holding showdown, of course. Ronan has essentially the same motivations as Drax, but because he has stripped himself of love, he can only succeeds in creating more versions of himself. Luckily Drax (and Gamora, who has a similar story) reject this hatred. Ronan really is the best villain I've seen yet in these Marvel films. If Marvel Studios were smart (interested in telling a good story as opposed to stretching one out into mediocrity) he would be the Big Bad. Or Thanos really should have been modeled on him; y'know a villain whose interesting and scary?? One who actually does stuff as opposed to sitting on his fat-rear end going "just as planned" ad nauseam. Raserys posted:Hell, Yondu says, "I may be pretty as an angel, but I sure as hell ain't one." He raised him, he is Starlord's father in a much more real way than some jackass. They should make Adam Warlock his father, I never read any of his comics but he sounds crazy weird, which this boring universe needs more of! Lets! Get! Weird! posted:Ghostbusters is much better than Fifth Element and Man of Steel wasn't good at all so it almost sounds like you're making a jab at Guardians of the Galaxy. Wrong on all three counts. Steve Yun posted:Is there some sort of subtext for The Collector in the comics where he's supposed to be an audience representative, a symbol for nerds collecting comics and toys and being extra anal-retentive about keeping them in mint condition? Yeah he was a great diss on nerd-culture and its compulsive consumption and terrible treatment of women. Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't get why people like Fifth Element so much. It's so hokey. The Fifth Element is luuuurrrrvveeee. Look it this fool, believes the Xandar propaganda that it was Starlords DNA that let the Guardians harness the orb. Nope. Uncle Boogeyman posted:Guardians is a good film but it can't even touch Fifth Element. Yeah no kidding. I'm chalking it up to peeps being blinded by excitement or something
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Aug 12, 2014 22:50
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Both Fifth Element and Guardians of the Galaxy have really strong production design and an interesting take on scifi, with maybe a slight difference being that Fifth Element was made in 1997 and therefore more impressive even yet. I shall enjoy both these movies equally.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:52
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:BI shall enjoy both these movies equally. No, that's not allowed! You must choooooose
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Aug 12, 2014 23:27
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Black Bones posted:Long post goddamn I have some thoughts regarding Ronan as a terrorist - Now, I don't think the Orb is the true villain of the movie, but looking at it from that perspective reveals the actual the conflict running through the movie: the conflict is not to defeat Ronan, but to control the Orb. Only Drax considers Ronan's defeat an end in itself, and he more or less abandons that goal. The real endpoint is control of the Orb, and the beats of the story revolve entirely around it. Ronan and Thanos matter only in relation to the Orb, and the fight against Ronan serves to rob him of the Orb. When the heroes control the Orb, they destroy Ronan, but its basically an afterthought, more judicial than military. If you read it as a statement on Islamic terrorism, it seems to say that the terrorist is not the true danger, and that defeating the terrorist is not an end in itself. The true conflict is against war and devastation itself. The Orb is pure violence, and the true conflict is to control and regulate that. They overcome it by forming a new society (the hand-holding), which amounts to metaphorical reform. Terrorism is a threat yes, but its, but one can only overcome it by addressing its underlying causes rather than, say, leading a nuke to the "right" target. In the end, the Orb is handed to the Nova Corps, who, while corrupt in their way, are shown to be agents of order and regulation. They don't project force as much as they prevent such (exemplified in the almost literal human barrier, which is their strategy against terrorism - defence instead of offence). There was something else I wanted to address - in addition to embodying the Other, I think Ronan is clearly a thanatic figure. On his vessel, Ronan is an underworld judge, holding a hammer in a dark cave, commands demonic (relatively speaking, of course) soldiers and "necrocrafts", and works for someone called Thanos. This ties into another theme of the movie, life and death, which I do want to talk about sometime when I have time for an effort post. e: I don't think Xandar is as corrupt as it immediately seems. It just a quibble, but when the Quill and company were being sent to prison, I didn't assume it was without a trial - they have previous criminal records, so its likely that they had been judged in absentia (which might be reasonable in a space-faring society where being present for a trial could be a luxury). Although that's arguing on a subnarrative level than a symbolical/metaphorical one. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Aug 13, 2014 |
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Aug 12, 2014 23:34
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:Both Fifth Element and Guardians of the Galaxy have really strong production design and an interesting take on scifi, with maybe a slight difference being that Fifth Element was made in 1997 and therefore more impressive even yet. I shall enjoy both these movies equally. Ladies and gentlemen, a man of reason and insight.
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Aug 12, 2014 23:42
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