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Huzzah!
Sep 15, 2007

Malnutrition is scarier than any beastie.

Austrian mook posted:

how much strength do I need to wield the black knight greatsword?


The black knight greatsword is 32 strength to one hand it, 22 if you two hand it. While the two handed heavy attack is rather slow, it's worth it to send fools flying. God I love doing that.

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Tarezax
Sep 12, 2009

MORT cancels dance: interrupted by MORT

RBA Starblade posted:

Yeah, I realized early on that I was probably dooming myself (and figured out that I was doomed when Rhea stayed mad), but I thought that maybe I could account for it, but I really don't do enough damage, and even if rolling wasn't freaking out and delaying itself for reasons I still haven't really figured out (seriously, at the sanctuary guardian it waited long enough to roll that it dodged another attack completely), I'm just not good enough at Dark Souls 1 to deal with it all solo. If I had a human buddy I probably could have taken Manus though.

This time I'm taking the Zweihander, I'm ignoring everything that doesn't make it +15 (or is the Lightning Zweihander still King poo poo of Dark Souls? I know they nerfed it at some point.), I'll probably keep power within because wow that's good, and I'm going to have my revenge. Except upper blighttown, to hell with that I'm taking the backdoor again the framerate is even worse up there. Actually I feel like my other mistake was not just buying the game again on PC and using DSFix.


I...I died trying. :negative:

I've had that same weird command buffering thing you're getting. With me it happened most often when I was trying to Estus. If you notice that your command didn't go through, do something else (like raise your shield or attack) and then it will trigger.

I don't know why this happens, and it's really dumb when it happens while you're trying to dodge.

Lightning Zwei is king at PvP but versus bosses a normal weapon + a weapon enchant/ resin is better IMO.

Austrian mook
Feb 24, 2013

by Shine

Huzzah! posted:

The black knight greatsword is 32 strength to one hand it, 22 if you two hand it. While the two handed heavy attack is rather slow, it's worth it to send fools flying. God I love doing that.

I swear to god I've got more than 22 strength and it's not letting me two hand it.

Huzzah!
Sep 15, 2007

Malnutrition is scarier than any beastie.

Austrian mook posted:

I swear to god I've got more than 22 strength and it's not letting me two hand it.

You also need 18 dex, that might be the problem.

Austrian mook
Feb 24, 2013

by Shine

Huzzah! posted:

You also need 18 dex, that might be the problem.

Oh poo poo, thanks man. How can you check this in-game? I've never understood.

Tae
Oct 24, 2010

Hello? Can you hear me? ...Perhaps if I shout? AAAAAAAAAH!
I mean you CAN gimp yourself stat-wise, but ultimately just getting a decent shield, upgrade it, and learn patterns will get through especially the 2nd half of the game when the bosses are arguably easier than the 1st half (Ornstein+Smogh or Sif harder than Nito, Seathe, Gwyn, 4 Kings IMO).

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Austrian mook posted:

Oh poo poo, thanks man. How can you check this in-game? I've never understood.

On a 360 controller, hit X at the equipment screen to toggle to the stats screen. If the stat is in red, you don't have enough of it.

quote:

I've had that same weird command buffering thing you're getting. With me it happened most often when I was trying to Estus. If you notice that your command didn't go through, do something else (like raise your shield or attack) and then it will trigger.

Are you on 360 too, out of curiosity? I don't remember it happening at all the last time I played.

quote:

Lightning Zwei is king at PvP but versus bosses a normal weapon + a weapon enchant/ resin is better IMO.

Thanks, I'll just put it to +15 then. Maybe also mess around with the Dragon Tooth and get a greatsword up to have fun with the Abyss Greatsword too. Though I probably won't feel like putting in the levels for that last one.

RBA Starblade fucked around with this message at 02:26 on Aug 23, 2014

pun pundit
Nov 11, 2008

I feel the same way about the company bearing the same name.

RBA Starblade posted:

30 because I was retarded enough to put points into faith for GLS, which while good, really, really wasn't worth the extra 8 levels, on top of managing enough strength for other weapons and hp and endurance, and 4 spell slots was overkill too. I didn't try spears besides Ornstein's which I didn't care for and needed more strength than I had to one hand, but on top of completely hating the other weapons now, I just completely hosed up the faith portion of it, and the whole thing just wasn't any fun at all anymore. Smashing my face against Manus and all those other bosses, losing repeatedly to things that were barely problems on my other characters, and then immediately getting shut down by Nito was just enough for me. I could actually kill most smaller enemies fine, but bosses just became more and more frustrating. This time I'm going Str/End and using pyromancy exclusively as a backup. Probably grab a big bow too because those were a lot better than I gave them credit for before. I still want to get all the way through the game again, even though I think the game peaks at Anor Londo.

I never saw a straight sword besides Astora's either. I got every other piece of balder equipment though! I bet one drops on the first knight I kill just to spite me.


GLS is really good, though. Because how defenses work in Dark Souls attack power buffs will make a larger difference to the damage numbers you do than the percentages of those buffs indicate. Dusk's silly hat (or Gwyndolin's silly hat) plus the miracle boosting ring should make GLS rather better against bosses.

EightBit
Jan 7, 2006
I spent money on this line of text just to make the "Stupid Newbie" go away.

Austrian mook posted:

I swear to god I've got more than 22 strength and it's not letting me two hand it.

It has a dex requirement too.

Nahxela
Oct 11, 2008

Execution

Your Computer posted:

Oh yeah, this is one of the worst things about Dark Souls. You can legitimately gimp yourself enough that the game is impossible for your skill level (it's possible to do SL1 runs, but that's for the people who have spent countless hundreds of hours) by spreading your stats too thin. I'm glad From saw the error of their ways and added a way to respec in Dark Souls 2. I was so used to DS2 (of which I have spent hundreds of hours)'s mechanics that I managed to do something similar in my last DS1 run and I just said "gently caress it" and re-allocated my stats using CE. v:v:v


e: I kinda feel like a DS1 run requires a lot of planning before even starting the game, in order to not get hosed down the line. Things like 1) what gear will I use, 2) what stats do I need minimum for it, 3) what/how many spells, etc.

The alternative is of course, as always, git gud :smug: Who needs stats anyway? Punch everything to death with your fists!
SL1 Dark Souls runs boil down to Great Combustioning most everything. It's actually pretty trivial in a lot of places.

In any case, I don't think you really need that much planning unless you want to really minmax the hell out of it. Just focus on a main damage stat and add in some other things. Yeah, you don't want to dabble in basically everything, but you don't really need too much of a plan beyond "I want to do a Dex Build" or something of that nature.

Austrian mook posted:

how much strength do I need to wield the black knight greatsword?

E: Right now my weapon is a raw halbard, is that okay for Anor Londo?
I'd go to a blacksmith and bring that Raw Halberd back to the normal path. Raw nerfs the physical scaling for some base damage, so if you're leveling up Str/Dex, you're going to be missing out on some bonuses. It also doesn't upgrade as many times as the other paths.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

Nahxela posted:

In any case, I don't think you really need that much planning unless you want to really minmax the hell out of it. Just focus on a main damage stat and add in some other things. Yeah, you don't want to dabble in basically everything, but you don't really need too much of a plan beyond "I want to do a Dex Build" or something of that nature.

You fail to account for the most important thing, Fashion Souls :pseudo:
(e: really though, my newest playthrough uses Ornstein's Armor with Gargoyle Helm and some other stuff and still fast rolls, that required a bit of planning!)

Really though, even planning "I want to do a DEX build" is a bit too much in my opinion. It's fine if that's your n'th run, but for first-timers it's very counter-intuitive and harsh. Even now, I was originally planning to do a STR build but was just underwhelmed by the weapons I found (quite the opposite of DS2 in fact) and wished I had more DEX instead. DS1 also has a lot less cool weapons in my opinion, and the ones that are cool are so late game that they serve no purpose. I started one character, intending to do a really heavy-hitting two-hand STR/FTH build using Grant, ran down to the Tomb of the Giants and... found out it was gated behind the Lordvessel (not to mention the ridiculous stats). It was easier to just make a new character than to run out of there again.


The idea of deciding "I want a [STR/DEX] character" when starting is a very good one though, and should keep you from completely screwing yourself over.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Your Computer posted:


The idea of deciding "I want a [STR/DEX] character" when starting is a very good one though, and should keep you from completely screwing yourself over.

Yeah, truth is this is my third run but I hadn't played since the dlc came out (I think), and I just absolutely screwed everything up and made undead life hell. I should have stopped back when I saw that Rhea was still pissed like ten hours ago.

Tarezax
Sep 12, 2009

MORT cancels dance: interrupted by MORT

RBA Starblade posted:

On a 360 controller, hit X at the equipment screen to toggle to the stats screen. If the stat is in red, you don't have enough of it.


Are you on 360 too, out of curiosity? I don't remember it happening at all the last time I played.


Thanks, I'll just put it to +15 then. Maybe also mess around with the Dragon Tooth and get a greatsword up to have fun with the Abyss Greatsword too. Though I probably won't feel like putting in the levels for that last one.

Nope, I'm on PC, using an XBox 360 controller.

Tokyo Sex Whale
Oct 9, 2012

"My butt smells like vanilla ice cream"

RBA Starblade posted:

Yeah, truth is this is my third run but I hadn't played since the dlc came out (I think), and I just absolutely screwed everything up and made undead life hell. I should have stopped back when I saw that Rhea was still pissed like ten hours ago.

She only really sells PvP spells and I don't think many people are PvPing this anymore.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

Tokyo Sex Whale posted:

She only really sells PvP spells and I don't think many people are PvPing this anymore.

How much I wish this was true :(

You can't be human for even a minute without getting invaded by someone getting their rocks off by griefing, who is either twinked out or (more likely) hacked in enough stuff to kill you in one hit. It's the worst.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Your Computer posted:

How much I wish this was true :(

You can't be human for even a minute without getting invaded by someone getting their rocks off by griefing, who is either twinked out or (more likely) hacked in enough stuff to kill you in one hit. It's the worst.

I didn't see a single invader when I was on 360 except when I got summoned in the depths, where I immediately died to Avelyn. Only a handful of summon signs too. :(

quote:

She only really sells PvP spells and I don't think many people are PvPing this anymore.

I was hoping for at least Great Heal and WoG.

Tokyo Sex Whale
Oct 9, 2012

"My butt smells like vanilla ice cream"

RBA Starblade posted:

I was hoping for at least Great Heal and WoG.

WoG is not very good in PVE so don't sweat it. Great heal is worse than estus.

animatorZed
Jan 2, 2008
falling down

Nahxela posted:

SL1 Dark Souls runs boil down to Great Combustioning most everything. It's actually pretty trivial in a lot of places.

Nuking 4kings with great combustion with an SL1 pyro was the easiest that fight has ever been.

Your Computer posted:

You can't be human for even a minute without getting invaded by someone getting their rocks off by griefing, who is either twinked out or (more likely) hacked in enough stuff to kill you in one hit. It's the worst.

Its not at all hard to get through most of the game at sl1 or close to it once you get used to the game. See above.
Also, even at SL1, even just carrying around 10-30 liquid humanity while naked basically makes you invincible to un-upgraded, or lightly upgraded weapons.

It also takes 10-30 minutes to get summoned as a helper when in a decent level range for an area, and only ~1-2 minutes at most to find an invasion target which is mostly why its skewed towards invasions.

The dedicated pvp areas like the forest, early parish, and oolacile township also seemed to have decent activity last time I tried. The forest definitely has the most actual hackers, though. Its not at all infrequent to hit them there.

Nahxela
Oct 11, 2008

Execution

Your Computer posted:

You fail to account for the most important thing, Fashion Souls :pseudo:
(e: really though, my newest playthrough uses Ornstein's Armor with Gargoyle Helm and some other stuff and still fast rolls, that required a bit of planning!)

Really though, even planning "I want to do a DEX build" is a bit too much in my opinion. It's fine if that's your n'th run, but for first-timers it's very counter-intuitive and harsh. Even now, I was originally planning to do a STR build but was just underwhelmed by the weapons I found (quite the opposite of DS2 in fact) and wished I had more DEX instead. DS1 also has a lot less cool weapons in my opinion, and the ones that are cool are so late game that they serve no purpose. I started one character, intending to do a really heavy-hitting two-hand STR/FTH build using Grant, ran down to the Tomb of the Giants and... found out it was gated behind the Lordvessel (not to mention the ridiculous stats). It was easier to just make a new character than to run out of there again.
I dunno, I don't really agree. I'd say that investing all your points into Dex in order to hit 40 as soon as possible is probably over the head of a new player, but I don't think generally aiming to build up one stat or another along side the generally beneficial stats, namely Vit/End, is more or less fine.
You can bypass most endurance issues with the ring of FaP and/or Havel's Ring, though.

I also don't really agree with there not being a lot of cool Str weapons early on. Right from the get go you can start as a Cleric and use a mace or be a Bandit with a Battle Axe (though this isn't as much Str), even a Deprived for their club if you're so inclined. At Firelink, you can go grab the Zweihander or if you really want, the Morning Star. When you go into Undead Burg, the undead Merchant sells clubs and some other stuff. When you get to the Hellkite bridge, you can grab the claymore. The latter is up in the air whether a new player will or will not grab it, since the drake would dissuade a bunch of people, but it's still plenty obtainable for anyone who wants to try to grab it. I'm sure there are a number of people who did so on their first run.
Aside from that junk, you can end up with a lucky drop, like one of the several Black Knight weapons, Taurus Demon's weapon, and I guess Asylum Demon's hammer as a stretch.

Fun fact, Leeroy's invasion spot is prior to the orange fog wall, however, no invasions can occur in those gated areas prior to getting the Lord Vessel.

pun pundit
Nov 11, 2008

I feel the same way about the company bearing the same name.

Tokyo Sex Whale posted:

WoG is not very good in PVE so don't sweat it. Great heal is worse than estus.

WoG has several good uses in PvE. It's the best tool bar none for soul farming in the painted world, if that's your thing. It also makes rat farming for humanity quicker and easier. Some bosses that have jump attacks or that have appendages right out of range for most weapon attacks can be easily damaged by WoG - after dodging his jump attack, you can get a big fat chunk of health off Centipede Demon (as well as killing his "tail") by quickly spamming WoG. And it's really satisfying to use it to kill Those Archers.

Tokyo Sex Whale
Oct 9, 2012

"My butt smells like vanilla ice cream"
Guess you have to start over then. Sorry, OP.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



RBA Starblade posted:

I didn't see a single invader when I was on 360

You're in the PC thread, obviously your experience will be different.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Manatee Cannon posted:

You're in the PC thread, obviously your experience will be different.

True, only posting in here because it's the only one for DS1 left afaik. I kind of figured it was just the general thread for it now.

e: Before I quit I grabbed the hawk ring and sniped Manus out of spite, then went to Kalameet just to see how much damage GLS would do. 130 damage with the firstborn ring on isn't a lot. Now I've cooled off maybe I'll just keep poking around at it.

RBA Starblade fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Aug 23, 2014

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Say, do you know how to do the walk?
Just beat Qualaag. First time beating her on PC but I beat her on the console once before. I have no idea why, but my trip through the swamp was much less pleasant than the console one. I felt like I never got poisoned on PS3, but it kept happening on PC. Maybe I am just misremembering.

In any case, I decided to check out the Demon ruins. Beat one of the bosses there then turned off the game.

lordfrikk
Mar 11, 2010

Oh, say it ain't fuckin' so,
you stupid fuck!
Started playing again after too many hours of the second game and got my rear end handed to me by the Taurus Demon of all things :darksouls: :lol: He pancaked me with the vertical slam and then killed me with a second one before I could roll away.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

I'm surprised there are as many people in Darkroot on 360 as there are. Though after beating Sif it's all kind of dried up. Surprisingly it's way smoother than DS2, except for one guy who kept stuttering behind me to backstab me. Also murdering the undead merchant in the Undead Burg for his hanzo steel basically saved my run after I pecked Manus to death. :toot:

e: And also I guess this other guy whose spear poked me to death while he was busy being backstabbed by another forest hunter. It's making me a red invader sometimes too, so if I die I have to reclaim my souls. That's weird.

RBA Starblade fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Aug 24, 2014

Castor Poe
Jul 19, 2010

Jar Jar is the key to all of this.

blackguy32 posted:

Just beat Qualaag. First time beating her on PC but I beat her on the console once before. I have no idea why, but my trip through the swamp was much less pleasant than the console one. I felt like I never got poisoned on PS3, but it kept happening on PC. Maybe I am just misremembering.

Maybe you forgot to equip the Ninja outfit this time around? :v:

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Say, do you know how to do the walk?

Castor Poe posted:

Maybe you forgot to equip the Ninja outfit this time around? :v:

I don't know. But moving on. gently caress Sens fortress. Glad to put that place behind me.

Nahxela
Oct 11, 2008

Execution
Sen's Fortress best Dark Souls area NA

Michaellaneous
Oct 30, 2013

Nahxela posted:

Sen's Fortress best Dark Souls area NA

Anor Londo
:colbert:

Cream-of-Plenty
Apr 21, 2010

"The world is a hellish place, and bad writing is destroying the quality of our suffering."
The first time going through Sen's Fortress was pretty memorable, and it remains one of those really tense areas to fight in, even long after you've leveled-up and have memorized all of its quirks. Plus, there's something very satisfying about fighting in what is basically a gigantic booby trap, and being able to knock/boot opponents into the path of giant boulders/giant pendulums/dart traps.

Nahxela
Oct 11, 2008

Execution
Anor Londo is visually impressive, but Sen's really catches me in how its level design works out. The first time you go through, you scrape around, struggling with all the traps and monsters, especially fearing that you'll fall to death or get crushed by a boulder. There are a bunch of nooks and crannies with cool gear, there's a cool unlockable shortcut, and the boss fight and NPC phantom are nice. Moreover, after you familiarize yourself with the level well enough, you basically take 2 minutes to get through its entirety versus the however long it took you on your first few attempts, what with the boulder path shortcut (hyper armor backstepping through boulders is also cool as gently caress).

It's also my favorite place to invade in because you get to be a jerk in so many places. I particularly enjoy dressing up as the Iron Golem and fighting dudes.

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Nahxela posted:

hyper armor backstepping through boulders is also cool as gently caress


what does this even mean?

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

double nine posted:

what does this even mean?

If you backstep up the ramp a boulder is coming down right before it hits you you'll go through it unscathed.

Flumpus
Jul 22, 2007

RBA Starblade posted:

If you backstep up the ramp a boulder is coming down right before it hits you you'll go through it unscathed.

I thought you still lost health, you just didn't get knocked down if you had enough poise, so are able to get through and take it as a shortcut?

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Flumpus posted:

I thought you still lost health, you just didn't get knocked down if you had enough poise, so are able to get through and take it as a shortcut?

It's been a while since I've seen it, you might. I instead choose to get crushed by them over and over. :v:

Tae
Oct 24, 2010

Hello? Can you hear me? ...Perhaps if I shout? AAAAAAAAAH!
Wait, what boulder shortcut? Are you not supposed to go up after the fog door in front of the shotel?

Huzzah!
Sep 15, 2007

Malnutrition is scarier than any beastie.

Tae posted:

Wait, what boulder shortcut? Are you not supposed to go up after the fog door in front of the shotel?

I think the game intends you to go down the path, where the boulders are going. That way leads you to the first mimic of the game and the gold serpent ring, so I usually go there.

Nahxela
Oct 11, 2008

Execution

Flumpus posted:

I thought you still lost health, you just didn't get knocked down if you had enough poise, so are able to get through and take it as a shortcut?

RBA Starblade posted:

If you backstep up the ramp a boulder is coming down right before it hits you you'll go through it unscathed.

double nine posted:

what does this even mean?
The backstep has hyper armor (you can't get flinched), so you can backstep through the boulder as it rolls down. You still take damage when stepping through the boulder. You technically don't need to backstep, since you can just wait for the boulder to cycle, but in speedruns, runners don't want to wait, so they just backstep when the boulder comes along.

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double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Meh. 2 ways of doing boulders: speedrun. You can juuuuuuuuuuuuust make it by fastsprinting up the slope before another one rolls down.

Alternatively follow the boulder down and go through the elevator.

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