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Mons Hubris
Aug 29, 2004

fanci flup :)


the milk machine posted:

My firm is a mid-size boutique that hasn't been exhibiting a lot of signs of "stability" and "good management" for the past several months. I guess I'm a third year now so I've gotten nibbles regarding lateral positions... how do you know when is the right time to make a move?

My "get the gently caress out of law practice" plan is probably to go to a consulting firm, but I'm not ready to pull the trigger on that just yet until I can pay down my loans a bit more.

Out of curiosity, what's your approach to going to a consulting firm?

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the milk machine
Jul 23, 2002

lick my keys

blarzgh posted:

\That said, the quality of your lateral options depend alot on portable clients. If you want to move somewhere that has stability, be prepared to pay for it with your personal space and freedom, if you aren't bringing your own clients.

Is this true for midlevel associates? Maybe it's my practice area, but I haven't met any 3-5 year associates in this field that have a book of business.

Mons Hubris posted:

Out of curiosity, what's your approach to going to a consulting firm?

I guess I don't have one yet. I live and work in Northern Virginia, which is just littered with the things, and I have a BS in engineering so I figure if I ever want to stop practicing I can probably kludge something together (not engineering, engineering is the worst).

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer

the milk machine posted:

Is this true for midlevel associates? Maybe it's my practice area, but I haven't met any 3-5 year associates in this field that have a book of business.

It may be your practice, it may be your particular firm. I've got 4 years into this bitch, and two at my current firm, and I have enough portables to pay my salary and some change.

I worked for 2 weeks at a small small firm in Dallas that was absolute poo poo, and run miserably. About 4 days in, I went to the older of the 2 other associates and asked her, "Whats the deal with this place?"

Her response was something akin to, "Its poo poo, and the way they run it is poo poo. They(the husband/wife partners) do every initial consult, and every trial, and nothing else. They make sure that every client stays with them. I'm 50 years old, and they don't let me have a single portable client. I can't go anywhere."

It was really depressing.

Staryberry
Oct 16, 2009

the milk machine posted:

My firm is a mid-size boutique that hasn't been exhibiting a lot of signs of "stability" and "good management" for the past several months. I guess I'm a third year now so I've gotten nibbles regarding lateral positions... how do you know when is the right time to make a move?

My "get the gently caress out of law practice" plan is probably to go to a consulting firm, but I'm not ready to pull the trigger on that just yet until I can pay down my loans a bit more.

There is no harm in talking to a recruiter about shopping your resume around. If something good pops up, then you can jump ship, if not, you can wait to see if the hammer drops where you are.

yronic heroism
Oct 31, 2008

a dick posted:

Justice Blackmun begins his statement by describing with poignancy the death of a convicted murderer by lethal injection. He chooses, as the case in which to make that statement, one of the less brutal of the murders that regularly come before us--the murder of a man ripped by a bullet suddenly and unexpectedly, with no opportunity to prepare himself and his affairs, and left to bleed to death on the floor of a tavern. The death by injection which Justice Blackmun describes looks pretty desirable next to that. It looks even better next to some of the other cases currently before us which Justice Blackmun did not select as the vehicle for his announcement that the death penalty is always unconstitutional--for example, the case of the 11-year old girl raped by four men and then killed by stuffing her panties down her throat. See McCollum v. North Carolina, No. 93-7200, cert. now pending before the Court. How enviable a quiet death by lethal injection compared with that! If the people conclude that such more brutal deaths may be deterred by capital punishment; indeed, if they merely conclude that justice requires such brutal deaths to be avenged by capital punishment; the creation of false, untextual and unhistorical contradictions within "the Court's Eighth Amendment jurisprudence" should not prevent them.

-Scalia in 1994, describing the murder a death row inmate just got (very clearly) exonerated from.

Mr Gentleman
Apr 29, 2003

the Educated Villain of London

Staryberry posted:

There is no harm in talking to a recruiter about shopping your resume around. If something good pops up, then you can jump ship, if not, you can wait to see if the hammer drops where you are.

I would caveat that there are a lot of lovely recruiters around who will just blanket your resume across town to lay claim to it so be a bit careful here since that might make it harder to move -- the recruiter fee does turn off people unless you're above the rest of the stack

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

yronic heroism posted:

-Scalia in 1994, describing the murder a death row inmate just got (very clearly) exonerated from.

Not only was Scalia's example of "Blackmun's too chickenshit to use this guy as his no-death-penalty poster child because lethal injection's too good for him" exonerated and released from prison, but:

Blackmun, dissenting, in McCollum v. North Carolina, No. 93-7200 posted:

Henry Lee "Buddy" McCollum is sentenced to be executed for his part in a brutal crime. He participated with three other young men in the rape and murder of an 11-year old girl. Each raped the child, and McCollum helped hold her down while another young man stuffed her panties down her throat with a stick. When I announced in Callins v. Collins, ___ U. S. ___, ___ (1994) (Blackmun, J., dissenting from the denial of certiorari), that I had reached the conclusion that the death penalty, as currently administered, is unconstitutional, Justice Scalia questioned why I did not choose Buddy McCollum's case as the vehicle to announce that position. Id., at ___ (Scalia, J., concurring in the denial of certiorari). He seemed to believe that my position would be harder to defend in a case that like this one that "cries out for punishment." State v. McCollum, 334 N. C. 208, 245, 433 S. E. 2d 144, 165 (Exum, C.J., concurring in part and dissenting in part). Far from it. The crime indeed is abhorrent, but there is more to the story.

Buddy McCollum is mentally retarded. He has an IQ between 60 and 69 and the mental age of a 9-year old. He reads on a second grade level. This factor alone persuades me that the death penalty in his case is unconstitutional. See Penry v. Lynaugh, 492 U.S. 302, 350 (1989) (Stevens, J., concurring in part and dissenting in part) (executions of the mentally retarded are unconstitutional).

The sentencing jury found two aggravating circumstances, that the murder was committed to avoid arrest and that the murder was especially heinous, atrocious, or cruel. It found seven mitigating circumstances: that McCollum was mentally retarded, that he had difficulty thinking clearly under stress, that he was easily influenced by others, that he committed the felony murder under the influence of mental or emotional disturbance, that he had cooperated with the police, that he had no significant history of prior criminal activity, and that he had adapted well to prison. In addition, the trial judge concluded that "[a]ll of the evidence tends to show that [McCollum's] capacity . . . to appreciate the criminality of his conduct or to conform to the requirements of law was impaired." McCollum was 19 at the time of the crime.

Along with these compelling mitigating circumstances, the evidence at trial tended to show that Buddy McCollum was far from the most culpable of the four accomplices. He was not the one who initiated the rape, the one who proposed the murder, or the one who actually committed the murder. Nonetheless, he was the only one convicted of murder and the only one sentenced to die.

North Carolina's death penalty scheme requires appellate proportionality review, N.C.G.S. §15A 2000(d)(2), and the Chief Justice of the North Carolina Supreme Court found himself compelled to conclude that the death penalty for Buddy McCollum was disproportionate. 334 N. C., at 248, 433 S. E. 2d, at 167-168 (Exum, C.J., dissenting). North Carolina jurors had never before recommended death for a defendant whom they had found mentally retarded. Only once had jurors recommended death where there was even any evidence of mental retardation. No North Carolina jury ever had recommended death for a felony murderer under 20 years of age. Nor had any jury recommended death ina sexual offense felony murder where there was evidence of the defendant's mental and emotional disturbance, not even where the defendant was the actual perpetrator of an especially heinous, atrocious, or cruel killing.

That our system of capital punishment would single out Buddy McCollum to die for this brutal crime only confirms my conclusion that the death penalty experiment has failed. Our system of capital punishment simply does not accurately and consistently determine which defendants most "deserve" to die.

Elotana
Dec 12, 2003

and i'm putting it all on the goddamn expense account

Mr Gentleman posted:

I would caveat that there are a lot of lovely recruiters around who will just blanket your resume across town to lay claim to it so be a bit careful here since that might make it harder to move -- the recruiter fee does turn off people unless you're above the rest of the stack
How do you tell the difference between the good recruiters and the lovely recruiters?

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer
For all you morbid fuckers talking about the death penalty:

http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/death_row/dr_executed_offenders.html

Nichol
May 18, 2004

Sly Dog

blarzgh posted:

For all you morbid fuckers talking about the death penalty:

http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/death_row/dr_executed_offenders.html
I want all of these statements in .mp3 for long car trips. :filez:

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.

blarzgh posted:

For all you morbid fuckers talking about the death penalty:

http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/death_row/dr_executed_offenders.html

quote:

Last Statement:

I hereby declare, Robert Steven Everett and Nicholas Velasquez, guilty of crimes against me, Douglas Alan Feldman. Either by fact or by proxy, I find them both guilty. I hereby sentence both of them to death, which I carried out in August 1998. As of that time, the State of Texas has been holding me illegally in confinement and by force for 15 years. I hereby protest my pending execution and demand immediate relief.

The two people he murdered cut him off on the freeway. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

yronic heroism
Oct 31, 2008

joat mon posted:

Not only was Scalia's example of "Blackmun's too chickenshit to use this guy as his no-death-penalty poster child because lethal injection's too good for him" exonerated and released from prison, but:

I remember the salad days of this thread's meltdown in '09. There was a fake Scalia quote making the rounds online where he says "mere factual innocence is no reason" to void a death sentence. I think some goon even had it in his avatar. And lo, like mana from heaven, Scalia comes out and says roughly the same thing for real, only with more textualism.

If Scalia did not exist lawgoons would have to invent him.

yronic heroism fucked around with this message at 15:30 on Sep 5, 2014

WhiskeyJuvenile
Feb 15, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
Scalia would be the worst if Alito didn't exist

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

yronic heroism posted:

I remember the salad days of this thread's meltdown in '09. There was a fake Scalia quote making the rounds online where he says "mere factual innocence is no reason" to void a death sentence. I think some goon even had it in his avatar. And lo, like mana from heaven, Scalia comes out and says roughly the same thing for real, only with more textualism.

If Scalia did not exist lawgoons would have to invent him.

Well, he did say,

quote:

This Court has never held that the Constitution forbids the execution of a convicted defendant who has had a full and fair trial but is later able to convince a habeas court that he is “actually” innocent. Quite to the contrary, we have repeatedly left that question unresolved, while expressing considerable doubt that any claim based on alleged “actual innocence” is constitutionally cognizable.

Elotana
Dec 12, 2003

and i'm putting it all on the goddamn expense account

WhiskeyJuvenile posted:

Scalia would be the worst if Alito didn't exist
Yeah, Alito manages to combine the worst tendencies Scalia and Thomas without either of their redeeming factors.

A Game of Chess
Nov 6, 2004

not as good as Turgenev
What are Thomas' redeeming factors though?

evilweasel
Aug 24, 2002

A Game of Chess posted:

What are Thomas' redeeming factors though?

Thomas may believe crazy things about the law, but he believes them sincerely and when they force him into a decision that isn't the policy decision he'd like he bites the bullet and rules that way anyway. Scalia believes the Constitution just enacts whatever his personal policy preferences are at that moment.

This is clearest in Raich v. Gonzales, where Thomas admits that his view of the Constitution compels him to agree that the states may legalize weed, while Scalia makes up a new doctrine out of whole cloth to justify how Congress can't regulate anything under the commerce clause EXCEPT weed, because he doesn't like drugs.

woozle wuzzle
Mar 10, 2012
I view it like:

Thomas is the old grandpa that believes in crazy poo poo like the Jews did 9/11. But he genuinely believes in that poo poo, so you listen to his stories and overlook the occasional n-word.

Scalia is the guy making "Jews did 9/11" youtube videos with 211 views each, all sweaty in his computer chair. Everything is a performance piece to an unseen audience, carefully calculated to put him at the crossroads of morality.

Elotana
Dec 12, 2003

and i'm putting it all on the goddamn expense account
Thomas believes in little executive fiefdoms where the President does what he likes and state police run riot. This means when Congress does something dumb he will sometimes write an opinion that goes "who do you think you are, the President?"

Scalia believes in an all-powerful quasi-Parliamentary Congress where any law voted on by the Peepul is beyond reproach. When the executive or state police do something dumb he will occasionally go "who do you think you are, Congress?"

SlothBear
Jan 25, 2009

The most I ever laughed at a law school joke was when my friend said he was studying for con law by focusing mainly on the Thomas dissents.

At least I think it was a joke.

Green Crayons
Apr 2, 2009
Law students are the worst.

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer
They don't have clients to laugh at, yet.

yronic heroism
Oct 31, 2008

joat mon posted:

Well, he did say,

Right, and I mean the meltdown era wasn't about SCOTUS. It was about every goon snowflake surveying the jobless wasteland and realizing there would be nothing to support the collective alcoholism that comes with the JD.

Munin
Nov 14, 2004


yronic heroism posted:

It was about every goon snowflake surveying the jobless wasteland and realizing there would be nothing to support the collective alcoholism that comes with the JD.

I was talking to someone today who's sister got a JD from the University of Washington a few years back and is now happily employed. As an event organizer in the UK.

Pook Good Mook
Aug 6, 2013


ENFORCE THE UNITED STATES DRESS CODE AT ALL COSTS!

This message paid for by the Men's Wearhouse& Jos A Bank Lobbying Group
This past week a girl in my class bitched to the Dean's office and on Facebook about a professor because he didn't give any trigger warnings when he started talking about consent with regards to sexual assault cases.

She wants to be a prosecutor.

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.
soon these trigger-warning obsessed tumblrtards are going to be running poo poo

I finally understand old people and their (our) fear and hatred of youth

evilweasel
Aug 24, 2002

Soothing Vapors posted:

soon these trigger-warning obsessed tumblrtards are going to be running poo poo

I finally understand old people and their (our) fear and hatred of youth

ahahahaha no they're not

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.

evilweasel posted:

ahahahaha no they're not

haha fair point, they'd have to leave home for that I guess

tau
Mar 20, 2003

Sigillum Universitatis Kansiensis

Soothing Vapors posted:

haha fair point, they'd have to leave home for that I guess

They do. To go to law school.

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?
What in the hell is a trigger warning?

EDIT: Nevermind, Googled it. I am honestly just sitting here, shaking my head.

SlyFrog fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Sep 6, 2014

Okuteru
Nov 10, 2007

Choose this life you're on your own

SlyFrog posted:

What in the hell is a trigger warning?

It's related to PTSD, I think.

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.

tau posted:

They do. To go to law school.

:smithicide:

At least I can prevent them from coming to my firm

Forceholy posted:

It's related to PTSD, I think.

A very real and very legitimate thing applied to people with PTSD, but tumblr has turned it into something idiotic and meaningless

edit: I just googled it too and the geekfeminism wiki page about trigger warnings has a trigger warning at the top. bellisimo

Alaemon
Jan 4, 2009

Proctors are guardians of the sanctity and integrity of legal education, therefore they are responsible for the nourishment of the soul.
Because some people are sensitive about trigger warnings, so you need to warn when you're going to give one.

Obviously.

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?

Soothing Vapors posted:

A very real and very legitimate thing applied to people with PTSD, but tumblr has turned it into something idiotic and meaningless

No doubt. That's why all of those WWII and Korea vets in the small town I grew up in made sure to bitch about not getting trigger warnings before town fireworks and other loud noises.

Why, I recall my grandpa, who went through the Battle of the Bulge, calling the local television station to complain that they didn't provide a trigger warning before running an episode of Combat! (With Vic Morrow!)

Pook Good Mook
Aug 6, 2013


ENFORCE THE UNITED STATES DRESS CODE AT ALL COSTS!

This message paid for by the Men's Wearhouse& Jos A Bank Lobbying Group
Just for reference at how prevalent trigger warnings are nowadays when the school sends out an e-mail alert about a violent crime on campus they preface most of them at the top with, "Trigger warning: sexual assault (or whatever it is)."

Fine, this is large fairly well-regarded college with a lot of "forward-thinking" people on campus. Whatever. But this is the loving law school, you're going to come across some heinous cases. Sorry no one warned you the real world isn't Tumblr. Or a college campus.

EDIT: And this is a relatively new phenomenon; I graduated from my undergrad back in 2010 and the very idea of trigger warning was brand new (if it even existed back then). And I'm sure that my undergrad institution has probably embraced it whole hog at this point. These are both public schools mind you.

Pook Good Mook fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Sep 6, 2014

evilweasel
Aug 24, 2002

ironically, trigger warnings are my trigger

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer
Monday, I plan to shoot out an email to the partners in my firm, letting them know about my triggers, and asking them to; include trigger warnings in their emails to me.

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.

SlyFrog posted:

No doubt. That's why all of those WWII and Korea vets in the small town I grew up in made sure to bitch about not getting trigger warnings before town fireworks and other loud noises.

Why, I recall my grandpa, who went through the Battle of the Bulge, calling the local television station to complain that they didn't provide a trigger warning before running an episode of Combat! (With Vic Morrow!)

hahaha

blarzgh posted:

Monday, I plan to shoot out an email to the partners in my firm, letting them know about my triggers, and asking them to; include trigger warnings in their emails to me.

my triggers are having to work and getting yelled at for not working

Hot Dog Day #91
Jun 19, 2003

My intern today had his first real client contact and case exposure. He saw:

The naked lower half of a 600 pound unrepentant meth addict;
A mother grieving over her dead baby asking me to help with burial costs; and
An elderly schizophrenic man who is missing 1/6 of his skull discuss his masturbation habits.

He also spoke to a woman who wanted a divorce from the man who raped and impregnated her daughter.

Guess who is the only one of whom has a remedy I can assist with?

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Mr Gentleman
Apr 29, 2003

the Educated Villain of London

Elotana posted:

How do you tell the difference between the good recruiters and the lovely recruiters?

friends who've worked with them

basically it's really hard until it's too late!

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