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Lmfao @ anyone over the last few pages who has unironically referred to gamers as a persecuted minority
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Sep 4, 2014 16:13
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poptart_fairy posted:you seem p defensive please take this hostility out of my gibbus
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Sep 4, 2014 16:14
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I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. You'd think with how many patreons everyone in that community backs they would be cool for kickstarting games in line with their vision. Right?  Why demand others adapt to you instead of making what you want?To The Moon did a wonderful job with that, nothing ever felt preachy or hamfisted even though one of the characters was autistic. The writing was actually good, too, which is more than I can say for Depression Quest.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:18
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BottledBodhisvata posted:This hasn't really ever been about games. It's about people being sick of being attacked for what they enjoy, and people getting sick of feeling marginalized when they attack people for what they enjoy. It's two sides playing victim and painting the other side as bullies and oppressors. This is the spark that's ignited all the resentment from both sides, the social justice warriors versus the people who don't give a poo poo about social justice, it seems--which is Everybody Else. That's where #notyourshield came from, that's the crux of all of this. People are sick of being attacked, and people who are attacking them are sick of feeling marginalized or downtrodden. Until a meaningful--I stress meaningful--dialog is brokered, this bickering will never end. Neither side can win. I'd say it's more about professional PR/marketing people who have themselves as their primary client and product reshaping a narrative about their dishonest, cliquish behavior into being about literally anything else to which they can get that narrative to stick, but especially that which gets a lot of earnest young people with notoriously terrible impulse control righteously angry. I think, too, there are a lot of earnest young creative-types who, consciously or otherwise, recognize that these cliques are hilariously good at selling themselves and shilling/covering for each other, and they would one day like to benefit from the same arrangement.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:19
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Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. please source your quotes
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Sep 4, 2014 16:22
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BottledBodhisvata posted:This hasn't really ever been about games. It's about people being sick of being attacked for what they enjoy, and people getting sick of feeling marginalized when they attack people for what they enjoy. It's two sides playing victim and painting the other side as bullies and oppressors. This is the spark that's ignited all the resentment from both sides, the social justice warriors versus the people who don't give a poo poo about social justice, it seems--which is Everybody Else. That's where #notyourshield came from, that's the crux of all of this. People are sick of being attacked, and people who are attacking them are sick of feeling marginalized or downtrodden. Until a meaningful--I stress meaningful--dialog is brokered, this bickering will never end. Neither side can win. I doubt that meaningful dialog can be achieved on the internet. It's hard enough to get heated combatants to calm the gently caress down in the real world where human lives are at stake. But on the internet it's incredibly easy to stir poo poo up and the consequences for doing so are comparatively insignificant.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:22
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quote:idk seems hard to have a meaningful dialog with someone who feels attacked by the mildest of feminist critiques you big baby seems hard to have a meaningful dialogue when someone turns anything related to video games into accusations of misogyny and sexism. the whole death of gamers line some people are running with is not constructive for dialogue.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:25
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Well I just smoked a couple cigars and had a few gins catching up on this thread again. I simply cannot believe this poo poo, it's totally insane that it has got to the point of what is basically the gestapo/spanish inquisition vs game players. As a philosophy graduate and gamer I am no longer finding entertainment in this, it has become a witch hunt, where the witch is some nebulous ideology that simply does not exist. Can we just get back to playing goddamn video games and talking about them?
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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EugeneJ posted:Entire game is your character sitting in the corner of the LGBT meeting with a gun pointed to your head, and you get a higher score the longer you listen to the meeting and don't off yourself. You can contribute but anything you say will result in condescending stares and abrupt dismissals. Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. They're basically the social justice version of the Minecraft community. It all boils down to "wah wah, make games more different the way i like them" but rather than directing their anger at Notch alone, it's directed at all game devs.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. What? You mean. Like learn how to code? Do you know how much a book on coding costs?! Sure you could just use the free C# tutorials, but that's work. Plus you gotta be ready to settle in for the long haul if you want to put a decent game together. Twitter posts take a second to write. That's way easier.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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reavor posted:seems hard to have a meaningful dialogue when someone turns anything related to video games into accusations of misogyny and sexism. the whole death of gamers line some people are running with is not constructive for dialogue. lol if u dont think that people who craft an identity for themselves based on their popular media consumption aren't human trash
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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Hey Wikipedia, Al-Jazeera made an article about Gamergate. That means we can finally update Zoe's Wikipedia page to mention it, right? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Zoe_Quinn#Al-Jazeera_source  Yes, Wikipedia admin Tarc deleted the account of the guy who brought up the Al-Jazeera article
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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i dont think mario would even want to associate with you guys luigi though, luigi would be disappointed
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Sep 4, 2014 16:27
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Sep 4, 2014 16:28
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:Lmfao @ anyone over the last few pages who has unironically referred to gamers as a persecuted minority I've already mentioned how video games tend to trivialise persecution, especially towards Jews, but it's sad to see this attitude finally spilling out to real life. Video games change people's perception of Shoah and oppression in general by essentially putting the player in control and purporting that antisemitism is easily defeatable or even somewhat justified. This leads to the idea that antisemitism is not a real threat, so very mundane things get compared to it, thus devaluing the catastrophe even further, until the standards for supposed persecution are set so low that any bit of criticism qualifies.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:29
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Fanelien posted:Well I just smoked a couple cigars and had a few gins catching up on this thread again. I simply cannot believe this poo poo, it's totally insane that it has got to the point of what is basically the gestapo/spanish inquisition vs game players. As a philosophy graduate and gamer I am no longer finding entertainment in this, it has become a witch hunt, where the witch is some nebulous ideology that simply does not exist. Can we just get back to playing goddamn video games and talking about them? come on dude we all know that you aren't actually smoking in your vids https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOp1GOL3skU
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Sep 4, 2014 16:29
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Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. I like how in the same post you suggest people making their own games, and then name a game (Depression Quest) that someone in that community made.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:30
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EugeneJ posted:Hey Wikipedia, Al-Jazeera made an article about Gamergate. That means we can finally update Zoe's Wikipedia page to mention it, right? lol, apparently reporting facts isn't journalism There you have it: game journalism, everyone. macnbc posted:I like how in the same post you suggest people making their own games, and then name a game (Depression Quest) that someone in that community made. Calling it a game is giving it too much credit.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:30
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BottledBodhisvata posted:This hasn't really ever been about games. It's about people being sick of being attacked for what they enjoy, and people getting sick of feeling marginalized when they attack people for what they enjoy. It's two sides playing victim and painting the other side as bullies and oppressors. This is the spark that's ignited all the resentment from both sides, the social justice warriors versus the people who don't give a poo poo about social justice, it seems--which is Everybody Else. That's where #notyourshield came from, that's the crux of all of this. People are sick of being attacked, and people who are attacking them are sick of feeling marginalized or downtrodden. Until a meaningful--I stress meaningful--dialog is brokered, this bickering will never end. Neither side can win. Press 3 and get them playing noughts and crosses.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:32
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macnbc posted:a game (Depression Quest)
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Sep 4, 2014 16:32
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 An infinite army of  Also I can't believe people are still pulling that "HAHA WOW YOU GAMERS SURE HATE EQUALITY A LOT!" card.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:33
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EugeneJ posted:Hey Wikipedia, Al-Jazeera made an article about Gamergate. That means we can finally update Zoe's Wikipedia page to mention it, right? quote:Administrators assume these responsibilities as volunteers who go through a community review process. They are not acting as employees of the Wikimedia Foundation. They are never required to use their tools, and must never use them to gain an advantage in a dispute in which they are involved. hmm
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Sep 4, 2014 16:34
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How deep does the rabbit hole go? 
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Sep 4, 2014 16:35
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Every day women of gender and transgenders of gender are crucified in the first world by lack of attention to their facebook and twitter posts crying out for more attention. Plz videogame journalists and videogame makers... it's time to do something. Honor me on patreon as I argue against "real life" and fight tooth and nail to make sure everyone quits their job and reposts each other on social media.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:36
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I play games because they are interesting and challenging mechanically. I don't give a gently caress about whatever agenda people are projecting on them. Also console fps's are trash.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:36
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EugeneJ posted:Hey Wikipedia, Al-Jazeera made an article about Gamergate. That means we can finally update Zoe's Wikipedia page to mention it, right? lol that account wasn't deleted tho. thanks for reposting some dumb stuff without even looking at it
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Sep 4, 2014 16:36
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horriblePencilist posted:
Wow, you weren't kidding.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:37
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Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. Have you ever heard of the concept of criticism and critical analysis?
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Sep 4, 2014 16:39
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macnbc posted:I like how in the same post you suggest people making their own games, and then name a game (Depression Quest) that someone in that community made. The key words were 'be profitable'. Releasing a game for free doesn't show other developers or publishers if funding games like that is a sound investment.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:39
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Jesto posted:I literally don't get why they don't just make or fund their own videogames instead of trying to change everyone else's videogames. If their vision for the future of games is correct then surely they'll be profitable. Other developers will follow by example if the outcome is good. Because it's a subculture that's been propped up with self-congratulatory back-patting between mutual friends who have managed to game(  ) their way into the scene despite a critical lack of any kind of vision, foresight, technical aptitude, self-management, resources, critical thinking, design theory, planning, development skills, basic social skills, professional integrity, life skills, or emotional maturity.This whole poo poo leads to some kind of anti-gaming guerrilla development philosophy that meets halfway between Werner Herzog's fever dreams and Dogme 95 if the proponents stuck to their principles rigidly and completely failed to make sense of the industry. They don't want to make games, they want to make "anti-games" so they can, in one fell stroke, challenge every established assumption about games. And in a lot of ways, this is an important thing to do. You see games like To The Moon, Papers Please, and so on making waves in small ways by merging story and gameplay to tell stories that aren't typical in the industry. But poo poo like Depression Quest or other low effort games are just that: low-effort. They're crass attempts to exploit a market for personal gain by delivering lovely products backed by an institution so in love with its own perceived legitimacy. If you inject this crap into the market and use the PR clout (which is manufactured), it can seem pretty easy to twist the narrative of where gaming is headed without being correct nor relevant. Oops, that was a serious post. let me try again i'm gay
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Sep 4, 2014 16:39
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I'm really glad that, two weeks into this great national nightmare, Slanderer is still around to Set the Record Straight by making really boring effort posts
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Sep 4, 2014 16:40
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Powercrazy posted:I play games because they are interesting and challenging mechanically. I don't give a gently caress about whatever agenda people are projecting on them. You are more likely to harass a woman if you see tits in your game. That's a fact 
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Sep 4, 2014 16:40
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poptart_fairy posted:please sleep with me now jenna am not jenna but am down
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Sep 4, 2014 16:42
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EugeneJ posted:Hey Wikipedia, Al-Jazeera made an article about Gamergate. That means we can finally update Zoe's Wikipedia page to mention it, right? update: Tarc, you obviously have no idea what journalism is and should remove yourself from this article. I've already forwarded my concerns to your superiors. Trying to control history is not your job. TheNewMinistry (talk) 15:37, 4 September 2014 (UTC)  Though there is a certain irony in the username.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:42
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E1M1 posted:I'm really glad that, two weeks into this great national nightmare, Slanderer is still around to Set the Record Straight by making really boring effort posts your gay
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Sep 4, 2014 16:42
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zack de la rocha warned us of this
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Sep 4, 2014 16:43
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Rad Tad posted:am not jenna but am down if we forsake the company of women are we not misogynistic
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Sep 4, 2014 16:49
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Powercrazy posted:update: Tarc, you obviously have no idea what journalism is and should remove yourself from this article. I've already forwarded my concerns to your superiors. Trying to control history is not your job. TheNewMinistry (talk) 15:37, 4 September 2014 (UTC) I hope this spins off into a separate Wikighazi.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:50
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tl;dr me this Al-Jazeera thing tia
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Sep 4, 2014 16:52
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quote:Because it's a subculture that's been propped up with self-congratulatory back-patting between mutual friends who have managed to game() their way into the scene despite a critical lack of any kind of vision, foresight, technical aptitude, self-management, resources, critical thinking, design theory, planning, development skills, basic social skills, professional integrity, life skills, or emotional maturity. seems that's kind of what started this whole thing. some indie game developers/journalists recieved (perhaps partly unfounded) criticism regarding their contacts/dealings with other developers/journalists and blocking of game-funding initiatives, and they responded by starting a crusade against their attackers, then expanding it to the gaming community as a whole.
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Sep 4, 2014 16:52
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