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Jurgan posted:Who are you and what is your objective here? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sUz5PbbIzk
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Sep 7, 2014 22:27
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If you guys are making a new wiki I have some suggestions: Could you divide things into continuity families like the TFwiki? The who wiki seems to put everything into canon whether it's from a story or comic no one ever read and has since been contradicted. And since you don't know what story they're referring to until the end of the paragraph it's really frustrating to use. Who has never had a total reboot but tfwiki at least puts things from different mediums and imprints under different headings or other pages if they're long enough.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:28
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CobiWann posted:Do you guys want Cybermen? Because THIS is how you get Cybermen! This is all just a desperate attempt to get the Mondasian Tenth Planet Cybermen back. The only good Cybermen
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Sep 7, 2014 22:29
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HD DAD posted:This is all just a desperate attempt to get the Mondasian Tenth Planet Cybermen back. Into the Cyberman? It's either Robert Shearman's return to television or a sequel to the Zygon porno.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:33
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as for this episode... it was stupid. Predictible, sappy, no new ideas anywhere, usually I'm pretty easy on these episodes and I'm just happy to watch more Who but something really went wrong here. I kind of wanted to know more about the robots. They barely figured into things and the idea of them making a robin hood and a nottingham to pacify people was an interesting idea just thrown away for more platitudes. Capaldi I think does a fine job as the doctor, and really what is being the doctor anyway? Even between Tennant and Smith there was a lot of difference, and the classic doctors seem to be even more different between each other (5 vs 6, 6 vs 7 even, I mean really) The stories just aren't landing for me yet. Actually, I watched a bunch of clips from classic who the other day and Capaldi really strikes seems to feel more like one of the classic doctors than the revival doctors going on that.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:34
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Rita Repulsa posted:If you guys are making a new wiki I have some suggestions: Could you divide things into continuity families like the TFwiki? Here we're running into a problem. The reason the current wiki does this is because BBC has been rather clear that there's no such thing as Who canon. It's not like, for instance, Star Wars, where there's clear layers of canon, the top layer being the films, the second layer officially licensed stuff, and so on. For Doctor Who, canon is whatever any fan decides should be canon. Any attempt to organize this is gonna lead to people arguing forever about what's canon.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:34
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I'm fully aware this will never happen, but it's at this point in the weekly thread that I wish we had per-episode threads and a general chat thread. The episode hit iTunes hours ago and we're already in "What Big Finish audio should I listen to next/hey, let's fix the Doctor Who Wiki" territory. Based on the chat here (and my finger, ever on the pulse of the rank-and-file Doctor Who fan), I think whether you liked this episode depends on how cool you are with pure fantasy in Doctor Who. Doctor Who is, fundamentally, science fantasy, so I expect a large chunk of the population have no problem when it drops the science pretext, but others want some measure of techno-bafflegab to give the fantasy parts the patina of existing in a world based on knowable rules. I'm in the second group, so I kind of thought this episode was a dog's breakfast. It would have been fine in an Army of Darkness-style universe (the Golden Arrow shot at the end made about as much sense as Ash jumping up and fitting his wrist to the chainsaw), but there was just too much "hey, poo poo happens  " for me to get behind. Most people are comparing this to Crimson Horror, but I see more Victory of the Daleks.I also wasn't too fond of Robin and the Doctor having a cat-fight over Clara. It had a lot of the weaknesses of Rose and Sarah fighting over the Doctor in School Reunion, just too facile, particularly in an episode with more than a faint air of The Three Stooges about it. Notwithstanding that: I love Capaldi and I love Clara. The spoon/sword fight was great (and IIRC a callback to the story of how Robin Hood meets Little John), and the Sheriff made a great, hammy villain. (Personally, I'm glad he wasn't Terminator Sheriff -- he makes more sense to me this way as the archetypal human dupe of the aliens. Sometimes it works (Kevin Stoney in The Invasion), but here I don't think it would have.) There were lots of little cute bits. It was fast-paced, fun and well-produced. As a whole piece, I still feel like it kinda sucked, but I can see other types of fans seeing it differently. e: Tightened it up a bit, believe it or not. pgroce fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 22:34
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Carbon dioxide posted:Here we're running into a problem. The reason the current wiki does this is because BBC has been rather clear that there's no such thing as Who canon. It's not like, for instance, Star Wars, where there's clear layers of canon, the top layer being the films, the second layer officially licensed stuff, and so on. For Doctor Who, canon is whatever any fan decides should be canon. Which means users will have their own ideas coming in to the wiki what's canon by medium. Dividing pages into subsections by medium will allow them to find relevant information easier.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:38
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Rita Repulsa posted:Which means users will have their own ideas coming in to the wiki what's canon by medium. Dividing pages into subsections by medium will allow them to find relevant information easier. I agree with this. There's no Canon, just the different mediums. If we're being more tongue in cheek like the Transformers wiki then we can have some fun with the contradictions and poo poo in the margins.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:48
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PriorMarcus posted:I agree with this. There's no Canon, just the different mediums. If we're being more tongue in cheek like the Transformers wiki then we can have some fun with the contradictions and poo poo in the margins. I demand random polls with nonsensical answers. Such as... quote:Who wears short shorts? But seriously, I'd contribute as best I could if given the opportunity.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:51
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I also think leaving the majority of work until the off season is a good plan, but maybe we should lay the foundations leading up to then so we can hit the ground running?
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Sep 7, 2014 22:57
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PriorMarcus posted:I also think leaving the majority of work until the off season is a good plan, but maybe we should lay the foundations leading up to then so we can hit the ground running? Agreed. We should set up something outside the thread to toss around plans and ideas.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:58
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Capaldi has only had three episodes. I find him a bit awkward, but I'd at least give him a full series before I say he's the best or worst thing to happen to the show since color TVs. I like that this episode made some assumptions about the audience. Specifically, we've had enough episodes in Dickens-land and other places that we know a Victorian or even medieval time period doesn't mean we don't find a hidden cache of UFOs, computers, time jump watches, etc. The Doctor himself is more an audience analogue than the assistant for the first ten minutes, because as soon as Robin Hood can properly introduce himself the Doctor is already trying to find the man behind the curtain, testing hair samples etc and waiting for the Area 51 poo poo to spring out of nowhere. Anyway, I'm just another voice that thought this episode was good. It's nice to see Clara actually dig into an adventure instead of stand around and occasionally play the Doctor's ethics compass. And it's nice to see an old world that isn't Dickens-land. Because please, no more Dickens-land. And no more Vastra & Friends. That make out session a few episodes back wasn't progressive or subversive, it was gratuitous and kind of exploitive, running on the "it's hot when chicks do it" logic of straight men.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:58
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HD DAD posted:Agreed. We should set up something outside the thread to toss around plans and ideas. Awesome. I'll PM you. I know DoctorWhat doesn't have PM so I'll tweet him.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:01
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Craptacular! posted:The Doctor himself is more an audience analogue than the assistant for the first ten minutes, because as soon as Robin Hood can properly introduce himself the Doctor is already trying to find the man behind the curtain, testing hair samples etc and waiting for the Area 51 poo poo to spring out of nowhere. This might be what's causing friction with some fans, the 12th Doctor has been more "I've seen everything already" about things. In these first episodes, Capaldi walks in on the scene and he's just "There is no Promised Land, there's no such thing as a good Dalek, and Robin Hood CAN'T exist." But then the situation gets reversed on him, it becomes "Where are these beings going? Is the Doctor actually good? and That IS Robin Hood." So maybe they're building toward some kind of character growth to shake him loose his cynicism? That said, I think Capaldi is magnificent, but I'm so curious about what they're building toward.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:12
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The way these threads go nowadays I really do agree with the notion that a single massive ongoing season 8 thread would work better than weekly threads per episode. A lot of potential discussion gets cut off when the new thread goes up and the old one closes. Wasn't the weekly threads thing a symptom of when the forums struggled with handling the size of megathreads?
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Sep 7, 2014 23:16
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Jerusalem posted:The way these threads go nowadays I really do agree with the notion that a single massive ongoing season 8 thread would work better than weekly threads per episode. A lot of potential discussion gets cut off when the new thread goes up and the old one closes. Yes, and it was dictated that we do it this way by that Star Trek fan we no longer talk about.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:17
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I understand why having four Doctor Who threads would be way too loving many for one forum, but I'd prefer it that way, because I can't watch the episode until my fiance is ready, which means I'm frequently two or three days behind. I haven't seen it yet, but I peeked into the thread to check reactions and it seems like we've already sort of moved on to a Goon Project involving a wiki.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:20
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Bicyclops posted:I understand why having four Doctor Who threads would be way too loving many for one forum, but I'd prefer it that way, because I can't watch the episode until my fiance is ready, which means I'm frequently two or three days behind. I haven't seen it yet, but I peeked into the thread to check reactions and it seems like we've already sort of moved on to a Goon Project involving a wiki. So, General Doctor Who, Weekly Doctor Who, Spoiler Doctor Who and dOCCter Who? We could close one of those easily: the spoiler thread.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:22
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Really, the spoiler thread, as much as I love it, probably won't have much more action now that the leaks and such are over and done. If anything does pop up, we could just be really careful about using the spoiler tag.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:24
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Spoiler Thread - "We. Must. Survive." Posters - "Why?"
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Sep 7, 2014 23:32
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The Spoiler Thread and a General Discussion thread (doubling as the weekly TV thread) are fine and all we'd really need. Occ's thread is its own thing and stands alone really, given that it is focusing on a newcomer to the show going through each episode and discussing only what the two guys watching have seen up to that point (though far too many people can't resist saying,"Now this isn't really a spoiler, but...."). I just think a thread a week per episode isn't really warranted anymore. Edit: Having a weekly thread AND a general discussion thread would be silly and cause far more problems than it would solve.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:36
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Fil5000 posted:I am reading a New Adventures novel. Ace just said "Cybershit". Oh dear. Is this before or after Chris gets a blowjob in the back of a taxi?  (The VNAs were weird)
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Sep 7, 2014 23:37
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TinTower posted:Is this before or after Chris gets a blowjob in the back of a taxi? That one's getting adapted by Big Finish! (and it's a gay blowjob  )
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Sep 7, 2014 23:56
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The big finish sound effects team will have fun with that
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Sep 8, 2014 00:03
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Just saw the bit of Pyramids of Mars where the Doctor shows Sarah the alternate 1980, "a desolate planet circling a dead sun", and wanted to reiterate how much that owns.
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Sep 8, 2014 00:03
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In fact, it's a gay blowjob that cures AIDS.
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Sep 8, 2014 00:05
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DoctorWhat posted:In fact, it's a gay blowjob that cures AIDS. 
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Sep 8, 2014 00:21
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Please for the love of god do not close the Spoiler thread.
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Sep 8, 2014 00:44
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Please for the love of god do not close the Spoiler thread. I concur. People have been really good over the last year or so about keeping spoilers to the spoiler thread... I assume so, anyway, since they haven't been posting them here.
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Sep 8, 2014 00:52
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BSam posted:Well don't worry, ending a post like that will get you all the suggestions. My vote is for Cuddlesome. https://soundcloud.com/big-finish/doctor-who-cuddlesome-complete
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Sep 8, 2014 01:12
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It would have been nice if robots didn't randomly show up again. A straight up historical once in awhile would be refreshing. I liked Clara in this episode (the medieval garb suits her well too) but the Doctor was Doctor Killjoy the entire time. His constant bitching dragged the whole episode down when all I wanted to do was go on an adventure with Robin Hood. It wasn't even witty bitching. Give Capaldi some witty bitching to do at least. The episode wasn't any fun and it didn't have anything meaningful to say either. Sheesh, Mark Gatiss, what happened?
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Sep 8, 2014 01:29
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 In a sun-dappled Sherwood Forest, the Doctor discovers an evil plan from beyond the stars and strikes up an unlikely alliance with Robin Hood. With all of Nottingham at stake, the Doctor must decide who is real and who is fake. Can impossible heroes actually exist? Peter Capaldi is the Doctor in Robot of Sherwood. Cast Peter Capaldi (The Doctor) Jenna Coleman (Clara Oswald) Tom Riley (Robin Hood) Ben Miller (Sheriff of Nottingham) Sabrina Bartlett (Quayle's Ward) Tim Baggaley (Knight) Richard Elfyn (Voice of the Knights) Written by: Mark Gattis Directed by: Paul Murphy Trailer - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNU4gP-nGVk Gifs by: J-Ru X X X X X It's been a while since Doctor Who had an episode that was just fun. Going all the way back to Series 7, The Power of Three saw what happens when the Doctor gets bored, faced with a problem that requires time to solve. He integrates himself into Amy and Rory's life while Rory's Dad becomes his lab assistant of sorts. While the episode does, of course, turn serious towards the end, the majority of its run-time is lighthearted and farcical. From then, the show goes on a run from The Angels Take Manhattan all the way to Into the Dalek that consists of more serious episodes with humor and entertainment used to break the tension. The first two episodes of Peter Capaldi's time as the Doctor have see him deal with post-regeneration sickness, getting into a deadly brawl with a half-man/half-clockwork creature, and wondering about the “goodness” of both himself and a malfunctioning Dalek. Robot of Sherwood, penned by noted Doctor Who fanboy Mark Gatiss, sees the Doctor and Clara encounter one of England's most legendary figures, the outlaw Robin Hood. Robot of Sherwood is not a perfect episode. The narrative flow is a bit discombobulated, switching between long, extended moments and quickly rushed scenes, and the science fiction plot feels tacked on. But the strength of the episode is, and always was, the chemistry and banter between the Doctor, Clara, Robin Hood, and the Sheriff of Nottingham. In that, Robot of Sherwood succeeds in spades, with Capaldi's Doctor coming off at not only distinct from his predecessors, but a little more alien and a little less human as well. Clara answers the Doctor's request to meet anyone anywhere in space and time with a roll of his eyes. England. 1170 AD. Nottingham. Robin Hood, who the Doctor states time and time again isn't real. And he continues to state this fact even as the very first person he meets when he steps out of the TARDIS is none other than the famed outlaw. Clara delights in meeting the Merry Men even as the Doctor insists that none of it is real and it must be some trick. But no matter what, the truth of the matter is that the Sheriff of Nottingham is stealing from the poor and impressing the peasants to work in an underground factory, assisted by a group of strange metal knights...  Mark Gatiss' Doctor Who output can be described as “fair.” He's had his misses, including The Idiot's Lantern and Victory of the Daleks. He's had his “average” episodes, including The Unquiet Dead. And he's had his “good, but flawed” episodes such as Cold War and Night Terrors. Robot of Sherwood falls into the latter category, landing squarely into the higher percentiles of the bracket. The tale of Robin Hood is familiar across the entire world. Gatiss could have very easily made this story like so many others throughout the show's production, where the Doctor's actions become a vital-yet-unknown part of established historical events. In this story, however, the Doctor is almost a bit-player when all is said and done. It's very refreshing that for the Doctor to be a part of history, but other people actually MAKE the history. From the moment the Doctor steps out of the TARDIS and Robin Hood introduces himself, it's obvious that the script is going to be much more Men in Tights than Prince of Thieves, a point driven home by the utterly ridiculous but insanely delightful sword vs. spoon duel the Doctor and Robin Hood face off in. It's further compounded by the bickering (bordering on homicidal arguing) the pair engage in over the course of the story, from a over-the-top archery contest to an attempt to distract their jailor ending in a manner that both of them are very glad Clara didn't see. While the comedy is very well done, it does make the “serious” moments a bit jarring when they pop up. Robot of Sherwood knows what kind of episode it wants to be, and it's the actual science-fiction aspects of the plot that fall flat. There are robots, they want to leave the planet, if they try to leave the planet the ship will explode and take out most of the British Isles, and it takes an arrow made of gold to give it JUST enough of a boost to let it exit the atmosphere so the robots can head to the same “Promised Land” that the clockworks from Deep Breath were apparently heading to. It's not quite a 180 from the comedic aspects of the story, but it's enough to cause a bit of a cognitive hiccup. The supporting cast boils down to two characters – Robin Hood, played by Tom Riley, and the Sheriff of Nottingham, played by Ben Miller. Or, as someone pointed out, “the Sheriff of Nottingham, played by Roger Delgado impersonating Anthony Ainley.” Miller, one half of British comedy team Alexander & Miller, embraces his role with gusto; not quite going full Alan Rickman, but you can see him from Miller's performance. He twirls the mustache, oppresses the peasant, trades banter with Robin Hood, and takes great glee in being evil. But Miller shows just enough intelligence that his character doesn't slide into pure caricature , and his “AND THEN THE WORLD” line just might be the revival's answer to the classic-era's “MY DREAMS OF.CONQUEST!” Opposite of him, Tom Riley's Robin Hood shows why he's such an annoying thorn in the Sheriff's (and the Doctor's) side. He's competent, cheerful, and boisterous. Excessively so, as the Doctor threatens to punch him over his ridiculous amounts of laughter, and it's easy for Riley's performance to go from “humorous” to “annoying” for some viewers. But Robin Hood's skill with sword and bow is beyond reproach in both his duel with the Doctor and his fight with Nottingham. The finale scene with the Doctor is a feather in Riley's cap, as he answers the Doctor's concerns and contradictions.  The great 2014 Clara Oswald Reclamation Project continues. Jenna Coleman was simply amazing in this episode. Let me count the ways. One, she meets Robin Hood and doesn't fall in love with him, doesn't develop a crush on him, but simply enjoys his company, both the good and the bad. Her sheer GLEE at meeting him radiates from the screen. She also goes so far as to chastise both Robin Hood AND the Doctor, and after hearing their “plans,” takes matters into her own hands. Her dinner scene with the Sheriff will easily make any “Clara Highlight Reel” that some fan compiles and puts on Youtube, as she shows smarts and a bit of sultry flattery as she makes the Sheriff reveal most of his plan without going “over the top vamp.” When Clara is on screen, Robot of Sherwood is usually clicking on all cylinders, which is something I never thought I would be writing a year ago. She DIGS into the adventure instead of being a passive observer or someone for the Doctor to provide exposition to. Clara, to me, will be remember much more for her travels alongside Twelve than for being “The Impossible Girl.” I loved Capaldi in this episode, but it's easy to see where some viewers would have reservations about his performance. One could make the case that David Tennant and Matt Smith's time as the Doctor went a very long way to “humanizing” the last of the Time Lords, lowering his defenses and sanding his edges. They definitely presenting the most appealing Doctors, not “TOO” alien and different from humans, aside from two hearts and a magic phone box. Capaldi, though, has gone the other direction. He insults humans, and what Ten would find “fantastic” and Eleven might find “neat,” Twelve finds “absolutely impossible.” Some viewers might have found his not accepting the situation as off-balance for someone who, over the course of 1200 years, has seen some absolute amazing things. But to me, Capaldi's regeneration is just doing what countless regenerations have done in the past, and that's be completely different from the ones before. Mark Gatiss wrote this episode before Twelve's personality had any of its characteristic defined on-screen, so I would like to think the Doctor's arrogance, bickering nature, and shock at being wrong as he realizes that Robin Hood isn't a robot were more the part of Capaldi and not Gatiss' script. I say this because, in many ways, Robot of Sherwood is a script that could have featured several other Doctors. The Third Doctor, of course, comes to mind, but one could also see Six complaining about the banter and insisting he's right, and perhaps even Seven trying to calmly deduce the “long game” that's going on. With Twelve as the Doctor on call, he comes off as, well, slightly off. He's determined to figure out what's wrong, determined that there MUST be a puzzle to be solved, that his superior intellect alone will save the day, even if it means casually telling someone they'll be dead in six months, biting into an apple and then scanning it, blatantly cheating at an archery contest, or challenging a man holding a sword to a duel while wielding a fork. It's either over-the-top silly and perfectly in line with the Doctor and the episode, or completely out of character and a major speedbump in the characterization of the Doctor, depending on how one chooses to look at it.  The end of the episode sums it all up. Robin Hood, instead of being dismayed that history will forget him and turn his crusade for justice into myth and legend, believes that it's a good thing as long as people take up the fight for good in his name...which is something the Doctor has seen before, for both good and ill. While to some people the big story arc this season will be Missy and “heaven,” to me the story arc is more about the Doctor, after all he's seen, coming to grips with the absolution of guilt over the Time War and trying to define himself. This episode saw him as a hero. Into the Dalek didn't. Which Doctor is which then?  Robot of Sherwood has several easily noticeable flaws, and depending on how you like your Doctor Who, they can either be overlooked in the course of an enjoyable episode, or glaring enough to drag down the whole story. In either case, it's a memorable story, and one that I could easily see myself rewatching in the future. And it's definitely an episode I would feel comfortable showing to someone who had never seen Doctor Who before, as it has everything I love about the show; humor, action, and just a touch of character driven pathos. And by the way, Patrick Troughton's cameo in this episode was absolutely awesome. 
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Sep 8, 2014 01:51
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Android Blues posted:I remember there was some talk in the threads for the second half of Season Seven that, despite Clara being a weak character right now, a few people hoped she'd stay on for the next Doctor and maybe gel better with him. All that you said is true, however, I think they were trying too hard for Clara to be that in this episode. What really shows this was the prison scene. 12 and Hood arguing was fine - for the first minute. Afterwards it seemed really forced, with Clara being the one in charge. (For that scene, for those that want a female Doctor - this was a preview.) After she was taken away, not only did they continue, they didn't even stop over something important (the key), and it was all so predictable that they would lose it. (I must admit the grate was a surprise - I just presumed they would kick the keys out of leg reach.) The back and forth just seemed so useless for someone as wise (wisdom gotten through sheer years of life at the very least) and as intellectual as the Doctor to argue so uselessly. Yes, even the wisest persons can throw a tantrum, but there was so no point to it at all. (Not cleverly trying to interrogate, not trying to create a distraction, nothing.)
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Sep 8, 2014 02:06
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Yeah, I can understand the criticism that the Doctor was being childishly stubborn and aggressive, but those were also pretty major qualities of Three as well. Actually I got serious Three vibes throughout the episode.
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Sep 8, 2014 02:11
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HD DAD posted:Yeah, I can understand the criticism that the Doctor was being childishly stubborn and aggressive, but those were also pretty major qualities of Three as well. Actually I got serious Three vibes throughout the episode. (I did like that call-out to Three. (When he said "HAI!" when he hit Hood to surrender).) But when Three was childish/stubborn, I don't know, it fit him. It worked. I don't recall it ever being self-defeating, overly-long, and/or pointless. And didn't Four have the quote that went something like "What's the point in being an Adult if you can't be childish sometimes?" Maybe since we're only in 3 episodes of Twelve, we don't know Twelve's full personality "range" yet, and so we(I?) have a hard time putting this into prospective? RunAndGun fucked around with this message at 02:20 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 02:18
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Seems to me like Twelve's a lot harder to pin down as just one or two characteristics. But if there was one word I'd use for him, it's "honest". "The Doctor Lies" was a line repeated annoyingly often in a GRRM-esque way during Eleven's run, but it strikes me that it might no longer be true in this incarnation. Everything I've observed in Deep Breath and Into the Dalek remains true, and it seems like for a change Moffat's developing a really solid character arc. No idea about the big plot arc, the whole Missy/Promised Land thing. But it's not as annoying as, say, TORCHWOOD. Or the omnipresent Cracks. Or THE IMPOSSIBLE GIRL.
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Sep 8, 2014 02:43
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HD DAD posted:Yeah, I can understand the criticism that the Doctor was being childishly stubborn and aggressive, but those were also pretty major qualities of Three as well. Actually I got serious Three vibes throughout the episode. I think Ten did a lot of that in "The Next Doctor," when he was competing with the fake Doctor. I feel there must be some other examples; the Doctor can be pretty juvenile at times. Spatula City posted:Seems to me like Twelve's a lot harder to pin down as just one or two characteristics. But if there was one word I'd use for him, it's "honest". "The Doctor Lies" was a line repeated annoyingly often in a GRRM-esque way during Eleven's run, but it strikes me that it might no longer be true in this incarnation. It's a good point. He is very straightforward and doesn't sugar-coat his interactions with people. The only exception is in "Into the Dalek," when he lies to the soldier who's about to die by making him think he has a plan. Jurgan fucked around with this message at 02:47 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 02:45
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CobiWann posted:This episode saw him as a hero. Into the Dalek didn't. Which Doctor is which then? I disagree that this episode "saw him as a hero." A hero participates directly in the action and moves it along; the Doctor didn't do that. He was more a witness, or maybe a prophet. (The bad kind who's wrong most of the time, it turned out.) There's nothing wrong with that necessarily, and it's not one of my criticisms of the episode, but I don't think it juxtaposes as well with Into the Dalek as it otherwise might. It might fit into your analysis if he is accepting that not everything revolves around him, and comcomitantly that the weight of "fixing things" does not always rest on his shoulders. That puts the metanarrative in a weird place, though; if the story is not about the Doctor being in the middle of the action, why should we be especially interested in him? Overall, though, a very thoughtful criticism.
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Sep 8, 2014 02:46
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One of the things that's been lost since Moffat took over was the companion having their own life outside of the TARDIS. RTD made the families and friends quite visible, and many of them had their own moments. Father's Day was probably the highlight of Rose's term from a story standpoint. And while initially I wasn't sure an entire extra-large adventure with Uncle Wilf would be tolerable, there it was. Moffat hasn't had to do much of that, partially because giving you any kind of insight into the life of the Ponds would ruin the mysteries-within-mysteries that shouldn't be opened until 18 months later. With Clara, we've seen how her parents met and the Doctor has apparently tracked her through childhood, but like the one time we saw her in a normal setting, she was babysitting and then had the Doctor camping outside like n obsessive stalker. So yeah, I think that Clara's lack of personality comes a lot from not having any regular relatives or friends to bounce things off of. Rose had her mum and Mickey, Donna needed Uncle Wilf to endure her oppressive mother, Martha's family weren't massively important but showed up a few times, and you eventually got a look at the Ponds history but only after it was far too late for many to care. I have no idea if this is what Mr Pink is for, but I liked Dalek-Clara a lot and I'm disappointed that her run as a regular character had been basically an observer. Even her big unique reveal was that she has observed every incarnation of the Doctor. Well whoopdeedo. EDIT: And if the Doctor's mad amounts of chalkboard calculations are about Gallifrey, then he sure didn't spend all that time on the Planet Christmas to much good use, did he? Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 02:52
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