|
Fuego's 10,000 Wonders is a pretty good example of how to do subsystems: http://tradwiki.foxxtrot.net/index.php/10,000_Wonders#Proficiencies You'll notice all the subsystems are just part of the fractal, but they each have distinct mechanics that give them a different feel, and give the players something to interact with on a mechanical level.
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 20:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 18:03 |
|
|
MadScientistWorking posted:why using natural language all the time for your mechanics is a really dumb idea. I'm probably sounding dumb here, but why is this? my strongest writing tends to be more natural than not and I'd love to get an idea what to watch for.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 20:14
|
|
|
Error 404 posted:I'm probably sounding dumb here, but why is this? my strongest writing tends to be more natural than not and I'd love to get an idea what to watch for. Speaking specifically for the various Firefly games (where the writers inexplicably feel the need to force vernacular pronunciation into the text), it's annoying as hell to read and tends to be unclear. If you can be perfectly clear while writing naturally, that's great. I think the problem is that games that are written "in character" (like Dresden) are hard to process as a gamer. Mechanics should be written, well, mechanically. The Dresden Files book is really fun and interesting so I would call it a success. There aren't any really obfuscated mechanics. It just parses poorly for people who gravitate toward a transparent 4E-D&D approach.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 20:20
|
|
|
Zurui posted:The Dresden Files book is really fun and interesting so I would call it a success. There aren't any really obfuscated mechanics. It just parses poorly for people who gravitate toward a transparent 4E-D&D approach. Gotcha, I'm a huge Dresden fan, so the game didn't strike me as being too dense to read, but I can see what you mean there. In a greater sense that also shows how far Evil Hat has grown because if you compare Dresden with Atomic Robo, they do a great job of incorporating mechanical mechanics with nifty in universe bits.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 20:24
|
|
|
Error 404 posted:Gotcha, I'm a huge Dresden fan, so the game didn't strike me as being too dense to read, but I can see what you mean there. In a greater sense that also shows how far Evil Hat has grown because if you compare Dresden with Atomic Robo, they do a great job of incorporating mechanical mechanics with nifty in universe bits. The way the DFRPG has the in-character margin notes means it will always have a special place in my heart, because they're spot-on for character tone and more neatly integrated than the text dialogue boxes in most other games (even ones like Atomic Robo that do a pretty good job of integrating it as well).
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 20:45
|
|
|
Zurui posted:The Dresden Files book is really fun and interesting so I would call it a success. There aren't any really obfuscated mechanics. It just parses poorly for people who gravitate toward a transparent 4E-D&D approach. I don't think it's the lack of clarity that's the issue, but the organization; the book opens with the city rules, which I get what they were going for trying to emphasize them, but it's a system you need to use once at the start of a campaign and not again. The stunts, for some reason, are located in a different chapters from the skills they're associated with. Similarly, the supernatural powers are in a separate chapter from the supernatural templates. It's the kind of book that tells you how skills are assigned in Chapter Four, gives advancement rules for skills in Chapter Six, but doesn't give you a list of skills until Chapter Nine. It regularly jams in setting details or important game rules in the middle of sections regarding character traits. And so on.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 21:01
|
|
|
The whole stunts-assigned-to-skills thing is something I'm so glad they got rid of.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 21:16
|
|
|
Evil Mastermind posted:The whole stunts-assigned-to-skills thing is something I'm so glad they got rid of. How exactly did that work? I've only ever played FAE.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 21:19
|
|
|
Covok posted:How exactly did that work? I've only ever played FAE. Basically pre-Dresden, stunts were pretty much eyeballed and didn't have the handy "a stunt does one of these things" list for you to make your own. In DF, they introduced the stunt creation rules, but all the sample stunts were tied to specific skills, so it kind of gave the impression that stunts were just skill modifiers as opposed to something your character was good at above and beyond the norm. It was more of a presentation thing, really. Yes, Fate stunts can be based off skills or approaches, but by presenting them separately they feel like they stand on their own more.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 21:24
|
|
|
Evil Mastermind posted:Basically pre-Dresden, stunts were pretty much eyeballed and didn't have the handy "a stunt does one of these things" list for you to make your own. In the Atomic Robo book, which is the newest/best version of the Fate rules, they're still presented as being attached to skills (Megastunts aren't, but those are the equivalent to Powers in DFRPG which also weren't tied to skills). The sample stunts are sorted under which mode the skill they're derived from appears in or directly after the Weird Skill it's attached to. E: quote:WHAT STUNTS DO
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 22:02
|
|
|
Lemon Curdistan posted:Yeah, that was my criticism of The Sprawl. In general, there's a lot of people making AW/DW "hacks" that blindly reuse their respective mechanics with no account for how those mechanics inform and are informed by theme, and it's the same thing for Fate. It's easy to slap a coat of flavouring over existing mechanics, it's a lot harder to understand how theme and mechanics impact each other and therefore what to do with either of them. Can you expand on this a little bit? I just looked at the Sprawl's basic moves (version 0.3) and they seem fine. They're definitely less re-hashy than some other PbtA games being kickstarted right now.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2014 22:54
|
|
|
Evil Mastermind posted:Fate shovelware isn't so much "the mechanics don't work" as "we just took the SRD and stapled our setting onto it, without trying to really talk about anything like genre emulation or tone or even adding something new to the system". The great thing about this is that it's so easy. Even just writing up a load of sample aspects and stunts can work if they're really engaging and not just "You get +2 to this thing!". But nope, that's too hard. If I didn't have things to do this morning I could cry a whole river of tears about shovelware in the Fate thread.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 01:33
|
|
|
I demand to read your river of tears.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 01:51
|
|
|
It feels weird reading about FATE shovelware. Possibly because it makes me feel that my ideas are doomed to failure  (Even worse, the sorts of ideas I'd like to try to write up would probably be utterly tasteless to run. Oh well.)
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
Evil Mastermind posted:I demand to read your river of tears. I agree.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
If you give a poo poo, you're not really producing shovelware. You might make something bad, but a bad project with some heart put into it is way more interesting than a book that's bad because the writer didn't care. And I am going to third the river of tears demand, would be interested to hear about some bad FATE.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
I will, but later when my work is done so don't hold your breath. And in case anyone missed it because it's late: Wargames are Game of the Month!
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:12
|
|
|
ascendance posted:I feel like someone needs to release Fate/Stay Night for FATE. You couldn't apply the Fate series to just any system. You'd need a system that's good for PvP, since that's what Fate basically is.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:37
|
|
|
Waffleman_ posted:You couldn't apply the Fate series to just any system. You'd need a system that's good for PvP, since that's what Fate basically is. Didn't someone try to make a Fate/Stay Night hack in FATE on this forum? I can't remember how it went, but I remember somebody tried. Maybe it'd be better in PbtA?
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:57
|
|
|
It depends on how accurately you want to replicate a Holy Grail War. Nasuverse worldbuilding is crunch as hell.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:59
|
|
|
Davin Valkri posted:Didn't someone try to make a Fate/Stay Night hack in FATE on this forum? I can't remember how it went, but I remember somebody tried. Maybe it'd be better in PbtA? Do it on the fly. IN NEXT!
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 02:59
|
|
|
Waffleman_ posted:You couldn't apply the Fate series to just any system. You'd need a system that's good for PvP, since that's what Fate basically is. Do it in BattleCON.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 03:29
|
|
|
Ettin posted:
Ettin cry the tears.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 05:15
|
|
|
You could do it with around four players, two mages two servants on a team, with the gm managing the rest. That'd also allow for the bizarre and broken outliers without giving one team a huge advantage.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 05:16
|
|
|
While we're demanding things, I demand that further discussion of a Nasuverse FATE rpg be henceforth referred to as FATE / Stay Night.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 05:28
|
|
|
Fate is not officially written in all caps any more.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 06:00
|
|
|
I'd rather have a game based on the greatest TYPE MOON property: Melty Blood. PCs are a bunch of weirdos who wander the night fighting vampires, ghosts, and their messed up alternate selves. Any non-Japanese character is forced to have a bizarre name. Being bad at cooking is a super power fit to contend with being the will of Gaia or carrying around 666 deadly animals inside you. Some sessions end with sacrifice and emotion, others with your sister turning into a giant and fighting you.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 06:05
|
|
|
My shift key will always hold back FATE.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 06:10
|
|
|
Okay, so I started a new group here in Seattle since I moved. Seem like a cool group of dudes. We're going to play Shadowrun one week, and the next is a mish-mash of 3.5/Pathfinder, where the DM is basically allowing everything. Apparently they're accustomed to power gaming, but I told them I have no intents to do such and that my girlfriend doesn't really know how to make a dude so I'll be making it for her. So they've held off on power, but are still allowing everything. I'm liking this. I'm liking this, specifically, because it means I get to play a Binder. Binders were, by far, my absolute favorite part of 3.5. I'll play one every chance I get, because you basically get the ability to be a new character every single day. It's glorious. More than efficiency in my characters, I love versatility, so I'm loving this. So I decide to look it up and see if anyone has updated the binder to Pathfinder from 3.5. Turns out some guy named Dario Nardi has released not one, but FOUR books on the subject (Secrets of Pact Magic, Villains of Pact Magic, Pact Magic Unbound Vol.1 and Pact Magic Unbound Vol.2). Something like 600 pages of stuff. And it's really, really good, guys. Like, I'm genuinely impressed with the thought he's put into designing new vestiges and new classes and feats, etc. It's honestly, genuinely good and it's about my favorite class. Honestly, pretty much the only Pathfinder/3.5 class I can really stomach. I am so gleefully excited to play this weekend that I can't wait. Oh, and for Shadowrun I made a crazy old Chinese alchemist so that I could screw around playing the old guy from Big Trouble in Little China while my girlfriend's troll adept goes around going "CAN I AXE YOU A QUESTION HAR HAR SERIOUSLY THOUGH THIS IS AN AXE." This group should be fun.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 08:40
|
|
|
Usually nobody's allowed to bring up Binders unless they also bring up what a shame the Truenamer was. Shame about that Truenamer. Froghammer fucked around with this message at 11:11 on Sep 9, 2014 |
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 10:46
|
|
|
Froghammer posted:Usually nobody's allowed to bring up Binders unless they also bring up what a shame the Truenamer was. Truenamer was a really cool concept with lacklustre powers and a completely broken casting mechanic that took a grand total of five minutes to fix (by making it a level check instead of a skill check and removing the skill item). Literally, all you need to do is change it to a DC 12+HD (instead of 10+2xHD or whatever it is originally) check where you roll d20 and add your level+casting stat, IIRC.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 11:11
|
|
|
Are there any games that are inspired/based off of ancient cultures that are generally obscure because they don't fit neatly into the western "world history" textbooks propaganda depiction of an imaginary line of progress going "Greece > Rome > Western Europe and USA"? Despite my tone I'm actually serious about the request.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 11:22
|
|
|
Tollymain posted:Are there any games that are inspired/based off of ancient cultures that are generally obscure because they don't fit neatly into the western "world history" textbooks propaganda depiction of an imaginary line of progress going "Greece > Rome > Western Europe and USA"? Despite my tone I'm actually serious about the request. There's New Fire, which is set in the myths and legends of precolumbian mesoamerica. It had a kickstarter, but I'm not sure if it's been released to the public. Ehdrigohr is a Fate Core game inspired mainly by Lakota myths, though it includes some elements from other cultures. There's also Shard, which is inspired by Indian/Chinese culture (and also has animal people instead of humans, but not in a creepy way).
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 11:42
|
|
|
Tollymain posted:Are there any games that are inspired/based off of ancient cultures that are generally obscure because they don't fit neatly into the western "world history" textbooks propaganda depiction of an imaginary line of progress going "Greece > Rome > Western Europe and USA"? Despite my tone I'm actually serious about the request. Glorantha. Like you have a lot of cultures in which are like hunter gatherers or tribal nomads but it's emphatically not because they're somehow inferior to the Lunars or the Kralorelans. The Doraddi are inspired by a variety of pre-modern African cultures and they're nomads who live in tribes and see furniture as a sign of wealth and status, but they're not ignorant of 'civilisation', they've actually tried sedentary living and written language and they think it's lovely.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 12:00
|
|
|
Lemon Curdistan posted:(instead of 10+2xHD or whatever it is originally) It's actually 15+CR*2.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 12:29
|
|
|
Any opinions on Warrior Rogue Mage? I plan on running a oneshot of it while waiting for my real dice set to arrive, since right now I only have d6s to work with. I also considered Mini Six, but WRM seems easier to grasp.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 12:58
|
|
|
Tollymain posted:Are there any games that are inspired/based off of ancient cultures that are generally obscure because they don't fit neatly into the western "world history" textbooks propaganda depiction of an imaginary line of progress going "Greece > Rome > Western Europe and USA"? Despite my tone I'm actually serious about the request. There's always Tekumel.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 13:48
|
|
|
I don't know if it is ancient, but Gurps fantasy 2 is partially inspired by the First Nations. Nyambe is based on Africa.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 13:52
|
|
|
Babylon Astronaut posted:I don't know if it is ancient, but Gurps fantasy 2 is partially inspired by the First Nations. It's only two decades old- wait, that was Robin Laws? Explains a lot.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 13:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 18:03 |
|
|
I still have no idea how you'd actually run the drat thing, but it sure is interesting.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2014 14:11
|
|