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Ludicro posted:Right, I'm flying out to the United States in a couple of days, and given the prospect of spending 19 hours in the air I've decided that this is the perfect time to get some Big Finish in to listen to during the trip. Might as well pick up Storm Warning and The Chimes of Midnight. Beyond that, you're going to get some varied recommendations! A lot of the Unbound line is pretty good. I also like (in order of my preference for them) Jubilee, The Holy Terror, Dust Breeding, Embrace the Darkness (others don't like it so much, so grain of salt), ...ish and The Harvest. Alternatively, you could just stick with some Eight stories and follow them through, as he kind of forms his own seasons, or if there are Doctors/companions that you like, let us know and we can tell you a few from their range!
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Sep 15, 2014 19:09
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BioMe posted:gently caress everyone who uses this tactic to champion their social "cause". Especially when you do this damaging antagonizing nonsense to attack people who disagree with a non-issue (even according to you) in children's TV banter dialogue. You could not make it clearer all you are doing is re-purposing a real issue to win a quick moral high ground to win a petty internet argument. Me replying to your earlier post: MrL_JaKiri posted:It's just a bit of harmless banter What do I win!
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Sep 15, 2014 19:16
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Doug Sisk posted:Is it significant that the Doctor has been wrong in every episode so far? The first he got the robots wrong and made a point of mentioning it, he was wrong about the Dalek, Robin Hood, and now possibly the whole monster thing. I can't recall this happening so much previously, or have I just misremembered and it's been happening with all the recent Doctors? I would swear that others had a lot of times they didn't know but were rarely straight up wrong. He's definitely a bit of a gently caress up, old Twelve. I do wonder if he'll eventually come into his own, so to speak, but at the moment he definitely only seems to have half a handle on what's going on.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:18
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Ludicro posted:Right, I'm flying out to the United States in a couple of days, and given the prospect of spending 19 hours in the air I've decided that this is the perfect time to get some Big Finish in to listen to during the trip. Deadline, Singularity, Jubilee, The Silver Turk, Dark Eyes, The Fires of Vulcan.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:22
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Bring along The Kingmaker and The One Doctor!
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Sep 15, 2014 19:22
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Me replying to your earlier post:
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Sep 15, 2014 19:29
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Did anyone tell Moffat that they already used the "End of the Universe" thing like 5 seasons ago?
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Sep 15, 2014 19:31
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Shugojin posted:In fairness, other planets are possibly not situated at the cosmic crossroads and don't have Daleks, Cybermen, and whoever else constantly trying to conquer it. For most planets, first one of those would also be the last one.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:34
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Plavski posted:Deadline, Singularity, Jubilee, The Silver Turk, Dark Eyes, The Fires of Vulcan. I didn't care much for Singularity. It did have some clever concepts to work from, but it dragged a little. The Fires of Vulcan was okay, though. BioMe posted:Try to miss the point harder, and for the love of god come up with better burns if you are going to pat yourself in the back for them. Calm down, BioMe.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:35
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Brett824 posted:Did anyone tell Moffat that they already used the "End of the Universe" thing like 5 seasons ago? The Universe ends in several places at once. There are stories to tell from any of them.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:36
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BioMe posted:Try to miss the point harder, and for the love of god come up with better burns if you are going to pat yourself in the back for them. It's not a burn, it's a sad prediction of things to come. The "Stop defending your social cause like this" thing is such loving bullshit and is a large part of the problem so :condi:
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Sep 15, 2014 19:37
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 What scares the Doctor? Ghosts of the past and future crowd into the lives of the Doctor and Clara: a terrified caretaker in a children's home, the last man standing in the universe and a little boy who doesn't want to join the army. Listen! Peter Capaldi is the Doctor in Listen. Cast Peter Capaldi (The Doctor) Jenna Coleman (Clara Oswald) Samuel Anderson (Danny Pink/Orson Pink) Remi Gooding (Rupert Pink) Robert Goodman (Reg) Written by: Steven Moffat Director: Douglas Mackinnon Trailer - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N15qtDfix78 Gifs by: J-Ru X X X X X It's fall in the United Kingdom, which means it's time for the annual Philip Hinchcliffe-esque “let's scare the hell out of Britain” episode of Doctor Who.  Listen is Steven Moffat 101, with all the usual timey-wimey aspects one would expect from a Moffat script along with one plot point that can either be considered absolutely brilliant or a plot hole you could pilot a TARDIS through. Add to that a final 10 minutes that overshadows the proceeding 35 and Listen might be the most polarising episode of Doctor Who in a very long time. There is no denying, however, that all 45 minutes of this story are top-notch, specifically the fine directing and great performances by a more minimalist cast.  The Doctor asks a very simple question to himself. “Why do we talk to ourselves when we're alone?” The answer? “Because we know we're not alone.” Enlisting the help of Clara after a disasterous first date with her fellow teacher Danny Pink, the Doctor explains that, throughout history, humans have had the same dream; alone in their bedrooms, with something under the bed waiting for them. The Doctor and Clara travel back in time to a point in her history where Clara has had that exact dream...except, thanks to Clara thinking about her date during their time jump, it's not her having the dream. It's a young Danny Pink. And, indeed, something is under his bedspread waiting for him... For good or for ill, Steven Moffat's scripts try to come at Doctor Who from a different angle. The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances saw what would happen if, just once, everyone lived. Blink introduced a new villain that only struck if their victims looked away, while The Impossible Astronaut/Day of the Moon saw villains who were forgotten as soon as their victims looked away. And he took the Time War and the end of the Doctor's regenerative cycle head on in the Name/Night/Day/Time of the Doctor episodes. Listen is classic Moffat, combining the fear of something unknown as the driving force of the story with focused characterization on the story's players. His script mixes in plenty of tense, suspenseful moments, such as the scene with Clara under the bed or the Doctor explaining the “rational” causes for all the noises being heard at the end of the universe. There are very few “jump” scares and “boo” moments so much as a slowly building sense of dread that the actors sell VERY convincingly.  And the highest compliment I can give Moffat for Listen is that he gives the characters time to develop a little bit. We see how Clara and adult Danny fumble towards a relationship, we see Clara's teacher side come through when talking to young Danny, we see the Doctor and time-traveling Orson feel each other out, and the conversations feel natural and not at all rushed. The smaller cast helps as short-term characterization has always been one of Moffat's strengths as a writer. As a whole, however, the episode's various scenes seem very rushed and disjointed. It moves from scene to scene quickly, one plot point rolling right into the next without giving the viewer a chance to breathe. The overall narrative is there, but it goes from “date night” to “children's home” to “date night” to “the end of the universe.” This quick movement really prevents the episode from coming together. There's no chance for that “spark” to catch and ignite the story and make it truly brilliant. Samuel Anderson plays two parts in this episode; Danny Pink, ex-soldier and current school teacher, and Orson Pink, Earth's first chrononaut/time traveler. Now, as Orson Pink, his relative, Anderson nails the confusion about who his rescuers are and his eagerness at getting the hell home. I'm a little unsure about Danny Pink right now. There is a sort of chemistry between Pink/Anderson and Clara/Coleman that's getting a bit lost in the “they're meant to end up together” plot that Moffat seems to be weaving. It's forced, but it's not forced. The “ex-soldier” narrative, I'm very unsure about. I'm willing to give it a little longer, but when almost every comment and reaction seems to be about his military service, it goes from characterizating him to overshadowing everything else about him. There's probably a secret in his past, beyond digging wells and saving villages, but I'm just not invested in his story as of yet. The scene where Clara comforts the young Rupert (to be re-named Danny someday) Pink is another feather in Jenna Coleman's cap. After a series of being little more than a puzzle for the Doctor to solve while she pined for him, Clara Oswald has become one of my favorite companions of the revival. This episode, in the future, should be held up as the answer to the question “why does the Doctor need a companion?” She easily proves to be not only his equal, but his other half. Where he's cold and honest, she's warm and compassionate. He mocks her putting plastic soldiers around Rupert's bed even as she consoles the young child. And in the very end, when the Doctor is scared the most, Clara is the one who who gives him words of comfort and hope. Her part in the Doctor's past was done so much better than the “insert/Rotoscope her into scenes from the Doctor's past” we got during the lead-up to The Name of the Doctor. Instead of coming off as “a special snowflake,” Jenna Coleman's performance is simply one of a caring human being. The viewer isn't being told Clara is being awesome; instead, Clara is just BEING awesome. And it's nice that the usual “timey-wimey” stuff happens naturally and it isn't called attention to in a heavy-handed manner. Clara has an effect on Danny Pink's life, and that's the story I'm interested in seeing from her point of view. Capaldi firmly puts his stamp on the Twelfth Doctor in this episode with a great performance. One of the opinions I've seen about the relationship between the Doctor and Clara has been that the Doctor consistantly insults and belittles her, while she gives back just as good as she gets. A lot of people have asked why Clara would continue to travel with a man who is mean to her. On one hand, such bickering isn't new to Doctor Who. Six and Peri were a Doctor and a companion who seemed to have nothing in common even as they saved each others' bacon amidst sniping and put-downs like good friends always do. But to go a little further down this rabbit hole, the first eight incarnation of the Doctor spent his life running from Gallifrey and a society he didn't fit in to. The War Doctor burned down that society for the good of the whole of reality. The Ninth, Tenth, and Eleventh Doctors spent more of their lives burdened by the guilt of Gallifrey's destruction. This is the first Doctor in over 1200 years who has no burdens, no traditions to uphold, no society to run from even as it beckons him home from time to time. All the Doctor has is himself and the TARDIS. He has no responsibilities to himself or anyone/anything else. Capaldi's Doctor isn't a dick. Capaldi's Doctor has no filters. Regeneration “fixes the flaws” in the last incarnation, as a rule of thumb. Eleven was one of the more “human” Doctors, integrating himself into Rory and Amy's lives, becoming a roommate in a flat for a brief period of time, and spending 200 years among the residents of Christmas to save them from the galaxy's most ruthless aliens. All that was a burden, whether or not the Doctor felt it. The Twelfth Doctor, on the other hand, has shown himself to be one of the more “alien” races, and with that, most social norms and concepts of politeness go out the window. When he's telling Rupert that being scared is his superpower, he's not trying to be reassuring for Rupert's sake. The Doctor was being reassuring to defeat the monster behind them. The Doctor's not trying to be mean or hurtful, he's just seeing things as they are and either can't take the time or won't take the time to sugarcoat things.  As for his performance in Listen, Capaldi does a fantastic job of an extremely clever man looking for a solution to a problem that may be there...or may NOT be there. What happens when people get bored? They find something do to. In the case of the Doctor, he hits the metaphorical hornet's nest just to see what happens. He goes from curious at the children's home to obsessed at the end of the universe because he has to know the answer. It's not enough to prove that he's right; along the way, he HAS to solve the puzzle. But as the ending shows, maybe the problem was never there at all and the Doctor simply made it up. He went looking for something that was never there. It could have been a Monster A-Go-Go style ending, but Capaldi sells it for all he's worth. He was wrong, he made a mistake, and he was willing to accept that mistake. With that said...WAS there something there? While it is nice to see the Doctor be wrong (someone that smart, they can be that wrong once in a while), that doesn't change the fact that something or someone WAS under Rupert's bedspread and stood behind him, Clara, and the Doctor. There WAS something at the end of the universe knocking on the door to Orson's time-ship. Or, WAS it just a change in atmospheric pressure? Was it an alien or a monster under Rupert's blanket, or one of his fellow housemates playing a prank and wondering why the hell Rupert was having a party in his room? To some people, it's the ultimate cop-out or a huge plot hole that ruins the episode. To me, however, not knowing if there truly was a monster or not falls into the same vein as what the Doctor saw inside his personal hotel room in my favorite Eleven episode The God Compelx. We don't know what he saw, and we could argue it until the end of the universe (Steven Moffat says it's one of the time cracks, I say it's eleven bodies hanging from a noose with the twelfth one waiting for him), but not knowing makes the episode better. And not knowing the truth, whether or not the Doctor simply courted trouble OR ended up overlooking/avoiding it, simply adds to the mystery of this new Doctor. Now, the final ten minutes. I will come right out and say it - I'm wary of anything resembling an “origin” story for the Doctor, and this includes going back into his childhood . For over 50 years, his existence prior to An Unearthly Child was barely touched upon, save for comments about his poor academic record from Romana and a few back-and-forth pieces of dialogue with the Master. This video sums it up much better than I ever could. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zc4HSf6NKiQ Listen isn't an origin story. We still don't know anything about the Doctor's childhood that we didn't know before, save that he would sometimes sleep in the barn, didn't want to go into the army (which will probably tie into Danny Pink's story later in the season, a friend of mine wagers), and that the barn meant enough to him that it was where the War Doctor was going to use the Moment to end the Time War. The third one is a nice reveal, the second one is barely a surprise, and the first one is nothing more than flavor text. Clara whispering into his ear some of the things he would later say during his travels, I can buy it, but it's more from Jenna Coleman's performance than Moffat's writing. Again, it's delivered casually, soothing words to a frightened child, not a catchphrase stamped into the side of an anvil being dropped on the viewer's head about just how important the Impossible Girl is. My biggest sticking point is how, once again, it felt seperated from the rest of the episode, a key moment in the Doctor's development that's only tie is that Clara grabbed his ankle at one point from under the bed.  I enjoyed Listen. The ambiguity of the “monster” and the performances by Capaldi and Coleman were above board, but it was, to use a phrase, “timey wimey” in terms of narrative flow and structure. It's a very good episode, maybe the best so far this season, but I'm hesitant to call it one of the best of all time.
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Sep 15, 2014 19:48
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TinTower posted:Really, he just loves humans. Possibly because his mother was one. You take that back son!
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Sep 15, 2014 19:56
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I'm a bit broke at the moment so I'll have to skip on the more expensive ones, but as its been mentioned twice I've added Jubilee to the basket along with Spare Parts and Davros. I'm also giving Storm Warning and Chimes of Midnight strong consideration.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:11
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Ludicro posted:I'm a bit broke at the moment so I'll have to skip on the more expensive ones, but as its been mentioned twice I've added Jubilee to the basket along with Spare Parts and Davros. I'm also giving Storm Warning and Chimes of Midnight strong consideration. Chimes is definitely a thread favorite and Storm Warning, though flawed, introduces you to some stuff you have to understand before listening to Chimes. What are some of your favorite serials from the show? The first 50 are the discounted ones, so you'll want to stick to those, but there's a lot of variety there.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:14
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I am totally loving these posters created for each episode this season.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:16
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Spikeguy posted:Has it ever been established why The Doctor took such a liking to Earth and hangs out there more often than not? I know he protects anyone he can, but this place seems to have taken a special place in his heart. Because it's cheaper to film there. 
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Sep 15, 2014 20:22
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Since we're on the subject of Big Finish again but it doesn't have its own thread, does anyone have any non-DW recommendations? The only one I have so far is Treasure Island but I haven't gotten around to actually listening to it yet. The Robin Hood stuff starring Richard Armitage looks particularly intriguing.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:24
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Bicyclops posted:Chimes is definitely a thread favorite and Storm Warning, though flawed, introduces you to some stuff you have to understand before listening to Chimes. What are some of your favorite serials from the show? The first 50 are the discounted ones, so you'll want to stick to those, but there's a lot of variety there. Yeah I've seen people commenting that Storm Warning needs to be listened to first before, sounds like I might have to take the plunge. Well if an idea of some of my favourite serials from the show I'll list some off the top of my head. The Daleks The Aztecs The Power of the Daleks The Tomb of the Cybermen The Mind Robber The Invasion ("Packer..."  )Inferno Terror of the Autons Genesis of the Daleks The Pyramids of Mars The Talons of Weng Chiang
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Sep 15, 2014 20:29
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Ludicro posted:Yeah I've seen people commenting that Storm Warning needs to be listened to first before, sounds like I might have to take the plunge. Well if an idea of some of my favourite serials from the show I'll list some off the top of my head. You might want to check out some of the Companion Chronicles then. William Russell, Carole Ann Ford and Frazer Hines all have several each and I've enjoyed the few that I've gotten a chance to listen to so far ("The Time Museum", "The Revenants", etc) Also Frazer Hines's 2nd Doctor impression is staggering.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:34
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Tim Burns Effect posted:You might want to check out some of the Companion Chronicles then. William Russell, Carole Ann Ford and Frazer Hines all have several each and I've enjoyed the few that I've gotten a chance to listen to so far ("The Time Museum", "The Revenants", etc) I think I might have to. Actually my list made me wonder, did Kevin Stoney do any Big Finish before he died? When I think of what I like about classic Who his performances as Mavic Chen and Tobias Vaughn always spring to mind.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:37
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Based on that list, I think The Holy Terror, Eye of the Scorpion and Invaders from Mars might be good points of interest from the first 50. Invaders is an homage to older sci-fi and, well, the Orson Wells drama specifically, so be forewarned it has some pretty hokey fake mafia accents. Eye takes place in ancient Egypt and has some good characters. Holy Terror is best left unexplained, in my opinion, except to say that the companion in the story, Frobisher, is a large penguin (trust me, it works). e: only problem with The Companion Chronicles is that they are quite pricey, unfortunately.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:38
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The best reason to listen to Storm Warning first is that some of the horrible "people describing what is happening in an awkward fashion" will be a lot less apparent. Also it introduces the 8th Doctor's companion and her story is very important to his adventures.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:39
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Ludicro posted:Yeah I've seen people commenting that Storm Warning needs to be listened to first before, sounds like I might have to take the plunge. I disagree that Storm Warning needs to be listened to before Chimes. It introduces the companion, but you're not going to be really missing any vital information if you listen to Chimes of Midnight first (as I did). I'm glad you're getting Jubilee, and I definitely nth the nominations for Chimes of Midnight and The Holy Terror. Bicyclops posted:Storm Warning, though flawed, introduces you to some stuff you have to understand before listening to Chimes. Just out of curiosity, could you tell me in spoilers what you think needs to be introduced before listening to Chimes? thexerox123 fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 20:41
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Bicyclops posted:Based on that list, I think The Holy Terror, Eye of the Scorpion and Invaders from Mars might be good points of interest from the first 50. These are all good suggestions. Invaders does have some historical inaccuracy that is intentional, but not explained or resolved in the story, so don't get too confused about it.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:49
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I was waiting for it to happen, and it did. 'Listen' is an episode where the writing is perfectly married to Capaldi's acting abilities. Actually, to the abilities of everyone involved - it was excellent all around. I knew the latest Doctor would have the potential to be 'the most literate doctor' so to speak - and it looks like we're seeing exactly that. Wow! I also feel strongly that Capaldi has the potential to be arguably the greatest Doctor of all time - time will tell there, but I feel we got our first real direct evidence of that possibility with Listen. Spacedad fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 20:59
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thexerox123 posted:
A lot of the important points in the story revolve around the fact that rescuing Charlie was specifically a problem for the timeline. That she is "supposed" to be dead is a problem the Doctor doesn't want to face any more than the inhabitants of the household. A lot of the mirroring is a bit lost, not to mention potentially confusing, without Storm Warning to back you up.
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Sep 15, 2014 21:13
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Spacedad posted:I was waiting for it to happen, and it did. 'Listen' is an episode where the writing is perfectly married to Capaldi's acting abilities. Actually, to the abilities of everyone involved - it was excellent all around. Going for an older Doctor was a pretty good move. I think my problem with Matt Smith was that he could play the goofy Doctor, but the writing constantly wanted to have the intimidating Time Lord. I mean the "I am the Doctor, last of the Time Lords! *An army of death machines steps backwards*" was always really cheesy writing, but I recall Tennant and Eccelston doing a much better job selling it than Smith ever could. He just always looked like the wacky cartoon character regardless of how dramatic the scene was supposed to be. And now they have a Doctor who can be genuinely unsettling. So far they seem to have dropped most of the silly bombastic speeches about how amazing and terrifying he is and whatnot, which I hope is the new trend. Yet I still really want to see Capaldi handle a really bad Mary Sue Doctor script. MrL_JaKiri posted:It's not a burn, it's a sad prediction of things to come. No, immediately telling possibly indifferent people that they are "part of the problem" or "the enemy" has the problem where they might start believing you. Since most social issues are purely a psychological warfare, turning a person against you is exactly like scoring in your own goal. Also in this case there's the matter of equating not buying a tone deaf interpretation of Doctor Who dialogue with being part of some kind of societal problem. I think there's some kind of misframing of the issue going on. Anyway, it's not so much how you defend your cause, it's against who.
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Sep 15, 2014 21:33
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BioMe posted:Jesus christ how long are you people going to cry about a joke? Couple pages in a very long thread, why? feeling touchy?
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Sep 15, 2014 21:39
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It doesn't seem like you're indifferent, BioMe, it seems like you were fairly angry that people were talking about it. It's perfectly possible to talk about it on a reasonable basis but posting "why won't you all shut up crying about this" is probably not the way to go about that.
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Sep 15, 2014 21:45
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BioMe posted:
The one sentence that you quoted wasn't actually saying that to you, though. The "It's you" was referring purely to the fact that the conversation was continuing because you, in your disagreement, were continuing the conversation. The point LividLiquid was making, I think, is that any time "social justice" topics are brought up, the discussion takes ten times longer than it has to because people who don't want to discuss it just have to post "Ugh, why are we even talking about this?" instead of just scrolling by. I understand that you may have difficulty understanding that was his point, because your own posts read a little like some kind of Rorschach word salad ("social issues are purely a psychological warefare"???), but he was not making you out to be "the enemy." Bicyclops fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 21:47
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BioMe posted:No, immediately telling possibly indifferent people that they are "part of the problem" or "the enemy" has the problem where they might start believing you. Anyway, I really liked your review, CobiWann. It hits the nail on the head for me, pretty much. Especially with how tell don't show the Clara in The Doctor's timestream stuff was. Witnessing the events of this episode first hand, from her perspective, was so much more effective. It didn't feel like somebody telling me Clara was important. It was just Clara comforting a frightened child. I don't hold The Doctor's past as completely off-limits, but I also don't want a Prequel situation, where it's all winky-noddy references to things that will happen in his future. This was just about the right level of intrusion in his pre-Unearthly Child life for me. He was a kid once. He slept in a barn sometimes. He was frightened at night. It's vague enough for me to still imagine around it, instead of taking all of my input on who a young Doctor was away from me.
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Sep 15, 2014 21:52
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Tim Burns Effect posted:Since we're on the subject of Big Finish again but it doesn't have its own thread, does anyone have any non-DW recommendations? The only one I have so far is Treasure Island but I haven't gotten around to actually listening to it yet. The Robin Hood stuff starring Richard Armitage looks particularly intriguing. http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3345654&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=631#post432275339 My write-up for the recent release of Survivors might interest you... LividLiquid posted:It's vague enough for me to still imagine around it, instead of taking all of my input on who a young Doctor was away from me. Exactly. I don't need to know the specifics of the Doctor's time before he left Gallifrey...heck, I don't need to know the specifics of the Doctor's time after he left Gallifrey (re: the running gag about the Terrible Zodin). Even after all these years, the Doctor still has an air of mystery around him and that's part of his charm/appeal.
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Sep 15, 2014 21:59
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Tim Burns Effect posted:Since we're on the subject of Big Finish again but it doesn't have its own thread, does anyone have any non-DW recommendations? The only one I have so far is Treasure Island but I haven't gotten around to actually listening to it yet. The Robin Hood stuff starring Richard Armitage looks particularly intriguing. Two things to know about Treasure Island: 1) Tom Baker plays Long John Silver (but, of course, you know that) and 2) Tom Baker plays Long John Silver's parrot. I repeat, TOM BAKER PLAYS A PARROT! But other ranges, the Blake's 7 full cast range is amazing. The best thing after Doctor Who that they do. The 2099 AD range is awesome too, though you actually can't get all of them anymore. They stopped repressing the CDs, and not all the stories are available for download yet, but the ones that are available are worth it. Plus the 2099 stories featuring Strontium Dog star Simon Pegg as Johnny Alpha.
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Sep 15, 2014 22:01
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BioMe posted:Going for an older Doctor was a pretty good move. I think my problem with Matt Smith was that he could play the goofy Doctor, but the writing constantly wanted to have the intimidating Time Lord. I mean the "I am the Doctor, last of the Time Lords! *An army of death machines steps backwards*" was always really cheesy writing, but I recall Tennant and Eccelston doing a much better job selling it than Smith ever could. He just always looked like the wacky cartoon character regardless of how dramatic the scene was supposed to be. Yeah Smith's strength was that he looks weird (and is actually surprisingly coordinated in his weird body, so he's good at physical acting), so he basically works when he's being a goofy galoot making things up as he goes along.
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Sep 15, 2014 22:02
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Bicyclops posted:The one sentence that you quoted wasn't actually saying that to you, though. The "It's you" was referring purely to the fact that the conversation was continuing because you, in your disagreement, were continuing the conversation. The point LividLiquid was making, I think, is that any time "social justice" topics are brought up, the discussion takes ten times longer than it has to because people who don't want to discuss it just have to post "Ugh, why are we even talking about this?" instead of just scrolling by. I understand that you may have difficulty understanding that was his point, because your own posts read a little like like some kind of Rorschach word salad ("social issues are purely a psychological warefare"???), but he was not making you out to be "the enemy."
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Sep 15, 2014 22:05
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LividLiquid posted:That isn't what I did. At all. I pointed out that people kept raging on the topic being broached, and that the conversation would be long over if people could just let "that was a bit sexist" lie there instead of arguing about it, then blaming the people they're arguing with for starting the argument that they, themselves, started. I think people are mainly railing against the assertions that: 1) Moffat is a misogynist because he wrote a joke goons didn't like/understand. 2) Putting down a woman's appearance is an issue of historical relevance and not just some silly windmill SJWs like tilting at. If people could be reasonable and make statements like "I don't think the Doctor's comments are coming off the way Moffat intended them. They feel really mean-spirited" instead of "MISOGNY! MISOGYNY! DERP DERP DERP!" you wouldn't have this kind of push-back.
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Sep 15, 2014 22:22
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Irish Joe posted:I think people are mainly railing against the assertions that: Yes, if only people could be reasonable and not use accurate words to describe things so as to protect the feelings of people who are emotionally invested in what 'SJWs' think.
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Sep 15, 2014 22:30
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Irish Joe posted:I think people are mainly railing against the assertions that: FYI if you're a person who has ever used SJW as a pejorative then you're a massive idiot with nothing to say worth listening to.
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Sep 15, 2014 22:35
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I think the problem is that the content of (for example) previous interviews Moffat has given and some stories he's written (for more than just Doctor Who - I think there might be a bit of a question mark over the portrayal of Adler in Sherlock) come across as indicating that he at least has issues with women. I'm extremely reluctant to accuse him of being some kind of full-on MRA, malevolent, Elliot Rodger-type misogynist. I've never met him, but my impression of him is that he's genuinely ignorant of how tone-deaf (if that's the right term for it) he sometimes sounds, inculcated by this sort of macho culture he grew up with in Scotland, the boys' club of the BBC where he's worked solidly for almost 20 years, and the purportedly ugly break-up of his first marriage. The point is that it prompts some viewers - with good cause, one might argue - to scrutinise his intentions much more closely than they would if it was any other writer. Perhaps I'm too being charitable but I'm trying my best not to assume the worst about people I've never met. 
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Sep 15, 2014 22:36
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