|
The "Fate" in "Fate/Stay Night" maps onto the name of the first route of the story, but do "Stay" and "Night" mean anything pertinent in the context of the other two routes respectively, or are they just Engrish that sounded good to the writers?
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 10:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 23:40 |
|
|
JosephWongKS posted:The "Fate" in "Fate/Stay Night" maps onto the name of the first route of the story, but do "Stay" and "Night" mean anything pertinent in the context of the other two routes respectively, or are they just Engrish that sounded good to the writers? Probably the latter. I can't recall anything that makes them relevant, other than a majority of the action taking place at night.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 10:04
|
|
|
I remember reading somewhere that the whole title is Engrish, and it was originally meant to be something like "The night fate stood still". Don't know if it's actually that way of if someone made it up on the internet, though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 10:18
|
|
|
Is this the thread about the porn game Fate/Stay Night?
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 11:14
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 11:21
|
|
|
I love crossovers! E: what exactly is Archer looking at, he knows she's like 15-16 right?
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 11:21
|
|
|
orange juche posted:Is this the thread about the porn game Fate/Stay Night? Yes, and also other eroge such as Monster Girl Quest or Kamidori.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 11:39
|
|
|
JosephWongKS posted:The "Fate" in "Fate/Stay Night" maps onto the name of the first route of the story, but do "Stay" and "Night" mean anything pertinent in the context of the other two routes respectively, or are they just Engrish that sounded good to the writers? I believe it's just cool English. The original title during development was Faith Save/Knight, I believe.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 12:17
|
|
|
Waffleman_ posted:I believe it's just cool English. The original title during development was Faith Save/Knight, I believe. There are some English<->Japanese aspects of the UBW story in particular that will be worth discussing once it's all over. Nate RFB fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Oct 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 12:32
|
|
|
orange juche posted:I love crossovers! That's not the first time that's happened.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 12:46
|
|
|
cloverpie posted:So Saber didn't get stabbed in the heart because of her "luck"? That's kinda lame.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 15:17
|
|
|
More Fujimura!  
PunkBoy fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Oct 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 17:10
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Basically Saber is so good that she can defy fate itself. I see what you did there. I liked the episode, but Shirou's internal monologues were irritating. They did so much in episode zero without having to use those, and then turn around and do the exact opposite in the next episode. I want to see Shirou's motivation and history, not get told it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 17:41
|
|
|
Be thankful he is not explaining how magic works (even if it is kinda sort of important... maybe)
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 17:50
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:I see what you did there. He had just 1 monologue. In episode 0 Rin had 2 and 1/2
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 17:51
|
|
|
orange juche posted:I love crossovers! You know that Archer is an horrible eprson, right?
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 17:58
|
|
MonsieurChoc posted:You know that Archer is an horrible eprson, right? I mean, it's also been an explicit thing that, regardless of his other character flaws, he avoids underage girls like they'll give him leprosy. There was an entire episode in... wanna say season 2? about it.
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 20:22
|
|
|
Hahaha, it took me at least an hour to get the "Archer" joke. That's pretty funny
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 20:24
|
|
|
YggdrasilTM posted:He had just 1 monologue. In episode 0 Rin had 2 and 1/2 Context is what separates them for me. Shirou's was internal. It's him (the writer) talking directly at the audience, and I can't stand that kind of laziness. Rin's were in a conversation with Archer. While in her case it doesn't make much sense to talk about stuff she (and Archer) already knows, at least the context of it is bearable.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 20:30
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:Context is what separates them for me. Shirou's was internal. It's him (the writer) talking directly at the audience, and I can't stand that kind of laziness. Rin's were in a conversation with Archer. While in her case it doesn't make much sense to talk about stuff she (and Archer) already knows, at least the context of it is bearable. For better or worse, FSN is a story that takes place inside Shirou's head. What actually happens or even what he does tends to be less important than what he's thinking at the time.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 20:36
|
|
|
Clarste posted:For better or worse, FSN is a story that takes place inside Shirou's head. What actually happens or even what he does tends to be less important than what he's thinking at the time. really for how much internal monologue there is in the original they've been doing a pretty good job working around that so far
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 20:38
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:Context is what separates them for me. Shirou's was internal. It's him (the writer) talking directly at the audience, and I can't stand that kind of laziness. Rin's were in a conversation with Archer. While in her case it doesn't make much sense to talk about stuff she (and Archer) already knows, at least the context of it is bearable. Rin is literally talking to herself on the school roof, alone (before Archer summoning, I mean)
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 22:01
|
|
|
Clarste posted:For better or worse, FSN is a story that takes place inside Shirou's head. What actually happens or even what he does tends to be less important than what he's thinking at the time. So? Express thoughts through actions and dialogue between characters. YggdrasilTM posted:At least Shirou monologue is 1/6 internal, 5/6 flashback. Ah, I'd forgotten about that one. I hope these are the only ones then.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 23:24
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:So? Express thoughts through actions and dialogue between characters. Maybe you didn't quite understand what I meant when I said the story takes place inside his head.
|
|
#
?
Oct 13, 2014 23:34
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:So? Express thoughts through actions and dialogue between characters. The source material is essentially a book with HUGE amounts of internalized monologues, many of which have no clear visual substitute. Attempting to lazily sub in swordfights and cutting that stuff is part of what brought down the DEEN version.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 00:15
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:So? Express thoughts through actions and dialogue between characters. "Show, don't tell" isn't some hard rule that always needs to be followed. It's entirely possible for narration to be preferable to awkwardly inserting dialogue between characters. I'd rather Shirou think a bunch of stuff than have some uncharacteristic conversation with Rin or something.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 00:53
|
|
|
PunkBoy posted:More Fujimura! Taiga Fujimura is my spirit animal.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 01:00
|
|
|
Clarste posted:Maybe you didn't quite understand what I meant when I said the story takes place inside his head. And? This isn't a visual novel. A story that takes place in someone's head is boring (unless we see it). Rodyle posted:The source material is essentially a book with HUGE amounts of internalized monologues, many of which have no clear visual substitute. Attempting to lazily sub in swordfights and cutting that stuff is part of what brought down the DEEN version. Slavishly following the source material will doom this show as much as what DEEN did to their version. Creative license doesn't mean you throw out the original wholesale; take what works for the different medium, adapt what doesn't, and move on. Ytlaya posted:"Show, don't tell" isn't some hard rule that always needs to be followed. It's entirely possible for narration to be preferable to awkwardly inserting dialogue between characters. I'd rather Shirou think a bunch of stuff than have some uncharacteristic conversation with Rin or something. 100% true. I'm not advocating for awkward conversations about things the characters should already know but are explaining to the audience because the writers think we are idiots. What I want is some subtelty.Rin's conversations with Archer in episode zero fit this very well; both knew what they were talking about already, but the flow of the conversation made such exposition make sense. It's all about the context; Shirou telling himself in his head why he does what he does makes no sense, but the earlier part where Taiga spills the beans to Sakura does. That is what I want.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 02:51
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:And? This isn't a visual novel. A story that takes place in someone's head is boring (unless we see it).[quote] Doing so changes Shirou's character into the kind of person who talks about his darkest, most traumatic memories. The discussion at dinner was clearly Taiga teasing him with an embarrassing childhood memory, and he played along with another teasing joke about being influenced by childish role models, but then we discover afterward that he's still taking that stuff seriously in his most private moments. He takes it dead serious but doesn't expect anyone else to and has no one to talk about it with now that Kiritsugu is dead. That's show-not-tell right there but apparently you missed it completely?
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 02:58
|
|
|
Sometimes there's going to be information that needs to be conveyed that just doesn't have a good means of conveying it through action or interaction. We had good conservation shown here where the monologues took place over scenes from the novel that weren't important but provide good pacing control.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 02:58
|
|
|
Clarste posted:Doing so changes Shirou's character into the kind of person who talks about his darkest, most traumatic memories. quote:The discussion at dinner was clearly Taiga teasing him with an embarrassing childhood memory, and he played along with another teasing joke about being influenced by childish role models, but then we discover afterward that he's still taking that stuff seriously in his most private moments. He takes it dead serious but doesn't expect anyone else to and has no one to talk about it with now that Kiritsugu is dead. That's show-not-tell right there but apparently you missed it completely? I'm talking about Shirou's internal monologue during that whole flashback bit. The flashbacks were solid, exactly what I wanted, but (again, I think this is the third or fourth time I've said this) the part where Shirou is talking to himself in his head about his motivations was dumb. He already knows this stuff. All we need is silence, then a cut to the flashback; it's implied that this is what Shirou was thinking about without throwing it in our face. We get to see that, yeah, everything Taiga made fun of him for is actually very important to him, that it's a central, defining part of who he is, and that we, as viewers, should keep that in mind as we watch him deal with everything that comes afterwards. The moment becomes poignant, and sticks with us for the rest of the show. Instead the writers threw it in our face. "Aw, you obviously wont know what's going on. Here, let me explain it for you~!" The moment, instead of actually meaning something, just becomes pointless.A waste of time. Something we'll skip past on re-watch because we remember it being not-important. Subtlety and nuance are not difficult, especially in a visual medium like anime. Raenir Salazar posted:Sometimes there's going to be information that needs to be conveyed that just doesn't have a good means of conveying it through action or interaction. quote:We had good conservation shown here where the monologues took place over scenes from the novel that weren't important but provide good pacing control.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 04:29
|
|
|
Have you read UBW? Why Shirou does what he does is literally the bulk of the route's development. And he has nobody to talk to about it most of the time.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 04:36
|
|
|
How would you recommend they replace his internal monologues? Dialogue would be awkward and forced since it's mostly his private thoughts, and most of the things he's thinking are going to be too complex to show through just action.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 04:39
|
|
|
Sergeant_Crunch posted:How would you recommend they replace his internal monologues? With a little Tagia on each shoulder: One good, one evil, but willing to put aside their differences when Shirou's cooking is on the line.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 04:41
|
|
AfroSquirrel posted:With a little Tagia on each shoulder: One good, one evil, but willing to put aside their differences when Shirou's cooking is on the line. This would have unironically owned.
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 06:10
|
|
|
jrdbnta posted:I'm talking about Shirou's internal monologue during that whole flashback bit. How about you call it "narration" instead? Like, imagine that this is Shirou writing his memoirs of the fifth grail war. They might as well have had a non-character narrator speak about what happened to him at the end of the fourth war, but that had probably been even more awkward.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 07:12
|
|
|
Just have Speedwagon scream it out loud.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 07:15
|
|
|
Perhaps at some point Gil and Kotomine could menacingly walk in a circle around him and explain his own motivations to him.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 07:32
|
|
|
He should wear t-shirts with his motivations printed on them sequentially, which no one ever acknowledges.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 12:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 23:40 |
|
|
Rodyle posted:Perhaps at some point Gil and Kotomine could menacingly walk in a circle around him and explain his own motivations to him. Kotomine walking in circles confirmed for ep2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAK-DEkHeQI (ep2-3 preview)
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2014 12:52
|
|
