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oxbrain posted:Why would you use a smaller feed for a compensating head? I always use those at the same settings as rigid. The argument I've heard is that since some heads are only tension, not compression, you want to be sure that you're going to underfeed. I dunno. Like I said, I've never done it, we rigid everything.
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Oct 6, 2014 06:51
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The only problem with form taps is if you break one, they can be a real bitch to remove without damaging the threads. Fluted taps you can usually just burn down the middle and it will break into pieces. God drat I hate burning out taps.
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Oct 6, 2014 23:44
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Karia posted:Haas machines Karia posted:Minimills from 2001 that haven't been treated very nicely Hey, good to hear that they are still running! The minimill was the new secret project when I left the company. We had just built 5 prototypes, and there was grave concern about how long they were going to last out in the field, since they are welded steel construction instead of the giant iron castings filled with sand. Here is a picture of a machine I designed and built for assembling drawbars (for VF1 through VF3, I think):  The textures suck because the Solidworks texture package was in beta at the time. The shiny poo poo on the bottom is supposed to be diamond plate.
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Oct 7, 2014 12:16
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Squashy Nipples posted:Hey, good to hear that they are still running! The minimill was the new secret project when I left the company. We had just built 5 prototypes, and there was grave concern about how long they were going to last out in the field, since they are welded steel construction instead of the giant iron castings filled with sand. Nice! They've served us well: trained over 4000 undergrads and a couple hundred professional machine operators, made untold numbers of research and class projects, and broken more tools than you can shake a stick at. I can't say we've run them hard by industry standards, but we've got more than our fair share of crashes. They're really starting to show their age. We had three service calls over the summer to get the tool changer on #2 working (turned out the voltage on the IO board was varying by about 20 volts, and the limit switches were screwed), #3 needed a replacement limit switch for the X axis, and #1 is down because somebody punched a hole in the tool probe, coolant got in, and now it doesn't stop when tools touch it. Then there was the time that someone had a tool that was too long in the umbrella and cracked the tool changer in half... Fun times. I believe the plan is to replace them next summer with either super minimills or VF1's. Since I think that was roughly the same time frame as the Minimills, any chance you remember the original MDC (not the MDC 500)? We've got one of the prototypes. If you try to tool change at 100% rapid it throws tools. It's also fun times. Hard to see from this angle, but very cool. Is the lever-looking thing to compress the belleville washers to assemble it?
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Oct 7, 2014 18:00
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Just wanted to share this extrusion die component I've been working on for a couple days. It was probably one of the most complicated wire jobs I've done in my 13 years here, though it may look deceptively simple. Thought it looked pretty neat!   Sorry for the vertical video. http://youtu.be/1d3HxcmQ8Pg
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Oct 7, 2014 19:40
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That reminds me, question about extrusions: I look at, say, aluminum extrusions, and sometimes they'll be hollow. How the heck does the extrusion work in that case? Like, in order for there to be a hollow space in the extrusion, there has to be part of the die at the exit side blocking that area. But of course something has to hold that block in place, so the material being extruded would have to go "around" one or more support type structures and then rejoin on the other side. Does the immense pressure involved just force the material to bond on the exit side of the support as if there is no seam as it travels through the die? I am certain my terminology is not even close to right, but hopefully it makes sense enough.
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Oct 7, 2014 19:51
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Bad Munki posted:That reminds me, question about extrusions: I look at, say, aluminum extrusions, and sometimes they'll be hollow. How the heck does the extrusion work in that case? Like, in order for there to be a hollow space in the extrusion, there has to be part of the die at the exit side blocking that area. But of course something has to hold that block in place, so the material being extruded would have to go "around" one or more support type structures and then rejoin on the other side. Does the immense pressure involved just force the material to bond on the exit side of the support as if there is no seam as it travels through the die? I'm not sure if I can explain it well either. An extrusion die generally consists of a bunch of plates stacked on top of each other, going from a big hole on one side where the plastic goes in, to the final shape on the other. One of the plates in the middle of the stack would be called a spider plate. In the center of the plate we cut a pocket that you press fit a mandrel into. This mandrel is the same size as the inside of the finished hollow piece. Around the pocket that the mandrel is pressed into are pockets, so that the mandrel is really only being held in by little legs. Looking at it straight on it looks like the mandrel is the middle of a spider and the little legs holding the mandrel pocket there are the spider legs. So yea you were pretty much right, after plastic or whatever flows through those pockets, it comes back together around the mandrel. There's plenty of time and it's more than hot enough that it's seamless by the time it reaches the exit of the die. I have no idea if this makes any sense to you.
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Oct 7, 2014 20:11
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Makes perfect sense, thanks. It was just the disappearance of the seam that was confounding me, but then, I don't work with metal/plastic much yet, and wood doesn't exactly do that sort of thing.  ... OR DOES IT https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0k04hjdYuQ
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Oct 7, 2014 20:14
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WTF? That... that's not like, someone copying Look Around You style parody, is it?
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Oct 8, 2014 01:16
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I know, right? That one dude.
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Oct 8, 2014 01:22
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A Proper Uppercut posted:Just wanted to share this extrusion die component I've been working on for a couple days. It was probably one of the most complicated wire jobs I've done in my 13 years here, though it may look deceptively simple. Thought it looked pretty neat! That's a hell of a piece. I'd love to know what it looks like on the inside. Could you explain why it looks like this? It looks like 4 strips go in and one "bracket" comes out. Or is that backwards? Bad Munki posted:That reminds me, question about extrusions: I look at, say, aluminum extrusions, and sometimes they'll be hollow. How the heck does the extrusion work in that case? Like, in order for there to be a hollow space in the extrusion, there has to be part of the die at the exit side blocking that area. But of course something has to hold that block in place, so the material being extruded would have to go "around" one or more support type structures and then rejoin on the other side. Does the immense pressure involved just force the material to bond on the exit side of the support as if there is no seam as it travels through the die? For metals it's something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsdZ6cj3y_g
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Oct 8, 2014 02:48
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On the subject of CNC operations since there seems to be some knowledgeable people. How in the hell do I beat G02/G03 into submission, holy hell. I can make circles all day long, but I'm trying to make a shape that is roughly 320~ degrees of a circle, with the start point being X4, Y5.65 and the end point being X4, Y5.45. The arc would be to the left of the points, so I've been using G03 for it, but for the life of my, I can't make any combination that makes sense in my head between I and J statements to make it work. The back side of the arc would be 2 inches from the front side, so X2, and the center would be Y5.5. So it all makes sense, the source I'm working off of is this:  Outside circle, and the diagonals for the mountain are just fine. I'm not trying to get the center of the crescent moon (yet) but I am trying to get the outline shape. For reference, I was working off a 7x7x1 block and the circle is 6.75" diameter. Once I get all that figured out, I get to figure out how to write a program to mill out the negative, and leave the body of the crescent, the lines of the mountain and a lip on the circle raise and the rest milled down. 
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Oct 8, 2014 04:52
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Kasan posted:On the subject of CNC operations since there seems to be some knowledgeable people. How in the hell do I beat G02/G03 into submission, holy hell. I can make circles all day long, but I'm trying to make a shape that is roughly 320~ degrees of a circle, with the start point being X4, Y5.65 and the end point being X4, Y5.45. The arc would be to the left of the points, so I've been using G03 for it, but for the life of my, I can't make any combination that makes sense in my head between I and J statements to make it work. I'd recommend CAM. There's cheap CAM programs out there that can handle simple stuff like this pretty easily, and if you're doing this for-profit, it's not worth your time (if it's for fun or learning, carry on!) I've played a little with VCarve Pro, and it can do this, no issues, although it's limiting in some respects. What's the error? You want a clockwise arc, so G03. Starting at X4. Y5.625, G03 X4. Y5.45 I2. J5.5 F should work. You could also do G03 X4. Y5.45 R-2. (you can calculate R better, I was being lazy. Also, the center point you provided is not centered between your start and finish in Y. Is that alright?) I don't write movement code much, so it may be incorrect. Make sure you're in G17, too. Haas mills auto select it, but yours might not (Haas lathes, however, do not, they start in G18. That took a day and a half to diagnose when using live tooling. Fun times.) A Proper Uppercut posted:Just wanted to share this extrusion die component I've been working on for a couple days. It was probably one of the most complicated wire jobs I've done in my 13 years here, though it may look deceptively simple. Thought it looked pretty neat! That's awesome. Did you drill four separate angled pilot holes to start the wire in each pocket?
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Oct 8, 2014 05:29
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Diggus Bickus posted:That's a hell of a piece. I'd love to know what it looks like on the inside. Well, we're a job shop, so most of the time I don't actually see what the end product does. The company it's for makes microwave absorbers and some other weird stuff, so I can only speculate they're extruding some weird material. I've seen extrusion dies like this in the past with the multiple pockets going into one when they're actually running different colors/types of plastic but want to combine them on the final part somehow. I would guess it's either that or it's just the way their extruder is set up, with 4 lines that would line up to the back of the die. Kasan posted:CAM Stuff Yea, like Karia said, I would recommend some kind of CAM program too. I have no problem writing a lot of programs at the machine, but when I start getting into stuff a little more complicated where I need to trig out the endpoints of intersecting radii and poo poo, I just use our CAM system, it's not worth the trouble trying to figure it out. Karia posted:That's awesome. Did you drill four separate angled pilot holes to start the wire in each pocket? Yup, though I used our hole popper. The start holes were only .025" in diameter. No fancy 4 axis hole poppers either, just a sine vise and some math. Bleh.
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Oct 8, 2014 12:11
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Karia posted:Nice! They've served us well: trained over 4000 undergrads and a couple hundred professional machine operators, made untold numbers of research and class projects, and broken more tools than you can shake a stick at. I can't say we've run them hard by industry standards, but we've got more than our fair share of crashes. They're really starting to show their age. We had three service calls over the summer to get the tool changer on #2 working (turned out the voltage on the IO board was varying by about 20 volts, and the limit switches were screwed), #3 needed a replacement limit switch for the X axis, and #1 is down because somebody punched a hole in the tool probe, coolant got in, and now it doesn't stop when tools touch it. Then there was the time that someone had a tool that was too long in the umbrella and cracked the tool changer in half... Fun times. I believe the plan is to replace them next summer with either super minimills or VF1's. No, I don't recall an MDC. There was one other thing they were building, it was a one-off in the lab, a 5-axis router (a CNC mill for cutting wood). Did that ever make it to market? As for the lever, no, that's to lean the stack in and out of the machine. It fits into a roller track on the side of the tube, and the whole tube assemble pivots on the pillow blocks attached to the base. The working part is the big cylinder on the bottom, that's a home made pneumatic that pushes with something like 4000 Lbs of force... I don't recall exactly how much, and the shop air was always wicked strong. You stack up the washers onto the bar, stick it in the tube, lean it, and throw the pneumatic switch, which pushes the bottom of the bar up, compressing the stack against the top plate. Then you stick the captivator on the bar, that's what the bevels in the top are for. Then you release the pressure, and lean the stack back out with the lever.
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Oct 8, 2014 13:28
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Squashy Nipples posted:No, I don't recall an MDC. There was one other thing they were building, it was a one-off in the lab, a 5-axis router (a CNC mill for cutting wood). Did that ever make it to market? There's the VB-1. 15k HSK A-63 spindle, 5 axis bridge mill. That sound right? Released in 1998, according to this article, but they've been off the market as long as I can remember. We actually have a banner advertising them in the lab, I'd always assumed it was a weird one off or something that never went to market like the VTC. Other than that, they still have the GR gantry routers, but those are just 3 axis. That makes a lot more sense, I was assuming there had to be some sort of cam in there to get the force to compress it. Thanks for explaining. Karia fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Oct 9, 2014 |
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Oct 9, 2014 05:40
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One of my teeny tiny jeweller's torch tips got clogged with something, flux probably. How can I unclog it short of rooting around in there with a pin or something else thatll probably damage it? e: Also, Brek, I don't think I'm gonna be able to make tonight's class; it's next week's that's cancelled, right?
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Oct 15, 2014 17:01
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Ambrose Burnside posted:One of my teeny tiny jeweller's torch tips got clogged with something, flux probably. How can I unclog it short of rooting around in there with a pin or something else thatll probably damage it? Take it off and put it in a solvent. Start with the weakest one that won't damage it, probably isopropyl alcohol. Not sure what the tip is made of or coated with so I can't say for sure what will be the safest.
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Oct 15, 2014 17:17
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It's copper with a steel ferrule, so yeah, I'll try some stuff that won't hurt either.
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Oct 15, 2014 19:46
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I'm looking at casting an aluminum bracket (about 7 cubic inches of aluminum)and I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with sand casting aluminum in a back yard environment. I do have access to a 3D printer, so I can do lost wax casting by melting out the abs.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:10
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Ambrose Burnside posted:One of my teeny tiny jeweller's torch tips got clogged with something, flux probably. How can I unclog it short of rooting around in there with a pin or something else thatll probably damage it? I soak my torches in phosphoric and then clean with soap and water and then use a pipe cleaner with both standard, and hard plastic bristles. I must have left last week before he told us of a cancelled class. Better not be this week. The 1.25 hour drive each way is pretty much the worst thing ever.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:19
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Brekelefuw posted:I soak my torches in phosphoric and then clean with soap and water and then use a pipe cleaner with both standard, and hard plastic bristles. I'm reasonably sure it is next week and not this, cause I remember him saying we were on for the week of Thanksgiving, but, you know, I'm not 100% if I'm asking sooooooo
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Oct 15, 2014 22:17
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Random Number posted:I'm looking at casting an aluminum bracket (about 7 cubic inches of aluminum)and I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with sand casting aluminum in a back yard environment. I do have access to a 3D printer, so I can do lost wax casting by melting out the abs. Not personal experience so ~maybe don't take my word for it~ but I've heard very good things about lost-foam casting for this sort of application. If your tolerances aren't too tight and the bracket isn't very detailed it'd be easy to hot-glue some styrofoam sheet together and away you go, no burnout step required. A lot cheaper than sacrificing a whole bunch of printer filament, too.
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Oct 16, 2014 02:59
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Ambrose Burnside posted:Not personal experience so ~maybe don't take my word for it~ but I've heard very good things about lost-foam casting for this sort of application. If your tolerances aren't too tight and the bracket isn't very detailed it'd be easy to hot-glue some styrofoam sheet together and away you go, no burnout step required. A lot cheaper than sacrificing a whole bunch of printer filament, too. The tolerances are loose, and the part is easily machinable, but it's for a class project so I want to have something fairly high quality. I also have no experience casting or making styrofoam positives. Samuel L. Hacksaw fucked around with this message at 03:36 on Oct 16, 2014 |
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Oct 16, 2014 03:33
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Random Number posted:I'm looking at casting an aluminum bracket (about 7 cubic inches of aluminum)and I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with sand casting aluminum in a back yard environment. I do have access to a 3D printer, so I can do lost wax casting by melting out the abs. Just an FYI, expect low strength, crappy aluminum as basically all of the things that weaken aluminum (improper heat treatment, Iron intermetallics/contamination, etc.) are present in abundance.
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Oct 16, 2014 05:39
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CarForumPoster posted:Just an FYI, expect low strength, crappy aluminum as basically all of the things that weaken aluminum (improper heat treatment, Iron intermetallics/contamination, etc.) are present in abundance. Hmm, maybe I'll only make a casting as an example of the mass produced bracket and still machine the prototype bracket. I was hoping to kill two birds with one stone, but it seems like it might not be feasible if I can't put 6061 alloy in, and get 6061 alloy out.
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Oct 16, 2014 12:05
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This may seem like a really simple question that I could just google, but I'm looking for some specifics. Particular products, brands, etc. I'm just trying to clean up some angle iron before I paint it, and I want to get the best, most durable finish possible. I got some spray paint that is supposed to be some sort of high-durability enamel, as well as a matching primer, but I'm wondering about surface prep. I've read something like wire brush, degreasing cleaner, denatured alcohol, then paint? If that's all there is to it, what am I looking for in a "degreasing cleaner," specifically?
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Oct 16, 2014 19:34
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I believe someone in this thread cleaned up an old lathe with "naval jelly" before priming and painting it.
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Oct 16, 2014 21:42
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Naval jelly is a rust treatment - specifically, it dissolves it. Not strictly necessary for painting.
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Oct 16, 2014 23:51
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I've never been able to use naval jelly. The last thing I tried to naval jelly turned white. And still feels rusty
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Oct 17, 2014 01:11
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Bad Munki posted:This may seem like a really simple question that I could just google, but I'm looking for some specifics. Particular products, brands, etc. I'm just trying to clean up some angle iron before I paint it, and I want to get the best, most durable finish possible. I got some spray paint that is supposed to be some sort of high-durability enamel, as well as a matching primer, but I'm wondering about surface prep. I've read something like wire brush, degreasing cleaner, denatured alcohol, then paint? If that's all there is to it, what am I looking for in a "degreasing cleaner," specifically? To remove paint or rust, I use a non-woven wire wheel on an angle grinder (http://www.lehighvalleyabrasives.com/servlet/the-4/4-dsh-1-fdsh-2%22-Non-Woven-Clean/Detail). Follow that with a 120 grit flap disc if you don't want the mill-scale texture. There shouldn't be any grease left at this point but if there was I'd do a wipe down with diluted Simple Green and then clean that off with denatured alcohol. Prime, paint. Anyone know if what the difference between acetone and denatured alcohol is in the above process? I feel like I've seen acetone recommended but maybe that was in place of the degreaser?
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Oct 17, 2014 02:28
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Wandering Orange posted:To remove paint or rust, I use a non-woven wire wheel on an angle grinder (http://www.lehighvalleyabrasives.com/servlet/the-4/4-dsh-1-fdsh-2%22-Non-Woven-Clean/Detail). Follow that with a 120 grit flap disc if you don't want the mill-scale texture. There shouldn't be any grease left at this point but if there was I'd do a wipe down with diluted Simple Green and then clean that off with denatured alcohol. Prime, paint. Acetone and alcohol are both solvents. Either works for degreasing, although acetone is considerably stronger (and nastier.) I'm guessing the denatured alcohol in your procedure gets rid of any of the Simple Green solution that's left. Both acetone and alcohol are nice for final wipes because they evaporate quickly and don't have residue. Give it a few minutes to let everything evaporate before you paint, though, I've had issues with adhesives right after I wash things with alcohol.
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Oct 17, 2014 07:25
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Random Number posted:Hmm, maybe I'll only make a casting as an example of the mass produced bracket and still machine the prototype bracket. I was hoping to kill two birds with one stone, but it seems like it might not be feasible if I can't put 6061 alloy in, and get 6061 alloy out. Even if you had a crucible that wouldn't leak impurities and you cleaned off the slag on top, the difference between the 6061-O (as cast) that comes out and 6061-T5/6/65 (Solution heat treated, aged) that you buy is still massive. Same alloy: http://asm.matweb.com/search/SpecificMaterial.asp?bassnum=MA6061O http://asm.matweb.com/search/SpecificMaterial.asp?bassnum=MA6061t6 Cast alloys are usually considerably higher silicon than their wrought counterparts. You could probably get higher strength out of an as cast 356 alloy (think wheels, transmission housings) and it would cats better. You're still in the order of 1/4-1/3 the strength of a 6061-T6 Bar. 6061 is a really awesome alloy because its cheap, widely available, pretty high strength, easily machinable and anodizes pretty well. There's good reason its used for almost everything. CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Oct 18, 2014 |
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Oct 18, 2014 16:49
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CarForumPoster posted:Even if you had a crucible that wouldn't leak impurities and you cleaned off the slag on top, the difference between the 6061-O (as cast) that comes out and 6061-T5/6/65 (Solution heat treated, aged) that you buy is still massive. That's all true, it makes investment casting or die molding seem like a better process because of the lower silicon. Unfortunately I can't do that in the back yard so I'll just machine it I guess.
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Oct 18, 2014 20:32
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I've got a bunch of these little ingots I made, it's just 1" wide 1/8" thick welding steel cut into 1 3/8" lengths. I'm going to drill out the center and they'll act as washers in some unistrut. Should I treat them in any way? I just see they got overheated a bunch at each end because I was cutting them with a 10" cutoff wheel, as I didn't have a shear and wasn't going to hacksaw them apart. e: Ehh, nevermind I guess, the discoloration was superficial so probably didn't affect the composition much, and it's not like it's tempered or anything. They're spanning a gap like 1 1/4" across, I don't think they'll need super strength or anything. Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 19:32 on Oct 19, 2014 |
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Oct 19, 2014 18:41
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Paint or black oxide if you're worried about rust, otherwise probably not.
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Oct 19, 2014 19:33
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Bad Munki posted:I'm going to drill out the center and they'll act as washers in some unistrut. What kind of a "washer" is used to "span a gap"? Sorry if I'm being all engineery-pedantic, but that doesn't make any sense. Fully mild washers shouldn't be a problem, unless you need a hardened surface to protect the fastener.
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Oct 20, 2014 12:47
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Ehh, it's not so much a washer as a bracket then, I guess? Are you familiar with unistrut? This "washer" is going to go inside the channel on the open side, against the lip that folds in. A bolt will go through the washer from inside the unistrut, and then into a t-nut, which will sit inside some aluminum extrusion, thus securing the extrusion to the unistrut. Here are the finished pieces:  And assembled with the bolts and t-nuts:  And installed to anchor the extrusion to the unistrut:  e: I decided to paint them just to prevent them from rusting in whatever humidity they may encounter. I had the primer/paint for some other bare metal anyhow, and it couldn't hurt. Anyhow, everything came out great, they look pretty good. Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Oct 20, 2014 |
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Oct 20, 2014 15:22
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I don't think the temper/heat treatment matters at all for your application, so I think you're fine. But for future reference, the color banding on a piece of steel you have heated is not "superficial", it's an oxidation layer with colors that can give you information about how hot the metal got. Which is critically important when you are dealing with carbon steel or any other alloy that has been or can be heat treated to affect hardness/ductility. For example, people in AI sometimes suggest using a torch to heat up bolts/car components that have become seized. That's fine if you're going to throw away all the parts you heated, or if you're certain your parts are mild steel or cast iron. But when they're (for example) hardened bolts, or structural members of the vehicle, they may have been heat treated to get a specific temper and you are potentially annealing them if you get them above around 400oF or so. And then cooling at an uncontrolled/unknown rate, which potentially could temper them (especially if it's an "air-hardening" alloy). In your case, assuming your steel pieces were mild steel, you did nothing to them and you're fine. If they were hardened ordinary carbon steel:  Each color band corresponds to a particular temperature the metal was heated to. If it was previously quenched to get it glass-hard, this temperature represents the temper to which it has been drawn down from that state of maximum hardness and brittleness. Note that at around 1000 degrees, the colors represent what color the metal is glowing, while below that, it's the color of oxidation layer on the surface.
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Oct 20, 2014 23:17
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Leperflesh posted:In your case, assuming your steel pieces were mild steel, you did nothing to them and you're fine. They're literally from a bar of welding steel I bought at the hardware store. The label said just that: "WELDING STEEL" I'd heard of the problems with overheating certain types of steel which is why I was concerned in the first place, but then I realized that yeah, this was just poo poo steel anyhow (I mean, relative to some of the types of steel out there, anyhow) and even so, in this application, it's not like I need some super strong super resistant special whoop-dee-doo steel alloy or anything, it's not even going to be taking that much of a load, just a 1/4-20 bolt pulling against a little bit of aluminum. Thanks for all the info everyone! I really want to get more into metal-based fabrication of parts, I'm always SO satisfied by what I do make out of metal, but it's just not plausible right now since my shop is absolutely full to the brim and I can't go mixing metal and wood environments. Next place, always the next place. 
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Oct 21, 2014 01:33
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