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Ebola is in all of Sierra Leone now  http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/ebola-safe-district-sierra-leone-26241774 quote:The deadly Ebola virus has infected two people in what was the last untouched district in Sierra Leone, the government said Thursday, a setback in efforts to stop the spread of the disease in one of the hardest-hit countries.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:33
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Pohl posted:That quote sounds bad, but it really isn't. His job is to communicate the truth, which is what he is doing. People that get all loving worked up about the fact that it sounds inconsistent are the retards, not him. His job is to communicate matters of infectious disease to the media for dissemination to the public. If he can't do that without nuance or ambiguity that the media falters on, that's on him. Not sure how on the one hand we can all pretty much agree that clear, concise communication is necessary to prepare for this, and then when someone suggests an important figure isn't doing the best job they're "loving worked up" and a "retard".
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Oct 16, 2014 19:37
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Helicity posted:His job is to communicate matters of infectious disease to the media for dissemination to the public. If he can't do that without nuance or ambiguity that the media falters on, that's on him. Not sure how on the one hand we can all pretty much agree that clear, concise communication is necessary to prepare for this, and then when someone suggests an important figure isn't doing the best job they're "loving worked up" and a "retard". Speaking as a student in a well-ranked health comm program, the standard you are attempting to hold him to is literally impossible.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:45
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Discendo Vox posted:Speaking as a student in a well-ranked health comm program, the standard you are attempting to hold him to is literally impossible. No it isn't. This is a challenge for any specialist, giving too much detail simply loses your audience. You have to be able to explain it to your grandmother, or however that quote goes. In my opinion the CDC should be taking a more active leadership role. I don't mean commandeering hospitals, just giving more clear guidance. Giving everyone the information and letting them figure out the strategy is not the way. Why can't he say "if you've potentially been exposed, we're going to call you and advise you" is that not what they'll do? So if we don't call you, don't worry. Also, expressing more "we should do something in Africa" would be nice, but I'm sure there are ~political reasons~ they can't do that.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:50
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Epitope posted:Not disagreeing with you necessarily, but is this what happened when the nurse called before getting on the plane? They gave her "the truth" but no clear direction, so she got on anyway? It's important to note that clear direction from the CDC does exist. Their own guidelines are very simple: http://www.cdc.gov/vhf/ebola/hcp/monitoring-and-movement-of-persons-with-exposure.html The nurse shouldn't have been on the airplane. Whoever was answering the phones at the CDC hosed up. It seems the story of Ebola in Texas is a set of minor fuckups coming together to a major one. ( and some major fuckups along the way too, I guess.)
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Oct 16, 2014 19:52
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Epitope posted:No it isn't. This is a challenge for any specialist, giving too much detail simply loses your audience. You have to be able to explain it to your grandmother, or however that quote goes. You packed a lot of information and opinion into a tiny post. Can you expand on any or all of it?
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Oct 16, 2014 19:54
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Johnny Cache Hit posted:It's important to note that clear direction from the CDC does exist. Their own guidelines are very simple: Has it been corroborated that someone from the CDC actually told her it was OK to fly? I don't remember seeing that confirmed anywhere. All of the articles just state what Vinson said, nothing from the CDC.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:56
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Kommienzuspadt posted:FYI, the technique they use is RT-PCR, not PCR. PCR would create DNA. Small nit to pick but thought you might appreciate knowing it. But RT-PCR also makes DNA! It stands for reverse transcription PCR, and uses an RNA template to create cDNA using a viral reverse transcriptase.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:58
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Epitope posted:No it isn't. This is a challenge for any specialist, giving too much detail simply loses your audience. You have to be able to explain it to your grandmother, or however that quote goes. In a statement, Epitope said that the CDC should lead, but not at any hospitals. He said that they should give more clear guidance, because telling people what to do is wrong.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:59
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^^ touche mon amiPohl posted:You packed a lot of information and opinion into a tiny post. Can you expand on any or all of it? On the quote we're talking about- it requires the reader to infer that sitting quietly next to an ebola case won't infect you, but there is a danger of them going into a coughing fit or something and infecting you. That's probably super accurate, but is that extra accuracy worth the ambiguity? On a leadership role, I hear that there are nurses caring for the first case diagnosed in the country, and they can't get any guidance. They are told to call the infectious disease guy, but they don't know either. Why wasn't CDC there to offer the guidance they were looking for? Then the infected nurse looking for guidance and getting lead astray, but I suppose that was just a mistake. On Africa, I don't know enought to say intelligent things, so probably shouldn't try.
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Oct 16, 2014 19:59
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Doctor Butts posted:Has it been corroborated that someone from the CDC actually told her it was OK to fly? I don't remember seeing that confirmed anywhere. All of the articles just state what Vinson said, nothing from the CDC. Haha just 10 minutes ago this: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ebola-virus-outbreak/ebola-nurse-amber-vinson-checked-cdc-flight-source-n226961 quote:The second Ebola-infected nurse from a Dallas hospital contacted Centers for Disease Control and Prevention officials on Monday to check if she could get on a plane with an elevated temperature, and was not barred from taking the flight, NBC News has learned. But the CDCs own guidelines - the ones I linked to - are clear that people with low risk exposures who have zero symptoms can not fly. So the answer is, like everything else, "who the gently caress knows, we seem to be making this poo poo up along as we go!" 
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Oct 16, 2014 20:02
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Epitope posted:No it isn't. This is a challenge for any specialist, giving too much detail simply loses your audience. You have to be able to explain it to your grandmother, or however that quote goes. I'm familiar with the constraints and policies involved in government communication to the lay public. Very few of them operate in the same way when the communication is mediated by media outlets. You can't meaningfully hold the speaker tot he same standard, especially when (as this thread has demonstrated) parts of the statement are taken out of context.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:04
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I still wouldn't have let her on the plane if I was the CDC, uncertain risk or not.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:06
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Johnny Cache Hit posted:Haha just 10 minutes ago this: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ebola-virus-outbreak/ebola-nurse-amber-vinson-checked-cdc-flight-source-n226961 The core issue: CDC's guidelines are based off limited data, when much more has been garnered from the field. They need to update their guidelines to reflect this fact.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:06
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Doctor Butts posted:I still wouldn't have let her on the plane if I was the CDC, uncertain risk or not. The CDC wouldn't have let her on the plane, either. Someone hosed up. Edited for clarity. Pohl fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Oct 16, 2014 |
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Oct 16, 2014 20:07
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Maybe I should share why this is particularly interesting to me right now. I'm currently designing an activity module for high school students to explore biomedical careers. It's centering on a disease outbreak, and the public health response. I want the students to think about how to respond to different scenarios, and communication to the public is a big part of that. I suppose I'm coming at it from an idealized point of view, where directing the response works well if you just figure it out well enough. The real world is a lot less forgiving than a classroom exercise, so I might be expecting things to be possible that are not. e- but this, this is just D- work. And makes me think it's not me expecting the impossible, just the organization not doing all it could. Johnny Cache Hit posted:Haha just 10 minutes ago this: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ebola-virus-outbreak/ebola-nurse-amber-vinson-checked-cdc-flight-source-n226961 Epitope fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Oct 16, 2014 |
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Oct 16, 2014 20:10
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Pohl posted:The CDC wouldn't let her on the plane. Someone hosed up. If I had to guess it would be the person in a cubicle who didn't maybe didn't receive the proper context for the nurse's inquiry or was given poorly-written information on travel advisories and told to just roll with it for now and escalate to a sup if they aren't sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it was working as intended and the CDC has become a shoestring mickey mouse operation in the past decade or so.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:15
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Serious question, and I can't seem to find an answer amid all the hysterical articles. Are there any theories as to why this outbreak is so huge compared to past ones? In layman's terms?
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Oct 16, 2014 20:16
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smoobles posted:Serious question, and I can't seem to find an answer amid all the hysterical articles. Are there any theories as to why this outbreak is so huge compared to past ones? In layman's terms? Compared with previous outbreaks, there's been an increase in the general population, population density, and transportation. This meant that the infection actually made it to urban centers.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:18
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Epitope posted:Maybe I should share why this is particularly interesting to me right now. I'm currently designing an activity module for high school students to explore biomedical careers. It's centering on a disease outbreak, and the public health response. I want the students to think about how to respond to different scenarios, and communication to the public is a big part of that. I suppose I'm coming at it from an idealized point of view, where directing the response works well if you just figure it out well enough. The real world is a lot less forgiving than a classroom exercise, so I might be expecting things to be possible that are not. This is totally an institutional failure, so you can't blame single individuals for that failure. As weird as it sounds, not even the guy in charge of the CDC. His main job is to stop the spread of disease, not be a good press agent. Teach your students to think in big dynamics, not on an individual level. Is he adapting to the situation and is he capable? I think he is. He is working within his resources and he seems to know his poo poo. If he says things to the press that can be taken out of context, that is only because he is providing a reasonable amount of information. He could be careful with his words, but why should he need to be. Nothing he said was untrue.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:20
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Captain Beans posted:Is donating to MSF still the recommended course of action for someone with no medical training who wants to help? I'd say yes, but i'm biased because I think they are hella awesome. Also, they've been there from the start.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:20
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-Dethstryk- posted:Seeing reports now that a hospital here in Arkansas (in Clinton) just went into lockdown for suspected ebola symptoms. Which, with how stupid some people here have been about it, I'm not really going to believe there is anything real yet. Arkansas Department of Health already cleared the patient. Some idiot probably had the shits or something.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:20
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FAUXTON posted:If I had to guess it would be the person in a cubicle who didn't maybe didn't receive the proper context for the nurse's inquiry or was given poorly-written information on travel advisories and told to just roll with it for now and escalate to a sup if they aren't sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it was working as intended and the CDC has become a shoestring mickey mouse operation in the past decade or so. One of my biggest concerns during the budget cuts was that the CDC would be shoestringed. loving christ on a stick.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:21
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FAUXTON posted:If I had to guess it would be the person in a cubicle who didn't maybe didn't receive the proper context for the nurse's inquiry or was given poorly-written information on travel advisories and told to just roll with it for now and escalate to a sup if they aren't sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it was working as intended and the CDC has become a shoestring mickey mouse operation in the past decade or so. I assume it was a contractor making minimum wage in a call center going off a prepared list.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:23
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Ebola Roulette posted:Ebola is in all of Sierra Leone now You know, at this rate I don't think we're going to have this contained in the next 44 days.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:24
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Nemo2342 posted:You know, at this rate I don't think we're going to have this contained in the next 44 days. Unless there is some sort of aid we don't know about, Africa is hosed. By aid I mean man power. Money means jack poo poo unless work is actually happening.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:26
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Pohl posted:One of my biggest concerns during the budget cuts was that the CDC would be shoestringed. loving christ on a stick. From what I've heard, CDC wasn't spared from sequestration either.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:27
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My Imaginary GF posted:From what I've heard, CDC wasn't spared from sequestration either. here you go.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:32
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Sequestration was unforgiving to almost every department of the government, especially in the way it slashed budgets without discretion. This is all a learning process for everyone involved, and having to rapidly change guidelines is always going to be difficult for a large organization like the CDC. I believe that they are trying their best to make the necessary changes, and it is not a wise idea to take statements by Dr. Frieden out of context. His main job is to manage the organization, and while it is important for him to communicate certain ideas to the public, it is not his primary function. Take any quotes cited by the press with a large grain of salt as the general public was probably not the intended audience.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:35
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 You can't cut $13 Million from Emerging and Zoonotic Infectious Diseases! YOU'LL REGRET IT!!!
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Oct 16, 2014 20:36
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-29628054 This is interesting reading about what people do if they actually survive Ebola. Helping HCWs with their PPE seems like a very effective idea to me.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:42
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My Imaginary GF posted:
That $98 million from public health preparedness and response is possibly the bigger issue.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:43
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 Texas A&M's school of veterinary medicine is now taking control over Eboladog care. This seems like a bit of overkill.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:50
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Ghost of Reagan Past posted:If it's malaria just grab a gin and tonic. This doesn't work. I drank gin and tonics constantly, and I definitely got malaria.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:54
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Three Olives posted:
Probably overkill. But A&M is definitely very good at this sort of thing. Also, they're probably taking this opportunity to collect and analyze samples.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:56
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Anyone have bulletpoints from today's COCA call?
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Oct 16, 2014 20:57
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Pohl posted:I actually considered Texas for a long time because of cost, but then I realized, I loving hate Repulicans. I loving hate you. I'm a San Diegan. Born there and lived most of my wife there; however, my wife talked me into moving to Indiana because it's cheaper. I've been here since mid-August and I loving hate it here. With every fiber of my being, I hate it.
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Oct 16, 2014 20:57
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ZombieLenin posted:I loving hate you. I'm a San Diegan. Born there and lived most of my wife there; however, my wife talked me into moving to Indiana because it's cheaper. I've been here since mid-August and I loving hate it here. With every fiber of my being, I hate it. I'm going to swim in a sea of your tears. And watch the sun set on the ocean. And just be me. Sorry that you moved to a lovely state, you should have divorced your wife. That is loving brutal. (I know this because I was born and live in Idaho). Edit: seriously, get the gently caress out of the red state. Life is way too short to live like that. It took me 16 years working to save enough money to get out of Idaho, but I'm loving out of here. Pohl fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Oct 16, 2014 |
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Oct 16, 2014 21:00
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It really is a shame Ebola started in Africa and not in America if there's any country and people that could use a culling it's the white devils of the USA.
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Oct 16, 2014 21:02
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England Sucks posted:It really is a shame Ebola started in Africa and not in America if there's any country and people that could use a culling it's the white devils of the USA. This, except unironically. Also, if it started in the south, that's be great.
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Oct 16, 2014 21:03
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