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BrianWilly posted:And their Amazons aren't the mythological Amazons but people will line up for blocks defend Azzarello's vilification of them based on how true he's being to mythology*. I think you're missing the fores for the trees by focusing too much on Zeus role on the story (when he's pretty much a non entity and the few mentions we've had of him paint him like a useless bum). The story has given a lot of attention at Hera's development as character where she comes off like being more misguided than vindictive. And I'm not too sure on Azzarello writing misoginy on the story when the First Born essentially represents everything wrong with men and is the ultimate villian of the story.
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Oct 14, 2014 08:14
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In a twist, Zeus was the baby the whole time.
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Oct 14, 2014 08:40
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Teenage Fansub posted:In a twist, Zeus was the baby the whole time. Could be possible, I don't think is mere coincidence that the three characters have names that start with Z (Zeus, Zola, Zeke) By the way, anyone knows when the January solicits will be released?
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Oct 14, 2014 08:48
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BrianWilly posted:If there are no awful acts from Zeus for Diana to react to then I don't want to hear another word about how great Azzarello is at depicting mythology. Hey, look, I actually have no problem with a "vanilla" depiction of Zeus that downplays his rapey, murdery ways, in order to make him palatable for a more palatable story. That's how most retellings of myths do it, after all. But if you're going to play it like that then you don't get to have it both ways. You don't get to say "Ah, see, my Hera is the vindictive bitch shrew from the tales and the Amazons are man-hating barbarians as they're meant to be, but hell if I'm gonna show Zeus loving little boys in the guise of an eagle! That'd be wrong!" There are no awful acts from Zeus for Diana to react to because there are no acts from Zeus for anyone to react to at all. The entire point of the first part of the story is that Zeus is missing and Olympus needs someone on the throne. The only mentions about Zeus are Hippolyta and Zola both recounting how he was a lovely dude for knocking them both up and then leaving them, and Hera calling him a cheating prick. It's established that he's an rear end in a top hat but that really doesn't matter because Zeus is honestly almost a nonentity in the story and may very well be dead. The only thing he's (not) there for is to establish that he does have a lot of illegitimate kids that pop up later in the story and to kickstart the plot by impregnating Zola. I have to agree with D_T* in that by focusing on Zeus and the initial poor depiction of the Amazons and the goddesses, you're totally ignoring that the comic makes no bones about the fact that almost all the other male gods are total assholes if not outright villains, right down to the main villain of the whole run being a hyper-macho spawn of Zeus. Additionally, the story's not complete either. Both Hera and Artemis have turned into allies and the Amazons are (going to be) undergoing social change (after they get done fighting). *(I realize that saying this may immediately discredit my argument but whatever)
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Oct 14, 2014 09:26
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quote:"Ah, see, my Hera is the vindictive bitch shrew from the tales and the Amazons are man-hating barbarians as they're meant to be, but hell if I'm gonna show Zeus loving little boys in the guise of an eagle! That'd be wrong!" Absolutely 100% yes.
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Oct 14, 2014 13:26
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I've enjoyed Azeraello's run overall, as it is a decent little horror story when divorced from Wonder Woman's past comics, but BrianWilly's criticisms are completely valid. Even ignoring the concerning feminist implications, many of Azerello's retcons also harm the narrative itself. Zeus's absence from the story seems more like a plot hole than one of the story's strengths, considering his actions did kick off the narrative. With the story ending soon, I doubt his responsibility or lack of will be adequately addressed, if at all. Likewise, having the adult princess, ambassador, and champion of the Amazons be completely ignorant of her culture's methods of reproduction paints Diana in a terrible light for someone even the story claims to be a force for progress.
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Oct 14, 2014 14:01
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glitchwraith posted:I've enjoyed Azeraello's run overall, as it is a decent little horror story when divorced from Wonder Woman's past comics, but BrianWilly's criticisms are completely valid. Even ignoring the concerning feminist implications, many of Azerello's retcons also harm the narrative itself. Zeus's absence from the story seems more like a plot hole than one of the story's strengths, considering his actions did kick off the narrative. With the story ending soon, I doubt his responsibility or lack of will be adequately addressed, if at all. Likewise, having the adult princess, ambassador, and champion of the Amazons be completely ignorant of her culture's methods of reproduction paints Diana in a terrible light for someone even the story claims to be a force for progress. Agreed entirely. I think it's fair to enjoy the hell out of something and still find facets of it very uncomfortable.
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Oct 14, 2014 14:15
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Weird question: What superheroes, if any, explicitly have the ability to resurrect others? Or supervillains, even. I know White Lanterns can restore the dead to life. And that at least at one point magicians of some sort revived Raven to try and destroy the world or something? What powers, in general, can revive the dead?
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Oct 15, 2014 20:36
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KittyEmpress posted:Weird question: What superheroes, if any, explicitly have the ability to resurrect others? Or supervillains, even. Actually, Kyle can't brought back people to life. He can heal anything but once they die, he can't do anything. And so far I think that Lazarus Pit are the only constant source of resurrection on DC.
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Oct 15, 2014 20:48
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A black lantern ring can kind of revive the dead I think.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:06
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KittyEmpress posted:Weird question: What superheroes, if any, explicitly have the ability to resurrect others? Or supervillains, even.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:10
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redbackground posted:I can't think of anyone who can just make that happen when they want. I'm sure heavy magic users could probably do it if they really needed to, but more than likely at great personal cost. Marvel has/had Elixir, but I don't know if his powers went quite that far. The Spectre can, that's how Ollie came back after being blown up to literal bits. Lazurus pits can restore but according to Batman and ............ only one can bring the dead back to life without some kind of monkey paw consequence.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:31
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redbackground posted:I can't think of anyone who can just make that happen when they want. I'm sure heavy magic users could probably do it if they really needed to, but more than likely at great personal cost. Marvel has/had Elixir, but I don't know if his powers went quite that far. Elixir's power has to be consciously used and they explained that he'd pass out or die from exhaustion before he could bring anybody back from dead dead.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:33
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Didn't he and Wither interrogate/torture someone in House of M by killing him and bringing him back over and over? And in DC, maybe Anton Arcane? Pretty sure it would just end up in zombies, though.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:38
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Dark_Tzitzimine posted:Actually, Kyle can't brought back people to life. He can heal anything but once they die, he can't do anything. Actually, in a fairly recent GL: New Guardians, Kyle brought a sentient planet back to life with the white ring. Then it turned out to be evil and he re-killed it.
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Oct 15, 2014 21:58
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Inkspot posted:And in DC, maybe Anton Arcane? Pretty sure it would just end up in zombies, though. Yeah, it is the same thing with the Black Lantern rings. Regarding the books of this week: Earth's end is really good and it seems we're close to lose Batdad Future's End is interesting but drat if isn't a drag to read through anything related to the Cadmus Island subplot. Batwoman is getting too weird for my tastes Amusingly (considering the previous posts) it seems Raven is able to revive people now, other than that, TT keeps being poo poo (Gangs inspired by the Titans, really?) New Guardians is bullshit, in general it seems that Godhand is focused to make anyone assholes, first the New Gods and now the Templar Guardians  Oh, and Kyle/Carol is a thing now.Justice League was cool although I can't made sense of Bruce plan and I can't help but wonder when Power Ring is gonna be left by another new toy like Simon. Batman Superman was entertaining but skippable. Trinity of Sin has potential but I hate that they killed Thirteen just to show how badass is this new baddie and I couldn't care less about Pandora, plus, the art was something poor.
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Oct 15, 2014 22:01
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Dark_Tzitzimine posted:(Gangs inspired by the Titans, really?) Gotham City Impostors sequel?
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Oct 15, 2014 22:05
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redbackground posted:Marvel has/had Elixir, but I don't know if his powers went quite that far. Layla Miller can resurrect people, too, but they come back without their soul.
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Oct 15, 2014 22:35
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This thread has been generally very down on the fact the New 52 gave the Phantom Stranger a definitive origin, but after thinking it over I really don't agree: he's been a much more interesting character as Judas Iscariot than he ever was as a mystery. I don't think there's anything wrong in pinning something like this down if it's pinned down well, and I think this is a case where it really has been.
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Oct 15, 2014 22:59
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Did today's Justice League start a new arc? The ad for it in the back of Trinity of Sin makes it sound like a new arc, but I saw that the Vol 6 trade collects #30-39 so I thought I'd have to wait until #40 to jump on with a new arc.
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Oct 16, 2014 00:32
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Dunbar posted:Did today's Justice League start a new arc? The ad for it in the back of Trinity of Sin makes it sound like a new arc, but I saw that the Vol 6 trade collects #30-39 so I thought I'd have to wait until #40 to jump on with a new arc.
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Oct 16, 2014 00:39
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Jiro posted:The Spectre can, that's how Ollie came back after being blown up to literal bits. That was Parallax. It was his last act before giving his life to reignite the sun or something, after which he became the Spectre.
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Oct 16, 2014 02:51
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Chaos Hippy posted:That was Parallax. It was his last act before giving his life to reignite the sun or something, after which he became the Spectre. I'm pretty sure the Spectre could too, if only to kill them again horribly for some crime.
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Oct 16, 2014 02:53
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Dr. Hurt posted:I'm pretty sure the Spectre could too, if only to kill them again horribly for some crime. Oh yeah it was Parallax wasn't it? But Spectre still can bring people back from the dead, if I am not mistaken again he did it during that whole mini of where it was revealed Vandal Savage was the biblical Cain. Also that Quagmire villaness from the Obsidian Age arc of JLA brought them back to life in order to kill them again. Does being able to spin the Earth backwards to reverse time count?
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Oct 16, 2014 03:17
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Jiro posted:Oh yeah it was Parallax wasn't it? But Spectre still can bring people back from the dead, if I am not mistaken again he did it during that whole mini of where it was revealed Vandal Savage was the biblical Cain. Also that Quagmire villaness from the Obsidian Age arc of JLA brought them back to life in order to kill them again. Does being able to spin the Earth backwards to reverse time count? I think in the Ostrander run the Spectre brings back Corrigan's girlfriend from the dead.
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Oct 16, 2014 03:24
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The Flash comic based on the TV show beats the poo poo out of the regular series.
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Oct 16, 2014 09:55
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Madkal posted:I think in the Ostrander run the Spectre brings back Corrigan's girlfriend from the dead. He definitely didn't. I don't remember if he tried and failed, but I do remember what he succeeded at: he hunted down her killer, kills him, then brings him back so that he can do it again, and again, and again. It only stops when demons from Hell show and go "Hey man, he's ours now. Quit biting our style."
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Oct 17, 2014 00:33
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HitTheTargets posted:He definitely didn't. I don't remember if he tried and failed, but I do remember what he succeeded at: he hunted down her killer, kills him, then brings him back so that he can do it again, and again, and again. It only stops when demons from Hell show and go "Hey man, he's ours now. Quit biting our style." I think he's talking about Corrigan's fiancee, when he first bound with the Spectre. She was caught in the crossfire while he was fighting the gangsters that had just murdered him. As the Spectre, he was able to grab her soul before it entered heaven and bring her back to life. Basically, if the soul was still in limbo, Spectre could bring the person back to life, no problem.
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Oct 17, 2014 22:59
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glitchwraith posted:I think he's talking about Corrigan's fiancee, when he first bound with the Spectre. She was caught in the crossfire while he was fighting the gangsters that had just murdered him. As the Spectre, he was able to grab her soul before it entered heaven and bring her back to life. Basically, if the soul was still in limbo, Spectre could bring the person back to life, no problem. Yep. That's the thing I was trying to remember.
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Oct 18, 2014 05:58
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New solicits are out: when did they bring back Manchester Black? And why is he a Teen Titan?
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Oct 20, 2014 22:44
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HitTheTargets posted:New solicits are out: when did they bring back Manchester Black? And why is he a Teen Titan? Since the relaunched #1. Not a Teen Titan. Soule is off Red Lanterns. The new writer is Landry Walker. Looks like he comes from doing young comics like "Brave and the Bold" and "Supergirl: Cosmic Adventures in the Eighth Grade" Soule's still on Swamp Thing, at least for January. Superman #38 solicit says new costume, but the cover doesn't show it. Fire and Ice are also coming into JLI3000 Catman has a golden cat mask: 
Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Oct 20, 2014 |
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Oct 20, 2014 22:51
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Teenage Fansub posted:Since the relaunched #1. Not a Teen Titan. Hey, I was wondering where Calvin Rose ended. RHATO was on the JL solicits and not on Batman's for some resaon.
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Oct 20, 2014 23:49
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A new Superman costume? Oh god, please don't bring back the red underpants!
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Oct 21, 2014 03:33
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The Goon posted:A new Superman costume? Oh god, please don't bring back the red underpants! Oh come on, it's Geoff Johns. You know it's going to be a massive cocktease and fakeout of the classic suit.
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Oct 21, 2014 03:38
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The Goon posted:A new Superman costume? Oh god, please do bring back the red underpants! I translated your post for those of us who arent living in Bizarro world
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Oct 21, 2014 03:40
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Come on new 52 electric blues!!
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Oct 21, 2014 04:12
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He'll have underpants made of mullet. Best. Ever.
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Oct 21, 2014 04:26
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Was Taters posted:He'll have underpants made of mullet. So Bayonetta, but male?
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Oct 21, 2014 04:35
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Doctor Spaceman posted:So Bayonetta, but male? No, the underpants are on the outside of his clothes. Clothes.
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Oct 21, 2014 04:51
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Doctor Spaceman posted:So Bayonetta, but male? Wicked weaves sound like a good Silver Age Superman superpower
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Oct 21, 2014 07:02
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