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verbal enema posted:Post a picture imo  (Crap resolution because I just worked a double shift)
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Nov 7, 2014 19:46
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They have completely broken the balancing system. I don't know what more to say about it. It wasn't just fluke last night.
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Nov 7, 2014 19:58
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Craptacular! posted:That's the kind of thing I put alongside Weird Physics, things that would be nice to have but aren't the most necessary. The most critical thing to me is no class personalisation. Every sniper hits equally hard, every HWGuy fires at the same rate, if one Engineer has a golden wrench then they all do, etc. I feel like this hasn't been pointed out nearly enough, there's something comical and quaint about this whole notion of seeing a game do something unfamiliar, rage-uninstalling, and still having the mistaken understanding of what even occurred long after the fact. Tollymain posted:I like to go engie on 2fort and try to sneak a full nest into the enemy sewer and hold onto my sandcastle until the tide washes it away I like to do the same once in a blue moon. Sometimes replacing "sewer" with "the enemy's intel room" depending on how bad they are. Reiley posted:Engineer is a dad-sized Scout and the shotgun is his scattergun. Always main your shotgun as an Engie, the buildings are just for added measure. I remember a year ago I spent an hour on a trade server as shotgun-only Engie just having duels with whoever wandered down to the combat area, and somehow managed to hold the pit against all comers for very long stretches of time. I feel like I achieved some kind of shotgun zen that I haven't quite found again.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:30
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IncendiaC posted:Honest question: what does Pyro even do without airblast (insert joke about how he still doesn't do anything with airblast) or unlockable melee weapons? Back in 2007 or so I remember watching a 'Pyro Guide' video that literally recommended Chaos Pyro as the optimal way to play the class. The Pyro was a training wheels class. He had low mobility but wasn't too slow, a really easy to use direct damage weapon, and when you figured out about the power of weapon switching to a shotgun (which had a slower reload and fire rate then the others originally), you could switch to soldier and automatically do a lot better. Pyro w/airblast just slows the game down now and other than a few niche situations any other class would be better. I wish they would make the airblast more skill based, and not allow it to be spammed so much. Maybe make the airblast cost more, but if you reflect a rocket you get the a half-refund, and if you hit the same character more than once, it costs double. Basically, poo poo or get off the pot. Because being repeatedly airblsts by a pyro isn't really that fun.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:43
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Midnight Raider posted:I feel like this hasn't been pointed out nearly enough, there's something comical and quaint about this whole notion of seeing a game do something unfamiliar, rage-uninstalling, and still having the mistaken understanding of what even occurred long after the fact. My favorite part about that comment was the read-between-the-lines interpretation that the guy wants TF2 to become Call of Duty. Instead of what it is, a silly team based shooter with hats and everyone laughing at the stupid stuff going on.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:47
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I want my video game to be fun to play, balanced and predictable. Almost every update since the original weapon side-grades have made that less and less true.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:53
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xzzy posted:My favorite part about that comment was the read-between-the-lines interpretation that the guy wants TF2 to become Call of Duty. Eh, stock-only TF2 is a pretty fun game. And I can appreciate the idea of instantaneous "see [class], know [abilities]". And he's far from the only one to be intimidated by the loving Huge Variety of wacky weapons in TF2 nowadays. We got to learn these items one by one as they were added. They have to encounter "if a scout's pistol is firing slightly slower, that means he has slightly more health but is weak to fire" at the same time as encountering every other item in the game. I personally prefer modern TF2, but I'd appreciate a simplified mode for some less-wacky-more-focused action on occasion, and I know such a thing would be much easier for a newbie to get into.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:53
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Powercrazy posted:Pyro w/airblast just slows the game down now and other than a few niche situations any other class would be better. I wish they would make the airblast more skill based, and not allow it to be spammed so much. Maybe make the airblast cost more, but if you reflect a rocket you get the a half-refund, and if you hit the same character more than once, it costs double. Basically, poo poo or get off the pot. Because being repeatedly airblsts by a pyro isn't really that fun. If they could find a way to hack it to reduce the variation introduced by latency that would be swell too. Like say the pyro could hold the mouse button and get one "guaranteed" reflect whenever an eligible projectile gets into range. Then it has a ~5 second cooldown before it can be used again. Obviously this idea has problems (it basically means all a pyro has to do against a soldier/medic combo is aim at the medic and hold a mouse button) but that's something I think could be a useful direction for the game to explore. I mean, we've all had games where it's impossible to reflect something at medium/close range just because the rocket blows up in your face before it's even being drawn on the screen. It raises the requirements for successful airblasts to literally reading the soldier's mind. Maybe that's fine, I'm sure some people enjoy it. I sure don't however, it makes the game feel way too random.
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Nov 7, 2014 20:57
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Comp tf2 restricts the weapons/classes you can use so it's more skill based and less of a guessing game.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:01
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Powercrazy posted:The Pyro was a training wheels class. He had low mobility but wasn't too slow, a really easy to use direct damage weapon, and when you figured out about the power of weapon switching to a shotgun (which had a slower reload and fire rate then the others originally), you could switch to soldier and automatically do a lot better. Eh, the Pyro is in a good balance place right now for pub play. The main advantage to airblasting is that you threaten a reflect and force the enemy to play defensively, put out fires, allows you to juggle away ubers or melee focused classes and knockback people into environmental hazards. Actually landing a reflect is important but it's not what you spend most of your airblasts doing; your solution radically reduces the functionality of it. Slowing down the game is part of their role; getting pinned by a sentry isn't fun, walking into a stickytrap isn't fun, etc etc
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Nov 7, 2014 21:02
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xzzy posted:My favorite part about that comment was the read-between-the-lines interpretation that the guy wants TF2 to become Call of Duty. How do you get to that interpretation? Call of Duty is much worse than TF2 for being able to tell someone's capabilities at a glance. Everyone uses the same model no matter which weapons/perks/grenades they have equipped.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:08
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CoolCab posted:Eh, the Pyro is in a good balance place right now for pub play. The main advantage to airblasting is that you threaten a reflect and force the enemy to play defensively, put out fires, allows you to juggle away ubers or melee focused classes and knockback people into environmental hazards. Actually landing a reflect is important but it's not what you spend most of your airblasts doing; your solution radically reduces the functionality of it. Slowing down the game is part of their role; getting pinned by a sentry isn't fun, walking into a stickytrap isn't fun, etc etc Forcing an enemy to be defensive is bad. In any game offense should be favored over defense, otherwise the optimal strategy is for both teams to not do anything. Also why is their role to slow down the game? Where does that come from? If that is their role, why is that a "good spot"?
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Nov 7, 2014 21:09
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The only way to play 2fort is to pyroshark.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:11
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The general balance of the classes is fine it's the broken autobalance which is ruining every thing. I'm weirded out that I'm the only one discussing this? Does nobody else play valve servers?
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Nov 7, 2014 21:16
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You guys hear about Team Fortress 3? It's called Overwatch now
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Nov 7, 2014 21:17
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Powercrazy posted:Forcing an enemy to be defensive is bad. In any game offense should be favored over defense, otherwise the optimal strategy is for both teams to not do anything. Also why is their role to slow down the game? Where does that come from? If that is their role, why is that a "good spot"? Sentry guns, sticky bombs, the Heavy class? Defending is a major part of the game, the Pyro is one of the tools for defending. Forcing an enemy to play defensively makes combat more tactically rich and makes the offensive player make choices and take evaluative risks, this is interesting, in my opinion. Their role is to slow down the game because one of their class abilities is the airblast, the airblast was added to give the Pyro a defensive role, just like the Sentry gun is a class ability that slows down offensive pushes. It's a good spot because it makes the game more complex and subsequently interesting for the reasons listed. I mean I don't totally disagree with you, I've expressed loads of times that some of the old maps, particularly Dustbowl 3, are completely ruined by the airblast. That's a flaw in the map, not the class. e: Jippa posted:The general balance of the classes is fine it's the broken autobalance which is ruining every thing. I'm weirded out that I'm the only one discussing this? No, it's just that we all talked about it extensively at the time of the change, I imagine most people agree with you. You have to Goldilocks your way through a bunch of servers and it sucks, hope they change it back. If it makes you feel better they already walked back from it some by allowing players to vote away the new autobalancing rules, but, unsurprisingly, this doesn't loving work for the same reason the teams become unbalanced: the stompers are required to vote away their ability to stomp, and most people are much more willing to drop now. CoolCab fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 21:17
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CoolCab posted:
Apologies I didn't read that part of the thread. I thought I was going nuts.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:23
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Atheist Sunglasses posted:You guys hear about Team Fortress 3? It's called Overwatch now Overwatch is a new multiplayer FPS made by Blizzard that has a beta launching next year for those who don't know. Looks pretty inspired by TF2, not sure if there are any videos up of in-game footage yet but there are a few screenshots up on PCGamer. Edit: Have some gameplay Zero! fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 21:30
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Ditocoaf posted:I disagree on this particular point. You have to be willing to be on the opposite team from a friend. Maybe it's fine at first (sometimes, though pure luck, there are enough competent players opposing to put up a reasonable fight), but if things are too one-sided and a scramble occurs, and you insist on undoing the scramble, then you're basically having your TF2 fun at the expense of everyone else on the server. Especially on those occasions where three (or even more?) people come with pre-arranged teamwork, against a server otherwise composed of total strangers, it's just an exercise in futility for their opponents. You can't create comparable teamwork on the fly using "thanks" emotes and one guy's lovely mic. Even three players is merely a quarter of the team. If that's a stack then the other team must suck donkey dicks. But instead of expecting the losing players to get their act together, Valve just pander to them.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:38
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I hope valve has something interesting in mind for TF3. I wouldn't mind 2 modern cartoony class-based FPS games.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:43
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Does any one know who is in charge of tf2 at valve now? It's pretty worrying that they have royally hosed up so much stuff in the last few patches? I'm honestly not that guy who constantly complains about valve (I'm a massive supporter of them) but these last few patches have just broken the game. It's complete amateur hour. Remember all those damage changes for the rocket launcher, they were all just a "mistake" as well. Who the gently caress is making all these terrible changes?
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Nov 7, 2014 21:44
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Zero! posted:Overwatch is a new multiplayer FPS made by Blizzard that has a beta launching next year for those who don't know. Looks pretty inspired by TF2, not sure if there are any videos up of in-game footage yet but there are a few screenshots up on PCGamer. And a website: http://us.battle.net/overwatch/en/
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Nov 7, 2014 21:45
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Jippa posted:Does any one know who is in charge of tf2 at valve now? It's pretty worrying that they have royally hosed up so much stuff in the last few patches? This happens every major update.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:48
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pisshead posted:Even three players is merely a quarter of the team. If that's a stack then the other team must suck donkey dicks.
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Nov 7, 2014 21:51
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BillehS posted:This happens every major update. You could be right and I just felt this mess up because of the class/servers I play? I have been through pretty much all of them though so who knows?
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Nov 7, 2014 21:55
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It's no worse than when they changed the build console command and allowed everyone to build an infinite number of sentries and dispensers. That took awhile to fix.
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Nov 7, 2014 22:07
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Zero! posted:Overwatch is a new multiplayer FPS made by Blizzard that has a beta launching next year for those who don't know. Looks pretty inspired by TF2, not sure if there are any videos up of in-game footage yet but there are a few screenshots up on PCGamer. Gameplay looks cool, but I don't like how you need to look at the big floating name above a player's head to see what team they're on, or just generally how all over the place the character designs are. If you're going to draw so much inspiration from TF2, surely you'd take its approach to character design onboard and make it super easy and quick to tell what class and team someone is, even from a distance. The Gorilla is pretty rad though.
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Nov 7, 2014 22:09
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How's that Chinese rip-off TF2 doing? I haven't heard anything about that lately.
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Nov 7, 2014 22:12
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I don't understand how you can think that teamstacking is a new problem, or how the forced-team-size-balance thing is supposedly causing it. Did you used to just always spectator-switch to the stacked team, so you wouldn't be on the receiving end? Badly losing teams have always hemorrhaged players from the server, forcing autobalance to switch someone over. Not many people knew or bothered with the "switch to spectator, so some other poor fool gets kicked to the disadvantaged side" trick, and if you did that you were almost always more experienced than the aforementioned poor fool, which would make the stacking problem worse. It was a lovely situation before and it's a lovely situation now, but I'm not buying that the spectator-mode change is for the worse. Ditocoaf fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 22:47
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Zero! posted:Overwatch is a new multiplayer FPS made by Blizzard that has a beta launching next year for those who don't know. Looks pretty inspired by TF2, not sure if there are any videos up of in-game footage yet but there are a few screenshots up on PCGamer. Very first thing I see is a character with blink in a first person shooter. gently caress that garbage.
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Nov 7, 2014 23:01
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pisshead posted:Even three players is merely a quarter of the team. If that's a stack then the other team must suck donkey dicks. But instead of expecting the losing players to get their act together, Valve just pander to them.
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Nov 7, 2014 23:10
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TF2 Update posted:-Fixed a bug where players could be teleported to hell and not have visible bumper car Edit: Asteroid is looking pretty. 
Zero! fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Nov 8, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 23:56
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Peanut President posted:Very first thing I see is a character with blink in a first person shooter. gently caress that garbage. That looks pretty bitchin' imo and solves a big problem Scout has always had (completely cockblocked by sentries.)
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Nov 8, 2014 00:21
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Increase the scouts runspeed when using Bonk and it's pretty much blink.
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Nov 8, 2014 00:32
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Otacon posted:Increase the scouts runspeed when using Bonk and it's pretty much blink. You can't attack while Bonking, giving it some annoyance utility but that's it. I saw the Scout in Overwatch run forward, kill an engineer with a sentry up, and then dash back with that recall ability before the sentry could kill her which I thought owned. Also you can stick a pulse-bomb on something then dash back or use the bomb to cover a retreat. I play Scout more than any other class so it makes me hard.
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Nov 8, 2014 00:36
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Fojar38 posted:You can't attack while Bonking, giving it some annoyance utility but that's it. Basically the antimage but in tf2.
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Nov 8, 2014 00:39
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My biggest problem with Scout in TF2 is that for a supposedly offensive class they instantly become useless if the defending team has a sentry up, doubly so if they're on the last point so you can't even bonk past it and harass their spawn. It's something I've been wanting addressed basically since I started playing.
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Nov 8, 2014 00:42
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Game looks potentially fun but I worry giving every character a special will make matches too chaotic. TF2 matches generally created tension around ubercharges: when and where to use it, and how best to protect the medic until the next charge. How is that tension going to be created when every character on the team is doing *something really cool* that breaks the frontlines every other minute? The classes seem all over the place too. Part of the reason I liked TF2 so much was it stripped down each character class so they did a particular thing really well and it was generally a thing that took hundreds of hours to master. Here, we have characters overlapping in abilities such as sentries, traps, tanking, healing, and it makes me wonder whether half these abilities will be that useful or deep in the first place. Also gently caress the lack of blood and exploding bodyparts. Asshole Businessman fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Nov 8, 2014 |
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Nov 8, 2014 00:48
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Oh no your team might have to have classes other than scouts to complete the push 
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Nov 8, 2014 00:58
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Oh no your team might have to have classes other than scouts to complete the push With proper use of invulnerability (proper meaning; have another scout with you) any one sentry gun can be easily taken down by just dancing in front of it while your buddy does the hard part. Scout supremacy, there is nothing wrong with an entire team of scouts! you are just gonna win faster
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Nov 8, 2014 01:02
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