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When korra lost her connection to the past avatars, I thought the avatar state would be weakened. In the original series, it seemed to me like the past avatars lent their strength or techniques. But then the show contradicted itself with the wan storyline. The avatar stage is just too powerful. In the atla, aang couldn't couldn't control it when he was in it. This is important so they could use other story elements other than an instant win button. They couldn't do the same thing again, so they let korra use it whenever she wants. But that's a problem because she could absolutely wreck everyone at any time. In past seasons they just had her forget about it. In season four, they had this ptsd stuff. I thought there were going to be some interesting story elements to it, but mostly it seems to me like just an excuse for her to stay out of the avatar state.
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Nov 10, 2014 20:01
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captain innocuous posted:In season four, they had this ptsd stuff. I thought there were going to be some interesting story elements to it, but mostly it seems to me like just an excuse for her to stay out of the avatar state. We are almost halfway through the season and Korra has struggled with depression and recovery, abandoned her friends and family to travel around the world trying to figure out her place in it, met Toph and learned one of the causes of her issues (although now we know it's not the main one), and has just been totally unable to keep up in a fight with any bender with or without the avatar state and you think there haven't been any interesting story elements to it? It's literally been the entire focus of her story so far this book.
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Nov 10, 2014 20:10
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ImpAtom posted:It's an abuse of power and frequently unnecessary, and if you should happen to be hit by a meteor or something while using the Avatar state to get a coke from the fridge, welp, that's the end of the Avatar. CeallaSo posted:Because calling upon the spirits of 1000 dead heroes to make you win at a children's game is generally considered to be bad form.
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Nov 10, 2014 20:24
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I know the system has existed for 10,000 years, but did they ever say how many Avatars there were?
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Nov 10, 2014 20:35
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Probably less than a thousand. Somewhere between 100 and 200.
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Nov 10, 2014 20:37
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Everybody wants to see the Avatar exact some divine
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Nov 10, 2014 20:50
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Mraagvpeine posted:I know the system has existed for 10,000 years, but did they ever say how many Avatars there were? Baron Bifford posted:Probably less than a thousand. Somewhere between 100 and 200. This is probably right. Avatars seem to be mostly exceptionally long-lived. Kyoshi was 230 for instance and Aang was arguably 166. Roku died at the relatively young age of 70 because of the volcano. No idea how old Wan was but he looked pretty old. Kuruk apparently died pretty young though.
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Nov 10, 2014 20:52
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Rosalind posted:Kuruk apparently died pretty young though. There is zero chance Kuruk didn't use Avatar State for the raddest surfing session ever.
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Nov 10, 2014 21:34
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Rosalind posted:This is probably right. Avatars seem to be mostly exceptionally long-lived. Kyoshi was 230 for instance and Aang was arguably 166. Roku died at the relatively young age of 70 because of the volcano. No idea how old Wan was but he looked pretty old. Kuruk apparently died pretty young though. I guess it'd be possible for there to be less than 100 Avatars then.
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Nov 10, 2014 21:41
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Isn't "10,000" just Chinese slang for "a whole lot"?
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Nov 10, 2014 22:04
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Toshimo posted:Isn't "10,000" just Chinese slang for "a whole lot"? Maybe, but it's probably literally 10000 years here.
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Nov 10, 2014 22:10
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Toshimo posted:Isn't "10,000" just Chinese slang for "a whole lot"? Jackard fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Nov 10, 2014 |
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Nov 10, 2014 22:10
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"Wan" is a unit of 10,000 in Chinese (and can be used to refer to an infinitely large number in everyday speech, yeah). As for meaning "first", well... Wan. One. 
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Nov 10, 2014 22:19
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It seems like the number 10,000 is to the Chinese the way English speakers sometimes use "a million" colloquially to mean some vague, but very large number. The point is you aren't supposed to know just how many avatars there's been. It's more mythic that way. I prefer it mysterious. The avatar is a force of nature that exists beyond human reckoning, and that includes something as mundane as counting. When Roku says a Thousand Lifetimes, he's being poetic. There could be 950, or 1500, or 10,000. It's an expression meant to convey gravity and let puny mortals know who they are dealing with. It's really too bad they stripped out one of the more interesting facets of the show.
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Nov 10, 2014 22:54
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Couldn't somebody just count all those cute little Avatar statues at the shrines?
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Nov 10, 2014 23:05
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blurry! posted:It's really too bad they stripped out one of the more interesting facets of the show. I honestly think it's temporary. I mean, in Season 1 she got her bending taken away and it magically came back via what amounts to deux ex machina. A similar thing can happen again. Maybe the past avatars can say something like, "we wanted you to learn how to live and make decisions on your own" or something.
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Nov 10, 2014 23:10
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To add to the deluge of reasons given why casual Avatar State is less than ideal, the Avatar State takes a lot out the Avatar's body. Aang was in continuous Avatar State for 100 years and his life was shortened due to the strain.Mraagvpeine posted:I guess it'd be possible for there to be less than 100 Avatars then. True, but apparently Kyoshi was the longest-lived. I'd imagine there were a lot of early deaths like Roku as well given the hazardous nature of the job. My guess is 100-150. Rosalind posted:This is probably right. Avatars seem to be mostly exceptionally long-lived. Kyoshi was 230 for instance and Aang was arguably 166. Roku died at the relatively young age of 70 because of the volcano. No idea how old Wan was but he looked pretty old. Kuruk apparently died pretty young though. I'm actually not sure whether Avatars tend to live longer than the normal population. Kyoshi apparently transferred leadership of Kyoshi Island to her daughter Koko when she died, and assuming Kyoshi had the fertility span of a normal woman that would put her daughter close to 200. Bumi was also very long-lived. enraged_camel posted:I honestly think it's temporary. I mean, in Season 1 she got her bending taken away and it magically came back via what amounts to deux ex machina. A similar thing can happen again. Maybe the past avatars can say something like, "we wanted you to learn how to live and make decisions on your own" or something. Season 1 is the main reason I think her past lives may come back. Like I've said before, I'm torn on whether that's a good thing.
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Nov 11, 2014 00:23
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Sato posted:I'm actually not sure whether Avatars tend to live longer than the normal population. Kyoshi apparently transferred leadership of Kyoshi Island to her daughter Koko when she died, and assuming Kyoshi had the fertility span of a normal woman that would put her daughter close to 200. Bumi was also very long-lived. I think powerful benders in general are very long-lived, because something something chi. Hence why Sokka is the only one dead besides Aang.
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Nov 11, 2014 00:41
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Neo_Crimson posted:I think powerful benders in general are very long-lived, because something something chi. Hence why Sokka is the only one dead besides Aang. I considered that myself and wouldn't be surprised if you were right. We don't technically know that Koko was an earthbender though; none of the Kyoshi warriors were. And I choose to believe that Sokka died in battle. 
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Nov 11, 2014 00:51
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Toshimo posted:Isn't "10,000" just Chinese slang for "a whole lot"? In Buddhist mythology, they use a big, round number to refer to "a longer period of time than we can/are not supposed to calculate." Like 5000 or 10,000 years. When is the next Buddha coming? 5,000 years. That sort of thing.
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Nov 11, 2014 01:16
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dj_clawson posted:In Buddhist mythology, they use a big, round number to refer to "a longer period of time than we can/are not supposed to calculate." Like 5000 or 10,000 years. When is the next Buddha coming? 5,000 years. That sort of thing. JT Jag fucked around with this message at 01:28 on Nov 11, 2014 |
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Nov 11, 2014 01:26
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JT Jag posted:So it's kinda like how "a ton" is used in English? In that it has an explicit meaning of 1,000 kilograms but is also colloquially used to mean "a large amount." Yes.
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Nov 11, 2014 01:27
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I now want a series based on the 2nd avatar ever. Imagine being the first born to have the powers.
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Nov 11, 2014 02:51
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Also as the second Avatar I guess your Avatar state isn't overly helpful. It's one dude's life experiences, and he was an idiot!
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Nov 11, 2014 03:44
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I think the Wan episode reestablished the Avatar state as the Avatar tapping not into the power of the previous Avatars, but into the power of Raava. Hence why Korra's Avatar state is presumably just as powerful as it ever was, despite her connection to all of the previous Avatars being severed.
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Nov 11, 2014 03:48
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Quixotic1 posted:I now want a series based on the 2nd avatar ever. Imagine being the first born to have the powers. Was Wan considered Fire Nation? Was Avatar 2.0 an Airbender?
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Nov 11, 2014 03:51
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Toshimo posted:Was Wan considered Fire Nation? Those are probably safe assumptions.
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Nov 11, 2014 04:02
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Toshimo posted:Was Wan considered Fire Nation? Most likely. He started with fire as his primary element, and the montage showed him learning them in the order of the avatar cycle.
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Nov 11, 2014 04:04
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quote:Kuruk apparently died pretty young though. Also, does it seem that the previous Avatars appear to the current Avatar as the age they were when they died, or when they were at their most powerful, or what? How do they determine what their appearance is? I mean if Kyoshi lived to be over 200, her manifestation doesn't look a day over like 40.
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Nov 11, 2014 06:23
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I'd guess they manifest themselves at the point of their life they felt most satisfied with; most of them just went with what they were like when they kicked the bucket, though there are some exceptions (I.E. Wan, most likely Kyoshi).
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Nov 11, 2014 06:49
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Doctor Reynolds posted:Also as the second Avatar I guess your Avatar state isn't overly helpful. It's one dude's life experiences, and he was an idiot! "Avatar Wan, I, the Second Avatar, seek your guidance and wisdom. What do I do about this evil warlord that's wrecking poo poo up and causing imbalance all over?" "  "
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Nov 11, 2014 07:19
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I want to see more Iroh. He was by far the most badass character in ATLA.   And he's awesome even without his bending 
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Nov 11, 2014 07:57
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Caros posted:Most likely. He started with fire as his primary element, and the montage showed him learning them in the order of the avatar cycle. I assumed this was why the Avatar Cycle is what it is, rather than some other progression of the elements.
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Nov 11, 2014 08:05
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So far, three of the elements have a "regular" version and one or two "upgraded" version. Earth: Metal/Lava Water: Blood Fire: Lightning/Explosion What about Air? The only thing I could think of is that Zaheer could fly, but that was more of a meditation technique (letting go of his earthly ties) rather than another type of bending.
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Nov 11, 2014 08:55
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enraged_camel posted:So far, three of the elements have a "regular" version and one or two "upgraded" version. Fartbending.
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Nov 11, 2014 09:13
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enraged_camel posted:So far, three of the elements have a "regular" version and one or two "upgraded" version. Air apparently has the spirit related stuff that Jinora does. And maybe the suffocating thing Zaheer did. And fartbending.
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Nov 11, 2014 12:26
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And soundbending.
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Nov 11, 2014 13:38
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murderapersononscreeniashowforkidsbending
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Nov 11, 2014 14:50
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RottenK posted:murderapersononscreeniashowforkidsbending Woah, woah, woah. The Earth Queen didn't die and you have no proof that she actually did. No one actually ever said she died. She just went to live with Jet, Combustion Man, Chin the Conqueror, Ming-Hua, Ghazan, P'Li, Noatak, and Tarrlok in peace and happiness on... Kangaroo Island. I hear it's really hopping. Jeeze this show is getting quite the body count.
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Nov 11, 2014 15:37
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Rosalind posted:Woah, woah, woah. The Earth Queen didn't die and you have no proof that she actually did. No one actually ever said she died. She just went to live with Jet, Combustion Man, Chin the Conqueror, Ming-Hua, Ghazan, P'Li, Noatak, and Tarrlok in peace and happiness on... Kangaroo Island. I hear it's really hopping.
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Nov 11, 2014 16:13
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