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Pththya-lyi posted:It was worse - Crassus' slaves would only put out the fire if the owner of the flaming building agreed to sell it to Crassus for a song. The deal was terrible for the original owner, but was better than having nothing. He'd have the building rebuilt and refurbished, then start renting it out. Nah, that's not how it worked. Crassus would charge an exorbitant price to put out the fire, and if you didn't pay, he would let your building burn and then come back later and buy the remains for a song.
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# ? Nov 14, 2014 15:26 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 06:33 |
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Oooh. My bad. The point still stands that he was practically an extortionist
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# ? Nov 14, 2014 15:28 |
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Pththya-lyi posted:Oooh. My bad. Oh yeah for sure, but to be fair to Crassus, pretty much all public services in Rome were performed by extortionists of one stripe or another.
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# ? Nov 14, 2014 15:48 |
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JackMann posted:Why the gently caress should I pay to have your house put out? Clearly, if you couldn't afford to pay the fire fighters yourself, you deserve to have your belongings lost. The free market will ensure that those who deserve protection will receive it. After all, it's not like fires spread, right? We mock, but it happens... Basically a guy who lives outside the city limits to avoid paying taxes didn't pay his annual firefighter's fee to the city, and they refused to put his house out when it caught on fire, because if they did it for him, no one would pay the fee (kinda like getting car insurance after an accident), they'd all just pay as soon as their houses caught on fire, defeating the purpose of the fee in the first place. They showed up to insure the fire didn't spread to the surrounding houses that had paid the fee. $75 a year is a steal for not having your house burn down completely, you'd think, but then again I live in a society and just pay taxes in exchange for a complete package of government services, so what do I know? http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2010/10/04/122193/county-firefighters-subscription/ quote:Imagine your home catches fire but the local fire department won’t respond, then watches it burn. That’s exactly what happened to a local family tonight. A local neighborhood is furious after firefighters watched as an Obion County, Tennessee, home burned to the ground. Toph Bei Fong fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Nov 14, 2014 |
# ? Nov 14, 2014 17:38 |
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A sequence happens where Richard can't call birds worth poo poo, so he's totally got actual flaws, you guys. It's very My First Original Character. Anyway, the Mud People decide to summon their ancestors because FINALLY Richard has done enough to merit it. Except only men can go in JUST BECAUSE but gently caress it he's going to break one more rule and Kahlan can come in to translate as well. Also: you have to be naked and lick a toad.quote:She held his eyes for a long time, then turned to Richard. "I need to explain something to you. When a person calls a gathering, they are sometimes asked questions by the spirits, through the elders, to be sure they are acting of noble intent. If you answer a question in a way that a spirit ancestor finds dishonorable or untruthful… they may kill you. Not the elders, the spirits." And I bet you thought I made that up. (Not transcribed in this post: the uncomfortable description of Kahlan rubbing a frog between her breasts at length.) So the ancestral spirits are basically your GM playing a djinn, and Richard is that rear end in a top hat rules lawyer with a two-page, pre-planned Wish. quote:"We have decided to answer your question. If we can. What is the object of magic you seek?" That is the shittiest metaphor, by the way, and I just wanted to highlight it. Holy god. quote:"We know the name of the person who has the box, and the names of several other people nearby, but we cannot tell you the names because that would be the same as telling you where it is. That is forbidden." Just to top off this shitshow, DARKEN RAHL IS LITERALLY OUTSIDE THE HUT BURNING MEN ALIVE ON A DRAGON. The spirits go "So, you can't beat this dude, but right now, he can't find you because you're in here with us. You now get to spend the night halfway to Hell and our people are gonna die. If you can handle that, congrats, you're the hero. If not, go outside and die." Richard, not surprisingly, stays inside to not die. But he gets pouty about it. Then we meet Princess Violet. Some of you probably instantly remember this character. quote:Princess Violet turned suddenly and slapped Rachel's face. Hard. Rachel had done nothing wrong, of course; the Princess just liked to slap her when she least expected it. The Princess thought it was fun. Rachel didn't try to hide how much it hurt; if it didn't hurt enough, the Princess would slap her again. Rachel put her hand over the sting, her bottom lip quivering, tears welling up in her eyes, but she said nothing. Hey. Hey guys. Princess Violet is going to be the SYMPATHETIC ONE soon.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 16:32 |
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And here I thought I'd already encountered the worst sort of Princess character in (fantasy) literature. That or Goodkin here read that same character and decided to one-up her.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 17:06 |
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Oh man poo poo is about to get so much more aggressively Randian any moment now.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 17:44 |
How do I not remember any of this poo poo?
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 17:50 |
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Oh god no, please not princess Violent! All the bad memories are rushing back!
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 18:27 |
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Zereth posted:How do I not remember any of this poo poo? Because like everything else that isn't Richard directly doing a thing, none of it ends up mattering. It's so much worse than I remembered.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 18:34 |
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Zereth posted:How do I not remember any of this poo poo? You too? Jesus Christ how did I even manage to get through this when I was 12? I should have known better by then.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 19:57 |
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This. This is why that shower took so long.
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 22:50 |
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I love the Shota part and the Princess Violet part. They just show what type of author Goodkind is. I barely remember anything that is going to happen until we start getting close to it, but when I do remember it is
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# ? Nov 16, 2014 22:59 |
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Rachel is a cartoonishly put-upon little girl. After the princess' bullshit, Rachel is left to clean up the queen's jewelry and hopefully not get caught. Just as she's about to sneak out, the court wizard, Giller, enters, curious about the noise. Why would Giller give a poo poo, you ask? Well, it's because the last Box of Orden is stored in here as an unassuming "jewelry box". These people literally leave WMDs around in plain sight where kids can toss the fuckers around. Amazing. Now, I've been snipping it for brevity, but Zedd has basically shat on Giller the entire novel thus far, whenever Kahlan tells tales of the Midlands, or when he was cursing those SELLOUT WIZARDS he trained. So actually seeing him is a weird change of pace. quote:He put a long finger over her lips, to gently silence her. "I get the point, child. So, you are the Princess's playmate then?" I think you get the gist. Giller actually goes to absurd lengths to try and cheer Rachel up, giving her an enchanted doll, making a hiding spot for it (as Violet forbids Rachel to have any toys or possessions)... seriously, read this. quote:"Well, as you walk down the central path of the garden, there are short urns, on both sides, with yellow flowers in them." Rachel nodded. She knew where they were. "I will hide your doll in the third urn on the right. I will put a wizard's web over it— that's magic— so no one but you will find it." He took the doll and carefully tucked it away back in his robes as her eyes followed it. "The next time you are put out for the night, you go there and you will find your doll. Then you can keep it at your place, your wayward pine, where no one will find it, or take it from you. Please note: "Wizard webs" are going to be like... the driving force of so much stupid poo poo by this series' end. "Hey Zedd how did we not notice this world-changing artifact that was in the Mud People's toilet back when we were dealing with Darken Rahl?" "Wizard webs, my dear boy! Bags, I tell you this every time." Let's just get into this: Queen Milena is a petty tyrant and yet still not half the monster her daughter is (mostly because she will die before she can really be shown as in-depth as Violet). Tonight she is throwing a dinner party with the other nobles of the kingdom where she has Darken Rahl's "Emperor's New Sculpin"* on tap for all the guests. The cooks ran out of the original batch ages ago and just threw some poo poo in a jug. * If you do not deal with beer, this joke probably fell flat. Just pretend it worked and move on. I sell liquor for a living and you have to either make terrible jokes about it as venting, or drink yourself to death. quote:The Queen stood, holding her goblet in the air, and the little dog in her other arm. "Lords and ladies, I present you with the drink of enlightenment, that we may see the truth. This is a very precious commodity; few are offered the opportunity of enlightenment. I have availed myself of it many times, of course, that I might see the truth, the way of Father Rahl, in order to lead my people to the common good. Drink up." I'm seriously keeping my commentary to a minimum here because these scenes really speak for themselves... and I forgot that he was taking collectivist potshots from book one. quote:"A special treat, lords and ladies, for your entertainment." She snapped her fingers. "Bring in the fool." Guards brought in a man, and made him stand in the center of the room, directly in front of the Queen, all the tables around him. He was big and strong-looking, but he was bound with chains. The Queen leaned forward. Yes, Rahl's forces are indeed the People's Army. The chapter ends nonsensically: Rachel 'misbehaves' so that Violet sends her out into the cold (and so she can grab her new toys/avoid watching an execution), then we just cut to a single snippet of Zedd, who has murdered his way through D'Haran territory trying to grab something that Rahl beat him to. quote:Furious, Zedd slapped his hand to the cold metal plate. The massive stone door slowly grated closed. He had to step over the bodies of D'Haran guards as he walked to the low wall. His fingers came to rest on the familiar, smooth stone as he leaned forward, looking out over the sleeping city below. With that, though, good news! We're now halfway done with Wizard's First Rule. Let me assure you everything gets crazier from here.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 00:05 |
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You know, poo poo like this is why I never made a connection between Libertarianism and Goodkind until someone pointed it out to me years later. Because if a Queen, or a leader like Darken Rahl, is spouting this bullshit about the common good, common sense tells you it's just the typical lies of tyrants and nobility to take control of the populace. In my head, every instance of "now we all work for the common good" got translated into typical villain-speak for "I steal all your poo poo because I'm evil". Goodkind practically overdid his communist nazi mages so far, it all wraps around to standard-fantasy evil. It's literally so unreal and farcical it turns fantastical again.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 00:34 |
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Quick question,why in the flying gently caress does this obvious tyrant of a Queen care about the common good? Yeah you can say she's doing it for propaganda purposes but there are only other nobles at the party. There's no point to that whole speech but bullshit potshots at collectivists ,Ayn Rand would be proud.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 01:09 |
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Libluini posted:You know, poo poo like this is why I never made a connection between Libertarianism and Goodkind until someone pointed it out to me years later. That's what I was thinking reading through that. Who on earth reads that and goes "Ah, of course! Communists!" Other then the batshit insane author.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 03:06 |
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Uh wait till you read Peasant John Galt's ridiculous speech because there's absolutely no misinterpreting that poo poo.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 03:13 |
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I dunno, I feel like taking from the rich to give to the poor would have fixed that peasant's problems.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 03:20 |
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DARKSEID DICK PICS posted:then we just cut to a single snippet of Zedd, who has murdered his way through D'Haran territory trying to grab something that Rahl beat him to. Isn't the thing he's looking for the Book of Counted Shadows? Which Richard's dad took, of course...
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 03:40 |
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ProfessorCirno posted:That's what I was thinking reading through that. Who on earth reads that and goes "Ah, of course! Communists!" Other then the batshit insane author. Much like with the conspiracy theorist, as with so many things, the polemic author requires his enemies to be both omnipotent powerful yet utterly incompetent. Comedy answer: Because A = A. No one could possible lie about their intentions! How could a man say one thing and then do another, yet still achieve a position of power?
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 06:46 |
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SavageMessiah posted:Isn't the thing he's looking for the Book of Counted Shadows? Which Richard's dad took, of course... Ssh. I'm not revealing EVERYTHING out of order, damnit.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 06:52 |
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Thanks to the Mud People's description of Rahl riding a demon, Kahlan fills Richard/us in on more Midlands lore!quote:"A dragon! There are dragons in the Midlands? I didn't think there really were such things!" Pay attention to that, as The pair get led off track by some poo poo named Old John who is clearly a trap. Meanwhile, talking dolls! quote:"Do you know what I should do?" Rachel asked the doll as she looked up at the firelight flickering on the dark branches inside the tree. That interlude does nothing for us for a while yet. Those get more frequent as time goes on. Goodkind does not balance plotlines well at all. For instance, when we cut back to Richard, he has suddenly noticed Old John doesn't leave footprints. quote:"But tell me, Old John, what is your old friend's name?" I wish some of these terrible similes weren't too long, I'll probably need a namechange by the time this thread is through. There are only so many work-safe pictures that go with this name. The fight scene isn't worth transcribing because the beast just turns and runs in the middle when some brain-damaged jackass runs out of the woods, screaming "MY SWORD! GIMME MY SWORD". I assure you, once again, I am making none of this up. quote:"Please!" it howled. "No kill! No kill!" The creature is Samuel, and he serves Shota, which is good, because it means we're suddenly back on the track labeled "plot". Somehow in the middle of all this, Shota grabbed Kahlan, and so literally every possible card Richard could have for going to see the witch woman is being played at once. Samuel is pretty much Gollum with the serial numbers filed off, incidentally. quote:"If you take me there, to your mistress, and if the pretty lady is all right, I won't kill you." Richard put tension to the rope to let Samuel know who was in charge, then put away the sword. "Here, you carry the pretty lady's pack." Long story short Shota lives in what is rather simply The Worst Neighborhood, and when Richard arrives, Kahlan is covered in snakes and Zedd gets clowned on by the witch woman. It's not really Zedd, but a test: when Richard tries to shield her from 'wizard fire', he wins her over. We, uh. We aren't told a lot of this yet, but Shota is effectively loving invincible. From the poo poo I remember off the top of my head: - She is a sorceress of no small power. - She is also a witch-woman, which is an entirely different thing and basically translates to "near-omnipotent oracular powers". - She can legitimately transform herself. Not an illusion, not a hoax, not an imaginary costume: straight up become other shapes and beings. I think 99% of the time she does this, she turns into someone's mother. (I'm not kidding. She disguises herself as Richard's mother at her introduction.) - She can still make illusions anyway because why the gently caress not. (See: Holo-Zedd.) - She will kill you later. quote:"Richard," she touched a finger to her chin, thinking, "you come here thinking me evil, didn't you? Even though you knew nothing of me, you were ready to bring harm to me, based on what you invented in your head. You have committed to belief that which you have heard from others." There was no malice in her voice. "People who are jealous or afraid say these things. People also say that to use fire is wrong, and that those who use fire are evil. Does that make it true? People say the old wizard is evil, and that people die because of him. Does that make it true? Some of the Mud People say you brought death to their village. Does that make it true, because fools say it is so?" No really. She's very good at turning into people's mothers, right down to the tone. quote:"I guess a formal introduction is in order. Richard, may I introduce Samuel, your predecessor. The former Seeker." Spoiler alert: Richard is going to find a way to avoid this curse and it is monstrous.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 06:56 |
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DARKSEID DICK PICS posted:Spoiler alert: Richard is going to find a way to avoid this curse and it is monstrous. Really? Huh. I remember that Sam got cursed because the sword was taken from him, so Richard isn't cursed because he never loses the sword. As for the dragon thing, that did always confuse me. The people of the Westlands have only been there for a generation, why world so much of the knowledge be myth and legend? Hell, Dick's dad totes is from the Midlands and knows all about magic, having lived there before the boundary went up and all. Conversations really should have much less ambiguity when many of the people have direct knowledge of what the gently caress they are taking about. Westland kid 1: Dragon's are really real! Westland kid 2: Nu-uh! WK1: Dad! WK2 said dragon's aren't real! Dad: That's cuz he never had to shovel the poo poo of some rich nobles's grey dragon pet. Which I have. And can tell you about in lenth.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 08:00 |
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There's that fire thing again. Man, he is just pleased as punch with that little metaphor, isn't he?
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 08:17 |
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Outside of the eye-rollingly "Wake Up Sheeple" nonsense that Shota went on about, she does bring up that wizard magic is unfathomable to her. Does this ever go anywhere? With witch/"nature" magic opposing wizard/"arbitrary bullshit" magic. Vague environmentalism would be better than any of the other themes, at least.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 16:05 |
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Bendigeidfran posted:Outside of the eye-rollingly "Wake Up Sheeple" nonsense that Shota went on about, she does bring up that wizard magic is unfathomable to her. Does this ever go anywhere? With witch/"nature" magic opposing wizard/"arbitrary bullshit" magic. Vague environmentalism would be better than any of the other themes, at least. I guess the second book deals with it, though as always the primary purpose is to reinforce that man-magic is way more important than woman-magic. In fact the overwhelming majority of woman-magic in this series exists EXPLICITLY to nurture man-magic. That's its stated purpose and literally the only thing it is used for, and any woman who doesn't do so is COMICALLY, IRREVOCABLY EVIL. I Love You! fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Nov 17, 2014 |
# ? Nov 17, 2014 17:30 |
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Mostly the "rules" of magic don't matter, even the male/female dichotomy. Magic's gonna do what the gently caress ever to make the plot do what Goodkind wants at the time. The most important divide is Additive/Subtractive, but as pointed out much earlier in the thread, that axis as-explained doesn't make much sense and likewise isn't exploited consistently when it drives the plot.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 18:12 |
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"Oh, they think Robert Jordan's magic system is misogynistic? I'll show them, I'll show them all! " - Possibly a real Goodkind quote... ??? The writing in this book started out... okayish (compared to say, noted Nobel Literature Prize winner Kevin J. Anderson) but this is some real dreck level of writing. Pimpmust fucked around with this message at 18:21 on Nov 17, 2014 |
# ? Nov 17, 2014 18:19 |
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quote:A creature of snarl and snap. This made me LOL for some reason. Goodkiiiind
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 20:28 |
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These really are worse than I remember. I mostly remember wondering exactly why it is confessors can't have sex for love though. I mean, we already know if they lose control it goes off and then whoever they're touching is their mind-slave, but we also know it has a cooldown, so why can't they just discharge into a rock, or someone they've already used their power on, and then go at it before they've recharged? And yeah, Richard really is a dick. A better author may have actually written something about a guy who prophecy says is in the right but is also kind of an rear end in a top hat, but nope we're supposed to agree with everything he says and does.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 21:02 |
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Elfface posted:These really are worse than I remember. Or just wear a rubber. But yeah you'd think they'd gently caress like rabbits after every trial.
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 21:03 |
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God, forgot so much about this book. "Now, Richard, just because I made myself look like your dead mother in order to gently caress with you, you got upset? You should be ashamed of yourself. Smother those irrational emotions, and think about it like a robot would! A=A after all!"
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# ? Nov 17, 2014 22:15 |
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Thanatosian posted:God, forgot so much about this book. Smother those irrational emotions, and let pure, unadulterated self-righteous anger direct your actions instead!
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# ? Nov 18, 2014 04:49 |
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I feel like we are overlooking an important part of the whole "ban fire" thing; the villains trying to outlaw fire are all strawmen - of course they're going to hate fire.
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# ? Nov 18, 2014 17:42 |
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Elfface posted:These really are worse than I remember. There is a conversation between Richard and Kahlan that addresses the cooldown part. I have no idea if we passed it over or not, but essentially, Kahlan's powers have such a low cooldown that it still wouldn't be feasible. But don't worry, Dick will rules lawyer his way out of it. That's his superpower.
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# ? Nov 19, 2014 01:30 |
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Dr.Magnificent posted:There is a conversation between Richard and Kahlan that addresses the cooldown part. I have no idea if we passed it over or not, but essentially, Kahlan's powers have such a low cooldown that it still wouldn't be feasible. But don't worry, Dick will rules lawyer his way out of it. That's his superpower. I think her "cooldown" time is still given as, like, hours. Which I can believe Goodkind would think is not enough time for a really manly man to finish the job. Because the manliest thing one can do with sex is turn it into an overlong chore. (EDIT: Here we go. A place for all your hilarious Sword of Truth needs!) That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 01:39 on Nov 19, 2014 |
# ? Nov 19, 2014 01:37 |
I think we haven't passed over it because I think she's still hiding the nature of her power from him.
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# ? Nov 19, 2014 01:37 |
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HotCanadianChick posted:I feel like we are overlooking an important part of the whole "ban fire" thing; the villains trying to outlaw fire are all strawmen - of course they're going to hate fire.
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# ? Nov 19, 2014 01:43 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 06:33 |
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HotCanadianChick posted:I feel like we are overlooking an important part of the whole "ban fire" thing; the villains trying to outlaw fire are all strawmen - of course they're going to hate fire. Dude, I take back anything bad I ever said about you or to you in the new car thread.
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# ? Nov 19, 2014 02:38 |