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Okay, I'll bite. I've been thinking about Christianity and atheism a lot more recently because of my neighbors I've been hanging out with. One man (the main renter) is a hardcore logical atheist. The other man, the roommate, was formerly training to be a preacher and still is a hardcore christian. There's the third one, who is a self-proclaimed atheist but because of personal happenings (What God would let these bad things happen?) And then there's me, someone who's had a lot of trauma in my life and sees God as more of an earthly being (I believe that God is people. The bible are merely guidelines and stories to how we should deal with others. There is no Hell because we currently live in it. But more on that later.) The conversations with the Christian are definitely the most interesting, but that's because he genuinely cares that you're going to burn in Hell. The bad side though is that he makes himself look more like an rear end in a top hat. He's an rear end in a top hat in general but when you had sacrilege and talking about Jesus in the mix, it makes him insufferably worse. So, in short: if you really want to make a serious talk about Jesus, how do you make it sound less like a dick? Note on my beliefs: I know there's fallacies in my belief that the bible are how we deal with people, but I think as society changes, some of the ideals can be timeless. Just be good to yourself and others, brudda.
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Nov 18, 2014 01:57
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CommieGIR posted:*sighs* Yeah, it was I'm genuinely curious where you got the idea from in the first place. Sure putting "In God We Trust" on things was a public thing to do, but that was also a time where literally posting the 10 commandments on public buildings was completely uncontroversial, school prayer was still fairly common in most public schools, and all that jazz. And that stuff was even more intense before the 50s - let alone all the religous rhetoric present in American WWII propaganda (and WWI for that matter). The "In God We Trust" thing was a reaction to the fact that religosity in public was finally starting to be challenged, yet a very large majority of the country was still religious and not in the "yeah I go to church around Christmas" sense.
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Nov 18, 2014 01:57
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Has anyone else (like the OP perhaps) cast a spell before? Please don't be afraid to share
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Nov 18, 2014 02:02
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Why can't we all just agree to embrace sweet sweet nihilism and hope (lol) that all of existence is negated sooner rather than later?
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Nov 18, 2014 02:12
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My Face When posted:Okay, I'll bite. I'm not sure anyone has found the answer to that one yet. Obviously, it can't be confrontational. Pope Francis recently made some waves by suggesting that maybe proselytizing is rude (obviously kyrie wasn't listening). quote:In the interview, the Pope also reiterated the Church grows by attraction, not proselytizing. “The worst thing you can do is religious proselytizing, which paralyzes,” he said. Fred Clark over at slacktivist similarly argues that, as Christians have a duty to love their neighbor as themselves, they should knock it off with the conversion attempts because nobody likes that. It's un-neighborly which is perhaps the greatest of sins. But if you're talking to someone who's interested in the whole business or discussing doctrine, it's a lot tougher. Generally, I try to be respectful and talk about moral principles (which I'm fully willing to admit can be derived entirely from extrabiblical sources, and more power to you if that's your bag) or why I believe what I believe. Trying to convince somebody that my way is the only way comes across as jackassery. I guess what I'm trying to say that if both parties in a dialogue are being respectful, then serious conversation about religious matters is possible.
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Nov 18, 2014 02:27
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Miltank posted:I reject the authority of the Council of Nicaea. Those fuckers overruled Arius, the One True Pope.  And Santa Claus punched him in the face!
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Nov 18, 2014 02:29
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Who What Now posted:I'm pretty sure not believing in gods factors in there somewhere. God has little to do with the development of religious identity. Genuine belief in god is not essential towards creation of religious community. Since time immemorial, religion has been a lens through which to institutionalize power and codify best-practices of tradition. You cannot separate an analysis of religious identity and expression from an understanding of tax structures and state development. My Imaginary GF fucked around with this message at 02:38 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 02:33
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Effectronica posted:Here I thought you'd taken your ball and gone home, Dickeye. Hoho yes I see its a bad joke my argument is undone by dumb bullshit from a year ago good show sir
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Nov 18, 2014 02:49
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My Imaginary GF posted:Since time immemorial, religion has been a lens through which to institutionalize power and codify best-practices of tradition. It really is something how the lower forces turned Christ's message about not perptuating the corrupt material world into 'get married, have lots of kids, and do as you're told'
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Nov 18, 2014 02:58
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"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God." "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." If you think about it, Jesus was the original Judeo-Bolshevist.
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Nov 18, 2014 03:38
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Kyrie eleison posted:This thread is for discussing Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Incarnation, the Son of Man, the Word, the Way, the Truth, and the Life, the Lord, the Light of the World, the Resurrection, the King of the Jews, the Messiah, the Savior, the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. Go gently caress yourself.
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Nov 18, 2014 04:42
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Sidakafitz posted:"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God." Well, there is the whole discussion on whether the mythos of a christ figure was a mesopotamian import of buddhism
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Nov 18, 2014 04:45
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What would our lord and saviour Jesus Christ think of the issues of ethics in Gaming Journalism?
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Nov 18, 2014 04:57
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Phobophilia posted:What would our lord and saviour Jesus Christ think of the issues of ethics in Gaming Journalism? 'Ask a rabbi' - ?
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Nov 18, 2014 05:00
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I was raised Mormon and attended a Mormon church for 15 years. Kyrie eleison, I find your omission of The Book of Mormon from the OP very troubling. How can you claim to be happy with your life when you have not understood the full truth of our relationship with God? You will eventually realize the error of your ways when your immortal soul burns in hell for eternity.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:00
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Salt Fish posted:I was raised Mormon and attended a Mormon church for 15 years. Kyrie eleison, I find your omission of The Book of Mormon from the OP very troubling. How can you claim to be happy with your life when you have not understood the full truth of our relationship with God? You will eventually realize the error of your ways when your immortal soul burns in hell for eternity. He won't burn in hell, remember? He'll just be stuck in eternal darkness. Ex-mormon.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:08
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CommieGIR posted:He won't burn in hell, remember? He'll just be stuck in eternal darkness.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:11
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Mormons are not Christians- its the one thing all Christians can agree on.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:14
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Nessus posted:Couldn't he be baptised retroactively and at least reach the telestial kingdom? In theory, supposedly even if you accept the gospel in the afterlife, someone has to do your baptisimal work in the real world for you to be ready. Its like a delayed heaven program. Only those who reject it in the afterlife and fail to repent are truly damned. Miltank posted:Mormons are not Christians- its the one thing all Christians can agree on. Not that I really care, but they worship Christ as the son of god and recognize the trinity. Pretty sure that makes them Christian. Thats like saying Lutherans are not Christian for following the teachings of Martin Luther. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 05:18 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 05:15
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Since this thread is a predictable shitstorm I'll just drop in to recommend that anybody seriously contemplating the philosophical issues that are being dodged by shitposting to read some Richard Mitchell writings http://www.sourcetext.com/grammarian/ He was a classics prof at a minor East Coast school, and he wrote some really interesting stuff. You may not agree with everything he wrote, but The Gift Of Fire at least is worth reading if you like thinking about thinking. He was kind-of goony in that he published a newsletter that he prepared by "typing" it on an old printing press directly.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:19
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Miltank posted:Mormons are not Christians- its the one thing all Christians can agree on. I would compare them more to the Gnostics than anything else.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:20
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CommieGIR posted:He won't burn in hell, remember? He'll just be stuck in eternal darkness. I'm sorry but no, I prayed on this point and I am quite sure of the revelation that I received. Kyrie eleison will burn in hell.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:22
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Mormons are more like Muslims than anything else.
Miltank fucked around with this message at 05:24 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 05:22
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Crowsbeak posted:I would compare them more to the Gnostics than anything else. Restorationist Christianity. Miltank posted:Mormons are more like Muslims than anything else. This I gotta hear 
CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 05:26 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 05:22
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Miltank posted:Mormons are more like Muslims than anything else. This is a total insult to Mormonism. Mormonism is true, while Islam is false and therefore they are completely different. If anything Christianity is identical to Islam because they are both wrong.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:26
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Salt Fish posted:This is a total insult to Mormonism. Mormonism is true, while Islam is false and therefore they are completely different. If anything Christianity is identical to Islam because they are both wrong. Its all idolatry anyways, which is ok 'cauae you can have your idols while I have my laws and pedantic legal interpretations also j smith totes wanted some 19th century pootytang and knew how to get it
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Nov 18, 2014 05:29
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CommieGIR posted:This I gotta hear Cool as hell.
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Nov 18, 2014 05:33
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Bwee posted:Has anyone else (like the OP perhaps) cast a spell before? Please don't be afraid to share I've made sacrifice to Dionysus a few times.
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Nov 18, 2014 06:33
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emfive posted:Since this thread is a predictable shitstorm I'll just drop in to recommend that anybody seriously contemplating the philosophical issues that are being dodged by shitposting to read some Richard Mitchell writings This sounds interesting, thank you.
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Nov 18, 2014 14:15
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CommieGIR posted:This I gotta hear In that Miltank knows nothing about either of them. Then again he doesn't know anything about his own religion either, sooooo...
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Nov 18, 2014 15:25
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How dare you insult my religion, that's so ignorant and intolerant. In other news Mormons and Muslims worship the same dumb Moon God, what idiots.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:08
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The verdict is in: this was a troll thread and OP is nowhere to be found.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:27
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Ninjasaurus posted:The verdict is in: this was a troll thread and OP is nowhere to be found. Probably. VitalSigns posted:How dare you insult my religion, that's so ignorant and intolerant. But the sun god is superior!
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Nov 18, 2014 16:28
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SedanChair posted:That's just coming up with stuff. Bacon said Pilate would not stay for an answer, but maybe he did. The mystical, insubstantial truth as represented by what Jesus said to the apostles wouldn't have made any sense to Pilate, and not because he was inured to it, because it's mystical hogwash in contrast to anything the dimly seen Master of the earliest texts would have said. There is a gap between the way you're thinking about it and how I'm thinking about it. Nearly everything in the bible is political. Take the OT genocide stuff, it's not really God killed group of people X. It's more like the author of that particular section place lives in a time and place where the Jews are at war with the people he's writing about God smiting/ helping the Jews kick the rear end of in the past. The historical story the author is writing is also commentary on the political situation he lives in. Think of it like propaganda. It's just the way the texts were used and written and it was even understood in the time they were written. The gospels are no different. They are constructed stories meant to convey a specific messages to specific audiences. Many things in them probably didn't happen. Why are each of the accounts in the gospels of the meeting with Pilate different? Jesus meeting Pilate probably didn't happen. Because only nobodies got crucified, important people were dealt with in other ways. Why would Pilate (who didn't seem to like or think much of Jews and there are examples of this I can provide) meet a Jewish nobody and talk about truth or care what a Jewish crowd thought? So the real question is what is the intent of whoever wrote John why does he present this interaction between Jesus and Pilate in this way. What is the author of John saying and why might it be important? I would ask the same type of questions about the OT interpretation Kyrie does. Being able to do this involves recognizing that the stories in the bible are myths: stories told by humans to communicate meaning with each other. Parts are definitely not factual. That should not be threatening to Christians. It should be especially nonthreatening to anyone who thinks Jesus is the Logos. It is a factual statement to say that the bible was written by people with agendas who occasionally made things up to try to influence the world and the people around them. Interpreting the bible as if it is perfect and directly from God is to deny a truth standing right in front of oneself. Logos-centric Christians (Kyrie) should not do that. Which is why I'm arguing with you about the interpretation of the Pilate story. Unrelated: This what passes for atheism.  FFRF foundation ad. An appeal to Reason (Logos), reality, with a universalized humanism. And the cherry is the use of the word "salvation". CommieGIR posted:Not that I really care, but they worship Christ as the son of god and recognize the trinity. Pretty sure that makes them Christian. Their trinity is not a trinity in the sense trinity is usually used in Christianity. But they are Christians in that they call themselves Christian and follow Jesus. They are not Christian in that they depart in fundamental ways from the rest of Christianity about things that most denominations agree define Christianity. Bar Ran Dun fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 16:33
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BrandorKP posted:This what passes for atheism. The FFRF does a lot of good work. BrandorKP posted:Their trinity is not a trinity in the sense trinity is usually used in Christianity. But they are Christians in that they call themselves Christian and follow Jesus. They are not Christian in that they depart in fundamental ways from the rest of Christianity about things that most denominations agree define Christianity. True, got me there. I looked it up and its defined as a Restorationist Christianity, which includes the Puritans and the Anabaptists.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:39
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BrandorKP posted:Their trinity is not a trinity in the sense trinity is usually used in Christianity. But they are Christians in that they call themselves Christian and follow Jesus. They are not Christian in that they depart in fundamental ways from the rest of Christianity about things that most denominations agree define Christianity. Well before you can define a doctrine that's nowhere in the bible as fundamental to Christianity, you have to kill and torture all the denominations of Christianity that don't agree. So mission accomplished, thanks Constantine, now we get to say who is Christian.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:47
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im a Catholicist so I don't know if I count as Christian for this thread. E: Oh wait forgot that KE is allegedly a Catholic, nevermind, I'm best Christian and can tell you non-trinitarians aren't Christian. You're welcome.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:51
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Technogeek posted:Which of the following anti-Catholic terms would you prefer to use: Mary-worshipper, papist, popery, whore of Babylon, or other? I like it. DrProsek posted:im a Catholicist so I don't know if I count as Christian for this thread. Yeah, this thread was started by a mary-worshipper, so even though you're not Christian, you're still good enough for this thread. (Renounce your blasphemy, renounce!) Mormons are no more or less Christian than the popery, which is to say they are not Christian but pretend to be.
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Nov 18, 2014 16:56
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Ninjasaurus posted:The verdict is in: this was a troll thread and OP is nowhere to be found. The OP literally made the Theological Argument From Letters On The Calendar and the famed Argument From How Poor And Stupid The Developing World Is, and it took you 14 pages to work out that's a troll?
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Nov 18, 2014 16:57
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Religious people have a lot in common with Anime fans. They get together each week to hear tales of heroes and villains and to discuss how those stories relate to their lives, they are inspired by their fandom to create art and literature exalting those stories and characters, and people find strength from being engaged with those stories and those communities that share those stories. Fascinatingly similar, religion and Anime.
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Nov 18, 2014 17:01
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