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Yeah and look where it got him.  Dude, F/Z is good and all, I get it, but every time someone complains about these characters doing something different than what people in Zero did, I have to roll my eyes.
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Nov 23, 2014 18:49
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It removes a lot of the romance of the thing when everyone just murders everyone wantonly.
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Nov 23, 2014 18:51
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It's not like "let's duke it out, but everyone retreats at the end" wasn't a constant theme throughout Fate/Zero either.
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Nov 23, 2014 18:54
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Fleve posted:What the gently caress is wrong with these people. Why doesn't anyone just straight up murder an enemy anymore. Sure, there's plenty of reasons for why character X let character Y live ( again ), but it felt a little forced. Kiritsugu would have dropped a building on Berserker by now.
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Nov 23, 2014 18:59
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It's probably frustrating when you don't know how the story is going to go. But most of these Masters are high school kids who barely have knowledge of the true purpose behind the Holy Grail and they aren't hardened killers like Kiritsugu.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:07
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Because Kiritsugu wanted to win at all costs to achieve The Greatest Good, Shirou is a doofus and wants everyone to be happy and Archer is just lazy.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:11
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kiritsugu was a butt, imo
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Nov 23, 2014 19:13
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Cake Attack posted:kiritsugu was a butt, imo The biggest
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Nov 23, 2014 19:14
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Pretty much.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:17
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Y'know, for all his big talk, Archer is every bit as stupid and small-minded as Shirou, just in a different direction. Letting a dangerous enemy live in hopes that maybe they might run off and kill a different, even more dangerous enemy is not a strategy with a high success rate, I imagine. I get the impression that half the reason he did it was to rub Shirou's nose in his coolguy "pragmatism" (ha!) Yes, I know there's an ultimate reason behind their dynamic, but still, I think this episode did a good job of demonstrating how those two relate to each other.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:32
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Squidster posted:I was also a little frustrated at how many hoops they jumped through this last episode to ensure that the status quo was maintained. And then he gets shanked because dropping a building on Ilya and Herk would've achieved jack and squat. The overall power level of FSN servants is higher, Gil aside.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:33
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That poo poo wouldn't have even worked on Lancelot. He'd have just walked out the rubble like "AAAAAAARTHURRRRRRRRR! FORGIVE ME FOR SLEEPING WITH YOUR WIIIIIIFE!"
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Nov 23, 2014 19:43
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Beef Waifu posted:That poo poo wouldn't have even worked on Lancelot. He'd have just walked out the rubble like "AAAAAAARTHURRRRRRRRR! PUNISH ME FOR SLEEPING WITH YOUR WIIIIIIFE!" Fixed for accuracy. And yeah dropping a building on Berserker would achieve precisely nothing except maybe pissing Illya off.
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Nov 23, 2014 19:59
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Which is why Kiritsugu always went for the master. I'm glad ufotable seem to be adding that dynamic to FSN more (like with the Rin vs Ilya scene).
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Nov 23, 2014 20:03
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Although that may be more Kirei's coaching than anything else.
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Nov 23, 2014 20:08
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It took a lot of willpower to stop watching the Tsubame Gaeshi scene and continue onto the rest of the episode. Goons weren't kidding when they said Ufotable nailed that one.
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Nov 23, 2014 20:25
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I note that Kiritsugu killed a grand total of one Master in the events of Zero, having fought that one three times previously without anyone dying.
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Nov 23, 2014 20:54
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I wonder how people who talk about how cool Kiritsugu was miss that part of the entire point of the franchise is underlining that Kiritsugu's methods were cruel and ultimately meaningless.
Rody One Half fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Nov 23, 2014 |
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Nov 23, 2014 21:00
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Rodyle posted:I wonder how people who talk about how cool Kiritsugu was miss that part of the entire point of the franchise is underlining that Kiritsugu's methods were cruel and ultimately meaningless. All of F/Z was basically leading up to trashing on Kiritsugu really. I feel like people think the cynicism angle that the show took made it cooler and more adult therefore it's better than dumb high school kids in FSN.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:13
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Rodyle posted:I wonder how people who talk about how cool Kiritsugu was miss that part of the entire point of the franchise is underlining that Kiritsugu's methods were cruel and ultimately meaningless. While I don't think Kiritugu's philosophy was anything admirable, and I don't particularly like him as a character, the things that happened to him and the things that he did were way, way more entertaining than Shirou, who runs around needing rescuing with more regularity than a Nintendo princess Like, for example, Kiritsugu would've shot Shinji in the head by now. Does that make him a "better" character than Shirou? Yes, probably.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:26
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UBW makes a lot more sense than people think so far. It's one of the things I like a lot about it. People aren't really that stupid.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:27
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Rodyle posted:I wonder how people who talk about how cool Kiritsugu was miss that part of the entire point of the franchise is underlining that Kiritsugu's methods were cruel and ultimately meaningless. Because they he was way more interesting to watch than kids being dumb.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:30
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Well, arguing over whether Kiritsugu was a cool guy or not (spoilers, he's a butt) is probably better than power levels. I guess.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:33
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Not sure why we're talking trash about Shirou, he explicitly did not want to let Caster get away.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:34
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Yeah, Shirou is more okay with gibbing Servants than Humans.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:40
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Genocyber posted:Because they he was way more interesting to watch than kids being dumb. Rejoice, boy! Your wish will be granted!
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Nov 23, 2014 21:43
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MonsieurChoc posted:Rejoice, boy! Your wish will be granted! Saying "It get's better" means nothing fyi.
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Nov 23, 2014 21:46
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Genocyber posted:Saying "It get's better" means nothing fyi. I just like Kirei.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:03
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It's kinda unfortunate as from what I understand F/Z isn't supposed to be seen first so that might be why seeing 'Dumb Kids Being Dumb' might not be as engaging as watching Kiritsugu bringing down a building.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:04
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Genocyber posted:Saying "It get's better" means nothing fyi.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:07
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Fleve posted:What the gently caress is wrong with these people. Why doesn't anyone just straight up murder an enemy anymore. Didn't he mention how it wouldn't have actually killed Caster if he "finished her off" there?
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Nov 23, 2014 22:16
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Kiritsugu obviously isn't a good guy, but having people target the master rather than the servant is interesting. That's part of why Caster is cool.Fangz posted:I note that Kiritsugu killed a grand total of one Master in the events of Zero, having fought that one three times previously without anyone dying.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:18
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Shiro is cool, Kiritsugu is not. The best part of Fate/Zero was the dumb teenager and his big goofy servant and their idealism so is this one (In different ways though).
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Nov 23, 2014 22:19
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Kiritsugu wasn't very interesting outside of his flashback. He tore a building down and played the gently caress out of Kayneth but Waver and Iskander clearly stole the show. Shirou at least has a character arc.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:31
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I don't think it's really a matter of good or bad when it comes to Kiritsugu. He's more of a plot device I suppose than an actual character, but he has his uses and his story fits into the larger narrative whole of the Fate franchise well enough. He'll be an interesting case to re-examine after UBW is all said and done at least.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:37
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p sure kiritsugu was the one who sniped the serial killer in the head
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Nov 23, 2014 22:44
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Phobophilia posted:p sure kiritsugu was the one who sniped the serial killer in the head in the chest. He wouldn't have had a chance to monologue about how pretty his blood was if he got headshotted.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:53
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You're both right.
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Nov 23, 2014 22:56
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Squidster posted:I was also a little frustrated at how many hoops they jumped through this last episode to ensure that the status quo was maintained. In this episode, both cases where a Servant let another another Servant go were direct results of having goals completely separate and contradictory of their Master's.
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Nov 23, 2014 23:05
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PunkBoy fucked around with this message at 00:55 on Nov 24, 2014 |
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Nov 24, 2014 00:46
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