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LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example. gently caress, I can't deal with this much brutal honesty. You have bested me, and I now wholly accept the superiority of the white race.
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Nov 25, 2014 00:59
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LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example. Dude dude dude did nobody teach you to code your racism?
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Nov 25, 2014 01:00
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LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example. If you're somehow older than 12, 
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Nov 25, 2014 01:06
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*panting* Sorry I'm late. Is this the thread where the racist numbskull is melting down because his poorly considered opinions are wildly unpopular?
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Nov 25, 2014 01:07
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Popular Thug Drink posted:*panting* Sorry I'm late. Is this the thread where the racist numbskull is melting down because his poorly considered opinions are wildly unpopular? Um I think he pretty clearly established he's not a racist? LuftWaffle posted:Nah That poo poo's pretty airtight.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:13
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LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example.  You know, drop mic actually works when you make a valid point, not where you expose yourself as a moron.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:13
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LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example. Lazy joke aside, I thought modern day racists were more advocates of "we should never have brought them over to begin with, thereby maintaining glorious racial purity" instead because that at least made it sound like they just wanted the black people to go away, not be enslaved  You seem like you're really half-assing this whole race realist thing, man.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:21
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I wonder who counts as White in Luftwaffle's eyes. Asians too for that mattter.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:46
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paragon1 posted:I wonder who counts as White in Luftwaffle's eyes. Asians too for that mattter. Well apparently white people can't hold onto a microphone.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:47
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CommieGIR posted:
At this point I think that was just him admitting he's trolling us and doesn't believe a word of it. Though I'm probably wrong.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:48
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DarklyDreaming posted:At this point I think that was just him admitting he's trolling us and doesn't believe a word of it. Though I'm probably wrong. Sadly, I do recall him laying down similar arguments quite a while back. Some people really are just white supremacists, hard as it is to believe.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:49
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Yeah it's interesting how often the height of trolling ends up being white supremacism.LuftWaffle posted:There are situations where the best people would be black. Picking cotton or playing cornerback for example. no, stop, come back Do you feel unwelcome or something? We're giving you lots of attention.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:50
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Like do Slavs count as white? What about Italians? Spaniards and Portuguese? Irish? Germans? All have been excluded from "whiteness" by bigots at some point or another? Also interesting to finally see a living example of the "Jews and Asians are almost as good as/honorary whites" breed of scum sucking shithead.
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Nov 25, 2014 01:54
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paragon1 posted:Like do Slavs count as white? What about Italians? Spaniards and Portuguese? Irish? Germans? All have been excluded from "whiteness" by bigots at some point or another? If you can pass for white, in the US you are white. Unless you have an accent, and then you're screwed, foreigner.
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Nov 25, 2014 02:10
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LuftWaffle posted:The government is a product of some group of people. So are the laws. So are the private enterprises like CNN/Fox/MSNBC. So are public enterprises like BBC/NPR. These are all products of the same civilization(s). Everything starts with the people, because everything is the product of people. The government that makes things you like is also a product of people. If you lived in a civilization with lovely people you wouldn't have CNN/Fox/MSNBC OR BBC/NPR, and may not have a real state at all. This may be the most minor of problems with your posts, but... LuftWaffle, do you believe that a tool of some level of precision and accuracy can produce something of higher precision and accuracy? Because, well, if not... http://home.comcast.net/~jaswensen/machines/straight_edge/straight_edge.html Government is designed specifically to cancel out the individual errors of the people in charge. We use democracy because even if some of the people in charge are shitbags, they can't gently caress everything up. It is a novel idea for reducing the input any one person has so as to allow the best aspects of everyone to be implemented and the worst to be weeded out in a relatively fair and impartial manner. If government depended on the Founding Fathers being literally perfect in every way to make a decent government... well, that would be problematic. But even racist slave-owners can collaborate and form a system that is better than any of them individually, and that can be continually improved. tl;dr: People handscrape, Therefore government. How's my praexology, Jrode?
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Nov 25, 2014 02:56
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"When I was an ancap, I was Not Racist[citation needed], but then I learned to love the State once I realized it was the best way to accomplish my lifeling dreams to keep blackie in his place and ensure the aristocratic rule of the master race!" Hmmm it's not the same as needling jrod. Man, it's just not funny when this guy actually is a loving Nazi.
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Nov 25, 2014 03:42
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 Well, this thread took a turn, didn't it? Holy poo poo, white supremacist letting his flag fly proudly. I didn't think anyone would actually come into this thread and just straight up admit to it, but here we loving are. This... was magic.
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Nov 25, 2014 04:49
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TLM3101 posted:
Pfft look at these plebs that can't read. He obviously said he's not a racist, he is above those dreg  . He is an enlightened rasist good sir I'll have you know what for!
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Nov 25, 2014 04:53
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TLM3101 posted:
In a free market of ethnicities, those with the most vibrant, healthy characteristics will naturally survive and those with weak, degenerate characteristics will wither away. Hitler was just trying to be an entrepreneur
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Nov 25, 2014 04:56
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People need to find a new angle for trolling that isn't just your opinions but louder and with posturing. Let's try this instead: a libertarian approach is the most efficient method for ensuring the protection of animal rights by not subsidising the fundamentally aggressive act of neutering pets.
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Nov 25, 2014 05:36
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DarklyDreaming posted:At this point I think that was just him admitting he's trolling us and doesn't believe a word of it. Though I'm probably wrong. Jokes on us, he was only pretending to be subhuman garbage. 
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Nov 25, 2014 05:44
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icantfindaname posted:Hitler wasn't a monster. He was just ahead of the curve
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Nov 25, 2014 05:46
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chaos rhames posted:People need to find a new angle for trolling that isn't just your opinions but louder and with posturing. You could make a similar argument about circumcision. When the family has to feel the full cost of every single procedure, getting frivolous procedures like getting their kid circumcised would have a larger financial cost tied to it.
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Nov 25, 2014 05:56
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CommieGIR posted:If you can pass for white, in the US you are white. Unless you have an accent, and then you're screwed, foreigner. In my town it is still illegal for Poles to operate oxen between the hours of 7:00 a.m. and 7:00 p.m.
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Nov 25, 2014 06:03
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TLM3101 posted:
I'm not gonna lie, the first and second time I skimmed over his post I totally missed the explicit racism. It was only when it was helpfully bolded for me that I realized that I was missing the stinkiest turd in his poo poo pie.
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Nov 25, 2014 06:39
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I'm not gonna lie, the first and second time I skimmed over his post I totally missed the explicit racism. It was only when it was helpfully bolded for me that I realized that I was missing the stinkiest turd in his poo poo pie. I read through his first post in here once and did a double take, because I couldn't believe I'd read this: LuftWaffle posted:[...] I really was wondering if it was just a slip, or some other point that he'd wanted to make and gotten horribly mangled, but then... Nope! Doubling down hard on the out-and-out racism. The best ( or worst ) thing, though, is that he pretty much explicitly said that he wasn't an an-cap anymore because he wouldn't be able to oppress minorities in an an-cap society. The mind loving boggles. edit for really idiotic typo. 
TLM3101 fucked around with this message at 08:34 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 08:18
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TLM3101 posted:I read through his forst post in here once and did a double take, because I couldn't believe I'd read this: Well the good news is that it cost him  The funny thing is that he is wrong, he would be able to oppress them in An-Cap land, its just that the current crop of An-Capers that he hangs out with have a personal dislike of overt racism. Your rank and file libertarian isn't necessarily racist, even if they hold policies that will hurt people in minority groups. They're just dumb.
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Nov 25, 2014 08:25
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True enough. I will say this for JRodefeld; As much as he's bought into the Hoppe/Rothbard idiocy, I don't think he's racist, even if his proposed solutions to the problem he's seeing ( real and imagined ) would make minorities worse off. His morals and ethics are just obscene in general, rather than having a specific racial animus.
TLM3101 fucked around with this message at 08:49 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 08:45
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TLM3101 posted:True enough. I will say this for JRodefeld; As much as he's bought into the Hoppe/Rothbard idiocy, I don't think he's racist Uhhhh... jrodefeld posted:I want to do something a little bit different for a minute. I just listened to an interview Tom Woods did with the economist George Reisman and an article he wrote was brought up that contended that "Western civilization is objectively superior". This is VERY similar to what Hoppe has said, but of course you all chose to categorize that statement as a reflection of racism and white supremacist attitudes. Just saying, Western Civilization is superior and yeah technically the native americans were the first humans to find America but they are objectively inferior so we can all agree that real discovery was made by the first white guy to come along. This is not racist because my problem with Indians is they're all savages, and racism would be having a problem with their skin color only. Jrod is racist. About the most generous I could be is to agree that he doesn't personally believe he is racist, because he has an idiosyncratic definition of racism wherein it's not racist if they really are inferior because then his attitude is justified by  facts and racism is disliking someone's skin color and only that.E: Side note, it's amusing how empirical evidence is unreliable and we must reason all sociological truths out with pure logic as our only guide, except when it comes to the inferiority of non-Anglo cultures and then well hey just look around it's obvious whose race is better 
VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 08:59 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 08:51
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VitalSigns posted:
... You know, I had managed to completely forget about that? Yeah, I was utterly wrong, JRod is just as racist as the next libertarian. God loving drat it.  edit: VVV Yeah, I hosed up. For some reason I'd completely blanked on that whole part of his argumentation. I'd blame it on  ing in horror at LuftWaffle and the Ferguson debacle, but honestly I plum forgot about it.
TLM3101 fucked around with this message at 10:02 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 09:04
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TLM3101 posted:True enough. I will say this for JRodefeld; As much as he's bought into the Hoppe/Rothbard idiocy, I don't think he's racist, even if his proposed solutions to the problem he's seeing ( real and imagined ) would make minorities worse off. His morals and ethics are just obscene in general, rather than having a specific racial animus. I agree that he isn't motivated by racial animus. However he is racist, he tried to defend the idea of inherent differences between races several times in this thread and others (see "blacks have a lower time preference than whites and that's why they're poor", also the whole western civilization thing). That kind of racial and cultural chauvinism that is still extremely harmful, even if it didn't lead to lynchings. You don't have to be explicitly hateful to be racist, not by the dictionary definition anyway(just to be authoritative/pedantic about it). E: VitalSigns said it better. But yeah, while Jrod probably isn't about to join the Klan, that doesn't make his attitudes any less racist.
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Nov 25, 2014 09:36
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paragon1 posted:Like do Slavs count as white? What about Italians? Spaniards and Portuguese? Irish? Germans? All have been excluded from "whiteness" by bigots at some point or another? I'm in the middle of this book, and it's really loving weird seeing Thomas Jefferson and Ralph Waldo Emerson fetishize Saxons to such an absurd degree.
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Nov 25, 2014 09:54
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I think Jrod is technically not racist, just a cultural chauvinist. Based on my experience with such people, he'd claim that there's nothing inherently wrong with PoC - they just happen to adopt the wrong cultural values and that leads to problems that would be avoided if they had happened to pick better (i.e. Western) values. He probably has yet to realize that the logic behind the claim "Western culture is objectively the best" is circular - "Western culture is best because it adheres most closely to Western cultural values."
Pththya-lyi fucked around with this message at 12:32 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 12:29
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I don't think Hoppes' argument is worth spending any time on, because it's just pure tautology taking on some weird chauvinistic form. He defines advanced cultures as White/Western, and then correctly explains that, yes, other advanced cultures who are neither white nor Western are actually Western cultures. Thus, advanced East Asian cultures like Japan or South Korea are actually Western cultures, which are superior. Pointing out other advanced societies that are neither white nor Western doesn't refute the thesis because those cultures are also Western, by Hoppes' definition. It makes sense if you pretend that "white" and "western" aren't pre-established words that have meanings. It's kind of like grouping up certain positive character traits as "manliness." It's super-chauvinistic, but nobody will deny that women can also express those traits, and as such women are perfectly able to be manly. Heavy neutrino fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Nov 25, 2014 |
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Nov 25, 2014 14:01
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I'm actually not 100% convinced that jrod is actively racist so much as he is so privileged that he's blind to the racial implications of the libertarian "thinkers" that he mindlessly parrots. He certainly still says racist things but the seem to stem from ignorance rather than malice.
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Nov 25, 2014 15:32
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Who What Now posted:I'm actually not 100% convinced that jrod is actively racist so much as he is so privileged that he's blind to the racial implications of the libertarian "thinkers" that he mindlessly parrots. He certainly still says racist things but the seem to stem from ignorance rather than malice. This is true, but unfortunately it is the most damaging (and patronizing) form of racism. Racism is a motivation and an social analytical framework, it does not need to be intentional.
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Nov 25, 2014 15:52
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archangelwar posted:This is true, but unfortunately it is the most damaging (and patronizing) form of racism. Racism is a motivation and an social analytical framework, it does not need to be intentional. Oh I absolutely agree, I just think it's a distinction that needed to be laid out is all.
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Nov 25, 2014 16:11
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I would agree that for the naive stripe of Libertarian like jrod, they aren't maliciously racist in the sense that they hope black people get hosed over in their system because they hate them and would enjoy seeing it. But like, he agrees with Rothbard that the reason for black poverty rates is the indolent, hedonistic, short-sighted nature of the Negro (eg "high time preference") and that's racist as gently caress. I wouldn't characterize the American eugenics movement as "not actively racist" just because they may have genuinely thought that sterilizing black women without their consent was helping the poor dears who just can't control their animal natures.
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Nov 25, 2014 20:30
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I'm a little uncomfortable with calling people racist. It's a loaded word with a loaded context, and all it really does is shutdown conversations and serves to make us feel superior to another person. The minute you call someone else a racist, how are they supposed to react? It's a conversation killer. The minute you call me a racist, that's when it's over. I can't defend myself against the claim. I can't say "Here I am with a black person having a lovely dinner!" "Here I am, helping some Jewish rabbi's cross the street!" "Here I am, embracing a foreign culture while respecting it!" It's impossible, and it just serves as a reason to disengage. I honestly believe that if you want someone to fail the "is he a racist" test, you will find a reason for them to fail. People do hold prejudices. I want to word this properly, so here it goes: I know I have held prejudices in the past. Not actively. Not anything that's full blown racist. But if you're saying I've never made an assumption about a person because of his or her race, I would have to say that it's probably not true. The thing is, I try to challenge myself. When I realize the implications of what I'm saying or thinking or doing, I try to push myself further to be a better person. There's a lot of things that have changed, even in my lifetime (and I'm not that old). You know what. 15 years ago, if you asked me if I was in favor of gay marriage, I think I'd say no. Today, you'd ask me the same question, I say hell yes. What changed? I got more experience. I realized how my views didn't make sense. I saw the reality underneath the convenient explanations I could come up with. I just couldn't see a reason to tell two people who were in love that they couldn't get married because of something as meaningless as gender. Even back then, I wasn't a homophobe. I didn't see anything wrong with homosexuality. But I was just under a misguided impression about what marriage was. But I grew up, and saw things in a different light, and realized I was wrong. But so did a lot of people. When I was 10, we saw no problems using homophobic slurs. Now, when I watch a show like Andy Richter Controls the Universe, and one of the characters uses "gay" in a pejorative way (referring to why he doesn't want to see a musical), it strikes me as wrong and bizarre. It really pulls you away. 11 years ago, when the show aired, we wouldn't bat an eye. Jrodefeld is an idiot. He holds views that do have strong racial implications, but he just doesn't understand it, whether it's stupidity or naivety or whatever other explanation we might have for him. But what good does smearing him as a racist do? Is it so you can feel superior? Then maybe you should look at yourself and really think "Hey, did I ever think something stupid that really had bigger implications that I realized." As I said, calling someone a racist is really a reason to disengage with them and their ideas. For example, Sheriff Joe. We call him a racist because we find his ideas so full of bias and malice that we simply find them so wrong that we don't see the need to reason with them.
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Nov 26, 2014 02:04
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Now I'm wondering which Jrode will hate more, being called racist or being told that he just doesn't understand the ideas he believes. Both have to sting pretty bad for a being of pure reason like himself.
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Nov 26, 2014 02:32
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