D&D NEXT: Infinite Posts of the Abyss

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Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

NorgLyle posted:

I remember back in high school playing an old computer RPG called Star Trail where just walking from town to town was generally more lethal than the actual combat because for some reason the designers had decided to include a random disease system. The game was not about diseases and there was, for the most part, nothing to do regarding swamp rot or whatever aside from sub-Oregon Trail level level 'rest and eat until it goes away' but I'm sure that whoever created the systems for PCs contracting the various ailments would tell you it was very realistic. That kind of stuff appeals to a certain type of gamer and I would be happy if we had a patron saint to come and drive them into the sea.

In a hypothetical game about "mounting an expedition into the unknown wilderness", this sort of thing is OK, or even good when it interacts with other mechanics in interesting ways. AD&D was trying to be this game, amongst other things. The problem we have now is that somehow all that semi-connected bullshit gets cargo-culted from edition to edition and everyone cries endlessly if any of it is changed or left out, even if it's un-fun and irrelevant when you look at what the game's actually about now.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 10:42

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# ? May 29, 2024 14:34

thespaceinvader: Mar 30, 2011; The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!

Darwinism posted:

I had a friend that could, and did, poison rocks to death, thanks to the Assassin (IIRC) having a feat that let you ignore poison immunity.

A Paragon Path IIRC.

It works fine, but the opportunity cost of using poison instead of, say, radiant or cold, is huge in terms of pure damage.

That always bothered me about 4e - that there were only really two ways to do massive damage (in terms of optimising around damage types, anyway) and they involved glowing or freezing. Not, say, fire or acid.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 11:28

Sage Genesis: Aug 14, 2014; OG Murderhobo

thespaceinvader posted:

A Paragon Path IIRC.

Both.

The Venom Hand Master is an Assassin feat that lets you ignore poison resistance. But you can also do the same with some paragon paths such as Fang of Zehir.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 14:19

Darwinism: Jan 6, 2008

thespaceinvader posted:

A Paragon Path IIRC.

It works fine, but the opportunity cost of using poison instead of, say, radiant or cold, is huge in terms of pure damage.

That always bothered me about 4e - that there were only really two ways to do massive damage (in terms of optimising around damage types, anyway) and they involved glowing or freezing. Not, say, fire or acid.

Yeah, 4E is pretty drat inflexible when it comes to pure damage optimization, it's far from a perfect game - utility powers are another gripe of mine for that system.

I had such high hopes at the beginning that 5E would build on the stuff that made 4E good.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 17:16

Mormon Star Wars: Aug 13, 2005; It's a minotaur race...

There are a lot of reverse-engineered BECMI class creation rules. In addition to Dragon Magazine's article on it (in the May 1986 issue, thanks Piazza!) there's this:

http://breeyark.org/building-the-perfect-class/

# ? Nov 22, 2014 18:27

ProfessorCirno: Feb 17, 2011; The strongest! The smartest!
The rightest!

thespaceinvader posted:

A Paragon Path IIRC.

It works fine, but the opportunity cost of using poison instead of, say, radiant or cold, is huge in terms of pure damage.

That always bothered me about 4e - that there were only really two ways to do massive damage (in terms of optimising around damage types, anyway) and they involved glowing or freezing. Not, say, fire or acid.

Fire is actually the most damaging! You just need a non-weapon form of easy fire access for it to work!

Acid isn't too bad if you use a warlock, but is still far more unsupported.

Really though, this is only for top of the line optimization. A good striker can do good damage without relying on that sort of thing if you're ok with not being the best of the best of the best.

Oh and the aforementioned Drow was a rogue, multiclass Executioner, with the Vhaerun theme.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 18:56

Name Change: Oct 9, 2005

Generally if you want to break the game's math you have to make people freeze, glow, or in some cases light their heads on fire. Everyone else who is not doing that can still play, of course.

Poison is doable if you take all the correct poison options, but yes it's way easier to do lots with radiant, for example, because radiant is one of the things they made sure to over-support at every level of play.

As a person who enjoys making gimmick builds that just do one thing exclusively the balance options in 4E aren't too bad, the real problem is that classes outside of the first few they released tend to be really underwhelming by comparison.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 19:18

Trast: Oct 20, 2010; Three games, thousands of playthroughs. 90% of the players don't know I exist. Still a redhead saving the galaxy with a [Right Hook].

My friends recently got my brother and I to try D&D for the first time with the 5e rules and we're enjoying it a lot. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on the monk class. In the manual it looks pretty fun but I'd appreciate hearing some opinions on it since I'm still learning everything.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 19:37

MonsterEnvy: Feb 4, 2012; Shocked I tell you

Trast posted:

My friends recently got my brother and I to try D&D for the first time with the 5e rules and we're enjoying it a lot. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on the monk class. In the manual it looks pretty fun but I'd appreciate hearing some opinions on it since I'm still learning everything.

I doubt this is the best place to ask. Anyway it looks fun at a glance but I am not familiar enough with the class to add any other input on it.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 21:36

dwarf74: Sep 2, 2012; Buglord

The monk is probably one of the top classes in the game, IMO.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 22:13

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

Trast posted:

My friends recently got my brother and I to try D&D for the first time with the 5e rules and we're enjoying it a lot. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on the monk class. In the manual it looks pretty fun but I'd appreciate hearing some opinions on it since I'm still learning everything.

A friend of mine DMed a game where one of the players was a Monk and he said the Monk was an "underwhelming" melee combatant compared to the fighter and the druid that were also in the game. That said, their game has only reached level 2 and so far I've found everything pretty underwhelming before level 3-5 when most classes start getting extra options and abilities.

Monk seems like it will suffer from being an unarmoured melee class. I haven't seen it in play, but it looks like you'll be less armoured than a fighter or paladin and have a smaller hp pool and less ability to self heal than a moon druid.

Way of the Four Elements looks like it would be the most fun tradition. It'll probably suffer from "jump through these hoops to be a wizard, only not as good", but you can take sweeping cinder strikes and hadoken the gently caress out of people which might make up for it, and you can always default back to kicking the hell out of your opponent.

dwarf74 posted:

The monk is probably one of the top classes in the game, IMO.

You posted this while I was writing. Can you explain why? I was thinking of testing Monk out next time I get a game, but I can't see a way to do it well.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 22:18

ritorix: Jul 22, 2007; Vancian Roulette

Trast posted:

My friends recently got my brother and I to try D&D for the first time with the 5e rules and we're enjoying it a lot. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on the monk class. In the manual it looks pretty fun but I'd appreciate hearing some opinions on it since I'm still learning everything.

I'm playing a monk in our home game. Only level three, but a couple of things I've noticed so far. First, make sure you take full advantage of the weapons available to you. That means use a quarterstaff with 2 hands, you'll hit for 1d8+DEX and 1d4+DEX with your unarmed attack. Unarmed doesn't have to be a fist attack, so flavor it as a kick, bite, whatever you want. Bring a shortbow too for when you aren't or don't want to be in melee range.

Second, monks aren't tanky. Don't dive right into the thick of things, and if you do, the best use of your Ki is often to Dodge while you are in melee.

I went Shadow to get access to Silence, Minor illusion, Pass without trace and a few others. Their spell list stays useful and gets cheaper as you level and get more Ki. Haven't got to use them much yet though.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 22:20

Trast: Oct 20, 2010; Three games, thousands of playthroughs. 90% of the players don't know I exist. Still a redhead saving the galaxy with a [Right Hook].

Thanks for the feedback so far. I really like the look of the elemental tradition. I also have a story I'd like to tell for a monks perspective so I'm going to keep reading up and put one together.

ritorix posted:

I'm playing a monk in our home game. Only level three, but a couple of things I've noticed so far. First, make sure you take full advantage of the weapons available to you. That means use a quarterstaff with 2 hands, you'll hit for 1d8+DEX and 1d4+DEX with your unarmed attack. Unarmed doesn't have to be a fist attack, so flavor it as a kick, bite, whatever you want. Bring a shortbow too for when you aren't or don't want to be in melee range.

Second, monks aren't tanky. Don't dive right into the thick of things, and if you do, the best use of your Ki is often to Dodge while you are in melee.

I went Shadow to get access to Silence, Minor illusion, Pass without trace and a few others. Their spell list stays useful and gets cheaper as you level and get more Ki. Haven't got to use them much yet though.

So that would be a two handed strike with the quarterstaff and then the unarmed could be a kick, nice. I'll keep that in mind.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 22:34

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

Trast posted:

So that would be a two handed strike with the quarterstaff and then the unarmed could be a kick, nice. I'll keep that in mind.

You said you've just got into D&D, right? You can really describe your attack however you like, the rules stay the same regardless.

"I make a 2 handed quarterstaff attack and an unarmed strike" could be described as "I take the Stance of the Oscillating Weasel, kick my quarterstaff into him, catch it on the rebound, and pirouette around it to kick him in the head" or "I loving headbutt him then smash him with the table leg".

e: You don't have to do this though. I always like to describe what the character is actually doing, other people want to say "I attack" and leave it at that. In D&D, either way is fine as long as you and the DM both understand which rule you're using.

e2: You can really "reskin" anything you want. Like, sweeping cinder strikes effectively says "you cast burning hands like a wizard", but if you describe it as throwing a hadoken or as kicking so fast that the air in front of your foot catches on fire and shoots towards your enemy, it still does the same thing.

Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Nov 22, 2014

# ? Nov 22, 2014 22:54

xiw: Sep 25, 2011; i wake up at night
night action madness nightmares
maybe i am scum
Cpig Haiku contest 2020 winner

Cackle fever triggers when you take damage, and if you fail the save, you take damage. Ouch.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 23:08

Trast: Oct 20, 2010; Three games, thousands of playthroughs. 90% of the players don't know I exist. Still a redhead saving the galaxy with a [Right Hook].

AlphaDog posted:

You said you've just got into D&D, right? You can really describe your attack however you like, the rules stay the same regardless.

"I make a 2 handed quarterstaff attack and an unarmed strike" could be described as "I take the Stance of the Oscillating Weasel, kick my quarterstaff into him, catch it on the rebound, and pirouette around it to kick him in the head" or "I loving headbutt him then smash him with the table leg".

e: You don't have to do this though. I always like to describe what the character is actually doing, other people want to say "I attack" and leave it at that. In D&D, either way is fine as long as you and the DM both understand which rule you're using.

Right, Ritorix described the situation and I was just repeating it. The DM is being patient with us and eases us into the roleplaying aspect which we are getting better at. We've actually managed to RP our way out of a few situations that could have ended in big brawls.

Don't get me wrong though the DM is still torturing us as any DM would. :rolldice:

# ? Nov 22, 2014 23:20

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

Oh, right. Sorry, from what you posted it sounded like "the unarmed attack could be a kick" was news to you. Sounds like you've got a good DM, which is probably the most important factor in having fun with D&D.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 23:26

Slightly Lions: Apr 13, 2009; Look what I can do!

xiw posted:

Cackle fever triggers when you take damage, and if you fail the save, you take damage. Ouch.

The Giggle Loop.

# ? Nov 22, 2014 23:46

thespaceinvader: Mar 30, 2011; The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!

It's really more of a Giggle Stack.

_{It's so rare to find someone who actually watched Coupling}

# ? Nov 22, 2014 23:57

Trast: Oct 20, 2010; Three games, thousands of playthroughs. 90% of the players don't know I exist. Still a redhead saving the galaxy with a [Right Hook].

AlphaDog posted:

Oh, right. Sorry, from what you posted it sounded like "the unarmed attack could be a kick" was news to you. Sounds like you've got a good DM, which is probably the most important factor in having fun with D&D.

The DM and my other buddy are both experienced players and they try to keep it fun and teach us the ropes. Also in a way they are learning 5e with us so it's interesting to hear how the game has changed over time.

# ? Nov 23, 2014 03:40

Ratpick: Oct 9, 2012; And no one ate dinner that night.

thespaceinvader posted:

It's really more of a Giggle Stack.

_{It's so rare to find someone who actually watched Coupling}

Well you can't call it a Giggle Stack now can you? That'd be ridiculous.

_{Coupling was the best show.}

# ? Nov 23, 2014 10:28

DrOgreface: Jun 22, 2013; His Evil Never Sleeps

It's not like my barbarian has a bucket of ears...

# ? Nov 23, 2014 19:58

ascendance: Feb 19, 2013

Quick and dirty morale system based on AD&D, for D&D5.

Make morale checks when:
Facing an obviously superior force DC 10 each round
25% of the force is slain or the leader is disabled DC 12
50% of the force is slain or if the leader is killed
DC 15

All monsters may add proficiency bonus to the check according to their hit dice.

Henchmen or hirelings add the Charisma bonus of their leader to the check (this bonus is lost if the leader if disabled).

Fanatical monsters add their best Ability Score bonus to the roll. Brave monsters add their second best Ability Score. Steady monsters add their third best. Cowardly monsters add their worst Ability Score bonus.

Gain Advantage on the Morale check if: kill or eliminate an enemy, enemies desert or flee, inflict casualties without receiving any

Gain Disadvantage on the Morale check if: taking casualties without receiving any, allies flee or desert, allies killed

Success: you keep fighting!
Fail by 1-5 fighting retreat/disengage
Fail by 6-10 flee in disarray
Fail by 11+ surrender

I am also going to say that you can make intimidate checks vs. 8+proficiency bonus of enemy+Wisdom bonus of enemy to force a Morale check.

ascendance fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Nov 23, 2014

# ? Nov 23, 2014 21:32

P.d0t: Dec 27, 2007; I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

ascendance posted:

I am also going to say that you can make intimidate checks vs. 8+proficiency bonus of enemy+Wisdom bonus of enemy to force a Morale check.

As an Action or a Bonus Action or...?
Targets only one enemy?

# ? Nov 23, 2014 23:24

mastershakeman: Oct 28, 2008; by vyelkin

Does 5e differentiate much between ranger and druid ethos? I've been poring over 2e and 4es descriptions of those classes because in the homebrew I okay, druids are Celtic pagans instead of nature lovers, so the rangers are inhabiting more of the nature guarding role. I'm hoping to expand the depth of what they do but narrow the focus but am totally lost on just what the hell a ranger is (I.e. not a guy with two scimitars)

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:09

The Crotch: Oct 16, 2012; by Nyc_Tattoo

"Guy who doesn't really do anything terribly well," in my experience playing one in 5e.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:14

Rannos22: Mar 30, 2011; Everything's the same as it always is.

mastershakeman posted:

Does 5e differentiate much between ranger and druid ethos? I've been poring over 2e and 4es descriptions of those classes because in the homebrew I okay, druids are Celtic pagans instead of nature lovers, so the rangers are inhabiting more of the nature guarding role. I'm hoping to expand the depth of what they do but narrow the focus but am totally lost on just what the hell a ranger is (I.e. not a guy with two scimitars)

A ranger is an Aragorn.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:19

ascendance: Feb 19, 2013

P.d0t posted:

As an Action or a Bonus Action or...?
Targets only one enemy?

One check is made for each similar group of monsters. So you would target one group of monsters at a time. Haven't decided if its a bonus action or regular action. Probably a bonus action if you narrate how your regular action is terrifying and intimidating.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:23

Lemniscate Blue: Apr 21, 2006; Here we go again.

Rannos22 posted:

A ranger is an Aragorn.

In a world of Gandalfs.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:26

Harthacnut: Jul 29, 2014

mastershakeman posted:

Does 5e differentiate much between ranger and druid ethos? I've been poring over 2e and 4es descriptions of those classes because in the homebrew I okay, druids are Celtic pagans instead of nature lovers, so the rangers are inhabiting more of the nature guarding role. I'm hoping to expand the depth of what they do but narrow the focus but am totally lost on just what the hell a ranger is (I.e. not a guy with two scimitars)

It describes rangers as defenders of civilization, like the Night's Watch I guess, protecting settlements from wild beasts or uppity barbarians.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 02:31

Ratoslov: Feb 15, 2012; Now prepare yourselves! You're the guests of honor at the Greatest Kung Fu Cannibal BBQ Ever!

Harthacnut posted:

It describes rangers as defenders of civilization, like the Night's Watch I guess, protecting settlements from wild beasts or uppity barbarians.

So they're Witchers?

# ? Nov 24, 2014 03:54

Fashionable Jorts: Jan 18, 2010; Maybe if I'm busy it could keep me from you

Ratoslov posted:

So they're Witchers?

Pretty much. The idea of rangers are really cool, like fighters but living on the fringe and dabbling in magic and mysticism. But unfortunately everything they do can be done so much better by others.

That being said, I would love to run a campaign of only rangers.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 04:07

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

Oh poo poo guys, I've been doing D&D wrong for decades by just giving the ranger's special niche of "guy who hangs around the edges of civilisation and fights evil" to every PC class.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 04:39

Ratoslov: Feb 15, 2012; Now prepare yourselves! You're the guests of honor at the Greatest Kung Fu Cannibal BBQ Ever!

Give'em 'guy who makes lovely potions out of monster bits and vodka, then gets high off them before going into battle'.

# ? Nov 24, 2014 05:03

Red Hood: Feb 22, 2007; It's too late. You had your chance. And I'm just getting started.

So our group is just about done with the abortion that is 'Lost Mines of Phandelver', and the group wants to head into the 'Tyranny of Dragons' storyline next. The problem is that 'Horde of the Dragon Queen' is designed to start at 1st level and take players through (roughly) 8th level. 'Lost Mines of Phandelver' takes characters from 1st through 5th level.

Has anyone heard of, or thought of, a way to integrate Lost Mines into Horde of the Dragon Queen without having do go through the first half of HotDQ and rewrite all of the Encounters to challenge 5th level characters? I assume that it'll make no sense to just jump in the middle and running it as is will be a bore for 5th level characters.

We can't even skip to Rise of Tiamat because that's for 8th level characters. It gives me a headache that the intro adventure in the Starter Kit doesn't match up with HotDQ.

...I'm going to have to re-write the encounters, aren't I?

# ? Nov 25, 2014 06:34

Grimpond: Dec 24, 2013

they might not like it, but what about setting them back to level 1 and letting them keep some of the loot as legacy items or something

# ? Nov 25, 2014 07:36

Waador: Sep 11, 2001; Smashin' down the light.; Pillbug

Red Hood posted:

So our group is just about done with the abortion that is 'Lost Mines of Phandelver', and the group wants to head into the 'Tyranny of Dragons' storyline next. The problem is that 'Horde of the Dragon Queen' is designed to start at 1st level and take players through (roughly) 8th level. 'Lost Mines of Phandelver' takes characters from 1st through 5th level.

Has anyone heard of, or thought of, a way to integrate Lost Mines into Horde of the Dragon Queen without having do go through the first half of HotDQ and rewrite all of the Encounters to challenge 5th level characters? I assume that it'll make no sense to just jump in the middle and running it as is will be a bore for 5th level characters.

We can't even skip to Rise of Tiamat because that's for 8th level characters. It gives me a headache that the intro adventure in the Starter Kit doesn't match up with HotDQ.

...I'm going to have to re-write the encounters, aren't I?

I don't actually think it would matter if you let them start Hoard of the Dragon Queen at level five. The first part of the campaign thrusts you into a city under attack by 200 to 300 cultists, with the support of a blue dragon, and several level 5+ NPC commanders. At least half of the scripted fights in the first two parts of the game are intended to play out as impossible to win and force you to run away with your tail between your legs, or get creative and use stealth or rules shenanigans to survive. Whether you start that game at level 1 or level 5, you aren't going to achieve a different result in the first few sections of the game because it's not mechanically possible to end up with a result different from the one the game forces upon you.

# ? Nov 25, 2014 09:02

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

I posted the other day that my bear druid felt ridiculously tanky, more so than the party fighter. I told this to a friend (who was not in the game) and his opinion was that paladins and maybe fighters should be more tanky than druids, so he did some math. I also did some math, but nowhere near as much.

Here's the two scenarios and results he came up with, with my stuff underlined (I mostly just asked questions). Please pick this apart or use it as a base for doing something better or whatever else.

quote:

The scenario, an infinite conga line of orcs (+5 to hit, 9 damage (I like the option of flat damages for everything in this edition)). How many rounds can each 6th level character stay up before dying?

Some assumptions: each character has a +2 Con value for calculating HP, let's give the Druid a +1 Dex bonus as well for when he drops out of Bear shape.

Each person takes the fixed value for HP on level up.

I'm going to use a simplified version of the damage per round formula that the Pathfinder crowd likes: Damage Per Round = Chance to Hit * Damage.

Contender 1: The Druid

Available Defenses: Polar Bear * 2 (12AC, 42 HP) Wild Shape Healing (assuming you burn all slots on this it's 19d8, let's use 4.5 as the average roll), Druid Form (15AC, 45 HP)

The orc has a 70% chance to hit the bear, so the orc's DPR is 0.7 * 9=6.3

Bear HP is 84 + (19*4.5) = 169.5
Therefore the bear is up for (169.5/6.3) 26.90 rounds.

The orc has a 55% chance to hit the druid, so the orc's DPR is 0.55*9= 4.95

Therefore the druid is up for (45/4.95) 9.09 rounds.

Result: Druid lasts 36 rounds, give or take. This is 47% as long as the paladin.

Contender 2: The Fighter

Available Defenses: Second Wind (1d10+6 HP, let's use 5.5 as the average), Heavy Armour Master Feat (reduces the orc's damage to 6), Combat Superiority Dice * 4 (Parry gives a d8+Dex bonus damage reduction, let's assume a dex bonus of 0), AC 21, 52HP

I'm not sure how to factor in the parries to be honest. I'll just add them to the HP pool to be whittled down.

The orc has a 25% chance to hit the fighter, so the orc's DPR is 1.5
Fighter HP is 52 + 11.5 + 18 = 81.5

Therefore the fighter is up for (81.5/1.5) = 54.33 rounds This is 72% as long as the paladin.

Contender 3: The Paladin

Available Defenses: Lay on Hands (restores 30HP), Heavy Armour Master Feat (reduces the orc's damage to 6), Spellcasty Bullshit (there's a lot of defensive spells that you could take, but let's keep it simple and go with Cure Wounds * 4 and Aid *2. I'll assume the Paladin's Charisma bonus is +1), AC 21, 52HP

The orc has 25% chance to hit the fighter, so the orc's DPR is 1.5
Paladin HP is 52 + 30 + 22 (cure wounds) + 10 (aid) = 114

Therefore the paladin is up for (114/1.5) = 76 rounds

If the druid wanted to last 76 rounds, he would need 456 hit points.

Which is frankly not what I was expecting, so he decided to change the scenario (but not the PCs) to see what happens)

quote:

Broad strokes analysis II: This time it's Giants

One hill giant with infinite HP, actually: +8 to hit, 18 damage, 2 attacks per round

Contender 1: The Druid

Available Defenses: Polar Bear * 2 (12AC, 42 HP) Wild Shape Healing (assuming you burn all slots on this it's 19d8, let's use 4.5 as the average roll), Druid Form (15AC, 45 HP)

The giant has a 85% chance to hit the bear, so the giant's DPR is 2(0.85 * 18) =30.6

Bear HP is 84 + (19*4.5) = 169.5
Therefore the bear is up for (169.5/30.6) 5.53 rounds.

The giant has a 70% chance to hit the druid, so the giant's DPR is 2(0.7*18)= 25.2

Therefore the druid is up for (45/25.2) 1.78 rounds.

Result: Druid lasts 8 rounds This is 80% of the Paladin.

Contender 2: The Fighter

Available Defenses: Second Wind (1d10+6 HP, let's use 5.5 as the average), Heavy Armour Master Feat (reduces the giant's damage to 15), Combat Superiority Dice * 4 (Parry gives a d8+Dex bonus damage reduction, let's assume a dex bonus of 0), AC 21, 52HP

I'm not sure how to factor in the parries to be honest. I'll just add them to the HP pool to be whittled down.

The giant has a 40% chance to hit the fighter, so the giant's DPR is 2(0.4*15) = 12
Fighter HP is 52 + 11.5 + 18 = 81.5

Therefore the fighter is up for (81.5/12) = 6.79 rounds (i.e. 7) This is 70% of the Paladin

Contender 3: The Paladin

Available Defenses: Lay on Hands (restores 30HP), Heavy Armour Master Feat (reduces the orc's damage to 6), Spellcasty Bullshit (there's a lot of defensive spells that you could take, but let's keep it simple and go with Cure Wounds * 4 and Aid *2. I'll assume the Paladin's Charisma bonus is +1), AC 21, 52HP

The giant has a 40% chance to hit the paladin, so the giant's DPR is 2(0.4*15) = 12
Paladin HP is 52 + 30 + 22 (cure wounds) + 10 (aid) = 114

Therefore the paladin is up for (114/12) = 9.5 rounds (i.e 10)

quote:

Feel free to put my math out for scrutiny. I'm sure there are many people who have a better gift for modeling who can shed some light on it.

My guess is that the first scenario is distorted by the heavy armor master feat. It cuts the orc's damage by a third. So maybe the armored classes are better against hordes while they're closer against big hitters.

# ? Nov 25, 2014 11:44

Jack the Lad: Jan 20, 2009; Feed the Pubs

Your friend isn't having the Druid use Barkskin to set their AC to 16, which would make a huge difference.

# ? Nov 25, 2014 11:59

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# ? May 29, 2024 14:34

Elector_Nerdlingen: Sep 27, 2004

Jack the Lad posted:

Your friend isn't having the Druid use Barkskin to set their AC to 16, which would make a huge difference.

...yes it would. Like I posted, he wanted to know if he'd done anything wrong. I can't believe I missed that, though. I missed it when actually playing too.

e: how much of a difference would it actually make, given that it's Concentration and you can't re-cast it as a bear?

Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 12:34 on Nov 25, 2014

# ? Nov 25, 2014 12:27

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