|
goatse guy posted:leica, show me on the doll where the bad dealer touched you. Seat Safety Switch posted:Let the court record show that the witness has reached for the doll's tiny wallet. I would watch this proceeding but only if you used the Supreme Puppy Court footage
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2014 18:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 07:17 |
|
|
leica posted:loving lol. When buyers lie maybe your time gets wasted and you just send them on their way, but when sales people lie some poor bastard gets stuck with a lovely rate on a car they paid way too much for that ruins them financially! You know what, leica, you're all right, especially when you speak the truth. goatse guy posted:leica, show me on the doll where the bad dealer touched you. Unfortunately, most customers that get taken by dealers can't show that directly, because it's their future that gets hosed.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2014 19:03
|
|
|
Ripoff posted:I had family in the dealer business as well and they always told me about the awkward conversations they would have with well-intentioned customers with extremely bad credit. Some would ask if they should be looking the used cars instead, and the salespeople would have to somehow suggest a "buy here, pay here" place without insulting the person too much. Always my least favorite conversation. If you're too nice about it they think if we just try a little harder I'll be able to convince the bank to give them money with their 400 credit score. Or the people who think I'm just not negotiating with them when they are 8 grand upside down with no money down. 600 score won't help you there. I spent a lot of time in sales trying to get people unburied.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2014 23:22
|
|
|
Chimbley Sweep posted:I spent a lot of time in sales trying to get people unburied. Wow, how did they get so upside-down on cars in the first place? (Answer: Shady dealers selling them poo poo they couldn't afford, but the bank put up the money, so all's good, right?)
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 00:13
|
|
|
Lots of people pay wayyy over retail for cars which then depreciate rapidly. It should be illegal but hey congress.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 00:29
|
|
|
Pryor on Fire posted:Lots of people pay wayyy over retail for cars which then depreciate rapidly. And then I buy them
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 00:35
|
|
|
meatpimp posted:Wow, how did they get so upside-down on cars in the first place? (Answer: Shady dealers selling them poo poo they couldn't afford, but the bank put up the money, so all's good, right?) Yep. Bait and switch on paperwork as well.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 00:47
|
|
|
piss boner posted:Time = money. The sales rep is incentivized to give the buyer the worst possible deal that won't cause them to walk.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 00:50
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:The sales rep is incentivized to give the buyer the worst possible deal that won't cause them to walk. Well. No poo poo. You don't understand how sales works, do you?
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 01:13
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:I just got a check from Don Ayers Honda for $70 and an apology letter from their GM condemning the behavior of their staff. And a Honda keychain! Bonus round, the part is $35 with free shipping so Honda bought our dinner tonight. With how common your type of story is/was (the dealer being lovely) it's good to see the car company actually dealing with it and being cool to a customer! 
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 06:43
|
|
|
piss boner posted:Well. No poo poo. You don't understand how sales works, do you? I understand how sales work and I am trying to point out that the inherent structures of sales compensation without a fixed retail price and a lack of transparency in financing can lead to dishonest salespeople taking advantage of underinformed buyers, and why it's important to have regulations in place to prevent that! I would think that this would be a pretty noncontroversial statement but of course someone has to come in here and white knight their lovely sales job because the CFPB might screw them out of ten bucks in commission on a deal.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 15:26
|
|
|
Mat_Drinks posted:With how common your type of story is/was (the dealer being lovely) it's good to see the car company actually dealing with it and being cool to a customer! I think the threat of a social media response was enough to get a positive ending for me. I made some vague comments about how connected to the local car scene I am (not entirely accurate but I have friends with a long reach). It all worked out for the best as the check deposited into my account with no issue.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 16:12
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:I understand how sales work and I am trying to point out that the inherent structures of sales compensation without a fixed retail price and a lack of transparency in financing can lead to dishonest salespeople taking advantage of underinformed buyers, and why it's important to have regulations in place to prevent that! I would think that this would be a pretty noncontroversial statement but of course someone has to come in here and white knight their lovely sales job because the CFPB might screw them out of ten bucks in commission on a deal. But it's not the salespeople's fault that buyers are uninformed, they should know better! If some old lady comes in on a fixed income, you bet your rear end I'm taking her for a ride if she's too dumb to know how this poo poo works, shoulda read the internet first or something.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2014 17:14
|
|
|
Anyway, enough about how car salesmen cause people to make poor choices, because there's one choice that they always talk our customers out of. I sit at a desk in the back of the showroom, surrounded by cars. To my left, there is a gorgeous Genesis Coupe, and it isn't going anywhere anytime soon, because every time a customer even looks at the thing, a salesman will blurt out, "But it's rear wheel drive, you wouldn't want that in the winter!" It's like they don't want to sell a car. Sure, RWD isn't ideal for winter, but I see tons of BMWs and Mercedes out and about in the snow. If they can do it, so can you. I would certainly take the opportunity to sell them some snow tires and coach them on safe winter driving, but I wouldn't talk someone out of buying a car over the drivetrain layout. gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2014 21:21
|
|
|
goatse guy posted:
Honestly, I prefer it. I've been driving BMWs in the winter for years, on all-seasons even. Yeah it's harder to get traction, but with FWD if you lose traction on the front wheels, you're boned. With RWD you can still steer with the throttle if the rears haven't broken traction yet. Awhile ago I had my E36 and my Nissan Altima, and I couldn't go back to the Altima. It was so much more uncontrollable in snow that it was scary as hell.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2014 21:31
|
|
|
hahaha  Went to the As far as I can tell the rear brakes aren't making any squeaking noises and the rotors aren't wobbling when I apply the brakes at all. I've taken it to the AutoX a total of two times. Going to do a brief inspection when I get it back, but I'm pretty sure they are smoking crack. It is near Oakland after all. They also had the new 2015 50th Anniversary Mustang there for a song! Only $80,000 before tax/title/reg  
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2014 22:51
|
|
|
Added markup only 30k, what a bargain!
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 03:32
|
|
|
The fact that dealers will just print "dealer markup $30,000" on the sticker just cracks me up. Oh yeah, those Ford Mustangs are really rare cars and you might only see three of them in your whole life. You should buy this because it just came out and will be a collector's item in 40 years! Usually it's M3s or a GTR or Viper or something though. And I took out a 5k car loan with probably not great credit to buy a car. Where did the idea that you have to buy new/cpo to get financing come from? jamal fucked around with this message at 04:23 on Nov 26, 2014 |
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 04:21
|
|
|
The dealer model in the USA is hosed. Where else can you get away with printing the MRSP and below that "60% markup because gently caress you" on the ticket?
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 18:18
|
|
|
Cakefool posted:The dealer model in the USA is hosed. Where else can you get away with printing the MRSP and below that "60% markup because gently caress you" on the ticket? The worst part is that somebody will probably walk in and pay that so they can be the first on their block with one.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 20:03
|
|
|
CornHolio posted:Honestly, I prefer it. I've been driving BMWs in the winter for years, on all-seasons even. Yeah it's harder to get traction, but with FWD if you lose traction on the front wheels, you're boned. With RWD you can still steer with the throttle if the rears haven't broken traction yet. What year is your Altima? I have a 2007 and it is awful in the snow. My dad didn't believe me that the car needed snow tires until he drove it himself.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 20:12
|
|
|
mariooncrack posted:What year is your Altima? I have a 2007 and it is awful in the snow. My dad didn't believe me that the car needed snow tires until he drove it himself. It was an '03 so I think that'd be the previous generation, but pretty much the same engine and transmission. I didn't have ABS or traction control on it, which didn't help things. It was abysmal.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2014 21:09
|
|
|
So, how much do dealers profit from warranty work? The veloster is getting its 4th radio now for the same issue (Canada so no easy lemon law) that's presenting the same general symptoms and the dealer keeps replacing radio/nav units. Is there an incentive for them to actually diagnose the issue, because it feels like they're either incompetent and expecting the results to change if they keep throwing the same part at it or they're making a profit from all the warranty work.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 00:32
|
|
|
Bajaha posted:The veloster is getting its 4th radio now for the same issue (Canada so no easy lemon law) that's presenting the same general symptoms and the dealer keeps replacing radio/nav units. Jesus Christ. You haven't threatened them to sue if they don't take that turd back yet? Why not?
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 00:35
|
|
|
That's the thing about warranty work, they actually make little to no profit at all. Unlike normal work where they charge the customer, for warranty jobs it's the manufacturer paying for parts and labor. That means zero markup on the parts, and not only do they not profit from the labor, the tech actually gets paid less, because warranty rates pay less time than non-warranty.* This means that techs hate doing warranty work, and will rush through and slap the new part in as fast as possible without necessarily taking the time to diagnose whether it's actually the issue. Hence situations like Bajaha's. *Techs are usually paid flat-rate, meaning they have a nominal hourly rate, but rather than hours worked they get paid by the job. Each job has a "book time" that the tech gets paid for, determined by having techs at the factory go through and do the job in a reasonable amount of time. So if an engine swap is billed at 10 hours, and the rate is $25.00, the tech gets paid $250, whether it takes him 4 hours or two days. Basically if they can work faster, they profit more, but if they hit any snags they end up losing money. For warranty jobs, rather than a single tech by himself, the factory gets their best, most experienced tech, gives him a team of assistants, and every single special tool necessary, has them practice it a few times to get a routine down, then times them with a stopwatch to the second to determine the absolute minimum time humanly possible to do the job. That's the rate that the factory pays. Which means that on warranty/recall jobs, the tech gets paid significantly less (usually about 20-30% less) than doing the exact same job on the owner's dime. Which is why they rush through and get the car out ASAP so they can get back to doing non-warranty jobs.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 00:49
|
|
|
Viggen posted:Jesus Christ. You haven't threatened them to sue if they don't take that turd back yet? Why not? Kinda worried that because the issues aren't mechanical and prevent me from using it to drive around, legal action might not turn out in my favor. Once I get a long enough list of various issues I'll try for arbitration, or if they actually fix my poo poo it might be ok. Either way, I'll continue bitching and keeping a record of the issues in my thread.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 00:52
|
|
|
Fucknag posted:*Techs are usually paid flat-rate, meaning they have a nominal hourly rate, but rather than hours worked they get paid by the job. Each job has a "book time" that the tech gets paid for, determined by having techs at the factory go through and do the job in a reasonable amount of time. So if an engine swap is billed at 10 hours, and the rate is $25.00, the tech gets paid $250, whether it takes him 4 hours or two days. Basically if they can work faster, they profit more, but if they hit any snags they end up losing money. Which SUCKS in states that use a lot of salt on vehicles that have long warranties. Because none of that poo poo is accounted for. A few of my friends who work at dealerships have told stories of having to fight for replacement bolts and other parts under warranty that anyone who turns a wrench around here knows are gonna be trashed/have to get cut off.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 01:01
|
|
|
Bajaha posted:Kinda worried that because the issues aren't mechanical and prevent me from using it to drive around, legal action might not turn out in my favor. Once I get a long enough list of various issues I'll try for arbitration, or if they actually fix my poo poo it might be ok. Once you show how many times it has been back, and you have not been able to use it- I'm pretty sure you'll be fine.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 01:11
|
|
|
Motronic posted:Which SUCKS in states that use a lot of salt on vehicles that have long warranties. Because none of that poo poo is accounted for. This is particularly ironic given that many cars have corrosion warranties which last much longer than their powertrain warranties.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 02:20
|
|
|
Corrosion warranties usually just cover rust perforation of body panels. Nasty rear end bolts that strip before you even touch them? Tough luck.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2014 02:51
|
|
|
Fucknag posted:For warranty jobs, rather than a single tech by himself, the factory gets their best, most experienced tech, gives him a team of assistants, and every single special tool necessary, has them practice it a few times to get a routine down, then times them with a stopwatch to the second to determine the absolute minimum time humanly possible to do the job. That's the rate that the factory pays. Which means that on warranty/recall jobs, the tech gets paid significantly less (usually about 20-30% less) than doing the exact same job on the owner's dime. Which is why they rush through and get the car out ASAP so they can get back to doing non-warranty jobs. Is this just the assumption, or do they actually video tape the job being done for proof? I mean, I certainly wouldn't put it past a manufacturer to just make up numbers. Has anyone ever been caught blatantly cooking book numbers?
|
|
#
?
Nov 28, 2014 23:20
|
|
|
Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Is this just the assumption, or do they actually video tape the job being done for proof? I mean, I certainly wouldn't put it past a manufacturer to just make up numbers. Has anyone ever been caught blatantly cooking book numbers? If it's anything like the computer industry.....no. And you don't need to see that to know it's blatant bullshit. But it's not reimbursed as a "per hour" but as a "per job". I'm sorry, you can not completely disassemble and reassemble a laptop that was built upside down to do the most common repair (keyboard replacement) in 30 minutes. You 1990s IBM fuckers. The point is, your shop keeps losing money on these things because it's a financially reasonable thing to do when you get the large contracts and out-of-warranty service since you are "authorized". And you don't get to be authorized unless you take their poo poo work. Motronic fucked around with this message at 00:57 on Nov 29, 2014 |
|
#
?
Nov 29, 2014 00:55
|
|
|
goatse guy posted:today I had some surprising honesty from a customer. "I'd like to get into a newer vehicle. I have a down payment of $3200 and a credit score of 525. That was me, without the marriage, 2 years ago.. and a $1500 down payment (including my trade - they gave me $1200 for it, and I had cash on me). Almost identical credit score. And I was upfront and honest about my credit, and even brought bank statements to support my income claims. I was actually ready to put $2k down including the trade (since they bought my old car before I had decided on a car), but the salesman actually suggested I hang on to some of the cash. Though they get the same commission whether you buy a Porsche or a Chevy there. Couldn't afford the payments on a brand new or CPO vehicle, and I like stuff like sunroofs and power locks/windows/mirrors. CarMax was able to finance me on a $9k car. We won't discuss the APR (it's low double digits), but it's less than half of what a buy here pay here lot wanted for a 14 year old Camry with bald tires and 100k (for almost the same price).
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 03:42
|
|
|
I have always bought from people and not dealers, but I bought my last 2 cars from CarMax and I had a wonderful experience. The guy was really upfront with me about everything and since they make a flat rate ( according to my buddy who works there. i am unsure if it is true) they never push to upgrade the car or add a bunch of weird accessories. The best part in my opinion was the fact the price on the car is the price out the door. On every car. No weird bait and switch stuff. Anyone else use these guys before?
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 04:07
|
|
|
goatse guy posted:My goals for November are 120 set, 90 shown, and 35 sold. I'm taking a couple of days off after Thanksgiving to visit my family in North Dakota so it's going to be tough, but I'm pretty determined to kick rear end and 85 set, 70 shown, 22 sold. My usual motto in life is, "Aim low so you'll never be disappointed," but I aimed high last month and while I didn't meet my goal, I'm still very happy with how I did. My goals for December are at 100 set, 80 shown, and 30 sold.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 18:45
|
|
|
Does making/not making your goal materially impact you with your sales manager / GM? Is it a management-goal or a goatse guy goal?
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 19:50
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Does making/not making your goal materially impact you with your sales manager / GM? Is it a management-goal or a goatse guy goal? It's more of a personal goaL, because I have learned a few things about looking like a go-getter and one of those things is to make a goal and talk about it with your boss so that they think you're a productive motivated employee. The only problem with this is that it actually requires you to be productive and motivated to meet it, so I fail in that respect.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 20:25
|
|
|
Looking for feedback on what working in finance at a car dealership is like. Is it enjoyable or some sort of personal hell? Is the pay decent? My parent's neighbor is a mercedes salesman and I've always thought working in a dealership would be cool. I'm getting pretty fed up with my job and trying to look at something else and finance would probably be the best fit for my background.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
1500quidporsche posted:Looking for feedback on what working in finance at a car dealership is like. Do you have no soul? Do you like loving broke people out of their last penny possible on a monthly basis? Do you want to have anal sex with people you've never met face to face? Congratulations, you've found your career!
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2014 01:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 07:17 |
|
|
Viggen posted:Do you have no soul? Do you like loving broke people out of their last penny possible on a monthly basis? Do you want to have anal sex with people you've never met face to face? Congratulations, you've found your career! I work in Life and Health insurance so tell me more.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2014 01:46
|
|