|
Pain dildo to the butt is a very important part of the world building here
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 01:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 9, 2024 23:38 |
|
|
The easiest way to build reader empathy with the situation at hand. THINGS. in. your. butt
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 01:48
|
|
|
Tolkien is like that DM who makes elaborate history for his campaign and goes on digressions all the time to show off the worldbuilding and that linguistics degree, but when you do get to the action, it's fun and cool, and even the less powerful PCs get to do cool stuff like rouse the treefolk or carry the ring. There are super-high-powered NPCs, but they mostly stay out of the way of the players, to the extent that you sometimes wonder why they aren't doing the quest. Goodkind is that creepy DM who keeps wanting to bring you into his magical world and when you do get to the action, it's all about how awesome his DMPC is.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 02:08
|
|
|
Tolkein really is a good DM but his idea of balance is completely and utterly hosed. Also he should have known that a 9-person party would inevitably infight and fracture before a single quest was finished.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 02:36
|
|
|
I Love You! posted:Tolkein really is a good DM but his idea of balance is completely and utterly hosed. Also he should have known that a 9-person party would inevitably infight and fracture before a single quest was finished. Trick is that the Fellowship of the Ring is two parties and a DMPC. The hobbits are one party, Aragorn/Boromir/Gimli/Legolas are another, and Gandalf is a DMNPC who was removed from the table for most of the game. Moria was an experiment running both parties together and didn't work that well so he changed what he was doing (in part because one player left). Yes, I'm cribbing from DM of the Rings - but it works.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 03:18
|
|
|
And Eragon is the game where one PC ends up totally overpowered because the DM needs to have a "Chosen One" for the metaplot masquerading as an adventure path. And the setting's elves are a thinly-veined vehicle for his political views told in a a  way.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2014 03:26
|
|
|
So are we doing book 2, or did DDP commit suicide to avoid it? either is a reasonable result
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 02:58
|
|
|
Libertad! posted:And Eragon is the game where one PC ends up totally overpowered because the DM needs to have a "Chosen One" for the metaplot masquerading as an adventure path. Eragon is just the one where your DM is running you through his thinly veiled Star Wars fan fic.  Real Talk: Absalom, Absalom! is a Call of Cthulhu Adventure.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 03:53
|
|
|
I just got through the thread and I am so disappointed that everything was just hand waved away. loving boxes of ordain. I could forgive it if the ride was good. Someone somewhere had to sign off on this though. Crazy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 04:05
|
|
|
What is really crazy is I heard Goodkind got the biggest deal (at the time) for an author debuting. He got a 2 book deal for $500,000 was the deal I originally heard. Keep in mind this was 20 years ago, so I don't know exactly what the amount would be in current monies due to inflation, but that is some serious cash to give somebody who apparently hasn't published before. According to Wikipedia, WFR (his debut novel) itself earned him $275,000 by way of auction between 3 publishers. Once upon a time this was my favorite book series. I guess everyone is young once.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 04:46
|
|
|
I think at the time that had more to do with publishers trying hard to find the next "Wheel-of-Time-style" unending fantasy brick-sized novel cash-cow juggernaut than it did with anything intrinsic to Goodkind's works. Although they did, unfortunately, sell a poo poo-ton of books as well, so they weren't wrong. It's hard to remember, since it has since become kind of a ground state, but when Robert Jordan dropped six 600+ page best-selling fantasy novels into the marketplace over the span of four years, it severely warped the face of the fantasy-lit genre. People used to just write trilogies, or occasional pulpy non-sequential series like Xanth, but not giant open-ended bloat-beasts. EDIT: which is why Goodkind's second book was a shameless ripoff of the Wheel of Time... Old Kentucky Shark fucked around with this message at 05:19 on Dec 5, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 05:07
|
|
|
Dalris Othaine posted:So are we doing book 2, or did DDP commit suicide to avoid it? either is a reasonable result He said he was taking some time off for the holidays. I hope he comes back, this series has not yet begun to suck. Well, no. It has begun, but it get worse. So much worse.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 07:39
|
|
|
what happened to Rick Roll's brother?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 08:13
|
|
|
Stallion Cabana posted:what happened to Rick Roll's brother? Executed as a traitor by Richard's order or maybe even own hands. Not because of his betrayal of Richard, who is above such things you see, but for betraying the people of Westland. Which includes Richard.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 08:22
|
|
|
TheSmilingJackal posted:He said he was taking some time off for the holidays. I hope he comes back, this series has not yet begun to suck. I am terrified, yet slightly aroused. Godspeed, DDP.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 09:16
|
|
|
Stallion Cabana posted:what happened to Rick Roll's brother? Richard goes "I cannot forgive you for what you did (to others, not to me, I totally forgive you), so I can't white-blade you, bro. But I can have you executed." He then, and I am not making this up: tells the D'Haran palace guards to put Michael's head on a pike, does something else, walks outside to see Michael's head on a pike and tells them to take it down, and then flies the gently caress off on Scarlet. It's completely schizophrenic. Yes, I'm still doing this, by the way, even if the TV stuff is going to come later because I forgot "television" isn't a medium well-suited to me transcribing and quoting, I have to edit poo poo. Also spoilers: if Terry Goodkind isn't an only child then he loving hates his siblings on some level, because I forgot about Richard's OTHER evil brother.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 09:39
|
|
|
Old Kentucky Shark posted:I think at the time that had more to do with publishers trying hard to find the next "Wheel-of-Time-style" unending fantasy brick-sized novel cash-cow juggernaut than it did with anything intrinsic to Goodkind's works. Although they did, unfortunately, sell a poo poo-ton of books as well, so they weren't wrong. Son of a bitch. This stuff seems like a bad parody of fantasy, and he made a mint off of it right from the start. I guess it's like fast food, filled with sugar, salt, and fat that tastes good, and filled out with the cheapest, most shoddy ingredients to give it bulk. People like it despite itself. I'm reminded of when my parents gave me Angels and Demons to read. The first couple of pages read like an awful Tom Clancy rip off. I just closed the book and stared at it, wondering how I would get through a six hour plane ride. I guess whoever was next to me was wrapped up in something else, so talking was out. I braced myself and read on. Fortunately it was just a hook. He cut that poo poo out, and got on with an interesting story. Goodkind, on the other hand, wallows in that crap. I don't want to guess what my state of mind would be after a six hour plane trip with nothing but one of his books.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 13:15
|
|
|
Angels and Demons was pretty bad, though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 14:14
|
|
|
One chapter of Angels & Demons literally ends with 'AND LITTLE DID HE KNOW THAT THIS PIECE OF POINTLESS INFORMATION WOULD SAVE HIS LIFE THAT VERY DAY'. It gets extra dumb when you actually find out how it saved his life. Also, the Italian in the book is loving AWFUL. Every single grammatical mistake that you can possibly make is present: wrong pronouns, wrong articles, using feminine article when you should use masculine, it's loving awful and made me wonder how such a successful writer couldn't even be bothered to get an italian proof-reader to check his loving awful grammar.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 14:36
|
|
|
Dan Brown is an extremely lovely writer. But I will admit that despite being extremely conscious of this fact throughout, I did make it through The Da Vinci Code because he is pretty good at making the plot move, even if it's in very stupid directions.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 14:48
|
|
|
malkav11 posted:Dan Brown is an extremely lovely writer. But I will admit that despite being extremely conscious of this fact throughout, I did make it through The Da Vinci Code because he is pretty good at making the plot move, even if it's in very stupid directions.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 14:55
|
|
|
I think my favorite part of the whole Da Vinci Code idiocy is when Brown was sued by a bunch of the other psuedo-scholarly hacks he stole his plot from, and won the suit only because they'd been dumb enough to claim their ramblings were non-fiction.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 14:58
|
|
|
Dan Brown has precisely one virtue as a writer; his pacing is excellent and he ends almost every chapter with a cliffhanger. But it's a good virtue, it gets people to turn pages.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 16:06
|
|
|
neonchameleon posted:Dan Brown has precisely one virtue as a writer; his pacing is excellent and he ends almost every chapter with a cliffhanger. But it's a good virtue, it gets people to turn pages.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 16:20
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:Contrast this with how Terry Pratchett does call-backs to earlier parts of his book. To be fair, if we're going to compare all fiction writers to Pratchett from here on out we should except that they will all be hacks.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 21:14
|
|
|
I Love You! posted:Tolkein really is a good DM but his idea of balance is completely and utterly hosed. Also he should have known that a 9-person party would inevitably infight and fracture before a single quest was finished. There was an ancient usenet post about this, back before DM of the Rings was a twinkling in the writer's eye, with the game starting off with 2 characters, Sam and Frodo, playing themed hobbit characters, eventually adding in two of their friends from class as Merry and Pippin, who also needed to play hobbits to keep the cohesion correct. But then the DM's girlfriend wanted to join, and they meet Aragorn, the mysterious ranger with a hidden past who's secretly a king and knows everyone and has a magical elf girlfriend, who cracks the power levels right open. The game goes right off the rails as her other theatre buddies want to join, and since the game has opened up non-hobbit characters, we get other princes and high powered dwarven warriors and such. The bit I remember best was the explanation for Boromir's death. His player wasn't staying in town for the summer, and wanted to kill his character with gusto. When he returns for the fall classes, he just brings in his character's brother, Faramir, so he doesn't need to roll someone else.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 22:23
|
|
|
Going out like Boromir IS a pretty loving awesome way to retire a PC, though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 22:38
|
|
|
PJOmega posted:To be fair, if we're going to compare all fiction writers to Pratchett from here on out we should except that they will all be hacks. Pratchett has all the virtues of a hack and none of the vices. His output is pretty regular, the plot is always moving, and he's always entertaining. I can't remember any really slow pointless bits in a Pratchett book. (Personally, I aspire to hackery. Getting my writing going is drat near impossible.)
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 22:48
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:Also, the Italian in the book is loving AWFUL. Every single grammatical mistake that you can possibly make is present: wrong pronouns, wrong articles, using feminine article when you should use masculine, it's loving awful and made me wonder how such a successful writer couldn't even be bothered to get an italian proof-reader to check his loving awful grammar. Counterpoint: Why should he give a poo poo if it'll sell just as well without it?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 23:35
|
|
|
ProfessorCirno posted:Counterpoint: Why should he give a poo poo if it'll sell just as well without it?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2014 23:47
|
|
|
Spoilers Below posted:There was an ancient usenet post about this, back before DM of the Rings was a twinkling in the writer's eye, with the game starting off with 2 characters, Sam and Frodo, playing themed hobbit characters, eventually adding in two of their friends from class as Merry and Pippin, who also needed to play hobbits to keep the cohesion correct. But then the DM's girlfriend wanted to join, and they meet Aragorn, the mysterious ranger with a hidden past who's secretly a king and knows everyone and has a magical elf girlfriend, who cracks the power levels right open. The game goes right off the rails as her other theatre buddies want to join, and since the game has opened up non-hobbit characters, we get other princes and high powered dwarven warriors and such. You might appreciate DM of the Rings then.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2014 00:42
|
|
|
LowellDND posted:You might appreciate DM of the Rings then. He literally mentions that in the post you quoted.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2014 02:00
|
|
|
Spoilers Below might appreciate if LowellDND actually read his post
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2014 03:56
|
|
|
I am shamed 
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2014 04:38
|
|
|
Thank you for this thread, I had been meaning to re-read these books for a few years now to see if they held up at all. I, like many others it seems, absolutely loved these back in high school. WFR was probably my favourite book for years, but being a dumb teenager I never really looked at it critically, so it was great seeing someone break down just how awful it really was. It was the first "mature" fantasy book I had read, and it was a striking tonal change from things like Lord of the Rings I had previously been constantly reading. There is something very appealing about Dick as a character when you are a teenager. He's smarter than everyone else, he uses his pent-up anger to win at everything, and he always defies authority. Which is the perfect hero when you are an angsty 15 year old going through highschool.
|
|
#
?
Dec 8, 2014 20:15
|
|
|
TheSmilingJackal posted:He said he was taking some time off for the holidays. I hope he comes back, this series has not yet begun to suck. How much worse? 
|
|
#
?
Dec 9, 2014 03:48
|
|
This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!
|
DeusExMachinima posted:How much worse? Here are the two things that have stuck with me the most, of what has yet to be covered. Note, I stopped reading the series about (what ended up being) half-way through. There is a loooooong sequence where Kahlan is thrown into some dungeon pit full of rapists. She never actually gets raped due to "smart talk" shenanigans and using her power on one of them. However, part of her "plan" apparently necessitates (graphically described) masturbation, acting like a slut to "trick" the rapists into thinking that they have to be nice to her so that she can make it good for them instead of resisting. …and… To solve the Apocalypse of the Week, Richard and Kahlan have to have sex with other people or something. OH WAIT! It's a magic trick, and she was enchanted into thinking she was loving $BadGuy when actually it was Richard all along. I can't remember if Richard is similarly tricked, but he sees through it in any case. Kahlan ends up vocally enjoying Kahlan is on her period at the time. It's lovingly rendered in prose.
|
|
#
?
Dec 9, 2014 03:59
|
|
Plague of Hats posted:Here are the two things that have stuck with me the most, of what has yet to be covered. Note, I stopped reading the series about (what ended up being) half-way through. Terry Goodkind: There is always more and it's always worse.
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 9, 2014 04:20
|
|
|
Plague of Hats posted:Here are the two things that have stuck with me the most, of what has yet to be covered. Note, I stopped reading the series about (what ended up being) half-way through. Regarding your second spoiler: Richard knew, he worked it out with the other dude to secretly switch. He get's mega pissed as Kahlan enjoys the sex and then says 'Don't tell Richard', then dramatic lighting OMG it was Richard all long how could you not recognise me my cock is totally different to all other cocks in almost complete darkness honest
|
|
#
?
Dec 9, 2014 04:32
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 9, 2024 23:38 |
|
|
Plague of Hats posted:Here are the two things that have stuck with me the most, of what has yet to be covered. Note, I stopped reading the series about (what ended up being) half-way through. Note that Neil Gaiman told this story and made the heroine badass. quote:To solve the Apocalypse of the Week, Richard and Kahlan have to have sex with other people or something. OH WAIT! It's a magic trick, and she was enchanted into thinking she was loving $BadGuy when actually it was Richard all along. I can't remember if Richard is similarly tricked, but he sees through it in any case. Kahlan ends up vocally enjoying Okay this was just Twilight-level soap opera that works perfectly if you picture the main characters as teenagers as someone said above. And then you get to that last part. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 9, 2014 04:36
|
|
