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sheri
Dec 30, 2002

I think 1.5 might be a little young to grasp the concept...

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Sweet Gulch
May 8, 2007

That metaphor just went somewhere horrible.
I need some baby nap help. :(

My son is 15 weeks old. Up until a week or two ago, he napped like a champ - we followed his cues, would put him down asleep or mostly asleep in his swing, and he'd nap for a few hours. Lately, though, unless we're holding him he will wake up without fail after 20min. He does so quietly and there's no trigger (like a noise). I thought he was transitioning to having fewer, longer naps, because when he first started to do this, he was usually sleeping longer for one morning and one afternoon nap. But now they're all short and by the evening he's super fussy from lack of sleep!

I've been reading the No Cry Sleep Solution which suggests anticipating his wakeups and preemptively soothing him back to sleep, but it only works for five minutes or so before he's waking again. I can't hold him for all his naps because (not only that it's working backward - we want him falling asleep all on his own eventually!) I exclusively pump and depend on his naps to do so when home alone. When he wakes, he's up for good that nap cycle and won't be soothed back to sleep if I pick him up.

We're also working on his night sleep, though I'm not too worried about it except as it might relate to his naps. He's always spent the nights in his crib but would generally refuse to be put down there until midnight or later. We've been nudging this bedtime gently earlier (currently it's about 10:30pm) but it wasn't an issue while he was still napping well, since he was still getting plenty of sleep. He wakes several times during the night but just feeds and goes straight back down, getting up for the day around 7:30-8am.

I've ordered a white noise machine and will be giving that a try. Should he take his naps in his room rather than our office? Should I darken the room? Should I start a nap schedule? I know he's got a lot going on mentally right now - he's grabbing things and putting them in his mouth, throwing toys around, rolling over, etc. I just want my poor l'il fatty to be well-rested. :(

Papercut
Aug 24, 2005

sheri posted:

I think 1.5 might be a little young to grasp the concept...

I don't. As long as you introduce it in a way that minimizes failure then that is easily old enough for them to understand the routine. We got one at around 22 months and I was absolutely kicking myself for not getting it earlier. It was amazing how well it worked.

Again the key, just like any behavior training, is to take it slowly enough to minimize failure until it just becomes routine. If your kids is waking up at 5, don't set it for 6 right away. The first night we set it for his normal wake time, then with each success we would move it forward by 1 or 2 minutes. As they get used to it you can make bigger jumps.

flashy_mcflash
Feb 7, 2011

Papercut posted:

Don't Let the Pigeon Drive the Bus and Pigeon Finds a Hot Dog are constant library checkouts in our house. The MIL just sent us Pigeon Needs a Bath last night and the toddler immediately ran to his bookshelf looking for the "other pigeon books".

Have you read the other Willems books? We just discovered the Elephant and Pig series and I have no problem reading them 5-6 times in succession as Sydney demands.

This is possibly my favourite childrens book right now.

skeetied
Mar 10, 2011

Sweet Gulch posted:

I need some baby nap help. :(

My son is 15 weeks old.

I've ordered a white noise machine and will be giving that a try. Should he take his naps in his room rather than our office? Should I darken the room? Should I start a nap schedule? I know he's got a lot going on mentally right now - he's grabbing things and putting them in his mouth, throwing toys around, rolling over, etc. I just want my poor l'il fatty to be well-rested. :(

This sounds like the four month sleep regression. It will pass!

Sweet Gulch
May 8, 2007

That metaphor just went somewhere horrible.
Ha, that's what I was afraid to hear!

On the bright side, he just had a fantastic nap (while sleeping in my lap, of course!) and at least his nighttime hasn't been affected.

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe
My little Eleanor has learned to talk very loudly and more articulately than ever (18 week).

And she just loveeeees to wake up at 3 am and have an extremely loud conversation with herself for an hour and a half. Good lord! It's not crying or fussing... Just learning to talk I guess. It's half cute and half "let me sleep please for the love of god!"

Guess its time to transition her to the nursery!

His Divine Shadow
Aug 7, 2000

I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.
Heh our kids refuses to fall asleep unless we hold them and rock them to sleep. And some times only mom will do, like last night I was totally unable to rock David to sleep, he was just crying and screaming and wanted mommy, but she was busy trying to get Daniel to sleep so I had to go with David elsewhere in the house so he wouldn't wake Daniel, then mom can come and rock David to sleep too.

They're definitely imprinted on their mom a lot, Daniel more than David, I can rock David to sleep most of the time, usually playing "Byssan lull" on my phone (an old swedish lullaby).

Also both of them woke up in the night and by morning we where four people and a cat in bed.

Sockmuppet
Aug 15, 2009

sheri posted:

I think 1.5 might be a little young to grasp the concept...

I agree, my kid is that age, and I can't see her getting her head around that.

But you could still get one and put it in her room now, and then talk about it and point to the colour when you come get her when it's orange, or whatever. That way you're ready when she's big enough to "get it". It's kind of what we've been doing with the potty, we've had it in the bathroom for months now, and talked about it and practiced sitting on it, and while we're nowhere near pottytraining, she's comfortable sitting on it, she seems to have a vague idea of what it's for, and she knows the word, and I think that'll come in handy later down the road.

We're definitely getting one of those clocks in a couple of months, they sound all around awesome.

Also Sweet Gulch, welcome to the wonderful world of baby sleep! Occasionally they will just randomly sleep like assholes for 1-2 weeks. The general advice is to stick to the routine as much as you can when they're doing this, and not start any big "we have to fix this madness!"-projects immediately, because most of the time it'll work itself out shortly.

For the last five days our kid has suddenly decided that morning is now 1,5 hours earlier than usual. It's super fun for everyone :shepicide:

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

I have a much greater appreciation for coffee now.

Marchegiana
Jan 31, 2006

. . . Bitch.
I just wanted to post and say to all you folks with babies/toddlers that they will eventually actually sleep through the night in their own beds without disturbing you. Someday, you will once again sleep a full night's sleep on a regular basis. It may seem like a distant impossibility at this point, but it does happen. Hang in there. :glomp:

newts
Oct 10, 2012
In a similar vein...

Anyone have any success getting with quitting cosleeping? My daughter will be two in February and she's been sleeping in my bed since she was probably 9 months or so. She's still breastfeeding and wakes me up at least 4-5 times a night for boob. It's really the only way I can get her back to sleep. I just want my bed back and want my husband to move back to our room: he's been sleeping in the guest room for a few months.

I've read a bunch of different suggestions and we've tried a couple of times to get her out, but if don't want to traumatized her. But I haven't slept through the night for 2 years :(

Marchegiana
Jan 31, 2006

. . . Bitch.
At two they really shouldn't be nursing 4-5 times a night. I had the same thing happen with my oldest, I kept nursing her to get her back to sleep because it was the fastest way to get back to sleep myself. Well then when I got pregnant again my milk dried up, but she still wanted to nurse all the time at night so I knew it wasn't because she was hungry, she just didn't have any other tools to get to sleep because she'd never been taught another way. It was not easy those first few nights when I cut her off from the boob, but it did get better. I transitioned by holding, cuddling, and rocking her just as I would if I was nursing, but with no actual feeding. She was PISSED the first few times but I just kept calmly repeating "no nun-nuns, it's sleep time" over and over (and over and over and over). Eventually she got the hint and stopped asking, which then turned into less waking me at night because what was the point if no boob?

She won't be traumatized if you're still being loving and supportive, but you've got to get her off the breast at night- for your own sanity and for your marriage if nothing else.

Oh and BTW, my daughter's night nursing at that age turned out to be super bad for her teeth. By the time she was four she ended up having to go under dental anesthesia and having one tooth pulled and two teeth get pulpectomy & crown combos because her night nursing had triggered awful dental decay.

skeetied
Mar 10, 2011

Marchegiana posted:

Oh and BTW, my daughter's night nursing at that age turned out to be super bad for her teeth. By the time she was four she ended up having to go under dental anesthesia and having one tooth pulled and two teeth get pulpectomy & crown combos because her night nursing had triggered awful dental decay.

As long as you brush well after any solids consumption, breast milk isn't actually bad for a child's teeth. It's when it interacts with other foods on the teeth that it's an issue.

Jay Gordon has a night weaning plan that's pretty popular and any crying will be with a loving adult. It may be more difficult, though, since a common helpful tool is to use the father to soothe since he's not associated with nursing. Is he ever home long enough to just make a big effort then? There are also a couple of picture books about nursing only when the sun is up, but I'm blanking on the names.

That said, even with night weaning, you may find your child still wakes up. It's developmentally appropriate at this age to still not "sleep through the night" unfortunately.

Hot Dog Day #82
Jul 5, 2003

Soiled Meat

Marchegiana posted:

I just wanted to post and say to all you folks with babies/toddlers that they will eventually actually sleep through the night in their own beds without disturbing you. Someday, you will once again sleep a full night's sleep on a regular basis. It may seem like a distant impossibility at this point, but it does happen. Hang in there. :glomp:

Uggggh it feels like that day is so far away. I have two year old twins and one of them is a horrible sleeper. I only hope that one day she will have twins of her own so that karma can repay her for all the times I've been up at random hours of the night trying to be a good parent :mad:.

I do like the idea of that toddler alarm clock mentioned a few posts up! I heard about them but for some reason completely forgot they existed. It might be a good purchase!

AlistairCookie
Apr 1, 2010

I am a Dinosaur


Okay. What in the hell is this about? Tim (first grade) brings this home a day this week for homework. He told me it was really hard, and in class they all had to work together and he still didn't understand it. I don't blame him! They took simple subtraction problems (which he is great at) and made them convoluted and needlessly difficult. We helped him do it, and explained the concept until he could do it (without disparaging the concept), but what is this? Or, I suppose, why? He's had other papers where he has to fill in a missing addend, like 3+__=7, and I totally understand that is pre-pre-algebra thinking. And that's great. But, for me, this thing jumped the shark.

Has anyone else encountered a strange math curriculum? Is this the "new math" I've been hearing about? Am I just old, and missed a memo? :corsair:

Also, if the math being taught stays strange and this isn't just a one off, how do I as a parent bring up concerns about a curriculum (without being douchebag?) Would I start with talking to his teacher and asking her to explain the rationale behind it?

sudont
May 10, 2011
this program is useful for when you don't want to do something.

Fun Shoe
Oh man. When I found out I was pregnant my biggest fear wasn't childbirth, or single parenting, or anything like that. It was "how am I going to help it with math homework?!" I am already having nightmares and I have a close friend who is a teacher who teaches teachers how to teach math. :(

Axiem
Oct 19, 2005

I want to leave my mind blank, but I'm terrified of what will happen if I do

AlistairCookie posted:

Okay. What in the hell is this about?

This is actually how I do math mentally, though choosing 14 - 8 is not a good example. Let's do 14 - 7.

14 is a hard number to subtract from, mentally speaking. It's better to get to 10. Okay, 14 - 4 = 10. So we've "eaten" 4 of the 7, leaving 3 more. 10 - 3 (being 7 - 4) = 7. Done.

Though honestly, I tend to do it mentally in the inverse (7 + 3 = 10, 10 + 4 = 14, 3 + 4 = 7, so 14 - 7 = 7).

This is pretty much the way to make change, like at a change register. Suppose you buy something that costs 8.36$, and you pay me 14.52$ (because loose change or something dumb). To figure out how much I give you back, I'm going to figure out how to get to 10$ even, and then get from there to 8.36$

So like, with that 17 - 9, they want you to break up the 9 into 7 + 2, so that you can do 17 - 7 = 10; 10 - 2 = 8; ergo 17 - 9 = 8.

That all said, I ran into an article a while back about how American teachers aren't getting the training in these techniques for teaching math, even though they've apparently been working well in other countries for years if not decades. So I wouldn't be surprised if he got a dumb explanation in class.

The real key of what's going on with the whole thing, though, is understanding that numbers can be broken up and put back together in different ways, and it all works because addition is commutative. Number lines work.

hailthefish
Oct 24, 2010

They're explaining it in a really lovely, convoluted way but it's a perfectly sensible concept to improve mental math abilities. Instead of trying to do "13-7=6 because I happen to remember that", they want you to go "13-3=10, and 10-4=6"

There's nothing the teacher can really do about it other than "continue to try their best to convert the convoluted bullshit they have to teach into words the kids understand"

FishBulb
Mar 29, 2003

Marge, I'd like to be alone with the sandwich for a moment.

Are you going to eat it?

...yes...
It's not so bad but it is the "new math" yes. You can figure it out.

Axiem
Oct 19, 2005

I want to leave my mind blank, but I'm terrified of what will happen if I do
Ah, found the article. I think it's worth a read.

Thinking about it, I agree that the way that sheet is presenting it isn't particularly emphasizing the point they want to make. When they have 17 - __ = [], they should instead be writing 17 - __ = [10], and 13 - __ = [10], in my opinion. Reinforce the fact that we're getting to 10 because it's a much easier number to do mental math with. By leaving that blank, they're inundating the kid with empty spaces that have unclear relationships with each other.

I would tell my daughter (and since I think we're in the same city, there's a good chance we might see that sort of homework in a few years) to put a 10 in the box in the first line, and then a 10 in the first blank of the second line. Then when you have 17 - __ = [10] and 10 - __ = __, you can figure out that the first blank is 7, put that in the first box under the 9, then do 9 - 7 = 2 and put a 2 in the other box, then you can put the 2 in the second line to get 10 - 2 = __, and boom, get 8.

...it sounds convoluted in words, moreso than it probably would be pointing it out. If'n I wanted to spend the time, I would probably also bring out little objects like marbles or blocks and count out 17 of them and work with them to show that 17 = 7 + 2 + 8, and all we're doing is taking away the 7 + 2 because 10.

But it depends on the kid, and I've been someone who's always been amazingly fantastic at math, so I don't know if it would really work for anyone else :shrug:

photomikey
Dec 30, 2012
We, parents, learned to do math when calculators were not as much of a thing - When I was in first grade, we didn't own a calculator at our house. I'm not sure my teacher owned a calculator. If you did have a calculator, you might have one at home or at the office or something, but if you needed to do math at the grocery store or bank or car dealership or whatever, you needed to be fully prepared to bust out a pencil and paper and do anything from simple addition to long division.

Today's kids will never know that world. Today's kids will never realistically be in a situation they will need to do math where they won't have a calculator. Math education has changed to reflect this. As stated above, this is how you'd do math in your head.

Also, as stated above, teachers in other countries have adapted to these new strategies. American Teacher's Unions have dug in their heels and it has terrible PR here.

Papercut
Aug 24, 2005

AlistairCookie posted:



Okay. What in the hell is this about? Tim (first grade) brings this home a day this week for homework. He told me it was really hard, and in class they all had to work together and he still didn't understand it. I don't blame him! They took simple subtraction problems (which he is great at) and made them convoluted and needlessly difficult. We helped him do it, and explained the concept until he could do it (without disparaging the concept), but what is this? Or, I suppose, why? He's had other papers where he has to fill in a missing addend, like 3+__=7, and I totally understand that is pre-pre-algebra thinking. And that's great. But, for me, this thing jumped the shark.

Has anyone else encountered a strange math curriculum? Is this the "new math" I've been hearing about? Am I just old, and missed a memo? :corsair:

Also, if the math being taught stays strange and this isn't just a one off, how do I as a parent bring up concerns about a curriculum (without being douchebag?) Would I start with talking to his teacher and asking her to explain the rationale behind it?

That's the common core math, yes, and yeah it puts a big emphasis on using multiples of 10/100/1000 etc as step points between other numbers.

Fionnoula
May 27, 2010

Ow, quit.
I think the biggest issue I see with it is that it's just a tear-out sheet from a workbook so the parents aren't seeing the part of the book that actually explains the concepts. I remember my dad bitching and moaning about the "bullshit" math I was being taught when I was a kid, but I had a textbook and he'd glance through the chapter and go "oh, ok I get what they're doing". If your kid doesn't understand the concept well enough, they certainly aren't going to be able to explain it to you. The math itself makes a ton of sense, but without instructions it's pretty easy to just go "WTF is this poo poo?" Can you ask the teacher to send home a copy of the actual book? Maybe tell him or her that your son is confused by the concepts and you would like to be able to reinforce it at home but you need the resources to do that.

Khizan
Jul 30, 2013


It's a good habit to get into, breaking down problems like that. It makes mental math MUCH easier.

My preferred way of doing it, though, is to break it down like this:

  • 14 - 8
  • 10 + 4 - 8
  • 10 - 8 = 2
  • 2 + 4 = 6

hailthefish
Oct 24, 2010

The way they do it with the two empty boxes does look incredibly confusing, like you're supposed to divine the numbers to put in the boxes based on the number being subtracted, when it's really about the relationship between the number being subtracted and what it's being subtracted from. Maybe there was a page in the textbook itself that explained it better, but from what I've seen of Common Core there's a lot of stuff where the concept makes sense but it's explained in the most completely rear end-backwards way.

greatn
Nov 15, 2006

by Lowtax
My car has child seat anchors on the left and right rear seat, but not middle. Is it OK to put the car seat in the middle by hooking one hook to the left anchor and one to the right anchor?

Papercut
Aug 24, 2005

greatn posted:

My car has child seat anchors on the left and right rear seat, but not middle. Is it OK to put the car seat in the middle by hooking one hook to the left anchor and one to the right anchor?

No.

Volmarias
Dec 31, 2002

EMAIL... THE INTERNET... SEARCH ENGINES...

greatn posted:

My car has child seat anchors on the left and right rear seat, but not middle. Is it OK to put the car seat in the middle by hooking one hook to the left anchor and one to the right anchor?

Not unless your car manual explicitly said that it's possible to do this (it almost certainly didn't)

Your car seat probably has instructions on how to secure it if there's no LATCH system, check that first. There might be no safe way to do it in the middle.

greatn
Nov 15, 2006

by Lowtax
Yeah I didn't think so. My wife just needs to sit in the back with him then so she'll have more room.

And I need to get a Mazda 5 or something space next time.

Fionnoula
May 27, 2010

Ow, quit.

Volmarias posted:

Not unless your car manual explicitly said that it's possible to do this (it almost certainly didn't)

Your car seat probably has instructions on how to secure it if there's no LATCH system, check that first. There might be no safe way to do it in the middle.

If there's a seatbelt in the middle, I'd consider doing the seatbelt install over LATCH. We used LATCH when Liam was little because it was easy, but once he got too heavy for LATCH and I made the switch to seatbelt install, I've been much happier with how solid I can get it. It feels like a much better install to me.

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe
I find it weird that newer model car equipped with LATCH wouldn't have it on the center seats as well. Are you SURE it's not there? What model/year?

greatn
Nov 15, 2006

by Lowtax
2012 Hyundai Accent

frenchnewwave
Jun 7, 2012

Would you like a Cuppa?

newts posted:

In a similar vein...

Anyone have any success getting with quitting cosleeping? My daughter will be two in February and she's been sleeping in my bed since she was probably 9 months or so. She's still breastfeeding and wakes me up at least 4-5 times a night for boob. It's really the only way I can get her back to sleep. I just want my bed back and want my husband to move back to our room: he's been sleeping in the guest room for a few months.

I've read a bunch of different suggestions and we've tried a couple of times to get her out, but if don't want to traumatized her. But I haven't slept through the night for 2 years :(

Oh hi! I just want to say that we must be mom twinsies because this sounds almost exactly like my situation. Except my daughter just turned two.

Unrelated, I need some diaper rash remedies. She has been sick and pooping more than usual and now her butt is an angry red and she's clearly uncomfortable. We've never dealt with this so severe and our usual all-natural toxin-free stuff isn't doing jack, and neither is A&D.

skeetied
Mar 10, 2011

BonoMan posted:

I find it weird that newer model car equipped with LATCH wouldn't have it on the center seats as well. Are you SURE it's not there? What model/year?

I have a brand new car and it doesn't have LATCH in the middle seat. It's very rare for a vehicle to have it.

Banana_Boy
Jul 14, 2003

BonoMan posted:

I find it weird that newer model car equipped with LATCH wouldn't have it on the center seats as well. Are you SURE it's not there? What model/year?

Fairly certain LATCH is usually only in the left and right seats. Maybe it's on all 3 on larger vehicles? Our 2012 Accent and 2013 CX 5 both only have LATCH on the left and right rear seats.

Though to the person saying they found the seatbelt offering a much more secure position than LATCH, it may also come down to tightening methods. I went to a free class to install our seat in the fall before our little one came along and before there was plenty of movement, and now there's literally almost zero movement where the two seats meet.

Hdip
Aug 21, 2002

frenchnewwave posted:


Unrelated, I need some diaper rash remedies. .

We use "butt paste" . Mostly because the name is funny. Seems to work though.

I have a 2010 prius and put the infant seat into the middle for the first time. No latch connectors, but the seat belt install worked great for a road trip last week.

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe
Oh. So I guess my wife and I have both been endangering our daughters life because we both have our car seats mounted in the middle using what we thought was the latch system. Goddamn that should be something that is pointed out with huge loving glaring red letters.

Why is it best to mount a car seat in the middle seat but the industry standard doesn't include middle latches?

sheri
Dec 30, 2002

The short answer is because a seat belt install is just as safe as LATCH. Latch was just supposed to make it easier to get a good install. Depending on the car and car seat it may still be easier to use the belt. Learn how to install using your seat belt. You are going to have to use that once the child hits 40 pounds anyway (or whatever the LATCH limits are).

My car has 3 sets of latch anchors in the back seat. That is incredibly rare because the law only requires automakers to do two sets.

It is a Saturn Ion, so a cheap, small car. I don't know why they put three sets in but I'm glad!

sheri fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Dec 8, 2014

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sheri
Dec 30, 2002

LATCH info:

http://thecarseatlady.com/latch-weight-limits/

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