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dogs are cool, if i lived in a place with a backyard instead of an apartment i'd have a dog. going for walks with dogs is also cool taking dogs into every store, acting like it's your god-given right and calling an employee a dick when they say that a store with lots of uncovered fresh food is maybe not the best of places to take your dog is not cool
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 04:45 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 13:44 |
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SeekOtherCandidate posted:dogs are cool, if i lived in a place with a backyard instead of an apartment i'd have a dog. going for walks with dogs is also cool Yes, this is reasonable.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 04:47 |
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foobardog posted:including humans yes, this is reasonable
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 04:50 |
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Error 404 posted:I am talking about trained service animals, not the poor animal your trailer trash uncle-loving cousin keeps on a chain to look tough. Compared to the amount of pitpulls I have seen, the trained ones have been minimal compared to the super-aggressive ones. You can blame "Oregon trailer-born trash" for the problem but if I had a kid in a store and a pitpull owner rolled in, if I had any sense I would keep them away as far as possible I don't blame soceer moms in Whole Foods for freaking out, if the pitpull rips up your kid, it is going to impact you more than the owner. Most of the owners I have seen are slightly amused their dog is trying to go for you.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:05 |
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mod sassinator posted:Some people are allergic to dogs, or some folks (like muslims) have religious issues with them. It's kind of a jerk thing to take one in a supermarket IMHO. Well the point of my dog (shih tsu) is that it's hypo-allergenic, since the rest of my family is allergic. Also I work in a grocery store myself and love to pet the dogs people bring in. They're cleaner than most other stuff I touch (wash vegetables before you eat them, seriously).
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:10 |
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Ardennes posted:Compared to the amount of pitpulls I have seen, the trained ones have been minimal compared to the super-aggressive ones. You can blame "Oregon trailer-born trash" for the problem but if I had a kid in a store and a pitpull owner rolled in, if I had any sense I would keep them away as far as possible Oh? How many pitbulls have you seen? I have no doubt I've seen more, by an order of magnitude. I've seen dog-fight dogs, dogs that have attacked other animals and people viciously. you are doing nothing more than parroting the "anti-science" bullshit the news spews out. And by doing so you ensure the continuation of the abuse those dogs suffer.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:14 |
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effectual posted:Well the point of my dog (shih tsu) is that it's hypo-allergenic, since the rest of my family is allergic. Also I work in a grocery store myself and love to pet the dogs people bring in. They're cleaner than most other stuff I touch (wash vegetables before you eat them, seriously). but why would i want to wash something that's sat in crates on trucks and warehouses and on moist shelves without sneeze guards for days on end?
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:15 |
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e: not the article I was looking for
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:19 |
I'd rather deal with lovely dogs at work than people's kids. At least SOME dog owners care when their dog is being a poo poo.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:23 |
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Error 404 posted:Oh? And what are people suppose to do if the Pitbulls they see on the street are continually aggressive? You can throw "anti-science" as a defense but at the end of the day, the dogs are aggressive enough for people to be fearful and it is largely because of their owners. I know I have learned to be watchful when they are around, and if I had a small dog, I would lift it in case. If you want to say statistically Pitpulls are loving animals, that is fine, but in reality, it makes far more sense to protect yourself than trust someone is out of it or malicious. To be clear, I agree it isn't the breed necessarily but the owners but I don't trust the owner and trying to use the "science" defense to defend people being lovely is a lost cause. Even if you say they are far in the minority, they are obviously common enough to be a real problem and it shouldn't be the issue of people shopping for onions to deal with. Ardennes fucked around with this message at 05:28 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:26 |
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Ardennes posted:And what are people suppose to do if the Pitbulls they see on the street are continually aggressive? You can throw "anti-science" as a defense but at the end of the day, the dogs are aggressive enough for people to be fearful and it is largely because of their owners. I know I have learned to be watchful when they are around, and if I had a small dog, I would lift it in case. If you want to say statistically pitpulls are loving animals, that is fine, but in reality, it makes far more sense to protect yourself than trust someone who very likely is out of it or malicious. Then loving say something if some cheesedick is being reckless or mistreating a dog. Say something to a store employee, call animal control if someone's leaving an animal chained up or off leash. Crying about bloodthirsty remorseless baby shredders does nothing but make those animals more attractive to the exact type of rear end in a top hat who should never, ever have one. I can sympathize with your point of view, I really can. I have a 2 year old, and I'd be way more on edge with my kid around a lab, retriever, shepard, chihuahua, rottweiler, sheltie, shiba inu, doberman, etc. Etc. Etc. Than I would around any pit in my nearest shelter.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:38 |
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Error 404 posted:Nope, but thanks for playing. In my personal experience, almost all the pit bulls I've met have been very sweet dogs, but I wouldn't characterize them as smart. The demonization they are currently undergoing reminds me of how German shepherds and dobermans (especially dobermans) were viewed in the 1970s. e: Also, any dog that isn't a service animal should wait outside the grocery store - dogs do not belong in stores. CaptainSarcastic fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 05:57 |
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CaptainSarcastic posted:In my personal experience, almost all the pit bulls I've met have been very sweet dogs, but I wouldn't characterize them as smart. The demonization they are currently undergoing reminds me of how German shepherds and dobermans (especially dobermans) were viewed in the 1970s. Even with the windows down I won't leave my dog outside in super hot weather, and shih tsus get real upset when they're left alone for a while...
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 06:04 |
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effectual posted:Even with the windows down I won't leave my dog outside in super hot weather, and shih tsus get real upset when they're left alone for a while... Then don't take your dog to the store, unless your dog can do this kind of thing:
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 06:09 |
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CaptainSarcastic posted:In my personal experience, almost all the pit bulls I've met have been very sweet dogs, but I wouldn't characterize them as smart. quote:The demonization they are currently undergoing reminds me of how German shepherds and dobermans (especially dobermans) were viewed in the 1970s. THIS, SO loving MUCH. quote:e: Also, any dog that isn't a service animal should wait outside the grocery store - dogs do not belong in stores.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 06:11 |
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Error 404 posted:Then loving say something if some cheesedick is being reckless or mistreating a dog. Say something to a store employee, call animal control if someone's leaving an animal chained up or off leash. The issue if anything when the owner is there and using the dog passively as a weapon. If you are more worried about a Chihuahua than Pitbull it is your choice, but I know on a personal level pitbulls have routinely have put me far more on the defensive than any other dog. If you are on a sidewalk, it doesn't matter if the dog is on a leash if can still reach you and the owner doesn't give a poo poo. If anything by denying these owners are an issue of real concern and animal control can't help if you don't know where the owner lives. It is actually a real issue, and no I don't think the dogs are evil by I do think giving their owners a free pass is. If you want pretend I am just making it up, go ahead. quote:THIS, SO loving MUCH. http://www.kptv.com/story/26631736/pit-bull-in-custody-after-killing-pomeranian-on-portland-streetcar http://www.kgw.com/story/news/local/animal/2014/10/06/pit-bull-that-attacked-portland-woman-had-history-of-bites/16820387/ http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2014/11/recent_pit_bull_attacks_in_por.html http://www.kptv.com/story/22858913/pit-bull-attacking-small-dog-shot-and-killed-by-police http://www.katu.com/news/local/Pit-Bull-attacks-kills-womans-hearing-ear-dog-238200131.html http://portland.gotnewswire.com/news/horse-euthanized-after-pit-bull-attack-in-damascus http://tdn.com/elderly-castle-rock-woman-airlifted-to-hospital-after-dog-attack/article_bb612d90-4c85-11e3-812e-001a4bcf887a.html Hell, even Beaverton gets on the action. http://www.kptv.com/story/19424490/only-on-12-man-says-pit-bull-bit-neighbor-to-defend-property And... Sherwood. http://www.kptv.com/story/24946426/police-man-stabs-pit-bull-to-death-to-stop-attack Ardennes fucked around with this message at 06:45 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 06:19 |
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effectual posted:Once in whole foods a dick employee there told me to leave since I had my dog with me. I always walk him before going in stores but whatever, so I only go back there a couple times a year for special beers. This shouldnt even need to be said. Its bad enough that its scattered all over (some) cities. To "make" some dickhead dog owner pick up their own poo poo requires potentially (extremely) hostile interactions. CaptainSarcastic posted:In my personal experience, almost all the pit bulls I've met have been very sweet dogs, but I wouldn't characterize them as smart. Rottweilers concern me more based on the ones Ive met.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 06:25 |
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Dogs are awesome, I own two and we take them everywhere. Everywhere doesn't include stores though because what the gently caress, it's a store! Other than pet stores, which is fun. What is becoming more common is dogs at the office. Which means poorly trained dogs at the office. Yes, please bark at me because I passed by your cubicle. That's nice. *repeats all day, multiple times*
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:06 |
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As a person who has to make deliveries to peoples' homes I've found the smaller the dog, the more likely it is to bite you. Big dogs are friendly and cuddly and little dogs just want to eat your face. I hate all those little Shihtz. I saw a golden retriever bite off someones face in my neighborhood once, friendliest dog, but it just went apeshit on this neighbor kid for no reason.
Doorknob Slobber fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:07 |
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Mrit posted:Yes, please bark at me because I passed by your cubicle. That's nice. *repeats all day, multiple times*
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:17 |
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Ardennes posted:A bunch of links Posting a bunch of individual news stories doesn't really say anything unless you compare it to similar searches for other dog breeds. And even then, it doesn't disprove that greater media focus on pitbulls is due to demonization rather than an actual greater number of incidents, as both situations could explain a greater number of stories. The only thing that actually matters is the number of actual total incidents per breed, not the number of media reports for a single breed.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:23 |
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I guess the lesson is that just like your ugly & annoying kids, people don't want to be bothered by your annoying, poorly trained pets. i.e. Keep your private poo poo to yourself. (This isn't to anyone in particular)
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:24 |
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Remember when that study came out a few years ago talking about how the carbon footprint of a dog was similar to that of a large suv and all the pearl clutchers were just flipping their poo poo because they already drove a Prius and bought organic food so therefore their dog didn't count? Good times. Dogs are pretty cool.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:33 |
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Ardennes posted:http://www.kptv.com/story/26631736/pit-bull-in-custody-after-killing-pomeranian-on-portland-streetcar I CAN POST LINKS TO THINGS TOO! quote:The media narrative has played a major role in today’s depiction of pit bulls as a dangerous, unpredictable dog. The reality is, most dog bites are not reported nor do their stories make into the headlines giving the community a false sense of security with other breeds while creating an unfair perception of pit bulls. Source: http://www.hamiltonhumane.com/services/pit-bull-education/hshc-pitbull-information quote:A study by the National Canine Research Council reveals biased reporting by the media,its devastating consequences for dogs and the toll it takes on public safety. Emphasis mine. Source: National Canine Research Council, Center for Disease Control and Prevention And from: Source:http://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/images/dogbreeds-a.pdf quote:Several interacting factors affect a dog’s propensity to bite, including heredity, sex, early experience, socialization and training, health (medical and behavioral), reproductive status, quality of ownership and supervision, and victim behavior. For example, a study in Denver of medically-attended dog bites in 1991 suggested that male dogs are 6.2 times more likely to bite than female dogs, sexually intact dogs are 2.6 times more likely to bite than neutered dogs, and chained dogs are 2.8 times more likely to bite than unchained dogs 12. Communities have tried to address the dog bite problem by focusing on different factors related to biting behavior.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:39 |
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Error 404 posted:I CAN POST LINKS TO THINGS TOO! quote:Posting a bunch of individual news stories doesn't really say anything unless you compare it to similar searches for other dog breeds. And even then, it doesn't disprove that greater media focus on pitbulls is due to demonization rather than an actual greater number of incidents, as both situations could explain a greater number of stories. The only thing that actually matters is the number of actual total incidents per breed, not the number of media reports for a single breed. http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/2010/10/29/dangerous-dogs.html 1, Pit Bull Varieties included: Pit Bull, Staffordshire Bull Terrier, American StaffordshireTerrier Registered dogs (U.S.): 2,683 [out of the Kennel Club I presume] Child victims: 661 Adult victims: 519 Maimings: 819 Deaths: 159 You can claim media bias, I don't even disagree but you need to actually provide evidence that the general public has no worry if a pitbull is aggressive towards them. You say you're far more scared than toy dogs than Pitbulls, but I just don't see it either from the sources I have provided or my personal experience. Hell, you can say Dailybeast is poo poo but they are providing data from the American Kennel Club. If anything you are claiming science is on your side but you haven't actually done any sourcing that addresses the issue. I don't even hate pitbulls themselves, it is the training they get and the denial of that danger that is actually a bad thing. quote:Australia,[30] Ecuador,[31] Malaysia,[32] New Zealand,[33] the territory of Puerto Rico,[34] Singapore,[35] Venezuela[36] Denmark, France, Germany, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania and Spain[37] have enacted some form of breed-specific legislation on pit bull-type dogs, including American Pit Bull Terriers, ranging from outright bans to restrictions on import and conditions on ownership.[37][38] The state of New South Wales in Australia places restrictions on the breed, including mandatory sterilization.[39][40] Governments run a muck, another argument against democracy? Ardennes fucked around with this message at 07:55 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:49 |
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I didn't realize the "Daily Beast" was a more authoritative source than the loving Humane Society and CDC.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:53 |
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Error 404 posted:I didn't realize the "Daily Beast" was a more authoritative source than the loving Humane Society and CDC. The data was the American Kennel Club, as I actually wrote in my post. You're desperate. quote:Hell, you can say Dailybeast is poo poo but they are providing data from the American Kennel Club. quote:For a final “score” for each breed, we referred to the American Kennel Club’s most recent precise data on dog registration statistics. The numerical attack score was divided by total registered population to calculate the total score for each breed—a metric of incidents per dog, in essence. Ardennes fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:56 |
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Ardennes posted:The data was the American Kennel Club, as I actually wrote in my post. You're desperate. You don't like GMO's or dogs. Maybe the problem is you?
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:57 |
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Mrit posted:You don't like GMO's or dogs. Maybe the problem is you? I like dogs and don't mind GMOs, try again. That said, in the discussion over Pitbulls, despite the claim of "science" there actually seems to be very few data presented that they are less dangerous than toy dogs. Btw, it isn't even about Pitbulls being smart or not smart or naturally aggressive or not, but that particularly owners have taught them to be aggressive. Ardennes fucked around with this message at 08:04 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 07:59 |
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Ardennes posted:The data was the American Kennel Club, as I actually wrote in my post. You're desperate. Yes, so you said, but I have only your word on it as nothing in your link, or on a cursory google search brings that poo poo up. What I do see, is copy and paste from loving wikipedia (which is always a dependable and accurate source ) Of several other sites and organizations of unknown provenance talking about Breed Specific Legislation here and across the world (don't even get me fuckin started) and given GMO chat we can all imagine how trustworthy that kind of info actually tends to be. Here's one of the "sources" footnoted in the bit you quoted, #38 to be specific http://dogbitelaw.com/dangerous-vicious-dogs/dangerous-and-vicious-dogs.html#meaning Some ambulance chaser's website. Dude's like Orly Taitz, but with less credibility. Edit: and as I said there is no link to any statement of any kind from the AKC, any googling of the text you've quoted just leads back to the Daily Beast. I mean gently caress, dude, you're really undermining your own position here. Error 404 fucked around with this message at 08:14 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:08 |
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We need labels on genetically modified dogs. I want to see giant warning labels on labradoodles and buggs.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:09 |
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Error 404 posted:Yes, so you said, but I have only your word on it as nothing in your link, or on a cursory google search brings that poo poo up. Wikipedia is used all the time around here, and usually if someone posts links, you post something that directly refutes them. Do you don't think those governments passed that legislation? Do you really have anything? We are at the point of saying GMOs are why Pitbulls can't bite people? gently caress me. It isn't like I want to shoot the dogs or something but you know maybe have dudes know train them to be aggressive and especially not bring them in stores if they do? Ardennes fucked around with this message at 08:16 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:13 |
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What is there to directly refute? You post unsourced facts and figures in response to my sourced arguments. literally googling the text you posted only leads to wikipedia (and the sources cited in the text don't actually have fuckall to do with our discussion btw, hth) Or it leads to the daily beast which claims to have AKC data, and yet I can find no such data from the AKC. Again, googling of the figures you quoted only leads me to various forums and yahoo news discussing the very daily beast link you've provided. loving hell dude, you are literally arguing with me about poo poo I spend all day every day doing. My career. I loving work with dogs, and I counsel people about pitbulls, educating them and dispelling the loving myths that pop up on the news all the time. Every loving day. So be scared or whatever, but just realize your fear has very little to do with reality.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:22 |
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Ardennes posted:
I will love anything if it has been genetically modified. Inbred dogs or bananas with ears, I want them all.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:28 |
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Mrit posted:I will love anything if it has been genetically modified. Inbred dogs or bananas with ears, I want them all.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:32 |
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Error 404 posted:What is there to directly refute? If anything I am a bit worried you can't produce your own data being a professional. Your sources are about media bias of a story and age/Sex differences not exactly what I need. If you can give me some sourced data on attacks anywhere comparable, link them. E: Also I don't get your problem with Wikipedia in particular over that paragraph. Anyway, all I ask is you have some data on how Chihuahuas are more dangerous by the severity of their attacks. Ardennes fucked around with this message at 08:42 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:33 |
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:41 |
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Hey look the Pacific NW is better than the South because our cops only give them black eyes! wait
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:45 |
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It's ok because that wasn't racism, it was just run of the mill police brutality.
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# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:52 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 13:44 |
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Ardennes posted:If anything I am a bit worried you can't produce your own data being a professional. Your sources are about media bias of a story and age/Sex differences not exactly what I need. Dude, apparently you never read what I linked: CDC Study on Breeds of dogs involved in fatal human attacks in the United States between 1979 and 1998 http://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/images/dogbreeds-a.pdf which is the primary source cited here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States But if a 20 year study isn't good enough because it's old, here's something more recent: http://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/abs/10.2460/javma.243.12.1726 From the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association: Co-occurrence of potentially preventable factors in 256 dog bite–related fatalities (DBRF) in the United States (2000–2009) (Apologies that this one is behind a paywall, but here's a whitepaper) From which I will quote: quote:Major co-occurrent factors for the 256 DBRFs included absence of an able-bodied person to intervene (n = 223 [87.1%]), incidental or no familiar relationship of victims with dogs (218 [85.2%]), owner failure to neuter dogs (216 [84.4%]), compromised ability of victims to interact appropriately with dogs (198 [77.4%]), dogs kept isolated from regular positive human interactions versus family dogs (195 [76.2%]), owners’ prior mismanagement of dogs (96 [37.5%]), and owners’ history of abuse or neglect of dogs (54 [21.1%]). Four or more of these factors co-occurred in 206 (80.5%) deaths. For 401 dogs described in various media accounts, reported breed differed for 124 (30.9%); for 346 dogs with both media and animal control breed reports, breed differed for 139 (40.2%). Valid breed determination was possible for only 45 (17.6%) DBRFs; 20 breeds, including 2 known mixes, were identified. quote:Conclusions and Clinical Relevance — Most DBRFs were characterized by coincident, preventable factors; breed was not one of these. Study results supported previous recommendations for multifactorial approaches, instead of single-factor solutions such as breed-specific legislation, for dog bite prevention. emphasis mine. I'm not even going to address your bullshit edit about the chihuahua, of course a bite from a pitbull does more damage, it is a bigger and stronger dog, but the likelihood of being bitten by a chihuahua is several times greater/less predictable, so if you really want to be all "think of the children" about it, you should drat well be more wary of small breeds or actual historically aggressive large breeds, than a pitbull. Like that time a pomeranian killed a baby for no reason at all. Media bias enters the equation because that's all you are evidently informed by, and that's the misinformation I'm attempting to correct here. Error 404 fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Dec 6, 2014 |
# ? Dec 6, 2014 08:54 |