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slorb posted:Sorkin has teetered on the edge of being human garbage for so long I'm sort of relieved he's finally gone redpill so I can write him off forever. Yeah, who knew the MRA force was so strong with that one? One of cornerstones of MRA ideology is that women always lie about rape. But then again, MRAs really hate women, so... I always flash back to the season 1 promos of the show, where all the actresses were talking about how great it was to work with a show runner who wrote women so well. Except for Olivia Munn (Sloan Sabbith), who I liked in this last episode even though her storyline was garbage, I was wondering what they were on or if they were merely being polite and wanted to keep working in Hollywood.
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Dec 8, 2014 11:27
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"You're paid $55,000/year. That's almost twice the national average for a family of 4." No, median household income is is $52,000. What the gently caress?edit: What the gently caress was that ending? Will and ghost dad? Will we never find out why Charlie was being such a lapdog? Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 11:32 on Dec 8, 2014 |
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Dec 8, 2014 11:28
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Josh Lyman posted:"You're paid $55,000/year. That's almost twice the national average for a family of 4." It was apparently revealed (though I wasn't paying attention at the time because I was too distracted by how awful the scene was). He was being a lapdog to save all of them from being canned. I think?
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Dec 8, 2014 11:34
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Josh Lyman posted:"You're paid $55,000/year. That's almost twice the national average for a family of 4." I personally was so upset at the show that i didn't even watch it or pay attention in the slightest, but it was godawful
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Dec 8, 2014 11:36
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Foo posted:It was apparently revealed (though I wasn't paying attention at the time because I was too distracted by how awful the scene was). He was being a lapdog to save all of them from being canned. I googled for what "Oh Shenandoah" is about and apparently nobody knows, so add that to the stack of bullshit this show has put us through.
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Dec 8, 2014 11:36
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Josh Lyman posted:Yeah, I guess that makes sense, but why wouldn't Charlie just tell them that? I vomited on my keyboard at how disgusting that portrayal of something I didn't even watch was. Apparently though, he was being a white knight for his employees, and, get this, like a cartoon he just up and died for no reason.
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Dec 8, 2014 11:40
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I will remember this episode as the Bill Cosby episode, because I learned the internet isn't fair to rapists or celebrities so imagine how rough it must be to be a rapist celebrity (but apparently pretty great to be a celebrity rapist).
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Dec 8, 2014 11:41
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Sub Rosa posted:I will remember this episode as the Bill Cosby episode, because I learned the internet isn't fair to rapists or celebrities so imagine how rough it must be to be a rapist celebrity (but apparently pretty great to be a celebrity rapist). Please call those allegations, because Bill Cosby hasn't been proven guilty, and it's sad that everyone just automatically assumes he is guilty.Do you think Micheal Jackson raped a buncha kids too?
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Dec 8, 2014 11:48
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What the gently caress was Maggie talking about on the plane with the turbulence being due to laminar flow? Laminar flow is the opposite of turbulence flow, which is what air turbulence is due to - it's in the loving name. This is literally worse than hurricanes are caused by low air pressure since that's at least half right. And how the gently caress did "Honor thy father is the Third Commandment" get into the West Wing pilot? That seriously makes me so mad.
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Dec 8, 2014 11:54
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rape
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Dec 8, 2014 12:02
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Wow, this a supremely awful episode, especially in context of the Rolling Stone rape story. Literally the only thing I liked about it was Ryan flipping his poo poo over Sloan's insubordination and what I thought correctly telling them to get the gently caress out if the Will deliberately disobey management. And holy poo poo Maggie/Jim could not be any more cringe worthy and just plain awful.
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Dec 8, 2014 12:12
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pentyne posted:Wow, this a supremely awful episode, especially in context of the Rolling Stone rape story. Literally the only thing I liked about it was Ryan flipping his poo poo over Sloan's insubordination and what I thought correctly telling them to get the gently caress out if the Will deliberately disobey management. I thought it was a great episode, personally.
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Dec 8, 2014 12:14
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pentyne posted:Wow, this a supremely awful episode, especially in context of the Rolling Stone rape story. Literally the only thing I liked about it was Ryan flipping his poo poo over Sloan's insubordination and what I thought correctly telling them to get the gently caress out if the Will deliberately disobey management. Actually it could not be more on topic with regards to the rape storyline, especially in light of the Rolling Stones story. We, as a society, have decided that we are deciding in dubio pro reo and therefore it is a very bad idea to convene courts of public opinion if we feel that the justice system has wronged us.
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Dec 8, 2014 12:24
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MRAs watch The Newsroom.
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Dec 8, 2014 12:46
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Poetic Justice posted:I thought it was a great episode, personally. Yup, enjoyed it a lot.
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Dec 8, 2014 13:54
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GaussianCopula posted:We, as a society, have decided that we are deciding in dubio pro reo and therefore it is a very bad idea to convene courts of public opinion if we feel that the justice system has wronged us. I agree, just look at Ferguson. Obviously the grand jury found that nice white officer didn't do anything wrong, so what are are everyone up in arms about?
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Dec 8, 2014 14:48
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Sub Rosa posted:I agree, just look at Ferguson. Obviously the grand jury found that nice white officer didn't do anything wrong, so what are are everyone up in arms about? I know, right? Really, all those protestors should just sit down and shut up, because can you imagine how horrible it must be for that nice white officer right now? Same with all those folks in NY protesting the death of Eric Garner. The legal system did its job, end of story.
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Dec 8, 2014 15:56
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The Newsroom isn't about misogyny. It's actually about ethics in
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Dec 8, 2014 16:23
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I'm curious how Don would react to a death row person being acquitted due to DNA evidence or something. He does not seem to have room in his narrow view for times the legal system failed. Was the Moscow adventure portion of the program supposed to be a parody? We get Sorkin's rant against participatory journalism at the top, and then the only news story they are covering could have been done by anyone with a smart phone. Are we supposed to think that Jim and Maggie bring some magical journalistic integrity to being paparazzi? The story is certainly newsworthy, but it is unclear how they think they are possibly covering it in a way that provides information beyond 'We were there!'. Did Jim think that if he sat next to the guy on the plane they were going to break the story wide open?
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Dec 8, 2014 16:25
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Doctor Spaceman posted:MRAs watch The Newsroom. e: I suppose you were probably making the joke more subtly than I. nooneofconsequence fucked around with this message at 16:50 on Dec 8, 2014 |
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Dec 8, 2014 16:42
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I'm pretty embarrassed I ever thought I liked this show after this episode. I don't think whoever wrote that scene with the rape victim has ever seen how rape victims are treated online. It's funny how just one awful scene can color your opinion on a series but, in a series without a lot of episodes, this is a pretty big deal.
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Dec 8, 2014 17:39
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If I, an upper-middle class, white, protestant male, the epitome of privileged, masqueraded as a female rape victim and used her website to sabotage a competing candidate for a job, would the website still be a cool "safe space for women"? Would it still be morally and ethically acceptable for it to exist? What do you think the odds of such a site being misused are?
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Dec 8, 2014 17:51
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tadashi posted:I'm pretty embarrassed I ever thought I liked this show after this episode. I don't think whoever wrote that scene "Whoever" is Aaron Sorkin. A man known for his horrifically misogynistic style has topped everything he's ever done in the past 2 decades and written the absolute worst loving think that his named is signed on. The fact that it occured in the same week that Rolling Stone walked back their graphic college rape story only means this episode will get an insane amount of additional backlash as a result. quote:“The kind of rape you’re talking about is difficult or impossible to prove,” Don tells her. It’s not a “kind of rape,” the woman responds sharply. She argues that her site isn’t about getting revenge, that it’s “a public service”: “Do not go on a date with these guys, do not go to a party with these guys.” Don cuts her off: “Do not give these guys a job, ever.” He argues that she’s making it easier for men to be falsely accused, but the woman says that she’s weighed that cost and decided that it’s more important that women be warned. “What am I wrong about?” she asks. “What am I wrong about?” There is no loving chance this season will be defined by anything other then this scene. A male writer decides to basically lecture the audience about how rape isn't a big deal and lying whores will always try to jam up a decent man and to ignore how prolific and abhorrent rape is in a college environment because there's always a chick just trying to cause problems. The idea that a bunch of women will decide to use anonymous rape reporting websites to get petty revenge by making false accusations trumps all other possibilities because clearly the majority of its use will be false reports and to injure innocent men via "Internet justice" gently caress you Sorkin, and I'm glad that your reprehensible episode aired during a loving typhoon of rape news stories so people can see just how much of a piece of poo poo you are.
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Dec 8, 2014 17:57
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The problem with rape accusations is that it totally is an ethically grey area where people accused of rape do have a lot to legitimately lose from the accusation alone, whether substantiated or not, and there's a difficulty in how exactly the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" is applied to unsubstantiated rape allegations But it's a loving quagmire that isn't solved by don insisting it's totally black and white where he has to side with the skeezy guy and especially isn't solved by him literally mansplaining to a loving rape victim or completely removing her agency by making her decision for her Seriously though the argument for how to deal with rape allegations are a loving minefield and sorkin addressed it in the absolute worst loving way possible that illustrates how much of a misogynist piece of garbage he is
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Dec 8, 2014 18:00
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Soooo, ignoring rape chat but I just loving knew that Charlie was dead as soon as he turned to walk away. He hit the ground and I heard Marine 1 flying overhead. edit: Also his heart attack face was quite possibly the best thing ever. Sam Waterson I love you to death but that was god awful, but now the world knows what your O face looks like. VVV: Martin Sheen, and having Sorkin take all the drugs seems to help. I don't think he had nearly as much control over things on WW as he did later on. NBC doubled down on Studio 60 and let him run amok. The Newsroom came along, HBO didn't learn from the past and now we've reached 100% Sorkin. HUGE SPACEKABLOOIE fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Dec 8, 2014 |
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Dec 8, 2014 18:13
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How the hell is Sorkin the same guy who wrote The West Wing, one of my favorite TV shows, and this poo poo.
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Dec 8, 2014 18:19
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The Bartlett admin was always on the Right Side and topics never had room for nuance. Closest they ever came to a moral question was when Bartlett had that dude assassinated and even then everyone was ok with it. Rape talk with Don "OJ didn't do it" Keefer at least allowed some room to argue each side. Which Sorkin sucks at. Just be happy MacKenzie, a Cambridge alum, hasn't counted on her fingers this season.
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Dec 8, 2014 18:29
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DARPA posted:Just be happy MacKenzie, a Cambridge alum, hasn't counted on her fingers this season. THAT'S the most unrealistic thing ever? Anyway this show is cool I like when the Columbia educated elite newsman tells the rape victim that she's being a big meanie by naming her rapists. Poor babies.
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Dec 8, 2014 18:42
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Toshimo posted:If I, an upper-middle class, white, protestant male, the epitome of privileged, masqueraded as a female rape victim and used her website to sabotage a competing candidate for a job, would the website still be a cool "safe space for women"? Would it still be morally and ethically acceptable for it to exist? 100% Don was right. And he was also right to worry about a false charge against him. He had never met this woman. For all he knew she was some nut who would seize upon the opportunity to cry rape against a reporter who stalked her. We got some critical thinking going on in this thread. And yes, there are some seriously disturbed women out there. This is reality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYl68KipxeM E: Also, RAPE KILLED CHARLIE! E2: The Snoozeroom: A show so bad, it makes people lose any ability for logical argument. Waltzing Along fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Dec 8, 2014 |
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Dec 8, 2014 19:05
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Agreed. Don did everything 100% correct. He was in the shittiest of poo poo situations. If he didn't do it he would lose his job and was forced into an uncomfortable discussion on a very nasty subject. I don't know or care whether or not the girl was lying. Neither the internet nor a news outlet are the place to hammer out such things. It belongs in a court, and a court only. I think this scene can be somewhat contrasted to the scene last year where Don tried to get Will to go on the air regarding the death penalty guy and Will shut him down. He was right to approach with caution, he was right about the site eventually being used for baseless attacks and he was right about what would happen if she took it on the air. The entire idea of a potential rapist and his accuser being made to face off on the news is beyond hosed. Pretty sure someone said it on the show but it isn't news it's entertainment. Regardless of everything else Don saved her from kicking up her already world of poo poo several orders of magnitude. This is why Don is awesome.
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Dec 8, 2014 20:09
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Came to this thread to post about how this episode was one of the worst things I've ever seen. I stand corrected, the last couple of pages of discussion are the worst thing I've ever seen. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that MRA rape apologists are fans of the show, especially after that episode.
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Dec 8, 2014 20:15
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Shakugan posted:Came to this thread to post about how this episode was one of the worst things I've ever seen. I stand corrected, the last couple of pages of discussion are the worst thing I've ever seen. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that MRA rape apologists are fans of the show, especially after that episode. On the one hand, Sorkin seems to be able to find protagonists who can twist themselves into knots finding the ideal way to report on the news, so why couldn't Don? On the other hand, this watched like something kind of real, and the white guy being a little bit out of his depth talking to a rape victim felt more complex. I liked it. He didn't know what to do with the situation where they had all made a commitment to doing the news well, and here was a CEO-ordered clusterfuck waiting to happen, riding under the guise of reporting on sexual assault on campus. And he still couldn't get off his high horse about it. He DID almost look curt and dismissive when he left, and I was pissed off that he didn't pull off the impossible when she deserved better. But that was more real than anything they've done this season, and making viewers have complex feelings about the scene was good.
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Dec 8, 2014 20:26
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It really was really bad. Like so bad we haven't even gotten to things that most TVIV threads would be complaining about, like Josh and Donna or whatever their names are this time getting together because well the show is ending so it is time to do that. I figured out that the cellmate was his dad around when he asked about the "Mission to Civilize" and put that together with that he was supposed to be in solitary. But apparently no one really cared that famous white news anchor does 52 or 53 days for contempt of court, that was really a non-issue wasn't it?
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Dec 8, 2014 20:29
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Sub Rosa posted:But apparently no one really cared that famous white news anchor does 52 or 53 days for contempt of court, that was really a non-issue wasn't it?
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Dec 8, 2014 20:32
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Kafka Esq. posted:Have you heard of James Risen? No, what nightly news show did he host?
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Dec 8, 2014 20:37
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Sub Rosa posted:No, what nightly news show did he host?
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Dec 8, 2014 20:45
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How many days has he served for contempt so far?
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Dec 8, 2014 20:47
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Kafka Esq. posted:Pulitzer prize winning journalists trying desperately to escape contempt charges isn't good enough for you? It has to be Great White Talky Man? I think you're buying into the premise of the show a little too much. 90%+ of Americans couldn't name a Pulitzer winner. Probably close to that many couldn't even name a single print journalist. Draw your own conclusions.
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Dec 8, 2014 20:48
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Actually they did mention that ratings had been up since Will was off the air, which I think is pretty funny. I guess Sloan is the fresh young face the network needed anyway.
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Dec 8, 2014 20:58
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Okay, fair enough. I don't think we have a comparable situation to MacAvoy being in prison for contempt with no attempt at expansion by the network. He's just missing for two months. Maybe Pruitt forbade them to chase the story. That's pretty weak. I don't know. Maybe the world really is being taken by apathy of the internet generation and nobody gives a gently caress that a popularity roller coaster disappeared for 50+ days? That would fit in with the thesis of the season.
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Dec 8, 2014 21:00
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