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The (offline, fat client) character and monster and campaign tools for D&D 4th Edition were excellent and I made great use of them. I canceled my subscription to the D&D thing when they turned it into a cloud client (and killed the ability to customize/extend it at the same time). Done well, these tools can be huge time-savers. There's definitely a market for them. I'm not sure this particular kickstarter makes much sense, though. The value proposition for the 4th edition thing was that you got effectively all of the content from 4th edition core and expansion books, plus customization options, and you could get enough copies with one online account for everyone in your group to share. E.g., the tight integration with the published rules. As an independent, third-party thing, you always have to wonder about the accuracy of the data (if it comes with any), not to mention buying in and then seeing it killed in a year or three and losing everything (which is a big problem with cloud software from tiny companies in general).
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Dec 6, 2014 20:28
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Evil Mastermind posted:I don't get how these projects don't seem to realize that for a lot of people, part of the appeal of face-to-face RPGs is that you don't need electronics or smartphones or tablets to play them. They're all trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist. You have no idea how many people I meet that start talking about the future of RPGs being ''something like an app or software.'' They don't know what, but by God it's gonna be some lovely app that will magically make games good.
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Dec 6, 2014 20:48
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Maybe I'm in the minority...but I love digital character sheets; I hate having to waste a dozen sheets of paper printing out new versions of sheets for my players.
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Dec 6, 2014 21:03
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Evil Mastermind posted:Hey look, it's warning sign number one! The core is that every player has go in for $25, for the GM needs to foot the bill for them. Presuming they have applicable devices, of course. So it's a pretty big investment, like $140-190 for most of the groups I'm in. There also isn't any comment on what happens if you lose your connection to the cloud. The funny thing about the video is starting out with "providing his RPG bonafides", and... personally, I don't care if you've been roleplaying for 10 or 40 years. Tell me about the software. There isn't much of that. There are a lot of generalities, but I'd have to have a detailed demonstration of the interface to take a project like that seriously. The interface is everything, it's the one thing that'll make or break the product. Everything else is just vagaries. Of course, it's also Pathfinder-only, I'd take it more seriously if they had approached any of the other open-source or OGL systems, like FATE. Mid-complexity and light-complexity systems would even be better for an system like this because it'd reduce the amount of interface-wrangling necessary. Can you imagine entering in a custom d20 monster on a tablet's software keyboard? Yikes.
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Dec 6, 2014 21:06
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jivjov posted:Maybe I'm in the minority...but I love digital character sheets; I hate having to waste a dozen sheets of paper printing out new versions of sheets for my players. Sure, but you can build the skeleton of a digital sheet in a spreadsheet, or use one of the dozens of other fan- or professionally-made spreadsheets or apps that are already out there. These guys are asking half a million dollars to reinvent the better mousetrap.
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Dec 6, 2014 21:17
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Alien Rope Burn posted:Of course, it's also Pathfinder-only, I'd take it more seriously if they had approached any of the other open-source or OGL systems, like FATE. Mid-complexity and light-complexity systems would even be better for an system like this because it'd reduce the amount of interface-wrangling necessary. Can you imagine entering in a custom d20 monster on a tablet's software keyboard? Yikes. Of course it's Pathfinder only; if they played other games like Fate then they'd realize that the problems they're trying to fix in Warning Sign Number One are problems that are pretty much specific to Pathfinder.
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Dec 6, 2014 21:39
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Evil Mastermind posted:Of course it's Pathfinder only; if they played other games like Fate then they'd realize that the problems they're trying to fix in Warning Sign Number One are problems that are pretty much specific to Pathfinder. Time to manage my incredibly complex character sheet! *looks at 3x5 index card*
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Dec 6, 2014 21:47
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I'm open to digital assistance in my roleplaying, but I don't want to interpose an app or device as the arbiter of the experience. I want the freedom to house rule, to handwave things that aren't dramatically important at the moment, to play outside the exact prescribed space of the Rules As Written. Hard-coding the rules into an app just won't make that possible. It's one of the reasons I never understood why Jason Rohrer's "game" Sleep is Death was supposed to be appealing. Sure, you can tell some two player interactive stories with it. But only some. If you aren't restricted by that interface, you have way more options.
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Dec 6, 2014 22:00
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Evil Mastermind posted:Of course it's Pathfinder only; if they played other games like FATE then they'd realize that the problems they're trying to fix in Warning Sign Number One are problems that are pretty much specific to Pathfinder. Well, it'd be nice for something like FATE to have an easy way to track zones and aspects and basically just act as a game board, but you probably wouldn't need more than one device for that.
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Dec 6, 2014 22:30
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Alien Rope Burn posted:Well, it'd be nice for something like FATE to have an easy way to track zones and aspects and basically just act as a game board, but you probably wouldn't need more than one device for that. I just use a Noteboard and a pack of these.
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Dec 6, 2014 22:54
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xiw posted:The D&D5 character builder project, having been dumped by WotC Wait, what? This is a thing that happened?
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Dec 6, 2014 23:07
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ElegantFugue posted:Wait, what? This is a thing that happened? It happened a while back, Wizards severed their business relationship due to what Trapdoor calls 'differences in vision'. Incidentally, a Trapdoor rep has been posting on Reddit. Pathfinder will be the only supported ruleset at launch, and including other rulesets 'isn't the top priority'.
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Dec 6, 2014 23:51
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ElegantFugue posted:Wait, what? This is a thing that happened? Yeah - the kickstarter adds a lot of information to let us read between the lines. My speculation is that Trapdoor wanted a complex digital publishing platform to be the future of online RPG distribution, Wizards wanted something simple and deliverable. If Trapdoor really wanted $425,000 more cash from Wizards to be done, then ending the relationship was the smartest digital movie I've ever seen Wizards do.
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Dec 7, 2014 05:11
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Oh yeah, the projected pricing based on the kickstarter:quote:Morningstar will be free to download. For free, people will be able to create basic characters (limited levels), run a free adventure, and set up a party. There will be a cost associated with unlocking full functionality for players, game masters, and game designers (i.e., the Forge) similar to the pledge levels we are running. The cheapest Forge pledge level is $125. The cheapest game master level is $40. The cheapest non-earlybird player level is $25. So it looks like designing adventures is a yearly cost, whereas it's a fixed cost to get the software for the other tools, but also ongoing costs to buy adventures! Note that without paying the ongoing (presumably $85 a year?) subscription to the forge, you can't play your own adventures using the GM tools - I guess you can mess with existing ones, but you can't upload maps, for example.
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Dec 7, 2014 05:21
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Evil Mastermind posted:I just use a Noteboard and a pack of these. Hello, new Christmas list.
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Dec 7, 2014 05:21
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xiw posted:Yeah - the kickstarter adds a lot of information to let us read between the lines. My speculation is that Trapdoor wanted a complex digital publishing platform to be the future of online RPG distribution, Wizards wanted something simple and deliverable. That's assuming it was even a choice in the first place. It's up in the air whether the D&D division has a spare four hundred thousand dollars (give or take 25k) just lying around for them to appoint to "Software, ugly and janky."
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Dec 7, 2014 05:25
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While that sure is a lot of money for a trad games publisher, it's also not a lot of money for software. As a basis of comparison, it typically costs something on the order of $120k a year to employ a basic software developer with a couple years' experience and a degree. So $440k is enough money to hire a team of three for a year, assuming one lead dev and two junior devs. Exactly how much work is involved in a given software project varies wildly, depending on platform, existing engines/frameworks, design goals, use cases, and many more considerations. I have no idea how much WotC spent developing its 4th edition digital tools over the last few years, but I'd be flabbergasted if it was anything less than a million dollars, and not at all shocked or surprised if it was more like two to five mil.
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Dec 7, 2014 05:36
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So they're trying to reinvent Hero Lab?
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Dec 7, 2014 05:45
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Evil Mastermind posted:I just use a Noteboard and a pack of these. You always post such useful stuff, it's like a superpower or something.
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Dec 7, 2014 07:17
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That seems pretty cool, but I'm still excited for The Future when we have full-table MSPaint screens everywhere. Hopefully, my life and the economy last to the point that, even after the collapse of civilization, I can draw multi-layer dongs on any surface and apply the craquelure filter to them at whim.
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Dec 7, 2014 07:37
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Evil Mastermind posted:I just use a Noteboard and a pack of these. I'm just musing, I got a Noteboard from Pelgrane Press when I volunteered for them.
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Dec 7, 2014 09:13
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Mehuyael posted:Just found out I have a package waiting for me in the mail from abroad. I'm suspecting/hoping it's Lagoon, but I'll have to wait until Sunday to know. It was Lagoon! Checked it and I think I have everything. I'll do a more thorough examination later. Can't wait to try it out!
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Dec 7, 2014 13:20
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Mehuyael posted:It was Lagoon! Checked it and I think I have everything. I'll do a more thorough examination later. Can't wait to try it out! My brother and I have played three games of it now, and we've had a lot of fun. It's not hard to learn, but there's obviously a lot of depth, and what you do depends a lot on what the other player(s) are doing and how you decide to react to that. Very cool game.
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Dec 7, 2014 18:45
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Echophonic posted:You always post such useful stuff, it's like a superpower or something. Aw, you're making me blush. 
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Dec 7, 2014 19:36
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Alien Rope Burn posted:Presuming the world needs another edition of a game written thirty years ago strikes me as practically fossilized by comparison. Keeping in print isn't a reason. Keeping it "modern" isn't a reason. Those are things that operate on presumption that another edition of Paranoia is, somehow, necessary. I was listening to James Wallace yesterday about Paranoia, and things aren't being mentioned by this thread. First, the boxed set/cards were insisted on by Mongoose. He doesn't know why - but decided to make the best of it. They also wanted custom dice. Second, the hook to the new Alpha Complex involves new technology. In the same way everyone has a smartphone but there is a whole lot of unprocessed data, and there's government censorship, all Alpha Complex citizens now have optical implants. The Computer can look through any of them, but can't process everything at once. Third there's an augmented reality system. A porn filter means that no Citizen has ever seen genitals. Including their own. Things that are censored? Are censored in their vision. Or pixellated. And the Computer can use the Augmented Reality filter to put treason markers over peoples' heads according to everyone else. Pity about the person standing in the way... And there's no possible way that the Secret Societies could ever get at these systems and hack them. None at all. After all the Computer wouldn't allow such mistakes. Fourth, the "terrorists"? Generally the Secret Societies - normally the Troubleshooters themselves. Especially when the Computer only starts checking what's happening after the explosions are reported - and notices there's a group of Troubleshooters on hand to try to get to the bottom of the trouble. And they are, after all, loyal troubleshooters... Fifth, there's an achievement system run by the Computer and only the first PC gets the achievement. "Heal an ally." (Cue troubleshooters wounding each other to heal them for XP). "Fall over 500 feet". (Parachutes not included - players will still do it). And any Secret Society missions. Sixth, the first session is designed to start only minutes after you open the box - and it's designed primarily for one-shots.
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Dec 7, 2014 19:59
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Leperflesh posted:My brother and I have played three games of it now, and we've had a lot of fun. It's not hard to learn, but there's obviously a lot of depth, and what you do depends a lot on what the other player(s) are doing and how you decide to react to that. Very cool game. I enjoy Lagoon, but it is very abstract and you will hate it if you play it with people who are AP prone. Components are top notch, though.
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Dec 7, 2014 20:02
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neonchameleon posted:First, the boxed set/cards were insisted on by Mongoose. He doesn't know why - but decided to make the best of it. They also wanted custom dice. Guys Guys! Let's be like those FFG games, it'll be gangbusters!
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Dec 7, 2014 20:03
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I don't believe either of these have been mentioned yet. First off, an IRL friend of mine is promoting a game on kickstarter. Apparently, he is friends with the head developer. The game is called Bleeding Edge and it's by Sanguine Productions. It is a cyberpunk game that uses the SRD, but diverges from it greatly. I, unfortunately, don't know much about it though I will be attending a demo game run by friend. Secondly, there seems there is six hours left on a staff picked trpg kickstarter: Vow of Honor. I have only glanced at it, but nothing seems too bad with it. There is a rough draft for the game on the kickstarter page that I haven't had a chance to look at yet. Seems to be about playing noble warriors comitted to a code of honor in a dystopian, post-apocalyptic future.
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Dec 7, 2014 21:02
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Covok posted:I don't believe either of these have been mentioned yet.
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Dec 7, 2014 21:30
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Zereth posted:"The" System Reference Document? Is there only one now? Yeah, when my friend said that, I needed it clarified for that same reason...Oddly enough, I don't actually remember what he said in response.
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Dec 7, 2014 21:33
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quote:Like 13th Age, Dungeons and Dragons, Mutants and Masterminds, Pathfinder, and many other popular games, Bleeding Edge uses the System Reference Document as its core design. Each character has six attributes to measure how strong, how quick, how smart they are, and their talents only increase from there. Sanguine Games enhances SRD with their Vermillion game engine. Action is fast and furious. Technology is abundant and powerful. The story can shift from a quiet, careful caper into a deadly fire-fight, and then a run for your lives, all without a break in the action I guess its d20 based. I am not surprised, but I am disappointed. 
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Dec 7, 2014 21:35
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Galaga Galaxian posted:I guess its d20 based. I am not surprised, but I am disappointed. Well, I decided to ask my friend to give a summary of the game. Here is what he sent: quote:Sure thing.
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Dec 8, 2014 04:17
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Evil Mastermind posted:I just use a Noteboard and a pack of these. I use a Noteboard and another Noteboard cut into individual cards.
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Dec 9, 2014 08:00
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I'd just like to point out that Far West is supposed to be "released" a week from today. That's GMS's self-imposed release date. Carry on.
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Dec 10, 2014 22:21
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Evil Mastermind posted:I'd just like to point out that Far West is supposed to be "released" a week from today. That's GMS's self-imposed release date. You really need to watch this libelous slander, EM. This gangstalking, bullying behavior is unacceptable.
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Dec 10, 2014 22:36
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Echophonic posted:You really need to watch this libelous slander, EM. This gangstalking, bullying behavior is unacceptable. I am gaming history's greatest monster.
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Dec 10, 2014 22:38
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Evil Mastermind posted:I am gaming history's greatest monster. Better than literal Hitler, but worse than figurative Hitler, at least.
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Dec 10, 2014 22:38
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I got the Metamorphosis Alpha reprint from Goodman Games in the mail earlier this week, haven't had time to crack it open yet, but the box is big for a book.
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Dec 11, 2014 02:11
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It sounds like the dock workers' strike ended, which means Wrath of Kings should be getting sent out... soon?
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Dec 11, 2014 17:39
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moths posted:It sounds like the dock workers' strike ended, which means Wrath of Kings should be getting sent out... soon? And also maybe reaper stuff.
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Dec 12, 2014 00:41
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