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Attacker strikes and kills first, unless the defender is defending terrain. Someone described BA as "a series of assaults", and that's pretty apt.
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Dec 18, 2014 17:03
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Thanks for the great responses guys - I guess I must have been hanging around too many 40k forums because I was gritting my teeth as I hit the post button, fearing the torrent of abuse I would generate for implying that someone's hobby/chosen game system was not perfect in every possible way.Dirt Worshipper posted:There is a lot of great stuff out there though, you just have to know where to look: This is exactly what I needed, cheers Dirt!
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Dec 18, 2014 20:08
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Southern Heel posted:
CoC is typical Lardies. They love what they call 'friction' in their games, the idea that as a gamer you havent got a god like over view and control of your forces, that command and control is important rather than just combat dice going your way. I guess if you come from a GW stable it is closer to something like Warmaster, not in terms of mechanics but in terms of the idea that your forces might not always do what you want them to do when you need them to do it. Theyve written some good blogs on the topic as well as done some good podcasts via Meeples and Miniatures. If you are interested in the intention its worth having a look/listen http://toofatlardies.co.uk/blog/?p=508
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Dec 18, 2014 20:19
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Oh, speaking of TFL, the 2014 Christmas special is out! I'm particularly excited for WWI CoC, since I couldn't wrap my brain around TtMAB.
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Dec 18, 2014 21:39
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Serotonin posted:CoC is typical Lardies. They love what they call 'friction' in their games, the idea that as a gamer you havent got a god like over view and control of your forces, that command and control is important rather than just combat dice going your way. I guess if you come from a GW stable it is closer to something like Warmaster, not in terms of mechanics but in terms of the idea that your forces might not always do what you want them to do when you need them to do it. Holy poo poo that is a manifesto. I have Sharp Practice (their campaign thingy?) but nothing else. I need to get CoC and try dat although I'm all in on BA. Do you have a link to the pcasts they did?
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Dec 19, 2014 05:15
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Hi all - this probably isn't the right place to ask this but I figure it would be the least-wrong place barring making a new thread (which would be silly for such a simple question): Does anyone know of any WW2 based RPGs? I've seen that a few books exist for GURPS, but I have absolutely zero experience with that system and don't know what the prevailing opinion is. I'm not quite sure exactly what I'm looking for in terms of content, moreso just trying to see what / if anything is out there. edit: or if there is a more relevant thread in which to ask. 
TehKeen fucked around with this message at 08:13 on Dec 19, 2014 |
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Dec 19, 2014 07:36
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KamNZ posted:Thanks for the great responses guys - I guess I must have been hanging around too many 40k forums because I was gritting my teeth as I hit the post button, fearing the torrent of abuse I would generate for implying that someone's hobby/chosen game system was not perfect in every possible way. This is historicals. All we ever talk about is how not perfect every system is in recreating very rare and specific oddities that occur during war; or even more common things. At least we don't have codex creep (German Tanks are cheese, American Jumbos are cheese, NGFS is cheese, LW Fireflies are cheese, IS85s are cheese, American TDs are cheese, wood elves, and I'm sure more I'm forgetting esp. with Flames of War).
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Dec 19, 2014 07:39
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TehKeen posted:Does anyone know of any WW2 based RPGs? As far as WWII goes, the market is sort of weird. GURPS does the no-frills actual war, and from what I've heard the system's pretty realistic if you want to know how dead you shot that guy. Godlike is a game about superpowered people in the war - but unless you ended up with the "immune to bullets" power, you might want to keep that helmet on and not dress in primary colors, because getting shot is really dangerous. Mutants & Masterminds does the golden era Nazi-punching superhero thing straighter, and the Atomic Robo RPG can be set in the comic's pulpy WWII. The World of Darkness title Mage: The Awakening has a short splatbook called Mage Noir which focuses on the forties. Finally, there's a couple of "Weird War II" settings floating around like Achtung! Cthulhu and also World War Cthulhu. No points for guessing what those are about.
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Dec 19, 2014 10:13
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Thanks, I'll ask over there. And yeah, the bit of GURPS stuff I've seen seems pretty appealing - I'm not really keen on hellsing-esque vampire nazi werewolves or other supernatural stuff. 
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Dec 19, 2014 10:18
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I'm looking at seeing if I can cobble together lists which would work for CoC and BA, I'm looking at the 1939 Poland/German lists. The Polish force has a +5 rating and the German Wehrmacht has a +1 rating. So, unless I'm totally mistaken - this means that the Germans will get a +4 bonus to their support roll for a given scenario and the Poles nothing? I'm trying to flesh this out a little further, so please bear with me and let me know if I'm mistaking anything. The majority of scenarios have 2d6+modifier for defender and half of that roll for attacker, so... On the usual 2D6+modifer roll, it means Germans will on average get a support roll of 11 (7+4) defending, and 7 attacking ((7/2)+4), - so something like a Panzer IV + Sniper Team + mortar battery (depending on attack/defend). Translated to BA points that's a lieutenantwith riflemen adjutants (116), 3 infantry section with MG34s (123*3), sniper (50) Panzer IV (210), Mortar (50) - 795pts. The Poles will get an average support roll of 7 defending (since no bonus) or 3 attacking (7/2). So a Mortar Team + Barbed wire + 7TP (again depending on attack/defend). Roughly translated to BA that's a HQ/AT Team/Mortar Team (158pts) plus three infantry sections with BARs (165pts each) plus a 7TP and another Mortar team (165pts) - for a total of 820pts. Is this roughly accurate? Here are the two lists I'm using: http://toofatlardies.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Poland-Infantry-1939.pdf and http://toofatlardies.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Germany-Infantry-19391.pdf For Bolt-Action I'm guesstimating using the points values here http://store.warlordgames.com/products/1000pts-blitzkrieg-german-army and http://store.warlordgames.com/products/1000pts-polish-army/
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Dec 19, 2014 12:48
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TehKeen posted:Thanks, I'll ask over there. And yeah, the bit of GURPS stuff I've seen seems pretty appealing - I'm not really keen on hellsing-esque vampire nazi werewolves or other supernatural stuff. I am huge fan of GURPS, probably my favorite system, but I don't think I'd want to use it for WW2. The problem is that it can be too realistic, so you will die. A lot. That said, I don't know any OTHER systems for WW2, so maybe you could tweak some things and make it work.
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Dec 19, 2014 15:28
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Southern Heel posted:I'm looking at seeing if I can cobble together lists which would work for CoC and BA, I'm looking at the 1939 Poland/German lists. The Polish force has a +5 rating and the German Wehrmacht has a +1 rating. So, unless I'm totally mistaken - this means that the Germans will get a +4 bonus to their support roll for a given scenario and the Poles nothing? I'm trying to flesh this out a little further, so please bear with me and let me know if I'm mistaking anything. The majority of scenarios have 2d6+modifier for defender and half of that roll for attacker, so... You can make free Bolt Action army lists here using this site: http://boltaction.easyarmy.com/
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Dec 19, 2014 16:54
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Colonial Air Force posted:I am huge fan of GURPS, probably my favorite system, but I don't think I'd want to use it for WW2. The problem is that it can be too realistic, so you will die. A lot. The Star Wars: Edge of the Empire / Age of Rebellion system is one of the best "don't get bogged down in mechanics, just tell an awesome story" RPG out there and SW is basically WW2 in space. With laser sword mystics. Edit: Played the D-Day starter kit last night. Even though I got wrecked repeatedly by the Germans I liked the rules system. Inexperienced VS Veterans seemed like a punitive way to teach players the rules, my drat GI Jokes couldn't hit the side of a barn. Springfield Fatts fucked around with this message at 17:16 on Dec 21, 2014 |
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Dec 19, 2014 17:32
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Did Victrix ever finish those WWI plastics?
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Dec 21, 2014 22:53
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Doesn't look like it; but I found out they now make plastic 1/100 WWII Aircraft.
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Dec 22, 2014 00:28
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No Pun Intended posted:Doesn't look like it; but I found out they now make plastic 1/100 WWII Aircraft. Why would you post this, you horrible, horrible person? Do you want me to spend all my money? For now it's just the Stuka and Typhoon. I'm tempted to order but I don't have a set up yet to work on them. May just have them ship the kits home and I'll play with them later.
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Dec 22, 2014 02:54
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YF19pilot posted:Why would you post this, you horrible, horrible person? Do you want me to spend all my money? For now it's just the Stuka and Typhoon. I'm tempted to order but I don't have a set up yet to work on them. May just have them ship the kits home and I'll play with them later. We all know the answer to that question 
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Dec 22, 2014 09:41
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Prior to dumping all of my savings into 28mm WW2 I figured it was a prudent step to at least play a few games with my DBA armies from a few pages back,so I'm painting up my Bacchus 6mm now, in preparation for a game in the new year. I picked up enough Romans and Germans for for Marian Roman and Germanic Barbarians, but I've bought a few additions for more flexibility: a pack of spears to field Camillan or Polybian Romans, and a pack of Chariots to field Scots-Irish, Gauls or Germans. I've heard that Marian Romans are pretty powerful with 8 blade-units, am I overestimating how important this is? I keep seeing different army lists around online, and since I'm using DBA 2.2+ I'd really prefer not to buy a bunch of books. I understand that it's preferable, but I really only need to know if a couple of lists are correct: Camillan: 2x3Cv, 3x4Bd, 5x4Sp, 2x2Ps Polybian: 2x3Cv, 6x4Bd, 2x4Sp, 2x2Ps Marian: 2x3Cv, 8x4Bd, 1x4Bd or 3Cv or 2Ps, 1x2Ps ---- German: 1x3Cv/4Bd, 6x3/4Wb, 2x3/4Wb or 2Ps, 3x2Ps Scots-Irish: 3xLCh, 1xLCh or 3Wb or 2Ps, 5x3Wb, 3x2Ps Gallic: 2xLCh or 3Cv, 2x3Cv, 6x3Wb, 2x2Ps ---- Can someone give me a quick y/n if possible?
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Dec 22, 2014 13:04
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Southern Heel posted:Prior to dumping all of my savings into 28mm WW2 I figured it was a prudent step to at least play a few games with my DBA armies from a few pages back,so I'm painting up my Bacchus 6mm now, in preparation for a game in the new year. I picked up enough Romans and Germans for for Marian Roman and Germanic Barbarians, but I've bought a few additions for more flexibility: a pack of spears to field Camillan or Polybian Romans, and a pack of Chariots to field Scots-Irish, Gauls or Germans. I'm away and don't have any lists on me, but I know that the Gallic army you posted is exactly the one I have.
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Dec 22, 2014 13:25
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Cross-posting!   Three armored cars  closeup of command vehicle  Two TACAM R-2 self-propelled guns  closeup of crew So this was a lot of fun, but I really need to get back to painting the legions of peasants they go with. E: Yep, 15mm Battlefront. moths fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Dec 22, 2014 |
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Dec 22, 2014 18:42
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^ Lovely, flames of war:? lilljonas posted:I'm away and don't have any lists on me, but I know that the Gallic army you posted is exactly the one I have. Perfect, I can assume the rest are fine then. No [GEN] units are specified, do I just nominate one?
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Dec 22, 2014 18:49
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Southern Heel posted:^ Lovely, flames of war:? I think most of them have the gen in a cav/chariot unit, or the option of having the gen in a cav or blade unit. Few sjould have them in a Sp unit.
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Dec 22, 2014 22:41
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Corrections from the 2.2 book: Camillan: 1x3Cv (Gen), 1x3Cv, 3x4Bd, 5x4Sp, 2x2Ps Polybian: 1x3Cv (Gen), 1x3Cv, 6x4Bd, 2x4Sp, 2x2Ps Marian: 1x3Cv or 1x4Bd (Gen), 1x3Cv or 2LH, 8x4Bd, 1x3/4Ax or 2Ps, 1x2Ps (Early?) German: 8 separate lists, lots of variety there. To do everything you'll need: 2X3Cv, 11X4Wb, 10x3Wb, 2x2Ps, 1X2Lh. Generals are varying choices of 1x4Wb, 1x3Wb, or 1x3Cv, depending. poo poo is messy mang. Scots-Irish: (a): 1xLCh (Gen), 2xLCh, 1xLCh or 4Wb or 3Ax, 6x3Ax, 2x2Ps. (b): 1xLCh or 3Ax or 3Wb(Gen), 9x3Ax, 2x2Ps. Gallic: 1x3/4Wb or LCh (Gen), 2xLCh or 3Cv, 8x3Wb, 1x2Ps Arquinsiel fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Dec 22, 2014 |
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Dec 22, 2014 23:15
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Thank you sir - I was looking at Early German yes, but you say there are 8 lists now?
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Dec 22, 2014 23:20
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Yup: (a) Cimbri &Teutones (b)Ariovistus's in 58BC (c)Batavi in 69 AD (d)Other Batavi (e)Cherusci (f)Tencteri (g)"others" I think it's maybe a little over enthusiastic, but if you get what I mentioned above you'll be able to do literally all of them, fielding multiple armies against each other if necessary and possibly even having a huge DBMM army.
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Dec 22, 2014 23:26
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Indeed, but I guess the great thing about ancients and late antiquity is how many of the forces only have scant record, which allows one to play a number of armies but use the same troop elements. I know this may tip me over the edge into full-on grognard, but Wikipedia suggests Republican/Imperial Roman uniforms were either white or red, with white cloaks for commanders: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Roman_military_clothing - is this roughly correct? Various Roman forces painted online show blue, green, yellow uniforms and gold armor. Shield designs seem to be uniformly red with gold or yellow designs (wings, wreaths, or geometric patterns). Is this roughly correct? Same question would apply to a paint-scheme for the barbarian tribes, but I gather completely-random is the name of the game: are there any colors that would be off-limits? I assume purple, right? I've done a little research from the evolution of the Roman army from Early through Camillan, Polybian, Marian and Imperial - it seems the trend is less spears and more blades, and then an influx of auxilia under the empire. I'm really having to sit on my hands to not start picking up more and more forces, 'if only I bought Auxilia and a trebuchet, then I could field Imperial armies, if I based up some barbarian cavalry as light horse, I could field Brits and Picts too' it's a slippery slope when you're only paying £5 for 96 soldiers ( http://baccus6mm.com/ )
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Dec 23, 2014 10:49
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Southern Heel posted:Indeed, but I guess the great thing about ancients and late antiquity is how many of the forces only have scant record, which allows one to play a number of armies but use the same troop elements. I'm no Roman expert so I won't touch that question, but army bloat is the name of the game in this hobby. My Later Carthaginian just happened to get enough Gauls to also be a Gaul army, and then I had enough Spanish auxilia to kind of make a Spanish army, and then you get all these Greek mercenary hoplites that are just waiting to be expanded, and then holy poo poo you have the entire Hellenistic world to explore and you're lost. It's awesome, is what I'm saying.
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Dec 23, 2014 14:57
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January's issue of Wargames Illustrated has an article on a new game called AGGRO 70's Football Skirmish Rules. Not something I'd likely invest in, but it sure looked like fun (the article itself is a big mess of rambling nonsense, though).
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Dec 23, 2014 15:02
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Southern Heel posted:I know this may tip me over the edge into full-on grognard, but Wikipedia suggests Republican/Imperial Roman uniforms were either white or red, with white cloaks for commanders: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Roman_military_clothing - is this roughly correct? Various Roman forces painted online show blue, green, yellow uniforms and gold armor. Shield designs seem to be uniformly red with gold or yellow designs (wings, wreaths, or geometric patterns). Is this roughly correct? Same question would apply to a paint-scheme for the barbarian tribes, but I gather completely-random is the name of the game: are there any colors that would be off-limits? I assume purple, right? This is from personal knowledge but as far as I know, we have next to no idea what a lot of the classical armies wore colour wise - red is the only colour we even have hints at for Rome, and for the Carthaginians and other barbarians, we don't even have hints - it seems no Roman historical put out anything like the Osprey books. As far as they were concerned, everyone just KNEW what a roman soldier dressed like - why waste time an expensive parchment telling people what they already know. Anyway, the soldiers were just there to make the commanders look good, so lets spend all our time talking about Biggus Dikkus and his exploits. Wargamers have adopted that and said, "well, if we don't know, I don't want to field a boring army of plain white or red figures, so I'm going to mix it up a bit" - it also helps to tell the different "legions" on the field apart at a glance - hence the primary colours.
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Dec 23, 2014 15:28
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^ Perfect, that's more or less what I was expecting and works nicely in my favor. My assumption for purple was it was my understanding it was a rare dye, but there you go. lilljonas posted:I'm no Roman expert so I won't touch that question, but army bloat is the name of the game in this hobby. My Later Carthaginian just happened to get enough Gauls to also be a Gaul army, and then I had enough Spanish auxilia to kind of make a Spanish army, and then you get all these Greek mercenary hoplites that are just waiting to be expanded, and then holy poo poo you have the entire Hellenistic world to explore and you're lost. Eight cav to a base looks nice, and gives me 24 roman cavalry left. If I place five on a base for Light Horse (you know, for when I end up fielding early, middle, late west and late east romans too), that still leaves me a baker's dozen left over. I guess they'll provide good scenic fodder for my base-camp.
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Dec 23, 2014 20:11
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I've got a decent group of friends looking to get into Flames of War. Any suggestions for terrain or general starting books to get? Different model sourcing options are also great, we're starting completely from scratch. Just by looking at Intel briefings and coming from a 40 background I think we get the general idea of list building. I know I'm thinking a Finnish force with a captured KV-1 or maybe somethijg Vichy French.
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Dec 24, 2014 15:43
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Karandras posted:I've got a decent group of friends looking to get into Flames of War. Any suggestions for terrain or general starting books to get? If you're not dead set on an era, and depending on how many people are in your group, a couple of Open Fire! box sets will go a long way, including providing a copy of the rules in each box. Might be a good idea for one person to go whole hog and get the rules set which comes with generic LW lists for the four major powers (US, UK, USSR, and Germany). Otherwise, pick one, EW, MW, LW, and go with that. MW only has two books that you actually have to get, but is 2nd Edition, so you need to be mindful about how some of the Nation-specific special rules have changed. LW is the most heavily supported, with lots of books, and most, if not all, lists have been updated to 3rd Edition rules. Where to buy? Obviously, Battlefront, but also Plastic Soldier Company (PSC), Old Glory/Command Decision (if you're in the states, probably easier to look up on eBay), Zvezda makes good and cheap plastic armor kits, and a few others. Remember, you're playing 15mm or 1/100 scale (1:100 or TT scale for you train nerds). What to buy? Depends on what you want. Infantry is easy to proxy as infantry, so if you buy a platoon/company box of whatever, nobody is going to get into a hissy fit if you decide to use them a something else. Points per dollar, armor is cheaper, ten tanks will run about $100~$120 from battlefront, about $50 from PSC for two boxes of five. That will probably get you in the 1000~1500 point range of most armies. Best thing to do is look at the list you want to start playing with and plan from there. Also, nobody cares if you use Sherman Vs as some other variant, or proxy the fireflies from the starter set as American 76mm Shermans. Or the StuGs for StuH 42s, or whatever fun version the Finns were using.
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Dec 24, 2014 16:35
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FWIW, the early war French models you'd be using for Vichy France are a bit harder to come by than any of the major powers. You can sometimes find them on clearance though, so it's got advantages and disadvantages.
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Dec 24, 2014 17:43
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I got myself a Christmas gift of Chain of Command. I imagine I'll still be a BA guy but I like checking stuff out. Thanks Historicals thread for making me get it!
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Dec 24, 2014 23:38
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It's got really cool ideas, but the certain aspects (the assault rules) make me want to set the book on fire.
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Dec 25, 2014 00:32
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Colonial Air Force posted:January's issue of Wargames Illustrated has an article on a new game called AGGRO 70's Football Skirmish Rules.
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Dec 25, 2014 01:04
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Thanks for the suggestions! If I split two Open Fire! boxes with someone who wants Germans then I'll have 12 Shermans and the Firefly models as well, then maybe grab some half tracks and Stuarts and that's a 2nd Armoured Free French list? Something like: Compagnie De Chars De Combat HQ (235pts) +105 Sherman Chars De Combat Platoon (390pts) Four Shermans, one upgraded to 76mm Chars De Combat Platoon (390pts) Four Shermans, one upgraded to 76mm Infanterie Blindée Platoon (275pts) Two rifle squads, .50 upgrade on two halftracks Light tank platoon (210pts) 4 Stuarts Does that work? Seems like as a late war list it'll really struggle against anything too heavy if the main AT is just two 76mm Shermans. I guess swap out the Stuart's for a pair of M10 TDs? Still seems like a few tigers would be terrifying.
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Dec 25, 2014 03:46
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That's pretty close to what I did, the most cost-efficient way to do it is to convert the Firefly Shermans with the barrel and mantlet from the plastic US tank sprue. (Those are pretty easy to find or trade for.) Pick up a 105, and the boxed US armored platoon, and it weighs in at 1000 points. I painted it up over the last two months in the oath thread, but I've also got some photos up on my painting Tumblr here.
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Dec 25, 2014 04:03
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Good sources of cheapish terrain: Get yourself a door mat without any writing on. Cut into rectangles of various sizes for cornfields. Roads. I like Battlefront roads but cork tile cut to lengths with spackle filler spread on it makes passable rural roads. Woodland scenics make a dense bag of green. Torn into sections and glued to strips of cork tile make good hedges. What makes a good game of FoW is the right mix of open ground, Line of sight blocking terrain and concealing terrain.
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Dec 25, 2014 04:51
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Karandras posted:Thanks for the suggestions! If I split two Open Fire! boxes with someone who wants Germans then I'll have 12 Shermans and the Firefly models as well, then maybe grab some half tracks and Stuarts and that's a 2nd Armoured Free French list? I would definitely go for some Wolverines. US Tank Destroyers are pretty deadly, and the Stuarts don't really do anything for you that the Shermans aren't already doing. The 76mm guns on the Shermans and the Wolverines should give you more than enough AT capability, though I would advise knocking out the 105 Sherman and one of the rifle squads to fill out the Tank Destroyer platoon-you'll need more bazookas than you can get from the pair of OF sets anyway for a full platoon, so you may as well use it to your advantage.
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Dec 25, 2014 05:06
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