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ImpAtom posted:I gotta say, I have no idea how you can say Suikoden V was empty, plain, had no lie and didn't look like it took advantage of the PS2 and praise Suikoden III of all games. I mean I don't dislike Suikoden III but it was a pretty bad looking game even for the time. I would say S5 is better looking technologically, but IMHO 3 is ahead in design.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:05
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OddObserver posted:I would say S5 is better looking technologically, but IMHO 3 is ahead in design. You can certainly argue the designs but Suikoden III had a lot of problems due to being their first really attempt at a 3D one. The thing that really stands out is that the model animation is crazy stiff and awkward even for a PS2 game. It has incredibly stiff movements, does a poor job with body language (especially in combat, which is an area other Suikoden game excel in), and in general everyone looks like an awkward marionette even by the PS2 standard of awkward marionettes being the norm. You can see it really clearly when you compare the combat screens between games,    (I still think Suikoden 2 looks the best of the lot, mind.) ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Dec 20, 2014 |
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Dec 20, 2014 23:09
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ImpAtom posted:I like Suikoden III. I'm just saying that you're praising the graphics of it in comparison to Suikoden V and that seems like it's misremembering just how SIII looked. In terms of straight up graphics S5 is more impressive by virtue of being later in the console's lifecycle, but I really do feel like the art design and general aesthetic of Suikoden III is more impressive and engaging than Suikoden V. The latter just didn't have as much heart in it.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:10
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BloodWulfe posted:In terms of straight up graphics S5 is more impressive by virtue of being later in the console's lifecycle, but I really do feel like the art design and general aesthetic of Suikoden III is more impressive and engaging than Suikoden V. The latter just didn't have as much heart in it. I've got the art books for every Suikoden game and I guess I'm not seeing "as much heart." I'm certainly not going to argue which aesthetic you like more but it feels weird to me to argue that SV had less heart in its character designs or backgrounds when there is a whole hell of a lot of work put into some of them,. Edit: Honestly "lack of heart" is one of the last things I'd say about SV. It is a game that could have used an editor rather then them trying to put everything they wanted to in a single game. It certainly didn't feel like a perfunctory attempt to make people happy the way SIV did. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Dec 20, 2014 |
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Dec 20, 2014 23:14
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Just look at all the expressions in the cutscenes in S5 and tell me it doesn't have heart. Lym's faces are amazing.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:16
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ImpAtom posted:
For sure. I think Suikoden 2 still looks gorgeous, though I recognize some part of that is influenced by nostalgia. I really do think the sprite graphics of Suikoden 2 hold up way better over time than the 3D of S3~5. For reference: Suikoden 2 is 16 years old, Suikoden 3 is 12 years old, and Suikoden 5 is 8 years old.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:17
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Having played both relatively recently (last 3 years) I would definitely give the nod to V for art design/direction/aesthetics. III was kind of an ugly and clumsy game in just about every respect.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:17
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BloodWulfe posted:For sure. I think Suikoden 2 still looks gorgeous, though I recognize some part of that is influenced by nostalgia. I really do think the sprite graphics of Suikoden 2 hold up way better over time than the 3D of S3~5. I certainly agree there. I think sprite graphics in general hold up better for a variety of reasons. The PS2 era had extremely stiff character models. It wasn't until the last part of the generation that they really got a good handle on making things move around and even then it was sort of touch-and-go. In comparison sprite graphics are a lot more emotive and expressive even when they're simple.
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Dec 20, 2014 23:19
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I don't remember much about playing Suikoden 3 at all except the music, which was really good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQOJuj4ZaZo
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Dec 20, 2014 23:34
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Suikoden III looked like poo poo when it was new and it has hardly aged well since. The game did some interesting things but it didn't feel like Suikoden to me. 2 is still the best by a ridiculous margin and has aged really well. The first has too, though it's a bit more basic. Suikoden V was a great nod to the older games but nothing beats the first duology.
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Dec 21, 2014 00:06
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I enjoyed Operation Darkness
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Dec 21, 2014 01:32
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BloodWulfe posted:Also I'll continue to recommend Suikoden Tierkreis, but just as JRPG and not as a Suikoden game. I feel it's a perfectly serviceable, albeit bland and cliche, JRPG, if you can check any expectations of it being a Suikoden game at the door. Yeah, you're right. We might like it. We never know until we try. 
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Dec 21, 2014 02:07
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corn in the bible posted:I enjoyed Operation Darkness I legitimately did, too. It was incredibly clunky and started off really slow, but then batshit crazy stuff started happening and I couldn't put it down.
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Dec 21, 2014 02:12
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I wouldn't say OD is good but I enjoyed it once you could start punching tanks to death.
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Dec 21, 2014 02:26
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corn in the bible posted:I enjoyed Operation Darkness It's an odd game and some of the mechanics are counterintuitive but like ImpAtom said, once you start punching Tanks and Godzilla apart, there's some real charm there.
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Dec 21, 2014 03:22
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Operation Darkness was my favorite anime videogame adaption of the hit DC property Creature Commandos. Also Liam O'Brien was Herbert West The Re-Animator and that poo poo was amazing. More games should, instead of being plucky Allies faced with the hellspawned abominations of the Third Reich, let you play as b movie monsters in world war 2 because even Dracula Hates Hitler.
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Dec 21, 2014 05:04
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Mr. Maltose posted:Operation Darkness was my favorite anime videogame adaption of the hit DC property Creature Commandos. Also Liam O'Brien was Herbert West The Re-Animator and that poo poo was amazing. Hey now, be fair. Dracula was on Hitler's side in OD. Now Jack the Ripper? He totally was anti-Hitler.
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Dec 21, 2014 05:30
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ImpAtom posted:Hey now, be fair. Dracula was on Hitler's side in OD. Exactly, which is why Operation Darkness didn't go quite far enough. I want the newest Wolfenstein style of Third Reich full of wunderwaffen techno gizmos except the good old US of A lets the boys from Miskatonic summon up being from beyond the stars to join Baba Yaga and The Mummy on D-Day.
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Dec 21, 2014 06:22
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I love Operation Darkness because it's basically Dead Snow the video game. I know Dead Snow came after Operation Darkness, but my point still stands: nazi zombie goofiness. e: Also Yuri Lowenthal and Liam O'Brien both are major voice actors in it, which is cool with me. It's only missing Crispin Freeman for the trifecta. BloodWulfe fucked around with this message at 06:29 on Dec 21, 2014 |
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Dec 21, 2014 06:27
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I just wish the game wasn't quite so punishing to play but it does a lot of things right. It's probably the largest scale SRPG around. Maps are huge and movement ranges are too. The weight system is a bit weird in that foregoing guns seems to be the way to go for most characters (the werewolves anyway). There's a nugget of an amazing game there. One of your squad members is literally Frankenstein's Monster.
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Dec 21, 2014 14:08
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I'm a little late to Suikochat, but I would like to point out that Suikoden V has Haud, and Suikoden III doesn't. In light of being reminded of this, I think we can all agree V is the superior.
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Dec 21, 2014 14:40
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Suikoden V had the nakedest Jeane, while III had the classiest one.
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Dec 21, 2014 14:45
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Dec 21, 2014 14:47
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ImpAtom posted:Hey now, be fair. Dracula was on Hitler's side in OD. Well Jack the Ripper was jewish, so it kinda made sense for him to be anti-hitler.
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Dec 21, 2014 14:48
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Coughing Hobo posted:I'm a little late to Suikochat, but I would like to point out that Suikoden V has Haud, and Suikoden III doesn't. In light of being reminded of this, I think we can all agree V is the superior. Counterpoint: Suikoden IV has Schtolteheim Reinbach III.
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Dec 21, 2014 14:55
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BloodWulfe posted:Counterpoint: Suikoden IV has Schtolteheim Reinbach III. Countercounterpoint: Suikoden IV sucks and not even he could redeem that game.
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Dec 21, 2014 15:23
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Wendell posted:Suikoden V had the nakedest Jeane, while III had the classiest one. so we agree 5 is better
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Dec 21, 2014 15:34
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tactics is better than 3 or 5
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Dec 21, 2014 16:02
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4 is worse than all of them and 5 is better than 3 tactics is hardly playable please stop posting ironically everyone
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Dec 21, 2014 18:05
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my opinions aren't ironic, just really bad
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Dec 21, 2014 18:09
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The best final fantasy was mystic quest.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:33
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 Final Fantasy Tactics was the best.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:34
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I'll fuckin fight you.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:36
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I just don't understand why anyone cares about Suikoden after II at all.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:44
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Francis posted:I just don't understand why anyone cares about Suikoden after II at all.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:45
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Francis posted:I just don't understand why anyone cares about Suikoden after II at all. They are still fun games. They just didn't really hold their momentum after II.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:49
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hubris.height posted:4 is worse than all of them and 5 is better than 3 i liked tactics a lot, whatever the hell you think
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Dec 21, 2014 18:51
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ImpAtom posted:I wouldn't say OD is good but I enjoyed it once you could start punching tanks to death. it is a badly designed game that i had a lot of fun playing, ergo it was a good game after all
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Dec 21, 2014 18:51
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I liked Tactics too but I was wondering if it's just because I like nearly every SRPG that I stumble onto.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:52
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Endorph posted:3 and 5 had their good points, regardless of what you think about them as a whole. I liked 5, but I couldn't get behind 3.
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Dec 21, 2014 19:01
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