PYF Dark Enlightenment Thinker

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Stultus Maximus: Dec 21, 2009; USPOL May

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

Idiots in the comments are right for once, it is pretty insubstantial.

Although I do love the "first they laugh at you..." bit, it's always the last resort of ridiculous people.

It's not insubstantial, it's that the "Dark Enlightenment" is fundamentally ridiculous. That is, it deserves ridicule. There isn't substance to these people, so they do not deserve a substantial intellectual rebuttal. They are silly, silly people who deserve mockery.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 00:25

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# ? May 8, 2024 08:00

TinTower: Apr 21, 2010; You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.

I think this is Dark Enlightenment stuff? I have no loving idea.

Oh, and seeing as we spent the past couple pages talking about Justine Tunney and trans people, her being part of the DE movement makes even little sense. See this graph/mind-map in the OP?

As the OP kind of touches on, the HBD movement were basically the Dark Enlightenment before the Dark Enlightenment existed. We all remember The Bell Curve, right? That was the HBD movement.

Several members of the Human Biodiversity Institute, Ray Blanchard and J. Michael Bailey, promote a really controversial theory that basically says "if you're a trans woman and into chicks you've really just got a fetish for yourself as a woman". Back in 2003, the SPLC did a report into how horrifically homo/transphobic the HBI, and their pet theory of "autogynephilia", as they call it, actually is.

Ten years later, and Bailey still remains a professor, and was last in the news for using a "fucksaw" on his students. Ray Blanchard, on the other hand, managed to rise to chair a DSM V working group and get his pet theory in the book. :smith:

# ? Dec 22, 2014 01:24

Tiberius Thyben: Feb 7, 2013; Gone Phishing

TinTower posted:

I think this is Dark Enlightenment stuff? I have no loving idea.

Oh, and seeing as we spent the past couple pages talking about Justine Tunney and trans people, her being part of the DE movement makes even little sense. See this graph/mind-map in the OP?

As the OP kind of touches on, the HBD movement were basically the Dark Enlightenment before the Dark Enlightenment existed. We all remember The Bell Curve, right? That was the HBD movement.

Several members of the Human Biodiversity Institute, Ray Blanchard and J. Michael Bailey, promote a really controversial theory that basically says "if you're a trans woman and into chicks you've really just got a fetish for yourself as a woman". Back in 2003, the SPLC did a report into how horrifically homo/transphobic the HBI, and their pet theory of "autogynephilia", as they call it, actually is.

Ten years later, and Bailey still remains a professor, and was last in the news for using a "fucksaw" on his students. Ray Blanchard, on the other hand, managed to rise to chair a DSM V working group and get his pet theory in the book.

Excuse me, but the first Dark Enlightenment was the Italian Futurists.

Also, I'm Judge Bitch.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 02:21

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

I like how the Dark Enlightenment love making charts and graphs for themselves, and none of them ever clarify anything.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 02:25

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

The Vosgian Beast posted:

I like how the Dark Enlightenment love making charts and graphs for themselves, and none of them ever clarify anything.

The purpose of charts and graphs is not to elucidate, but to intimidate.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 02:56

sub supau: Aug 28, 2007

It's because they confuse data with facts.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 04:01

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

TetsuoTW posted:

It's because they confuse their rear end with a hole in the ground.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 15:13

Pedestrian Xing: Jul 19, 2007

Also that chart unsurprisingly includes a few straight up white supremacists.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 16:22

Shame Boy: Mar 2, 2010

Pedestrian Xing posted:

Also that chart unsurprisingly includes a few straight up white supremacists.

Um I think you mean masculine patriots of genetic :biotruths:

# ? Dec 22, 2014 18:10

Darth Walrus: Feb 13, 2012

Pedestrian Xing posted:

Also that chart unsurprisingly includes a few straight up white supremacists.

'A few'?

# ? Dec 22, 2014 18:14

Luigi's Discount Porn Bin: Jul 19, 2000; Oven Wrangler

Two pretty great things about that chart:

1. The "ethno-nationalists" section includes VDare.com, named after Virginia Dare, supposedly the first white child born in what's now the U.S.; the same site also used to regularly host content written by LF's good friend, founder of not-at-all-fascist Youth For Western Civilization and former Pat Buchanan staffer, Marcus Epstein:

quote:

[Epstein] uttered, 'friend of the family,' as he delivered a karate chop to Ms. [REDACTED]'s head.

2. The "femininity" section is completely unconnected to the rest of the Dark Enlightenment HMM I WONDER WHY

# ? Dec 22, 2014 18:26

Shame Boy: Mar 2, 2010

Luigi's Discount Porn Bin posted:

2. The "femininity" section is completely unconnected to the rest of the Dark Enlightenment HMM I WONDER WHY

It's weird that they didn't even connect it to "Thinking Housewife" even though they carefully put Thinking Housewife over in the ~~icky girl quarantine zone~~ feminine area.

# ? Dec 22, 2014 20:45

I AM GRANDO: Aug 20, 2006

Is "Red Pill Wifery" another name for A World Called Gor [whipcrack]?

# ? Dec 22, 2014 21:13

Count Chocula: Dec 25, 2011; WE HAVE TO CONTROL OUR ENVIRONMENT
IF YOU SEE ME POSTING OUTSIDE OF THE AUSPOL THREAD PLEASE TELL ME THAT I'M MISSED AND TO START POSTING AGAIN

Tiberius Thyben posted:

Excuse me, but the first Dark Enlightenment was the Italian Futurists.

Also, I'm Judge Bitch.

Hey, don't lump the Futurists in with these idiots. Whatever their politics, the Futurist Manifesto is still an electrifying piece of poetry. I might not agree with their views but this is a far cry from the Dark Enlightenment's usual obscurantist waffle:

quote:

We are on the extreme promontory of the centuries! What is the use of looking behind at the moment when we must open the mysterious shutters of the impossible? Time and Space died yesterday. We are already living in the absolute, since we have already created eternal, omnipresent speed.

The oldest among us are not yet thirty, and yet we have already wasted treasures, treasures of strength, love, courage and keen will, hastily, deliriously, without thinking, with all our might, till we are out of breath.

Look at us! We are not out of breath, our hearts are not in the least tired. For they are nourished by fire, hatred and speed! Does this surprise you? it is because you do not even remember being alive! Standing on the world's summit, we launch once more our challenge to the stars!

Your objections? All right! I know them! Of course! We know just what our beautiful false intelligence affirms: "We are only the sum and the prolongation of our ancestors," it says. Perhaps! All right! What does it matter? But we will not listen! Take care not to repeat those infamous words! Instead, lift up your head!

Standing on the world's summit we launch once again our insolent challenge to the stars!

Don't you just want to crank up the Attack on Titan theme and shout that at the top of your lungs?

# ? Dec 23, 2014 02:23

Silver2195: Apr 4, 2012

Count Chocula posted:

Hey, don't lump the Futurists in with these idiots. Whatever their politics, the Futurist Manifesto is still an electrifying piece of poetry. I might not agree with their views but this is a far cry from the Dark Enlightenment's usual obscurantist waffle:

Don't you just want to crank up the Attack on Titan theme and shout that at the top of your lungs?

Starting an "Is Attack on Titan fascist?" debate in PYF? Well played.

Unless you're sincerely defending Matinetti's declared intent "to glorify war � the only cure for the world � militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of the anarchists, the beautiful ideas which kill, and contempt for woman."

Edit: For the sake of fairness, another translation has "We will glorify war�the world�s only hygiene�militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of freedom-bringers, beautiful ideas worth dying for, and scorn for woman." This is slightly better ("scorn" is subtly different from "contempt," dying for an idea isn't the same as being killed by one, and "freedom-bringers" saves Matinetti from the contradiction of championing both patriotism and anarchism), but not by much.

Silver2195 has a new favorite as of 03:46 on Dec 23, 2014

# ? Dec 23, 2014 03:35

RagnarokAngel: Oct 5, 2006; Black Magic Extraordinaire

Jack Gladney posted:

Is "Red Pill Wifery" another name for A World Called Gor [whipcrack]?

There's a forum called /r/Redpillwomen which is basically for women who buy into that stuff. It's like a social experiment in stockholm syndrome.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 03:38

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

RagnarokAngel posted:

There's a forum called /r/Redpillwomen which is basically for women who buy into that stuff. It's like a social experiment in stockholm syndrome.

Don't forget Christian Domestic Discipline.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 03:54

Count Chocula: Dec 25, 2011; WE HAVE TO CONTROL OUR ENVIRONMENT
IF YOU SEE ME POSTING OUTSIDE OF THE AUSPOL THREAD PLEASE TELL ME THAT I'M MISSED AND TO START POSTING AGAIN

Silver2195 posted:

Starting an "Is Attack on Titan fascist?" debate in PYF? Well played.

Unless you're sincerely defending Matinetti's declared intent "to glorify war � the only cure for the world � militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of the anarchists, the beautiful ideas which kill, and contempt for woman."

Edit: For the sake of fairness, another translation has "We will glorify war�the world�s only hygiene�militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of freedom-bringers, beautiful ideas worth dying for, and scorn for woman." This is slightly better ("scorn" is subtly different from "contempt," dying for an idea isn't the same as being killed by one, and "freedom-bringers" saves Matinetti from the contradiction of championing both patriotism and anarchism), but not by much.

Oh, I disagree with the IDEAS. But I first encountered the Manifesto in an art history class and presented as a piece of rhetoric or poetry it's stirring. And the call to turn art and poetry away from natural subjects to technological ones is a good call.

quote:

MANIFESTO OF FUTURISM

We want to sing the love of danger, the habit of energy and rashness.
The essential elements of our poetry will be courage, audacity and revolt.
Literature has up to now magnified pensive immobility, ecstasy and slumber. We want to exalt movements of aggression, feverish sleeplessness, the double march, the perilous leap, the slap and the blow with the fist.
We declare that the splendor of the world has been enriched by a new beauty: the beauty of speed. A racing automobile with its bonnet adorned with great tubes like serpents with explosive breath ... a roaring motor car which seems to run on machine-gun fire, is more beautiful than the Victory of Samothrace.
We want to sing the man at the wheel, the ideal axis of which crosses the earth, itself hurled along its orbit.
The poet must spend himself with warmth, glamour and prodigality to increase the enthusiastic fervor of the primordial elements.
Beauty exists only in struggle. There is no masterpiece that has not an aggressive character. Poetry must be a violent assault on the forces of the must be a violent assault on the forces of the unknown, to force them to bow before man.

Count Chocula has a new favorite as of 04:43 on Dec 23, 2014

# ? Dec 23, 2014 04:37

Shame Boy: Mar 2, 2010

Absurd Alhazred posted:

Don't forget Christian Domestic Discipline.

I saw a story or documentary or something about a woman who thought this was a great idea until her husband wound up using threats of violence to turn her into a silent slave and she was horribly terrified the entire time but thought that this was how a relationship "should" be at the time or something like that and it was all very :smith:

# ? Dec 23, 2014 04:52

Silver2195: Apr 4, 2012

I see your point about the idea of art depicting machines. Having said that, even the non-political parts of the Futurist Manifesto are often pretty silly, and the love of machines has a nasty side too.

Marinetti posted:

Literature has up to now magnified pensive immobility, ecstasy and slumber. We want to exalt movements of aggression, feverish sleeplessness, the double march, the perilous leap, the slap and the blow with the fist.

G. K. Chesterton posted:

While I am quite willing to exalt the cuff within reason, it scarcely seems such an entirely new subject for literature as the Futurists imagine. It seems to me that even through the slumber which fills the Siege of Troy, the Song of Roland, and the Orlando Furioso, and in spite of the thoughtful immobility which marks "Pantagruel," "Henry V," and the Ballad of Chevy Chase, there are occasional gleams of an admiration for courage, a readiness to glorify the love of danger, and even the "strengt of daring," I seem to remember, slightly differently spelt, somewhere in literature.

The distinction, however, seems to be that the warriors of the past went in for tournaments, which were at least dangerous for themselves, while the Futurists go in for motor-cars, which are mainly alarming for other people. It is the Futurist in his motor who does the "aggressive movement," but it is the pedestrians who go in for the "running" and the "perilous leap."

# ? Dec 23, 2014 05:26

Monocled Falcon: Oct 30, 2011

Absurd Alhazred posted:

Don't forget Christian Domestic Discipline.

Lifestyle BDSM people are weird, sure, but I don't know if it's fair to lump people into CDD with redpillwomen. I mean, there's is a modest community of people that practice a secular form of it.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 05:39

SurreptitiousMuffin: Mar 21, 2010

Monocled Falcon posted:

Lifestyle BDSM people are weird, sure, but I don't know if it's fair to lump people into CDD with redpillwomen. I mean, there's is a modest community of people that practice a secular form of it.

Um, dude, that's not BDSM. It's not a kayfabe kink thing. It's a group of men who believe they need to spank/beat their wives to bring them together as a family. They're very adamant about the fact that it is :siren:

NOT SEXUAL :siren:

. Whether or not you believe them, they are very serious about it.

TinTower posted:

I think this is Dark Enlightenment stuff? I have no loving idea.

It's a joke from /pol/. Like all things 4Chan, it started out taking the piss and ended up attracting a bunch of people who take it way too seriously. Pretty sure they've started chucking the terminology around on Stormfront now.

SurreptitiousMuffin has a new favorite as of 06:11 on Dec 23, 2014

# ? Dec 23, 2014 06:09

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

SurreptitiousMuffin posted:

Um, dude, that's not BDSM. It's not a kayfabe kink thing. It's a group of men who believe they need to spank/beat their wives to bring them together as a family. They're very adamant about the fact that it is NOT SEXUAL . Whether or not you believe them, they are very serious about it.

Quite a few of the testimonials are from women, though. :confused:

# ? Dec 23, 2014 06:50

Monocled Falcon: Oct 30, 2011

Perhaps he's mistakenly talking about the quiverfull movement?

# ? Dec 23, 2014 07:30

Shame Boy: Mar 2, 2010

Absurd Alhazred posted:

Quite a few of the testimonials are from women, though.

The women buy into it too, they both agree to the woman's "place" and the man's "place" in disciplining her. It has nothing to do with the BDSM community for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is BDSM's valuing of safewords and consent.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 07:35

Sham bam bamina!: Nov 6, 2012; ƨtupid cat

The Futurist Manifesto somehow gets dumber every time I see it; anyone sincerely moved by it is pretty drat na�ve.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 07:40

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

Parallel Paraplegic posted:

The women buy into it too, they both agree to the woman's "place" and the man's "place" in disciplining her. It has nothing to do with the BDSM community for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is BDSM's valuing of safewords and consent.

Not that I was making the connection to BDSM (that was Monocled Falcon), but from the very homepage I linked:

"This website is intended to be a haven for married couples who practise safe and consensual Christian Domestic Discipline (CDD)"

That being said, if you read their Non-Conesnsual Consent page, safewords aren't really there.

It does, in any event, seem to fit in with redpilledwomen as far as them buying into this submission above and beyond play-acting - which is why I brought it up.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 07:49

Monocled Falcon: Oct 30, 2011

And I'm just saying it's doesn't seem all that different from any other supposedly permanent lifestyle BDSM kink like Total Power Exchange.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 08:08

Count Chocula: Dec 25, 2011; WE HAVE TO CONTROL OUR ENVIRONMENT
IF YOU SEE ME POSTING OUTSIDE OF THE AUSPOL THREAD PLEASE TELL ME THAT I'M MISSED AND TO START POSTING AGAIN

Silver2195 posted:

I see your point about the idea of art depicting machines. Having said that, even the non-political parts of the Futurist Manifesto are often pretty silly, and the love of machines has a nasty side too.

Wasn't there an SA troll who claimed to be a 'GK Chesterton style Catholic' who was really into the monarchy and DE stuff?

There's a great Michael Moorcock essay that explains why LOTR appeals to these types.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 08:34

SurreptitiousMuffin: Mar 21, 2010

Monocled Falcon posted:

Perhaps he's mistakenly talking about the quiverfull movement?

Nope. You'd be amazed at the weird and lovely things people can think about themselves. A lot of these women talk about how they were born with SINFUL URGES and how they need the STRONG MORAL GUIDANCE of a man. There's one testimonial of a woman who has to spank herself while her husband is away on business.

Seriously just go listen to the FPlus episode. It's educational, to say the least.

Why does this thread keep going into FPlus subjects. What does the FPlus keep going into this thread's subjects. It's weird when the internet streams cross.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 08:35

Monocled Falcon: Oct 30, 2011

Eh, it still doesn't seem all that different from the regular kind of Domestic Discipline.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 09:38

ANIME MONSTROSITY: Jun 1, 2012; by XyloJW

TinTower posted:

I think this is Dark Enlightenment stuff? I have no loving idea.

Oh, and seeing as we spent the past couple pages talking about Justine Tunney and trans people, her being part of the DE movement makes even little sense. See this graph/mind-map in the OP?

As the OP kind of touches on, the HBD movement were basically the Dark Enlightenment before the Dark Enlightenment existed. We all remember The Bell Curve, right? That was the HBD movement.

Several members of the Human Biodiversity Institute, Ray Blanchard and J. Michael Bailey, promote a really controversial theory that basically says "if you're a trans woman and into chicks you've really just got a fetish for yourself as a woman". Back in 2003, the SPLC did a report into how horrifically homo/transphobic the HBI, and their pet theory of "autogynephilia", as they call it, actually is.

Ten years later, and Bailey still remains a professor, and was last in the news for using a "fucksaw" on his students. Ray Blanchard, on the other hand, managed to rise to chair a DSM V working group and get his pet theory in the book.

Hmmm... I think I'll be the seductive gaze (no homo).

# ? Dec 23, 2014 09:49

Pope Guilty: Nov 6, 2006; The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Count Chocula posted:

Wasn't there an SA troll who claimed to be a 'GK Chesterton style Catholic' who was really into the monarchy and DE stuff?

That would be this guy, and I think he still does it sometimes.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 10:31

InediblePenguin: Sep 27, 2004; I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Absurd Alhazred posted:

Not that I was making the connection to BDSM (that was Monocled Falcon), but from the very homepage I linked:

"This website is intended to be a haven for married couples who practise safe and consensual Christian Domestic Discipline (CDD)"

That being said, if you read their Non-Conesnsual Consent page, safewords aren't really there.

It does, in any event, seem to fit in with redpilledwomen as far as them buying into this submission above and beyond play-acting - which is why I brought it up.

that page you linked explicitly says that by marrying somebody you've just given consent forever. that outdated concept that lead to the idea that you can't get raped if you're married. just because they said "safe and consensual" at one point doesn't mean they are actually using the words to mean what they're supposed to mean to society at large

# ? Dec 23, 2014 15:36

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Count Chocula posted:

Wasn't there an SA troll who claimed to be a 'GK Chesterton style Catholic' who was really into the monarchy and DE stuff?

There's a great Michael Moorcock essay that explains why LOTR appeals to these types.

Chesterton had a huge influence on both Tolkein and C.S. Lewis, and Chesterton (and Belloc)'s Catholic socialism was pretty compatible with monarchy. Not coincidentally, Chesterton and Belloc were also xenophobes who thought the influx of ethnic immigrants to Britain, combined with evil technological capitalism and banking, was going to ruin their pastoral fairyland.

edit:
This stuff works great if you're a Tory (like the article you posted gets into), but it's completely antithetical to American values. David Brin has a nice essay series about how awful the values of LOtR and even Star Wars are.

I'm trying to remember who it was who observed that in genre fiction, high fantasy has always been the domain of Christianity and European ethnic identity, and conversely sci-fi is dominated by assimilated Jews. The point being that sci-fi embraces a metropolitan, technological, secular and democratic future ideal that is very much in line with the sorts of American dream stuff that brought Jews to the US. It's reformist and progressive by its nature, even when it's dystopian, because the dystopia is usually a critique of lower social states like fascism. High fantasy on the other hand is nostalgic about a return to a social order where white kings, queens and knights literally lorded over everyone else by divine right.

neonnoodle has a new favorite as of 16:48 on Dec 23, 2014

# ? Dec 23, 2014 16:34

Stultus Maximus: Dec 21, 2009; USPOL May

neonnoodle posted:

Chesterton had a huge influence on both Tolkein and C.S. Lewis, and Chesterton (and Belloc)'s Catholic socialism was pretty compatible with monarchy. Not coincidentally, Chesterton and Belloc were also xenophobes who thought the influx of ethnic immigrants to Britain, combined with evil technological capitalism and banking, was going to ruin their pastoral fairyland.

So other than the xenophobia, they were pretty much on the money.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 16:39

The Vosgian Beast: Aug 13, 2011; Business is slow

neonnoodle posted:

Chesterton had a huge influence on both Tolkein and C.S. Lewis, and Chesterton (and Belloc)'s Catholic socialism was pretty compatible with monarchy. Not coincidentally, Chesterton and Belloc were also xenophobes who thought the influx of ethnic immigrants to Britain, combined with evil technological capitalism and banking, was going to ruin their pastoral fairyland.

edit:
This stuff works great if you're a Tory (like the article you posted gets into), but it's completely antithetical to American values. David Brin has a nice essay series about how awful the values of LOtR and even Star Wars are.

I'm trying to remember who it was who observed that in genre fiction, high fantasy has always been the domain of Christianity and European ethnic identity, and conversely sci-fi is dominated by assimilated Jews. The point being that sci-fi embraces a metropolitan, technological, secular and democratic future ideal that is very much in line with the sorts of American dream stuff that brought Jews to the US. It's reformist and progressive by its nature, even when it's dystopian, because the dystopia is usually a critique of lower social states like fascism. High fantasy on the other hand is nostalgic about a return to a social order where white kings, queens and knights literally lorded over everyone else by divine right.

A lot of neo-reactionaries love both SF and Fantasy though, being huge nerds.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 16:54

neonnoodle: Mar 20, 2008; by exmarx

Oh yeah no doubts there. This was the article I was trying to remember: Why There is no Jewish Narnia

# ? Dec 23, 2014 17:05

Stultus Maximus: Dec 21, 2009; USPOL May

neonnoodle posted:

Chesterton had a huge influence on both Tolkein and C.S. Lewis, and Chesterton (and Belloc)'s Catholic socialism was pretty compatible with monarchy. Not coincidentally, Chesterton and Belloc were also xenophobes who thought the influx of ethnic immigrants to Britain, combined with evil technological capitalism and banking, was going to ruin their pastoral fairyland.

edit:
This stuff works great if you're a Tory (like the article you posted gets into), but it's completely antithetical to American values. David Brin has a nice essay series about how awful the values of LOtR and even Star Wars are.

lol.

quote:

Consider the rings. Those man-made wonders are deemed cursed, damning anyone who dares to use them, especially those nine normal humans who tried to rise up, using tools to equalize and then usurp the rightful powers of their betters � the High Elves.

The nine Ringwraiths aren�t just evil henchmen and cardboard monsters. In my opinion, they are among the most important figures of the epic. Tolkien himself calls them tragic figures and dwells on their background. These fallen mortals � men who were hauled into service to the �dark side� � can be looked upon as cautionary figures, conveying the universal lesson that �power corrupts.�

On that much we can all agree. But I think there�s more to the Ringwraiths. To me, they distill the classical Greek notion of hubris � a concept that Romantics often embrace � the idea that pain and damnation await any mortal whose ambition aims too high. Don�t try putting on the trappings or emblems or powers that rightfully belong to your betters. Above all, don�t try to decipher and redistribute mysteries.

And I'm done with this nonsense.

quote:

I'm trying to remember who it was who observed that in genre fiction, high fantasy has always been the domain of Christianity and European ethnic identity, and conversely sci-fi is dominated by assimilated Jews. The point being that sci-fi embraces a metropolitan, technological, secular and democratic future ideal that is very much in line with the sorts of American dream stuff that brought Jews to the US. It's reformist and progressive by its nature, even when it's dystopian, because the dystopia is usually a critique of lower social states like fascism. High fantasy on the other hand is nostalgic about a return to a social order where white kings, queens and knights literally lorded over everyone else by divine right.

This is especially funny given that Brin himself contributed to the Foundation fan-fiction canon.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 18:30

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# ? May 8, 2024 08:00

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

InediblePenguin posted:

that page you linked explicitly says that by marrying somebody you've just given consent forever. that outdated concept that lead to the idea that you can't get raped if you're married. just because they said "safe and consensual" at one point doesn't mean they are actually using the words to mean what they're supposed to mean to society at large

I just think this is a cautionary tale which should be in people's minds when they assess more "progressive" BDSM power exchanges and such. Is there a real exit strategy for someone being abused? You look at stories from the "DD is not DV" page, like this one, and she says she "was able to escape" a relationship she did find abusive, but there's nothing in her description of the loving submissive relationship she has now that provides tools for women to leave, and there is a lot of metaphorical self-flagellation. I've seen disturbingly similar themes in BDSM submissive writing, even though the reasoning is not faith-based.

In any event, CDD would probably seem very sensible to neoractionaries (except they could never live up to the ideals of the benevolent Christian husband these women are looking for, and they couldn't lead an expedition to find their own rear end in a top hat, much less a household), and these women definitely sound redpilled.

# ? Dec 23, 2014 18:49

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