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hand of luke posted:For you Qud esper veterans, what's your opinion on the Ego/Willpower buffs to mutation level and cooldown? Main feedback I'm looking for: There's nowhere near enough points to run a functioning esper without pumping the hell out of the ego bonus, especially since most of them have such long cooldowns that they're basically one per encounter even with a lot of willpower. Light manipulation is pretty much the one exception to that, but it doesn't start getting good til around mutation level 5, at which point it's roughly equal to a revolver that doesn't miss. Is there a way to make allies follow you? So far proselytize seems to be more of a get out of fighting a dude button than a get a buddy button. dis astranagant fucked around with this message at 02:44 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 02:30
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waddler posted:I thought I heard of this before... Based on the description, I'd expect something more like a bot that plays some roguelike, constantly evaluating whether it's in a situation where the chance of player death on the next turn is non-zero. Once it is, it reverts to manual control until that's no longer the case. So in the monster pit situation, it would autoexplore, autoequip, and autofight until it reached the point where an attack by the surrounding monsters could potentially kill it in one turn, and then hand it to the player and go "gl hf".
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Jan 3, 2015 04:34
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Dunno if this is a display bug or not but sunder mind drops from 2d12+2 to 1d12+4 at level 11.
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Jan 3, 2015 04:55
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dis astranagant posted:Dunno if this is a display bug or not but sunder mind drops from 2d12+2 to 1d12+4 at level 11. That's what you get for turning it up to 11. (Followers should path around behind you and zone with you, I'll see if there's a new bug there.)
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Jan 3, 2015 05:04
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Unormal posted:That's what you get for turning it up to 11. I proselytized some snapjaws and they just kinda milled around roughly LOS of where they started or the last enemy they found and definitely didn't zone with me.
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Jan 3, 2015 05:11
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Maelephant and HandOfLuke wanted a map editor; I had an old C# one for old-Qud, but I needed to write something new to support the tiles. I was thinking I was going to do it in the Unity Editor, but Maelephant mostly uses Linux. I thought about it for a minute and realized that really, with my Sproggi UI kit + onGUI stuff, it's probably just about as easy to do it directly in game as it is to do it as an Editor plugin So now I have a hideous but functional in-game editor starting to take shape.  Should be much less hideous by COB tomorrow! F12 will open the editing toolbox. Unormal fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 06:07
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Okay, some more stuff.
Word of advice to other CoQ players: don't drink slime.  Also, as noted above, time clones can throw your grenades. So, uh, don't have high-explosive grenades if you plan on using Temporal Fugue because your clones can and will instakill you with them because you happen to be standing next to their target.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:09
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hand of luke posted:For you Qud esper veterans, what's your opinion on the Ego/Willpower buffs to mutation level and cooldown? Main feedback I'm looking for: Willpower is nice but it seems to drop off really badly at higher values, so I never bother raising it above 18 or so (that's enough to keep me from getting instagibbed by Sightless Eye dicks and it buffs my cooldowns a bit). Ego on the other hand is critical for boosting Esper abilities. If anything, I'd like to see something similar for physical mutations - not as potent, mind you, since chimeras can much more reliably depend on melee and ranged combat since their stats tend to support it better, but it would be nice to be able to play a chimera and not sink every last mutation point into two to three mutations or just have a million mutations at level one. I'm not sure what stat you'd want to base physical mutation scaling off of, but that could be a good way to make the mental stats less comparatively worthless for combat ogres - I'd sink a handful of points into Willpower or Ego if they gave me a couple of bonus levels to my physical mutations, since some of those things scale really nicely with level. The alternative is scaling it off toughness or something and that seems like it'd be really hard to balance (but then again, to really gouge tons of extra mutation levels you'd have to skimp on all your other stats, and you'd pretty much have a massive pile of hit points, a bunch of cool mutations, and relatively decent combat stats and nothing else, which might not work out too badly). The biggest hurdle I can think of for boosting physical mutations using physical stats is that some physical mutations actually boost or penalize your physical stats, which could throw their power and/or desirability way out of whack. Angry Diplomat fucked around with this message at 06:16 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 06:13
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:[*]Dropped salty water is displayed as "...drams of diluted salt". This is actually working as intended. The liquid chemistry simulation is way, way more complete than it should be. When you pour liquid on the ground it mixes with an equal amount of solid salt (the salty loam of qud), and since at that point it's more salt than water, it will display as "diluted salt". If you go find fresh water, you can pour water onto that patch and eventually get it back up past the "salty water" threshhold. It handles pools of any number and concentration of mixed liquids, with each liquid having a dilute and primary component adjective.  My personal predilection would be to bend the systems so they start to incentivize mixed-type builds. Pure espers/chimeras are somewhat interesting flavorfully, but practically it just tends to reduce the number of interesting/optimal combinations by splitting the mutations you use together into two silos. (Though you tend to build more pure espers than pure chimeras). I think the way espers work now tends to work against one of our goals which was to make as many combos of the tiny individual pieces as viable and interesting as possible. Unormal fucked around with this message at 06:23 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 06:19
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Honest question: why invest time making it so your game can represent that?
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Jan 3, 2015 06:22
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nutranurse posted:Honest question: why invest time making it so your game can represent that? Well, only a crazy person would think it was a good idea try to make Qud in the first place. So, because I'm a crazy person.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:23
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You raise a good point. Roguelike development seems like it can let its creators get up to some really zany stuff.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:25
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nutranurse posted:You raise a good point. Roguelike development seems like it can let its creators get up to some really zany stuff. Honestly, as a developer, a huge part of the fun for me working with ascii/lowfi tiles is that the representational nature lets you go off in those zany directions much, much more freely than any sort of game with real graphical fidelity does. That's a huge draw to traditional lowfi roguelikes for gamers and devs alike.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:27
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Unormal posted:My personal predilection would be to bend the systems so they start to incentivize mixed-type builds. Pure espers/chimeras are somewhat interesting flavorfully, but practically it just tends to reduce the number of interesting/optimal combinations by splitting the mutations you use together into two silos. (Though you tend to build more pure espers than pure chimeras). I think the way espers work now tends to work against one of our goals which was to make as many combos of the tiny individual pieces as viable and interesting as possible. This is fair, but I worry that espers would be dramatically harder to play if it were changed around all that much. It might be interesting if Ego boosted all mutations to some degree, but that might make it too much of a god-stat for mutants. Could be neat to just pile up a crapload of Toughness and Ego and trundle around as some kind of horrible psychic demon crab with no meaningful ability to use weapons or armour, but a shitload of deadly mutations and eerie mental powers.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:44
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Unormal posted:This is actually working as intended. The liquid chemistry simulation is way, way more complete than it should be. When you pour liquid on the ground it mixes with an equal amount of solid salt (the salty loam of qud), and since at that point it's more salt than water, it will display as "diluted salt". If you go find fresh water, you can pour water onto that patch and eventually get it back up past the "salty water" threshhold. It handles pools of any number and concentration of mixed liquids, with each liquid having a dilute and primary component adjective. Yes  This is why I have one waterskin full of slime, asphalt, blood, and every other liquid I could find in Golgotha. Implement a chemist class please. Or how about a quest to make rocket fuel. So Qud questions: How do you break down walls/dig. I have the pickaxe . Where is the shop you can only access if you choose Merchant? Is it in Joppa? Re: Dungeonmans. Dungeonmans is my favorite Steam purchase this holiday.
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Jan 3, 2015 06:50
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Espers are kinda weird in that they essentially have a set of per encounter powers, most of which emulate stuff they could toss out every turn if they had shoved those ego and will points into agility. Most of the actually unique ones are on super long cooldowns and don't help you kill things.
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Jan 3, 2015 07:09
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Merchant just lets you walk into Grit Gate without doing any quests IIRC. If you have a digging implement equipped, simply walking into walls should attack them, like enemies. This can be problematic when you accidentally Kool-Aid Man through a starapple farmer's fence and he goes homicidal on you.
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Jan 3, 2015 07:10
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Helical Nightmares posted:Yes You can only dig by using certain mutations afaik. Also merchants don't appear to actually let you into anywhere you couldn't otherwise go, they just get to use the shop in the Grit Gate entrance without doing the Golgotha quest.
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Jan 3, 2015 07:10
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Everyone who reads this thread should play Dungeonmans, it's like essence of roguelike and has an irreverent brand of humor that hit the mark for me a lot better than Dredmore did (and the designer is right here, so once you start getting annoyed with little poo poo, you can gripe to him directly, just like Qud and Sproggi!).
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Jan 3, 2015 07:10
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I played a rangermans, held down f for a long time, acquired a bunch of buttons that didn't seem to actually be useful enough to make me let go of f, then fell asleep.
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Jan 3, 2015 07:12
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dis astranagant posted:You can only dig by using certain mutations afaik. Nope! Try making a True Man Child of the Deeps, wielding your nanojackhammer, and walking into some walls!
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Jan 3, 2015 07:12
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dis astranagant posted:I played a rangermans, held down f for a long time, acquired a bunch of buttons that didn't seem to actually be useful enough to make me let go of f, then fell asleep. try making a 2h fightermans with just enough necromansy to do an aoe drain attack as a panic button and play unkillable conans, it's surprisingly fun
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Jan 3, 2015 07:54
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dis astranagant posted:I played a rangermans, held down f for a long time, acquired a bunch of buttons that didn't seem to actually be useful enough to make me let go of f, then fell asleep. Best part is that you can use this sleep aid whenever you like! No need to keep stocking up on costly medicine. Dungeonmans is safe, efficient and apparently in your case, non-habit-forming.
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Jan 3, 2015 08:26
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I wanna play Qud 
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Jan 3, 2015 08:31
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dis astranagant posted:You can only dig by using certain mutations afaik. Also merchants don't appear to actually let you into anywhere you couldn't otherwise go, they just get to use the shop in the Grit Gate entrance without doing the Golgotha quest. You can actually attack walls with any weapon. They have loads of HP and armor so it takes hundreds or thousands of turns, but I once dug my way to freedom with a mace when I "lost my bearings" and the game generated me in an enclosed area.
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Jan 3, 2015 09:06
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willus posted:try making a 2h fightermans with just enough necromansy to do an aoe drain attack as a panic button and play unkillable conans, it's surprisingly fun Actually did that first, minus the necromancy. Got killed by bullshit on the world map, almost didn't roll the rangermans. I also started a wizardmans but the mighty 2 line aoes and a 3x3 tree looked silly so I put it down.
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Jan 3, 2015 09:17
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victrix posted:Everyone who reads this thread should play Dungeonmans, it's like essence of roguelike and has an irreverent brand of humor that hit the mark for me a lot better than Dredmore did (and the designer is right here, so once you start getting annoyed with little poo poo, you can gripe to him directly, just like Qud and Sproggi!). The Dredmor team are on the forums as well, mind you. Fun Dredmor Fact: I believe it's the second floor which can spawn crypts, which include coffins with unique inscriptions. A *majority* of the beta testing team for Dredmor were goons, and the notable testers were all memorialized as specific inscriptions on those coffins.
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Jan 3, 2015 09:56
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Angry Diplomat posted:Willpower is nice but it seems to drop off really badly at higher values, so I never bother raising it above 18 or so (that's enough to keep me from getting instagibbed by Sightless Eye dicks and it buffs my cooldowns a bit). At 24 willpower you hit just over half cooldown and at 28 you hit a tad over a third. The problem is that the shortest cooldown (aside from high level force wall) is 30 turns and you're still in the realm of resting them off between fights rather than using them more than once in the same fight.
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Jan 3, 2015 10:00
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:You can actually attack walls with any weapon. They have loads of HP and armor so it takes hundreds or thousands of turns, but I once dug my way to freedom with a mace when I "lost my bearings" and the game generated me in an enclosed area. That's pretty hardcore. Like escaping from Alcatraz or something.
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Jan 3, 2015 10:13
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I got Dungeonmans in the sale and was wondering, is it not optimised for multiple cores? It seems to only be using my first core and maxing it out really hard rather than spreading the load at all.
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Jan 3, 2015 11:12
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Cuntpunch posted:The Dredmor team are on the forums as well, mind you. I didn't know that, I blame goons for the terrible elemental system then I like Dredmore ok, but it didn't keep my interest past one completion (and that was with short/small levels or whatever and I still found it dragged a bit). Funny because Dungeonmans is probably a good bit longer overall, but it manages to feel faster just due to the pacing. I also wasn't a big fan of Dredmore's skill system (and by extension, Dungeonmans! I don't like a la carte skill systems much I guess, I prefer class based in general).
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Jan 3, 2015 11:13
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Paper Lion posted:I got Dungeonmans in the sale and was wondering, is it not optimised for multiple cores? It seems to only be using my first core and maxing it out really hard rather than spreading the load at all. That's pretty funny, I hadn't noticed it before. Most games aren't well multithreaded because the main thread handles the graphics engine which most events tie into, and time matters a lot in games, so syncing stuff between threads can be more challenging than with other applications. I took a screenshot of the task manager and noticed that it drops back to like 3% CPU use when it's not the active window.
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Jan 3, 2015 11:43
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So I got Dungeonmans installed an gave it a quick start up, and figure I'll look up controls and such later as well as face my first moronic deaths then too (if there is a manual or quick reference guide in the steam folder, I'm looking past it while tired). Though my first question... Is the quickstart guide supposed to look like this? EDIT: vvv Gotcha, It's cool. I was able to fumble around enough to smash some scrobolds and get baby's first relic. Thus lulling me into a false sense of security for when proper gameplay starts  I google up basic control features later when I'm not realizing I've been awake unable to fall asleep for Oh poo poo hours again.
Section Z fucked around with this message at 13:23 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 12:54
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Section Z posted:So I got Dungeonmans installed an gave it a quick start up, and figure I'll look up controls and such later as well as face my first moronic deaths then too (if there is a manual or quick reference guide in the steam folder, I'm looking past it while tired). No, something went wrong in the last patch with regards to wrapped string writing. That help screen is terrible, and I don't (yet) have a good way to simply print a text file on screen.
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Jan 3, 2015 13:03
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Why do I take the ammo, drop the ammo, take the ammo and then finally reload the gun? Enemies seem to get several moves when I reload. e: also the message history screen eats a hilarious amount of processor time for no apparent reason. dis astranagant fucked around with this message at 13:29 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 13:18
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Well now, in a tremendous surprise to mark 2015 kicking off with some intrigue in the Roguelike world, out of freaking nowhere, Legend of Siegfried had a new release and is getting back in the action: http://www.roguebasin.com/index.php?title=Legend_of_Siegfried The game is/was part of the Absolutely Ambitious Class of Roguelikes right up there alongside ADOM and Caves of Qud while also definitely having some of ToME 4's attributes in his sights to equal or trump. My memory is fuzzy, but I think it may have now switched from C++ to C# after this giant stasis period---hopefully that helps to get things moreso underway as opposed to getting lost in the weeds sort of like how Infra Arcana is an ongoing casualty of the SDL/SFML Wars. Now all we need is Solstice to hopefully get back to updating again since October and 2015 will definitely be quite a year for mega-projects alongside the newfound progress that ADOM and Qud are making on Steam and whatnot.
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Jan 3, 2015 15:10
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Rexxed posted:That's pretty funny, I hadn't noticed it before. Most games aren't well multithreaded because the main thread handles the graphics engine which most events tie into, and time matters a lot in games, so syncing stuff between threads can be more challenging than with other applications. I took a screenshot of the task manager and noticed that it drops back to like 3% CPU use when it's not the active window. I'd be shocked if Dungeonmans needs an entire core; most likely it's just not using vsync or something, and thus running at 3000 fps.
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Jan 3, 2015 19:57
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Got a corpse for the watervine quest in Caves of Qud, decided to head right back to town so I could finish the quest properly for once, and it froze while transitioning from DL1 to Red Rock surface. Nothing in Player.log looks amiss; the last lines are "Starting game..." and the corresponding source file. Unusually, I can't even interact with the menu or the window-close button (the application shows as "not responding"), which I could previously when it was the CoQ thread that died. I'm guessing that means that this time something went wrong with Unity itself? Weird. Restarted the game, tried to continue, the game gave me a blank screen except for the continue/cancel options, I hit spacebar to continue, it dumped me back at the main menu. So I'm guessing the savefile got corrupted. Again, nothing amiss in Player.log.
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Jan 3, 2015 20:38
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Got a corpse for the watervine quest in Caves of Qud, decided to head right back to town so I could finish the quest properly for once, and it froze while transitioning from DL1 to Red Rock surface. If you run across bad saves like that, I'd take them for 'ye ol' debuggery.
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Jan 3, 2015 20:49
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Bought Dungeonmans. Spent three days on-and-off killing twelve dungeonmans and finally getting a guy to level 8. Felt brave enough to take on a dungeon that turned "dangerous" on level 2. Made it to level 4! Found a portal to a monster party. Managed to scramble my way into a corner and clear the party by spamming my banner, my maybe, and my awesome two-space spear attacks. Step out from corner to confront boss mob. I killed the boss mob! Then I took 220 damage from something that fired when she died. Now I'm dead and I'm not sure why. TL;DR: Dungeonmans is definitely a roguelike. 5/5 rogues.
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Jan 4, 2015 00:11
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