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wooger posted:And yet they cut out a bunch of useful, interesting plot for them by randomly excising Coldhands. Tell me specifically how Coldhands contributes to any plot other than "whoa that looks cool".
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Jan 2, 2015 17:35
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computer parts posted:Tell me specifically how Coldhands contributes to any plot other than "whoa that looks cool". Depends on who or what he is.
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Jan 2, 2015 17:47
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computer parts posted:Tell me specifically how Coldhands contributes to any plot other than "whoa that looks cool". Establishes more about the Others/wights because he's a sentient sapient dead guy who only seems to kill night's watch deserters and turns Bran and his group into unwitting cannibals
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Jan 2, 2015 18:19
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Calaveron posted:Establishes more about the Others/wights because he's a sentient sapient dead guy who only seems to kill night's watch deserters and turns Bran and his group into unwitting cannibals It doesn't tell you anything about the Others except that things other than them can control dead bodies. Which, if the theory of Bloodraven as Coldhands is correct, can easily be introduced once Bran is actually with Bloodraven.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:39
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loquacius posted:Blackfish is a good name for a token Evil Tully but that dude rules The Black Watch and Black Prince were both pretty cool. Black isn't evil all that often.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:49
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computer parts posted:if the theory of Bloodraven as Coldhands is correct Whereas every other possibility makes him infinitely more interesting.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:49
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It's really going to be difficult to argue the strength of the TV adaptation in a thread full of people who have read the books and probably discussed the poo poo out of the books for almost a decade in some cases. We are the people who have gone over every detail with a fine comb and have written about the different themes and character arcs that GRRM is writing. But that's not what the TV show is. It's a show that is meant to entertain a bunch of people and keep them entertained throughout its entire run. You have to understand that I watch this show with a reasonably intelligent group of people who have never read the books, and most of them don't even refer to Dany by her real name. Between seasons the only character name they even remember is Robb and Jon Snow. They remember the basic beats of the plot, and who is who amongst the main characters, but beyond that they don't really think about it. I'm willing to guess that they are the in upper spectrum of people that watch the show, as I've met people that don't even understand that Dany is on a different continent, or remember that Khal Drogo is dead. To this type of audience, Lady Stoneheart appearing isn't some kind of commentary on the return of magic, or a way to show how resurrection changes you. It's just "a TV show refusing to kill of its cast!!!1"
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Jan 2, 2015 18:52
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computer parts posted:Tell me specifically how Coldhands contributes to any plot other than "whoa that looks cool". Yeah, I've come around to this way of thinking about a lot of the excised material. The show probably doesn't have enough time to bring up Coldhands or Lady Stoneheart or Victarion unless they're going to play pretty large roles. I'm sure people can just point to scenes they didn't like that they'd want tossed in favor of this stuff, but it's a time commitment that they'd have to make going forward, and without knowing what D&D know about where the plot is going, it's impossible to say whether, say, checking in with Lady Stoneheart every 3 episodes (hey, she's still killing Freys, what do you know) would be time well-spent.
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Jan 3, 2015 20:25
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I'm probably wrong, but I think Stoneheart will still make an appearance. The writers have established a pattern of fronting the seasons with a pretty major event (eg, Bran falling, Jaime getting his hand cut off, the Purple Wedding) and Brienne running into the Brotherhood at the start of five will fit that pattern very well. Cutting unneeded Greyjoys is one thing, but without Cat forcing Brienne to betray Jaime, there isn't much left for Brienne to do. (I know Jaime's going to Dorne this season, but that doesn't mean he can't also end up in the Riverlands by the end of it--the show's played fast and loose with geography before.)
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Jan 3, 2015 21:41
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With Jaime in Dorne and Brienne in the Vale, I just don't think its probable that they will bring them both back to the Riverlands. You can say its "possible", but I don't think its gonna happen.
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Jan 3, 2015 22:20
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Frankly, it's just something I hope. I love the show, and I understand that it's becoming something largely different from the books, but the writers made some pretty bad omissions and interpretations in the back half of the fourth season.* I can understand why they'd save some of the major points for the fifth season (Jon becoming lord commander at the beginning, and then getting assassinated at the end, is a pretty good arc), and I'm hoping they're doing the same thing for Stoneheart. We'll see. Edit: But then again, D&D know where the story ends, so they know what they can cut. *Littlefinger is my biggest gripe in this regard. It's one thing to have him change accents every season, but the way they wrote him murdering Lysa--without having someone to blame--is the exact opposite of his character. He's an opportunist, and he never acts rashly. Asbury fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Jan 3, 2015 |
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Jan 3, 2015 23:07
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http://winteriscoming.net/2014/11/02/new-revealing-pictures-daznaks-pit/
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Jan 3, 2015 23:50
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"Posted November 2nd 2014"
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Jan 4, 2015 02:10
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Didn't notice. It still shows rather interesting alterations what with Tyrion being on the dais and Jorah not being in exile or a slave.
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Jan 4, 2015 02:14
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Jorah not being in exile or a slave.
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Jan 4, 2015 02:36
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3Romeo posted:
I think blaming suicide works well enough, LF's judges hated him and knew he wasn't trustworthy but I think he could of convinced them on his own. Blaming some random singer who got given everything by Lysa then decides one day to murder her for no loving reason in front of two people makes waaay less sense than suicide.
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Jan 4, 2015 03:20
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BillBear posted:I think blaming suicide works well enough, LF's judges hated him and knew he wasn't trustworthy but I think he could of convinced them on his own. Blaming some random singer who got given everything by Lysa then decides one day to murder her for no loving reason in front of two people makes waaay less sense than suicide. Everyone knew the singer was a spaz who was desperate for Lysa's attention though. It wasn't too hard to spin it into "He went too far and made a move on Lysa and she said no and he snapped." It's like all those self-described nice guys who are really just incredibly creepy and freak out at their well-deserved rejection. That said, the way the show did it worked too. Everyone knew Lysa was batshit and even the ones who distrusted Littlefinger the most knew there wasn't any proof and probably also that despite how self-serving LF is, he's at least going to be better administering the area than Lysa. Not too mention the ones who can't figure out how LF in charge can be to their advantage are probably just biding their time until they can find both the means and the justification to get Littlefinger's rear end out of there anyway.
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Jan 4, 2015 04:24
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Lycus posted:With Jaime in Dorne and Brienne in the Vale, I just don't think its probable that they will bring them both back to the Riverlands. You can say its "possible", but I don't think its gonna happen. You say that, but do you really think that Brienne and Jaime's stories won't cross again? I still think that they could have good stuff in store for Jaime and Brienne, but I really like the thematic elements of their story in the books. How Brienne is becoming more like Jaime, and Jaime more like Brienne...It's something they could still pull off in the show. And for a show that just loves to put two actors together that have good chemistry together, I don't see them not having Brienne and Jaime cross paths in the future.
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Jan 4, 2015 07:43
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That was about Stoneheart, not Jaime and Brienne never meeting again.
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Jan 4, 2015 08:05
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Lycus posted:That was about Stoneheart, not Jaime and Brienne never meeting again. Well, it's possible that all of Stoneheart's role is just being a vehicle to get the two together.
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Jan 4, 2015 09:43
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Which is just another reason why I think significantly changing Jaime and Brienne's storylines, which may change the timing, location and circumstances of their reunion, means that it's likely that Stoneheart is cut.
Lycus fucked around with this message at 10:11 on Jan 4, 2015 |
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Jan 4, 2015 10:05
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Steve2911 posted:I'd definitely count Yara's quest and the Craster's Keep story as classic definition filler. Adds nothing, changes nothing, exists to give characters something to do for a while or to cram in action scenes to up the excitement. Fine in theory, but when you look back on it it's just wasted time that could have gone to sexy sexy Coldhands. Most of this is poisoned by book knowledge of where the story is supposed to go. It's easy to defend Arya's scenes because her part of the story has almost no plot whatsoever, it's just her shuffling about Westeros aimlessly. Her scenes with the Hound were already getting pretty repetitive this season anyway, they just kept going over the same points and the character beats were more or less the same. But it's easier to accept that because the acting's good and you know when it's going to end and how. The Yara quest wasn't well executed, but wasted time? We haven't even seen Yara since then and the Greyjoy plotline seems to be changing a lot. We have no idea whatsoever how her attempt and failure at rescuing Theon will affect the story going forward. It could be that it's thematically important that Theon didn't take external help to escape but will eventually escape through his own will after reclaiming his identity. I don't know, because I don't know what's happening in that story and neither do you. Pedro De Heredia fucked around with this message at 11:52 on Jan 4, 2015 |
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Jan 4, 2015 11:43
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Pedro De Heredia posted:The Yara quest wasn't well executed, but wasted time? We haven't even seen Yara since then and the Greyjoy plotline seems to be changing a lot. We have no idea whatsoever how her attempt and failure at rescuing Theon will affect the story going forward. It could be that it's thematically important that Theon didn't take external help to escape but will eventually escape through his own will after reclaiming his identity. I don't know, because I don't know what's happening in that story and neither do you. It was a garbage scene that would have been bad on Network TV, nothing will save it
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Jan 4, 2015 13:32
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Harley Quinn
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Jan 4, 2015 16:49
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Bah, I still can't watch and enjoy the finale of season 4. I can rewatch and love most episodes from most seasons, but watching one of my favorite characters probably-most-likely-maybe die (The Hound) after him taking care of Arya (bitch), and then the cock tease shot where it cuts to the river and I think it's going to be Stoneheart and then nope it's the bitch again.
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Jan 4, 2015 19:48
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oswald ownenstein posted:Bah, I still can't watch and enjoy the finale of season 4. I can rewatch and love most episodes from most seasons, but watching one of my favorite characters probably-most-likely-maybe die (The Hound) after him taking care of Arya (bitch), and then the cock tease shot where it cuts to the river and I think it's going to be Stoneheart and then nope it's the bitch again. What?
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Jan 4, 2015 20:01
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oswald ownenstein posted:Bah, I still can't watch and enjoy the finale of season 4. I can rewatch and love most episodes from most seasons, but watching one of my favorite characters probably-most-likely-maybe die (The Hound) after him taking care of Arya (bitch), and then the cock tease shot where it cuts to the river and I think it's going to be Stoneheart and then nope it's the bitch again. You're a hateful man.
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Jan 4, 2015 20:21
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oswald ownenstein posted:Bah, I still can't watch and enjoy the finale of season 4. I can rewatch and love most episodes from most seasons, but watching one of my favorite characters probably-most-likely-maybe die (The Hound) after him taking care of Arya (bitch), and then the cock tease shot where it cuts to the river and I think it's going to be Stoneheart and then nope it's the bitch again. Seek help.
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Jan 4, 2015 22:22
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Not liking Arya is a sign of sociopathy.
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Jan 4, 2015 22:40
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Arya is the only Best Character in the series who remains a Best Character for the entire series. She is, in other words, The Best Character.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:34
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rydiafan posted:Not liking Arya is a sign of sociopathy. TV Arya can't act and has the same constipated look on her face in every scene. Book Arya is cool, though.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:35
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I love Arya but she was a cold hearted bitch to the hound at the end there. And seeing her smug rear end on the horse when the shot panned to the river, instead of Lord Beric, was soul crushing.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:36
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oswald ownenstein posted:I love Arya but she was a cold hearted bitch to the hound at the end there. And seeing her smug rear end on the horse when the shot panned to the river, instead of Lord Beric, was soul crushing. He shouldn't have killed the butcher's boy  The Hound is not a virtuous character who deserves a happy ending (even if he is entertaining), but don't worry, the books suggest he receives one anyway 
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Jan 4, 2015 23:40
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Irish Joe posted:TV Arya can't act and has the same constipated look on her face in every scene. This is literally the opposite of the truth.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:40
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loquacius posted:He shouldn't have killed the butcher's boy I mean saving her from getting raped and tons of other lovely things is worth nothing right?
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Jan 4, 2015 23:42
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Irish Joe posted:TV Arya can't act and has the same constipated look on her face in every scene. 
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Jan 4, 2015 23:42
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loquacius posted:He shouldn't have killed the butcher's boy Killing the butcher's boy was his job, he had no choice, and somebody would have done it if he hadn't. You might as well claim Ned is a shithead for executing the deserter in episode 1. When you factor everything the Hound did to protect both Stark girls he is probably the most virtuous person on the show.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:45
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This was a nice moment, but I didn't buy that it was the broken laugh of a character pushed to the edge by poo poo circumstances. She just seemed like someone had told a funny joke at a slumber party. She's a fine actress for what is demanded of Aria though.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:45
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That gif wasn't submitted as evidence he was wrong. It was dismissal of his idiotic opinion.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:47
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rydiafan posted:That gif wasn't submitted as evidence he was wrong. It was dismissal of his idiotic opinion. Congratulations on scouring the deep web for the one moment in the series where she expresses an emotion.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:54
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