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Flobbster posted:In that GIF, Chris Christie is literally every awkward teenager looking for group acceptance that Jonah Hill has ever played. Can't wait for the biopic.
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Jan 5, 2015 19:44
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Huckabee, Cruz, Rubio, Romney have no chance from the way I look at things. Jeb Bush and/or Chris Christie seem likely to me. Maybe there's some weirdo dark horse candidate we don't know about yet that could strike lightning but for all the talk I hear about "appealing to the base" and appeasing the Tea Party nuts, none of them ever gains any real traction (Paul (x2), West, Cain, Santorum, Gingrich). The GOP knows what it's doing in a lot of ways. The fact that they're even taken seriously, consistently frame the political narrative and get poor (white) people to consistently vote against their own self interest is testament to that, but the people who run the show know better than to believe the bullshit that the carnival barkers espouse. The stuff we all laugh at. That's why there hasn't been a "radical", out of the box, revolutionary Republican nominee in my lifetime and probably won't be. They know who butters their bread and only take the rhetoric so far, to the point that it distracts and divides the electorate into areas that the real power brokers don't give two shits about (gays, spending, debt, guns, etc.).
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Jan 5, 2015 20:06
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It's Paul.
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Jan 5, 2015 20:11
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BiggerBoat posted:Rubio
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Jan 5, 2015 20:40
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shadow puppet of a posted:I'm always baffled whenever his name is mentioned for anything. The hairline he is sporting alone kills him as a candidate. How the hell could he possibly frontrun any ticket? How could he even be a VP candidate? He needs that black scalp paint.
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Jan 5, 2015 20:56
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shadow puppet of a posted:I'm always baffled whenever his name is mentioned for anything. The hairline he is sporting alone kills him as a candidate. How the hell could he possibly frontrun any ticket? How could he even be a VP candidate? After 2012 the line of reasoning was the Hispanic vote was killing the GOP (which is a problem, but it was boiled down to THE ONLY PROBLEM), and Rubio was floated as the solution. Since people always vote along racial lines, he was a free pass to the Presidency. Since then the GOP fell into the same immigration traps they always fall into, and Rubio completely fell apart with any sort of national spotlight, but he still has some of that momentum.
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Jan 5, 2015 21:10
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Lockback posted:After 2012 the line of reasoning was the Hispanic vote was killing the GOP (which is a problem, but it was boiled down to THE ONLY PROBLEM), and Rubio was floated as the solution. Since people always vote along racial lines, he was a free pass to the Presidency. Since then the GOP fell into the same immigration traps they always fall into, and Rubio completely fell apart with any sort of national spotlight, but he still has some of that momentum. He's also taken the wrong side of the Cuba thing, which, while it might win him the votes of the decaying Cuban exile bloc, will not endear him to any Hispanics under the age of, like, 50.
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Jan 5, 2015 21:14
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BiggerBoat posted:Huckabee, Cruz, Rubio, Romney have no chance from the way I look at things. Jeb Bush and/or Chris Christie seem likely to me. Maybe there's some weirdo dark horse candidate we don't know about yet that could strike lightning but for all the talk I hear about "appealing to the base" and appeasing the Tea Party nuts, none of them ever gains any real traction (Paul (x2), West, Cain, Santorum, Gingrich). Surely CC is too moderate on social issues to win over grassroots Republicans - even without a move to the centre undermining his credibility in the general election. Also, where would his finance come from? The establishment money would go to Bush and the Koch's would go to Perry or Cruz, wouldn't it? I don't see CC's constituency within the GOP, given the prospective field mooted here.
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Jan 5, 2015 21:48
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Alter Ego posted:He's also taken the wrong side of the Cuba thing, which, while it might win him the votes of the decaying Cuban exile bloc, will not endear him to any Hispanics under the age of, like, 50. Should he somehow get the nomination, and then predictably go down in flames, I expect there would be a rash of Rovian op-eds with titles like "What's Wrong With Latino Americans?" As the right, scratching its head, tries to puzzle out yet again why insincere tokenism didn't produce expected results.
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Jan 5, 2015 22:10
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:Surely CC is too moderate on social issues to win over grassroots Republicans - even without a move to the centre undermining his credibility in the general election. Also, where would his finance come from? The establishment money would go to Bush and the Koch's would go to Perry or Cruz, wouldn't it? I don't see CC's constituency within the GOP, given the prospective field mooted here. Christie is Pro-life and was anti-gay marriage, but now says he doesn't want to talk about it. He has more of a perception of being socially liberal than he really is. He also has closer connections to NY finance and money than Bush does, but I think most of the establishment money probably will go to Bush anyway.
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Jan 5, 2015 22:32
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I think it's really funny that Christie's idea of pandering to the base is "fawn over Jerry Jones like a sub in his box."
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Jan 5, 2015 22:39
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Christie is Pro-life and was anti-gay marriage, but now says he doesn't want to talk about it. He has more of a perception of being socially liberal than he really is. Quite possibly, but he was pro-gun control, pro-medical use for cannabis, and in favour of Federal relief after Hurricane Sandy, and is not a hardliner on immigration, so he seems a moderate on many GOP touchstones. But you are quite right that CC as a social liberal is a matter of perception, regardless of the evidence of his past positions which show him more a conventionally GOP on social isues
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Jan 5, 2015 23:18
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:Quite possibly, but he was pro-gun control, pro-medical use for cannabis, and in favour of Federal relief after Hurricane Sandy, and is not a hardliner on immigration, so he seems a moderate on many GOP touchstones. But you are quite right that CC as a social liberal is a matter of perception, regardless of the evidence of his past positions which show him more a conventionally GOP on social isues Eh, that was mainly because Sandy was in his backyard; one of the house members who voted against Sandy relief, Mo Brooks, was also on record as wanting relief for when tornadoes ravaged his Alabama district. Only moral X is my X, etc.
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Jan 5, 2015 23:20
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Jerry Manderbilt posted:Eh, that was mainly because Sandy was in his backyard; one of the house members who voted against Sandy relief, Mo Brooks, was also on record as wanting relief for when tornadoes ravaged his Alabama district. Only moral X is my X, etc. True and strictly speaking it is a matter of political manoeuvring rather than a social issue.
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Jan 5, 2015 23:46
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:Quite possibly, but he was pro-gun control, pro-medical use for cannabis, and in favour of Federal relief after Hurricane Sandy, and is not a hardliner on immigration, so he seems a moderate on many GOP touchstones. But you are quite right that CC as a social liberal is a matter of perception, regardless of the evidence of his past positions which show him more a conventionally GOP on social isues He'll abandon all of that on the campaign trail if he has a legitimate chance of winning the presidency. Just look at John McCain.
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Jan 5, 2015 23:56
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Rand Paul is going to introduce a bill tomorrow to cut US aid to Palestinians. Guess that's his foreign policy this week.
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Jan 6, 2015 00:05
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Does the US even give foreign aid to Palestine, or is this a waste of everyones time that will still sound good to the uninformed?Flobbster posted:In that GIF, Chris Christie is literally every awkward teenager looking for group acceptance that Jonah Hill has ever played. Hi, I'm Christie, and I like warm hugs! BiggerBoat posted:The GOP knows what it's doing in a lot of ways. The fact that they're even taken seriously, consistently frame the political narrative and get poor (white) people to consistently vote against their own self interest is testament to that, but the people who run the show know better than to believe the bullshit that the carnival barkers espouse. The stuff we all laugh at That unskewing the poles ever got any traction suggests you're giving them too much credit. Jerry Manderbilt posted:Eh, that was mainly because Sandy was in his backyard; one of the house members who voted against Sandy relief, Mo Brooks, was also on record as wanting relief for when tornadoes ravaged his Alabama district. Only moral X is my X, etc. Doesn't matter, they've still got him on camera hugging the
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Jan 6, 2015 00:21
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Fulchrum posted:Doesn't matter, they've still got him on camera hugging the Chris Christie has a real hugging problem. No Republican has ever come back from hugging Obama on camera, and then Christie went and hugged the Cowboys too. I mean, near half the country like Obama, but nobody likes the Cowboys.
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Jan 6, 2015 00:43
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How do you even hug Jerry Jones without cutting yourself?
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Jan 6, 2015 00:52
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:Surely CC is too moderate on social issues to win over grassroots Republicans - even without a move to the centre undermining his credibility in the general election. Also, where would his finance come from? The establishment money would go to Bush and the Koch's would go to Perry or Cruz, wouldn't it? I don't see CC's constituency within the GOP, given the prospective field mooted here. What about as VP? CC may be able to shore up some blue state votes (NY, NJ, DE,). I don't know. All I really meant was that the GOP nominee will be a center right establishment type, like he always is, and the idea of a far right Tea Party crazy type seem as unlikely as it's ever been. When I think GOP Non Crazy Moderate, the first two names I think of are Christie and Jeb, followed closely by Mitt. I'd put my money on some a ticket involving two of those three.
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Jan 6, 2015 00:55
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BiggerBoat posted:What about as VP? CC may be able to shore up some blue state votes (NY, NJ, DE,). I don't know. That fucker just had his brother insult the Eagles and the Giants while he personally praised the Cowboys. That's poison up there.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:09
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Nintendo Kid posted:That fucker just had his brother insult the Eagles and the Giants while he personally praised the Cowboys. That's poison up there. Also Christie can kiss Michigan goodbye.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:13
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Fulchrum posted:Does the US even give foreign aid to Palestine, or is this a waste of everyones time that will still sound good to the uninformed? We give token aid to stuff in West Bank and Gaza, but the aid that goes to Israel absolutely trumps it. It's also literally nothing from a budget standpoint, either. Fulchrum posted:Doesn't matter, they've still got him on camera hugging the Remember that time Romneycare torpedoed the candidacy of noted primary failure Willard Romney? The GOP will toss its principles if it thinks for even a moment a candidate has a shot of winning the general. Beating those evil Democrats trumps ideological purity every time, and the times where it hasn't has usually resulted in the chosen candidate losing pretty badly. Nintendo Kid posted:That fucker just had his brother insult the Eagles and the Giants while he personally praised the Cowboys. That's poison up there. On the other hand, everybody knows the Cowboys are 'Merica's team. The only place this kind of non-scandal plays is in NJ and NY. In every other state it nets him "guy I'd like to have a beer with" points, and helps him push back against his reputation as a northeastern liberal RINO. Christie has serious charisma, and that's going to make up for quite a lot in covering up for some of the more liberal policies he's supported. He has also been pretty good about putting up token opposition that he can use to say he tried to do something, and then just scapegoat those gosh darn liberals for overriding him. He verbally abuses union members on camera. That's worth quite a lot as long as he can keep some semblance of decorum during the primary debates. He can use it as evidence that he's on the front lines of fighting the awful liberals having government do things. ErIog fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 01:29
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ErIog posted:We give token aid to stuff in West Bank and Gaza, but the aid that goes to Israel absolutely trumps it. It's also literally nothing from a budget standpoint, either. Yes, they will toss their principles. Which would mean anything if their hatred of Obama was based on principles. People who act like Romneycare meant anything are acting like the only problems that Republicans have with Obamacare si the suffix "-care". No, it was all about their hatred of the black man achieving something in his time, and how it must be destroyed. It was similar to something Romney did? Who the gently caress cares, Romney is white. But what Christie did was embracing the black guy, and acting like he's the president. And not just that, there's the "He helped Obama get elected by pretending that Sandy wasn't a fuckup". They will ignore their supposed principles, but they don't forget, and they don't forgive.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:37
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Fulchrum posted:People who act like Romneycare meant anything are acting like the only problems that Republicans have with Obamacare si the suffix "-care". No, it was all about their hatred of the black man achieving something in his time, and how it must be destroyed. It was similar to something Romney did? Who the gently caress cares, Romney is white. But what Christie did was embracing the black guy, and acting like he's the president. And not just that, there's the "He helped Obama get elected by pretending that Sandy wasn't a fuckup". They will ignore their supposed principles, but they don't forget, and they don't forgive. I can't believe I'm finding myself saying this, but I think you're drastically overestimating how many frothing overt racists there are among the group of GOP primary voters. There's lots of them, but it's not a KKK rally by any stretch. I also think your read on Obamacare is off the mark because it's something the base would be against no matter the color of who was implementing it since it's the federal government strengthening regulations and doing things. I think it'll be something that appears in ads from PAC's with scary music behind it, but I have trouble seeing it do any real damage. There's just too much video footage of Christie yelling at teachers that offsets it.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:44
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ErIog posted:Remember that time Romneycare torpedoed the candidacy of noted primary failure Willard Romney? I'm sorry, who? I guess it did because I've never heard of the guy.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:45
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ErIog posted:I can't believe I'm finding myself saying this, but I think you're drastically overestimating how many frothing overt racists there are among the group of GOP primary voters. There's lots of them, but it's not a KKK rally by any stretch. Oh really? Then why are so many frothing overt racists getting elected to positions of loving power? Mitt Romney won that primary because he had more money than everyone else, plain and simple. No one else in the field matched his cash reserves or his organization. He didn't have an Obama to get in his way like Hillary did. Give Santorum the same money and organization, and he could have at the very least gotten a brokered convention, where his crazy rear end would have played kingmaker. The GOP literally tried EVERYONE before settling on Romney. You give them an alternative that even smells like he/she has a chance to win and they will drop Christie like a bag of fetid poo poo. Fritz Coldcockin fucked around with this message at 01:51 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 01:48
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Alter Ego posted:Oh really? Then why are so many frothing overt racists getting elected to positions of loving power? Because its good for cheaply increasing base turnout.
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Jan 6, 2015 01:53
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ErIog posted:I can't believe I'm finding myself saying this, but I think you're drastically overestimating how many frothing overt racists there are among the group of GOP primary voters. There's lots of them, but it's not a KKK rally by any stretch. Phoneposting, so pretend I linked that video of them booing a returned serviceman because he is gay. quote:I also think your read on Obamacare is off the mark because it's something the base would be against no matter the color of who was implementing it since it's the federal government strengthening regulations and doing things. Fulchrum fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 02:03
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My Imaginary GF posted:Because its good for cheaply increasing base turnout. Yeah, the base aren't racist, they just really really love electing racists. And ostracized a man who shook Obamas hand so hard, he had to switch parties, and they replaced him with the corpse of a snake someone found in their pool.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:06
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Fulchrum posted:Phoneposting, so pretend I linked that video of them booing a returned serviceman because he is gay. Racist sentiment exists for sure, but you haven't demonstrated its connection to outcomes in the GOP primary process. If it was as strong as you say it is then shouldn't Pat Buchanan and David Duke have gotten the nominations? Fulchrum posted:Its their idea! The whole idea is a Heritage foundation Conservative Alternative to a federal healthcare system. That was their response when Dems were discussing Hillarycare so that they would appear as though they had a plan. It's not surprising that when Hillarycare exploded so did that response. It was never intended to be advancing support for serious policy, and there's also a lot of really key differences between it and Obamacare. It was about as serious of a policy proposal as the Ryan budget is a serious budget proposal. ErIog fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 02:10
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Fulchrum posted:Its their idea! The whole idea is a Heritage foundation Conservative Alternative to a federal healthcare system. No it loving isn't.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:12
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Ugh double phone post.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:12
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Fulchrum posted:Its their idea! The whole idea is a Heritage foundation Conservative Alternative to a federal healthcare system. The only part the Heritage Foundation contributed is the part that conservatives hate the most, the individual mandate.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:14
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BiggerBoat posted:What about as VP? CC may be able to shore up some blue state votes (NY, NJ, DE,). I don't know.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:16
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http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/jeb-bush-in-94-sodomy-shouldnt-be-given-same-protections-as#.wwXJrwNqKb Jeb Bush in 94: "“Sodomy” Shouldn’t Be Given Same Protections As Race, Religion", also compared homosexuals to "“Polluters, pedophiles, pornographers, drunk drivers, and developers without proper permits.” Also in 94 he said he would do "probably nothing" for African Americans if elected governor (bootstraps etc). Not that the GOP has any market share to lose in that demo. Jeb's been out of the spotlight for essentially the entire Obama administration, but people forget that he's been in the public eye since the late 80s (worked on his dad's election campaign). More importantly, he was a Republican in the 1980s. Yeah the Dubya baggage will be there, but so will the "being a Republican in the 1980s" baggage, where you could casually call homosexuals sodomites and nobody batted an eye. His office has already come out and said Jeb "no longer believes" ...whatever offensive thing he said 20+ years ago, but I imagine this won't be the last time Jeb will have to walk back whatever casually racist, sexist, homophobic thing he said back in 1993 or whatever. I imagine the "do nothing for blacks" line will be trotted out soon. He's a top tier candidate on paper, but ultimately I just cannot see him winning the general election (or even securing the GOP nomination). The Dubya stuff, the moderate/Democratic views on several issues, his own 25+ years in the public eye... It's Chris Christie or bust as far as the GOP is concerned. Edit: Another gem: In his 1995 book, Profiles in Character, Bush described the “gay rights movement,” “feminist movement,” and “black empowerment movement” as part of a so-called “modern victim movements.” Cigar Aficionado fucked around with this message at 02:24 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 02:16
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Deteriorata posted:The only part the Heritage Foundation contributed is the part that conservatives hate the most, the individual mandate. As I said before, the part they hate most is the guy who signed it. If any part of the real hatred was idealogical and not raw lizard brain hate, the name Obamacare never would have caught on.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:19
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Fulchrum posted:If any part of the real hatred was idealogical and not raw lizard brain hate, the name Obamacare never would have caught on. It was being called Obamacare from the beginning by people on both sides the same way that scandals are called "-gates." Hillary's plan was called Hillarycare. Romney's thing was called Romneycare. Short-handing the PPACA as Obamacare is as non-partisan as you get. Obama himself resisted that label for a time, but eventually caved when it was demonstrated that calling it that wasn't as toxic as previously thought. Yeah, there's an irrational hatred of Obama among the GOP, but you're doing a poo poo job of backing up your point that a 4 year old photo is going to doom the candidacy of a pretty charismatic guy who polls pretty alright. He can call bullshit on it pretty easily, and probably in a way that endears him to the base, even! Calling bullshit on things is kind of a thing he is known for. ErIog fucked around with this message at 02:31 on Jan 6, 2015 |
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Jan 6, 2015 02:26
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I still sorta like Chris Christie from that time he launched his 2016 campaign in the leadup-to-keynote speaker slot at Mitt's actual convention. It got glossed over thanks to Clint Eastwood giving that chair hell, but it was a great moment.
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Jan 6, 2015 02:31
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Cigar Aficionado posted:Jeb Bush in 94: "“Sodomy” Shouldn’t Be Given Same Protections As Race, Religion", also compared homosexuals to "“Polluters, pedophiles, pornographers, drunk drivers, and developers without proper permits.” Also in 94 he said he would do "probably nothing" for African Americans if elected governor (bootstraps etc). Not that the GOP has any market share to lose in that demo. The Onion snippet for this should be "Bush walks backs comments about polluters in light of recent widespread GOP support for pollution."
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Jan 6, 2015 02:39
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