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Now do the Sami.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:17
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They don't come up much. I think they're just seen as weird? Now, Swedish speaking Finns on the other hand don't get them started on that sorry lot of bastards.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:19
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Torrannor posted:I don't know what's ironic about Europeans being protective of their culture. It's not unique (see a whole lot Americans who would love to deport all these foreigner Mexicans etc.). drilldo squirt posted:It's still wrong and xenophobic. How exactly is this wrong? Are you saying that European cultures are worthless and thus not worth protecting? Or they do have some value but it shouldn't be protected? Do you have a problem with Culture as such?
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Jan 8, 2015 00:37
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Doctor Malaver posted:How exactly is this wrong? Are you saying that European cultures are worthless and thus not worth protecting? Or they do have some value but it shouldn't be protected? Do you have a problem with Culture as such? Sure I do. Those damned Special Circumstances goons, coming over here, destabilising our governments... Seriously, though, European culture is hardly in danger of being wiped out. It's a dominant hegemony integrating other cultures into itself. All immigration does is make it richer and more diverse and keep it from becoming stagnant.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:50
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Doctor Malaver posted:How exactly is this wrong? Are you saying that European cultures are worthless and thus not worth protecting? Or they do have some value but it shouldn't be protected? Do you have a problem with Culture as such? Cultures that are actually in danger of disappearing, e.g. by being oppressed, stateless or tiny enough to be at risk of going extinct or becoming quaint regionalisms, need protecting. The majority cultures of large European nations are not in that situation and anyone who talks about "protecting" them actually means "keeping them homogenous and free from outside influence" which is dumb, counterproductive and xenophobic.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:51
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Orange Devil posted:They don't come up much. I think they're just seen as weird? Now, Swedish speaking Finns on the other hand don't get them started on that sorry lot of bastards. I've found that my Norwegian colleagues are quite vocally anti-Sami, for some reason. There's this weird combination of nationalism and anti-indigenous racism which kind of bugs me. From what I understand - and please correct me if I'm wrong - Sami children are exposed to a lot of prejudice.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:54
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Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that.
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Jan 8, 2015 01:16
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DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. Well as we all know the UAE is about to make Hindi an official language.
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Jan 8, 2015 01:18
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Badger of Basra posted:Well as we all know the UAE is about to make Hindi an official language. To quote a Bollywood movie, "we will show them who is the master and who is the slave :india:"
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Jan 8, 2015 01:22
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DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. Not quite the same thing, but Mexico while it still controlled Texas let in so many white settlers that they had a war and broke off from Mexico when it became apparent a bunch of Racist Slave owning assholes didn't gel too well with the rest of the country. There's some other examples of the elites of some countries intentionally encouraging Immigration to 'Dilute' what was seen as undesirable elements in the country, later nineteenth century Brazil for example encouraged immigration because the white bigwigs were worried Black former slaves made up too large a proportion of the population. khwarezm fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 01:26
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Doctor Malaver posted:How exactly is this wrong? Are you saying that European cultures are worthless and thus not worth protecting? Or they do have some value but it shouldn't be protected? Do you have a problem with Culture as such? European cultures created fascism, plunged the world into two world wars and are poised to make those same mistakes all over again. Maybe they're just incompatible with modern civil society.
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Jan 8, 2015 01:31
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Darth Walrus posted:Seriously, though, European culture is hardly in danger of being wiped out. It's a dominant hegemony integrating other cultures into itself. All immigration does is make it richer and more diverse and keep it from becoming stagnant. DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. Just because something hasn't happened so far is not a proof that it won't happen. Nobody is worried about being wiped out, but it is quite conceivable that for instance the Swiss could become a minority in their own country without restricting immigration. You can also watch Macedonians slowly losing the majority in Macedonia to Albanians, although that's less an issue of immigration and more of a difference in fertility. Sheng-ji Yang posted:European cultures created fascism, plunged the world into two world wars and are poised to make those same mistakes all over again. Maybe they're just incompatible with modern civil society. Which would be I guess the American society? Shall we list stuff that makes USA incompatible with modern civil society? Or just file you under Trolls.
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Jan 8, 2015 01:55
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DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. Incidentally, this is why colonialism is good. Just reframe it as large scale immigration and suddenly it's a desirable thing.
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Jan 8, 2015 02:15
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ekuNNN posted:Wait, what are you talking about? I kind of skimmed all those earlier shitposts on this page. it's Europeans being pissy about legitimate criticisms of far right and bigoted sentiment because America are supposed to be the racists, not them
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Jan 8, 2015 02:26
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icantfindaname posted:it's Europeans being pissy about legitimate criticisms of far right and bigoted sentiment because America are supposed to be the racists, not them slogsdon posted:I love the irony of the Europeans being so protective of their culture. They're so afraid that what they've done to cultures around the world is going to happen to theirs. There is no such thing as a monolithic European culture, nor do Europeans share equally in the guilt of colonial oppression. e: there is not one iota of legitimate criticism in slogdons post. It's just dumb. Cake Smashing Boob fucked around with this message at 02:40 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 02:37
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Cake Smashing Boob posted:There is no such thing as a monolithic European culture, nor do Europeans share equally in the guilt of colonial oppression. It's borrowing a meme from the Freep thread where people accuse the old white racists of "being scared of minorities because they think minorities think the same way they do (regarding racial oppression, etc)".
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Jan 8, 2015 02:43
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Holy poo poo Le Pen has probably run out of champagne by now. Jesus Christ, Islamists and dead leftists?  Doctor Malaver posted:How exactly is this wrong? Are you saying that European cultures are worthless and thus not worth protecting? Or they do have some value but it shouldn't be protected? Do you have a problem with Culture as such? That's not European culture, thats serious political action. It could happen anywhere in the world if popular will, political competence and military strength unites into one good package. Everytime i see some dolt talk about "national culture" they always start by talking about bullfighting, traditional marriage, catholic morals and how Salazar was not so bad. Usually when i think about culture i think about the local cuisine, the classic architecture that built our cities and villages, the local folk traditions, the local music and dances and hospitality, but for some reason all culture lovers never talk about that. icantfindaname posted:it's Europeans being pissy about legitimate criticisms of far right and bigoted sentiment because America are supposed to be the racists, not them We literally cordoned off an area of the city to a skin color because of a scuffle and people still refused to see how it was racist. We Europeans aren't racists because we don't see ourselves as racists. Since we don't consider ourselves racists our actions could never be racists, ergo, only americans are racists.
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Jan 8, 2015 02:44
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Cake Smashing Boob posted:There is no such thing as a monolithic European culture, nor do Europeans share equally in the guilt of colonial oppression. Well, the attack in France was what started this conversation, and France was up there with the worst colonizers. Would you be happier if I said "it's French people being pissy because Americans are supposed to be the racist imperialists, not them?" Unless you're taking the angle that "there's not one iota of criticism to be made of France's imperialism and racism" vvvvvvvvv Fair enough icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 02:47 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 02:44
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icantfindaname posted:Well, the attack in France was what started this conversation, and France was up there with the worst colonizers. Would you be happier if I said "it's French people being pissy because Americans are supposed to be the racist imperialists, not them?" Perfectly.
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Jan 8, 2015 02:45
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Mans posted:What is the European culture exactly? Are we talking about democracy, free speech, wellfare, labor rights and a society that tries to even out inequality so that everyone has a chance? It's hard to define, that's why I used the plural form (cultures). In any case you should direct that question to the goon who said that being protective of your culture is wrong and xenophobic. I'm sure that person can offer a great definition of European culture, being so confident about how it should be treated. Mans posted:That's not European culture, thats serious political action. It could happen anywhere in the world if popular will, political competence and military strength unites into one good package. Well if something happens a lot in country X (and doesn't in countries Y and Z) then it becomes a part of its culture and doesn't become a part of culture in Y and Z. You're saying that anything can happen anywhere given the right circumstances (popular will, political competence and military strength) but that's not much of an argument. Given the right circumstances, Sharia law could be implemented in Latvia or Peru or I could become an astronaut. It's true but it's irrelevant.
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Jan 8, 2015 03:54
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Orange Devil posted:Finns like to point out how they were actually a colony rather than a colonizing power and thus that they share no responsibility whatsoever for the loving up of the rest of the world by Europe and that's why it's okay for them to say Somalis should just gently caress off back to their own country or at the very least change completely for their behaviour must be why their country is poo poo and now they're in Finland so they better act Finnish or they will turn Finland to poo poo too. Oh and also it's not racism to point out how Roma really are dishonest and violent thieves because it's true. Europe is so freaking racist, lmbo.
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Jan 8, 2015 03:56
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DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. Australian Aborigines. Not just one courier, but thousands. All wiped out by the white man. Whites - never turn your back on them or let them in your country, IMHO
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Jan 8, 2015 07:36
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Mans posted:
That's doubly interesting when you consider, you know, Portuguese history. I mean, holy poo poo even the American South had nothing on the Brazilian plantation complex. It's amazing people can look at that colonial legacy and go "racism in Portugal?? Nope, we didn't have anything to do with that.But look at those fuckers over there!"
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Jan 8, 2015 08:02
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Remember that lady cutting up the black person cake which was super racist looking? I do and wow.
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Jan 8, 2015 08:07
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fspades posted:That's doubly interesting when you consider, you know, Portuguese history. I mean, holy poo poo even the American South had nothing on the Brazilian plantation complex. It's amazing people can look at that colonial legacy and go "racism in Portugal?? Nope, we didn't have anything to do with that.But look at those fuckers over there!" spoken like a typical Amerikkkan 
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Jan 8, 2015 08:15
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Mans posted:Some time ago the police locked out one of the biggest commercial centers of Lisbon to all blacks in the city because two blacks got into a fight inside. Holy poo poo Mans we are largely on the same political side and we agree more often than we disagree but this is a crock of poo poo and you know it. What happened wasn't "a fight between two black guys", you can find two black (or white) guys fighting every day in Lisbon, what happened was a gathering of around 800 teens from slums neighboring the Vasco da Gama mall which then steamed the place. The police forbade more teens from continuing to enter the mall while they were trying to make arrests and disperse the crowd. Jesus loving christ, any reason why you so thoroughly misrepresented what happened to the point where someone not familiar with the situation might think there are now "No Colored or Dogs Allowed" in one of Lisbon's malls? I was in Vasco da Gama just last month and believe it or not there were plenty of black people around doing their Christmas shopping. MeLKoR fucked around with this message at 08:41 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 08:37
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hrm yes police icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 08:46 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 08:40
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icantfindaname posted:hrm yes police Don't be disingenuous, this isn't an issue of race but of class. These kids didn't invade the mall and steal poo poo because they were black but because they are poor and live in lovely degraded slums and youth unemployment is around 50% to the general population and certainly much higher for teens living in these slums. Do you propose that police just let a group of 800 teens have free reign over a shopping mall and steal and break poo poo because most of them were black? And again, closing off a space while you make arrests isn't the same as "blacks are now forbidden from entering the mall". e: In order to save us all some time I am pro-immigration and think our country desperately needs much more immigrants to balance out our terrible birth rate. MeLKoR fucked around with this message at 08:49 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 08:46
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Well yeah that's exactly how it works in America too. But nobody is going around claiming police in America aren't racist, because the issues of race and class are not separable, and the magic soil of the European continent doesn't change that. I mean this is literally the exact same thing as Ferguson, etc, only possibly on a smaller scale
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Jan 8, 2015 08:48
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icantfindaname posted:Well yeah that's exactly how it works in America too. But nobody is going around claiming police in America aren't racist, because the issues of race and class are not separable, and the magic soil of the European continent doesn't change that. I mean this is literally the exact same thing as Ferguson, etc, only possibly on a smaller scale No this isn't "literally the exact same thing as Ferguson" because no one was shot or beaten up, this was a public order issue and arrests were made. Should cops also do nothing if a football riot broke out and the fans were mostly black? Do you think if these had been 800 all white kids the cops wouldn't have bothered? Shops were being raided and people were being mugged for gently caress's sake.
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Jan 8, 2015 08:52
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MeLKoR posted:I, Racist. Yeah, seems like.
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Jan 8, 2015 08:54
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DrProsek posted:Has there ever been a culture that has been wiped out because the nation that had that culture kept letting immigrants freely immigrate to their nation? You'd basically have to find a situation where a nation let so many people immigrate the immigrants actually became a majority but that has literally never happened and no European country is in danger of that. #BarbarianInavsion476 Don't let your country fall to foreign hordes! Learn from the folly of Rome!
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Jan 8, 2015 08:59
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drilldo squirt posted:Yeah, seems like. Dumbass 1st- the fact that that title isn't red should tip you off. you'd be surprised how good it is at filtering idiots such as yourself that rather than address what I actually said pick up on it 2nd- what gave me off as a racist? the fact I want more black immigrants?
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Jan 8, 2015 09:05
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MeLKoR posted:No this isn't "literally the exact same thing as Ferguson" because no one was shot or beaten up, this was a public order issue and arrests were made. Should cops also do nothing if a football riot broke out and the fans were mostly black? Do you think if these had been 800 all white kids the cops wouldn't have bothered? Shops were being raided and people were being mugged for gently caress's sake. You're right, Ferguson MO was simply police following public orders and making arrests in the name of public order. If it were a crowd of white people breaking into shops and looting do you think the cops wouldn't have bothered? Basically what you're saying is that racism doesn't exist in America. Is it just because some people died in Ferguson and not Lisbon that instantly America is Racist and Portugal is Not Racist?
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Jan 8, 2015 09:05
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e:^^I don't see where he is saying these things you attribute to him at all. I don't know what happened in Lisbon, but to me it seems as if he is arguing that the police were "merely" stopping a group of teenagers from further robbing/looting a shopping mall. They would have done this regardless of the race of the perpetrators, just that in this case it was a group of extremely disadvantaged black teenagers. He was contrasting this with Mans assertion that all black people were banned from Lisbon's inner city just because two black men got into a fight with each other. Jack2142 posted:#BarbarianInavsion476 I wanted to post that!  Angles, Saxons and Jutes in England as well. Torrannor fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Jan 8, 2015 |
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Jan 8, 2015 09:08
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MeLKoR posted:Dumbass I think cops keeping people outside of a area based on their skin color racist and you don't friend.
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Jan 8, 2015 09:11
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icantfindaname posted:You're right, Ferguson MO was simply police following public orders and making arrests in the name of public order. If it were a crowd of white people breaking into shops and looting do you think the cops wouldn't have bothered? I made no comment what so ever over the events in Ferguson and if you read the Freep thread you'd know where I stand regarding that. Also the historical origins of present day race relations in my country have nothing in common with the reality in the US and neither the situation in Ferguson nor it's aftermath have anything in common with what happened in Lisbon except that both involved police and some black kids.  I ask again, if a bunch of kids storms a mall and starts looting shops and mugging shoppers what should the police do? You are commenting on an event you know nothing about.
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Jan 8, 2015 09:11
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Not punish other people who look like them?
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Jan 8, 2015 09:12
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drilldo squirt posted:I think cops keeping people outside of a area based on their skin color racist and you don't friend. Quote me on that. Let me restate this once again, there are no "No Blacks Allowed" signs on that mall and plenty of black people continue to shop there. Closing off an area while you are trying to stop a riot is not the same as "forbidding blacks from entering the mall".
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Jan 8, 2015 09:14
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drilldo squirt posted:Not punish other people who look like them? I think he was arguing that the police stopped everybody from going into the mall while the looting/robbing was going on, and that it was just for the time they needed to "disperse the crowd and make arrests".
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Jan 8, 2015 09:16
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