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Volkerball
Oct 15, 2009

by FactsAreUseless

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Samurai Sanders
Nov 4, 2003

Pillbug
What's the word on whether American Sniper glorifies war or not? From the trailer I couldn't tell at all.

Volkerball
Oct 15, 2009

by FactsAreUseless
I don't know. A lot of people on twitter are pointing towards awful things Kyle said in his book or w/e, but I don't know if that's preemptive, or if there's reason to believe the movie makes him seem like a true patriot who had to make Tough Decisions and all that jazz.

JT Jag
Aug 30, 2009

#1 Jaguars Sunk Cost Fallacy-Haver

HootTheOwl posted:

Holy poo poo why are we still talking about the Ted Rall of Brazil?
This is a factually incorrect post.

Post 9-11 User
Apr 14, 2010
Found this while cleaning up old files, presented here because the understanding of what Antisemitism looks like seems to have been lost.

sub supau
Aug 28, 2007

Also how in the gently caress is this thread already nearly 100 pages just two weeks into the year?

majormonotone
Jan 25, 2013

TetsuoTW posted:

Also how in the gently caress is this thread already nearly 100 pages just two weeks into the year?

Because we completely loving hate ourselves

Also, Charlie Hebdo

Samurai Sanders
Nov 4, 2003

Pillbug
Like ten of them were just today arguing over whether Israel = Jews or whatever.

Skellybones
May 31, 2011




Fun Shoe

Post 9-11 User posted:

Found this while cleaning up old files, presented here because the understanding of what Antisemitism looks like seems to have been lost.



Isn't that s wallpaper from STALKER?

Axe-man
Apr 16, 2005

The product of hundreds of hours of scientific investigation and research.

The perfect meatball.
Clapping Larry

TetsuoTW posted:

Also how in the gently caress is this thread already nearly 100 pages just two weeks into the year?

Most of them is people arguing if they understand true satire, or not, or if it is horrible racism. And then someone declared that Latuff was the Ramirez of Brazil, which is like being Hitler cause you know the Boys of Brazil and all that. So basically none of the 100 pages were worth reading except for a few posts.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!

Post 9-11 User posted:

Found this while cleaning up old files, presented here because the understanding of what Antisemitism looks like seems to have been lost.



Is there some hidden meaning behind using Call of Pripyat art for this thumbnail?

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Lady Naga posted:

Is there some hidden meaning behind using Call of Pripyat art for this thumbnail?
Major Degtyriev is secretly a massive antisemite?

joeburz posted:

is this a real thing?
Yeah, though I kind of overstated it. Basically, There's a few laws on the books stating that American businesses aren't supposed to boycott the same things that America's enemies are or something along those lines. So if countries we don't like in the middle east are boycotting Israel we're not allowed to. I've never heard of it being enforced and not many people seem to know about it, it's just something that I found worrying when I first found out about it.

I'm on my phone at the moment but I'll attach a link here once I can get to a computer.

Edit: here we go:
http://www.rense.com/general24/illegalforUS.html

You have to report it if you're engaging in a boycott, and if you boycott something unsanctioned by the US government you can be fined or jailed for it. Jeez, that sounds...really lovely when I put it like that.

InequalityGodzilla fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Jan 16, 2015

Portals
Apr 18, 2012

TetsuoTW posted:

Also how in the gently caress is this thread already nearly 100 pages just two weeks into the year?

News and derails happened and we're a chatty bunch.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!

InequalityGodzilla posted:

Major Degtyriev is secretly a massive antisemite?

Maybe it's just because it's super popular on 4chan but if I found out that neo-nazis really loving loved S.T.A.L.K.E.R. I somehow wouldn't be surprised. I suppose that a military junta is one of the most prominent factions would probably appeal to them.

BBJoey
Oct 31, 2012

Lady Naga posted:

Maybe it's just because it's super popular on 4chan but if I found out that neo-nazis really loving loved S.T.A.L.K.E.R. I somehow wouldn't be surprised. I suppose that a military junta is one of the most prominent factions would probably appeal to them.

Well it's popular in the former Soviet bloc and if there's one thing the former Soviet bloc loves it's questionable fusions of nazi and soviet rhetoric.

sub supau
Aug 28, 2007

majormonotone posted:

Also, Charlie Hebdo
Yeah fair enough actually.

voltroon
Apr 29, 2009
Here are some cartoons from Arabic language cartoonists from Twitter. I'm relying on Google Translate for the bulk of this, so I apologise if my attributions are incorrect.

Ahmed Rahma, AlJazeera Arabic
1
I believe this is a Saudi Arabian cartoon? The politician sitting on top of the cage is holding a "Je Suis Charlie" sign. The people in the cage are a reporter, cameraman and a protester (not sure what his sign says). The arrow sign is pointing to Recently a blogger in Saudi Arabia was sentenced to 1000 lashes and 10 years in prison for creating a free speech forum on his website. Ironically, a number of leaders of countries that regularly practice journalistic repression attended the French memorial services.

??? al-Athbah, Al Arab Qatar
2
The sign says "Journalism is not a crime ... and I am not Charlie"

I can't decipher this dude's signature, but his twitter is @barq_news
3
Anti-Muslim, Anti-Semitism

Also from @barq_news
4

Emad Hajjaj
5
The sign says "#jesuischarlie", and the Palestinian woman is saying "#It's been going on for 67 years" (The joke is that "it's been going on" kind of sounds like "Charlie")

Moses Jawi, Al Jazeera Arabic
6
Leaders running over "Gaza martyrs" to lay flowers on the memorial for French terror victims.

7
No idea who the artist is but check out that Netanyahu caricature.

And to wrap it up, a classic Latuff has been making the rounds recently. You may recall this as one of his controversially anti-Semitic cartoons. I think it's one of the ones that got him labeled an anti-Semite by an anti-defamation organization (Simon Wiesenthal center maybe)?
8

Again, sincere apologies for any translation or other errors.

Apple Pie Hubbub
Feb 14, 2012

Take that, you greedy jerk!
1

2

3

Sega 32X
Jan 3, 2004


Latuff did "Dying for Bush's oil profits" right? When Did consensus decide he was good at his job?

ZenMasterBullshit
Nov 2, 2011

Restaurant de Nouvelles "À Table" Proudly Presents:
A Climactic Encounter Ending on 1 Negate and a Dream

Sega 32X posted:

Latuff did "Dying for Bush's oil profits" right? When Did consensus decide he was good at his job?

He does cartoons about how monogamy is bad and threesomes are cool and drew SSJ3 Goku loving a man in the rear end.

He's basically the most Goon Friendly cartoonist.

Axe-man
Apr 16, 2005

The product of hundreds of hours of scientific investigation and research.

The perfect meatball.
Clapping Larry

ZenMasterBullshit posted:

He does cartoons about how monogamy is bad and threesomes are cool and drew SSJ3 Goku loving a man in the rear end.

He's basically the most Goon Friendly cartoonist.

Wait Wait, he draws like he has seen a woman naked, this is not very goon like. I am on to you.

Duckbox
Sep 7, 2007

Samurai Sanders posted:

What's the word on whether American Sniper glorifies war or not? From the trailer I couldn't tell at all.

Haven't seen it. Don't really want to (but then I tend to avoid Iraq movies even when everyone says they're good), but the actual dude it's based on,Chris Kyle, was a total creep and compulsive liar and it sounds like the movie is a bit of a white wash. Here's how the New Yorker described him

The New Yorker posted:

Kyle seemed to consider himself a cross between a lawman and an executioner. His platoon had spray-painted the image of the Punisher—a Marvel Comics character who wages “a one-man war upon crime”—on their flak jackets and helmets. Kyle made a point of ignoring the military dress code, cutting the sleeves off shirts and wearing baseball caps instead of a helmet. (“Ninety per cent of being cool is looking cool,” he wrote.) Like many soldiers, Kyle was deeply religious and saw the Iraq War through that prism. He tattooed one of his arms with a red crusader’s cross, wanting “everyone to know I was a Christian.” When he learned that insurgents had placed a bounty on his head and had named him al-Shaitan Ramadi—the Devil of Ramadi—he felt “proud.” He “hated the drat savages” he was fighting. In his book, he recounts telling an Army colonel, “I don’t shoot people with Korans. I’d like to, but I don’t.”

Charming, I know. Now, the guy has 160 confirmed kills and possibly even more unconfirmed ones making him the deadliest sniper in US military history and by most accounts he had the crippling PTSD to match, so I don't want to be to hard on him, but then again this is a guy who claimed to have beaten up Jesse Ventura in a bar fight after Ventura badmouthed the SEALs and said they "deserved to lose a few." Ventura sued him for defamation and was awarded 1.8 million). According to Ventura, he didn't mind the story about being "punched out" so much as the fact that now he can't go in front of a group of fellow veterans (Ventura did naval demolitions in Vietnam) without getting booed and hissed for something he never even said.

And then there's this:

The New Yorker posted:

Supporting veterans was only one way that Kyle tried to establish a new identity off the battlefield; it was hard to let go of being a hero. In January, 2010, Kyle later told friends, he was once again put to the test: two men tried to carjack his truck. He was parked at a gas station, southwest of Dallas. “He told the robbers that he just needed to reach back into the truck to get the keys,” Michael J. Mooney wrote in a recent article about Kyle, in D Magazine. Mooney, who had worked on the piece with Kyle’s coöperation, wrote that Kyle “turned around and reached under his winter coat instead, into his waistband. With his right hand, he grabbed his Colt 1911”—a sidearm that is popular with military personnel. “He fired two shots under his left armpit, hitting the first man twice in the chest. Then he turned slightly and fired two more times, hitting the second man twice in the chest. Both men fell dead.”

Police officers arrived at the scene. When they ran Kyle’s license, Mooney wrote, something unusual occurred: “Instead of his name, address, and date of birth, what came up was a phone number at the Department of Defense. At the other end of the line was someone who explained that the police were in the presence of one of the most skilled fighters in U.S. military history.” According to Kyle, security cameras documented the episode.

Like Mooney, I also heard many of Kyle’s friends and associates tell this story. Details varied, but the ending was the same: Kyle drove away without being charged and, as Mooney put it in a related blog post, later received “e-mails from police officers all over the country, thanking him for ‘cleaning up the streets.’ ” Mooney never saw the security tape or found other corroborating evidence, such as police files or a coroner’s report for the dead carjackers. “Consider this story confirmed by the man himself,” he wrote in the blog post, in which he described Kyle as a “true American badass” and a “real-life action hero.”

There is cause to be skeptical. The counties of Erath, Somervell, and Johnson cover the stretch of highway where the incident supposedly happened. Tommy Bryant, the sheriff of Erath County, told me that he could “guar-an-drat-tee it didn’t happen here.” Greg Doyle, the sheriff of Somervell County, said that he had “never heard” the story, which he found “kinda shocking,” and added, “It did not occur here.” Bob Alford, the sheriff of Johnson County, told a local reporter, “If something like that happened here I would have heard of it, and I’m sure you all at the newspaper would have heard of it.” These denials do not automatically disprove the story, of course. And it’s true that certain operatives, from certain government offices and agencies, drive government-registered vehicles whose license plates prompt civilian authorities to contact a call center in the event of an accident or a traffic stop. But a SEAL with extensive experience in special-mission units told me that the notion of such a provision being in place for a former SEAL driving a private vehicle was “bullshit.”

If you think that one is the embodiment of thingthatreallyhappened.txt, you ain't heard nothing. From the same article:

quote:

The SEALs began telling stories, and Kyle offered a shocking one. In the days after Hurricane Katrina, he said, the law-and-order situation was dire. He and another sniper travelled to New Orleans, set up on top of the Superdome, and proceeded to shoot dozens of armed residents who were contributing to the chaos. Three people shared with me varied recollections of that evening: the first said that Kyle claimed to have shot thirty men on his own; according to the second, the story was that Kyle and the other sniper had shot thirty men between them; the third said that she couldn’t recall specific details.

Had Kyle gone to New Orleans with a gun? Rumors of snipers—both police officers and criminal gunmen—circulated in the weeks after the storm. Since then, they have been largely discredited. A spokesman for U.S. Special Operations Command, or SOCOM, told me, “To the best of anyone’s knowledge at SOCOM, there were no West Coast SEALs deployed to Katrina.” When I related this account to one of Kyle’s officers, he replied, sardonically, “I never heard that story.” The SEAL with extensive experience in special-mission units wondered how dozens of people could be shot by high-velocity rifles and just disappear; Kyle’s version of events, he said, “defies the imagination.” (In April, Webb published an article on SOFREP about the incident, but took it down after concluding that Kyle’s account was dubious.)

Perhaps this story, like the one about the gas station, contains a kernel of truth. Both narratives, however, portray Kyle as if he really were the Punisher, dispensing justice by his own rules. It was possible to see these stories as evidence of vainglory; it was also possible to see them as attempts by a struggling man to maintain an invincible persona. Kilbane, having read Kyle’s book, knew about his drinking habits and his battles with combat stress. Watching Kyle put down pint glass after pint glass of whiskey-on-the-rocks, he said, “It made me think there were still demons bouncing around in there.”

So yeah, the guy was deranged and obsessed with his own aggrandizement, and, unfortunately, people believed him. Since his death (he was shot by a marine with PTSD, apparently during a psychotic break), there's been a rush to lionize him as a True American Hero, but all I see is a strong, egocentric man who went off to war, killed a lot of people, and came home broken. I really hope the movie touches on that, at least a little.

Duckbox fucked around with this message at 09:10 on Jan 16, 2015

Dr. Killjoy
Oct 9, 2012

:thunk::mason::brainworms::tinfoil::thunkher:

That Obama at the top - gently caress you Lester.

rodbeard
Jul 21, 2005

Samurai Sanders posted:

What's the word on whether American Sniper glorifies war or not? From the trailer I couldn't tell at all.

The trailer for the movie is so divorced from reality that I literally didn't realize what they were adapting until somebody told me. It's an adaptation of a man's autobiography wherein he brags about going to new Orleans during Katrina to murdering black people. Thankfully this probably didn't happen but this is the kind of thing he thought would make himself look cooler. He openly admitted to signing up to kill foreign people. He was the living embodiment of the over the top foreign invader stereotype of American soldiers. The only unfortunate thing about his death is he did not live long enough to lose more lawsuits. Eastwood could have chosen anyone else or just made an original a story. If it was not his intention to glorify this man he has raised the bar for abject failure.

E: I guess I was beaten but it bears repeating

rodbeard fucked around with this message at 09:06 on Jan 16, 2015

Duckbox
Sep 7, 2007

^^^beat ya to it by this much.^^^

voltroon posted:

Emad Hajjaj
5
The sign says "#jesuischarlie", and the Palestinian woman is saying "#It's been going on for 67 years" (The joke is that "it's been going on" kind of sounds like "Charlie")

Super nitpicky, I know, but he forgot the "H" in UNHCR.

Saint Isaias Boner
Jan 17, 2007

hi how are you


Sega 32X posted:

Latuff did "Dying for Bush's oil profits" right? When Did consensus decide he was good at his job?

Latuff's job is to draw protest signs for anti-US and anti-Israel protesters and he has been very good at that for a very long time.

E: shut up about Latuff

E: have a new Latuff!

Saint Isaias Boner fucked around with this message at 09:19 on Jan 16, 2015

some plague rats
Jun 5, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Mister Beeg posted:

The cartoonist who drew this is a sexist douche (I used to have him on Facebook), but, I'll admit, this one made me laugh



I just couldn't parse this one at all until I realised the hand holding a knife is actually the head of the guy talking

Fojar38
Sep 2, 2011


Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia


also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

Gilganixon posted:

Latuff's job is to draw protest signs for anti-US and anti-Israel protesters and he has been very good at that for a very long time.

E: shut up about Latuff

E: have a new Latuff!



See, my problem with Latuff is less "Is he an anti-semite?" and more that I'm constantly getting mixed messages from him. On one hand he constantly draws the West loving things up with neocolonialism or what have you but then he draws stuff like this which I can't see any other way to interpret aside from "Why isn't West stopping bad thing?"

Swan Oat
Oct 9, 2012

I was selected for my skill.
is it a coincidence that page 88 was dominated by latuff chat? clearly, the man is an anti-semite.

Saint Isaias Boner
Jan 17, 2007

hi how are you


Fojar38 posted:

See, my problem with Latuff is less "Is he an anti-semite?" and more that I'm constantly getting mixed messages from him. On one hand he constantly draws the West loving things up with neocolonialism or what have you but then he draws stuff like this which I can't see any other way to interpret aside from "Why isn't West stopping bad thing?"

Latuff's message is "gently caress the US".

Mercedes Colomar
Nov 1, 2008

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Fojar38
Sep 2, 2011


Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia


also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

Gilganixon posted:

Latuff's message is "gently caress the US".

IMO that is not a very intelligent stance for someone to take on literally every issue.

Gyre
Feb 25, 2007


At first glance I thought I was unironically agreeing with a Lester (why should religion get special treatment in jokes?) but then I look again and realized that no, he's still a fuckward.

exmarx
Feb 18, 2012


The experience over the years
of nothing getting better
only worse.

Fojar38 posted:

IMO that is not a very intelligent stance for someone to take on literally every issue.

Pretty good success rate, in my experience

Saint Isaias Boner
Jan 17, 2007

hi how are you


Fojar38 posted:

IMO that is not a very intelligent stance for someone to take on literally every issue.

You're going to be right more often than not which is a better average than most cartoonists.

E: FB

Samurai Sanders
Nov 4, 2003

Pillbug

Gyre posted:

At first glance I thought I was unironically agreeing with a Lester (why should religion get special treatment in jokes?) but then I look again and realized that no, he's still a fuckward.
Yeah, it took me a while to see that Obama is apparently Muhammed, and then a bit more to notice that the pope is wearing a dunce cap.

Duckbox
Sep 7, 2007

He's got major shithead tendencies, but one thing I really respect about Latuff is how much he's grown as an artist. Compare his stuff from ten years ago with his work today and the progress he's made in everything from caricature to composition is remarkable. It's clear this is a man who has worked very hard to hone his craft which, in an industry dominated by complacent hacks, I can't help but appreciate. So many of the cartoonists in this thread either haven't changed at all since it started (Tinsley, Ramirez, etc.) or have somehow managed to get worse (Muir, Rall), that genuine growth is something of a revelation.

Actually, I've got a question for you all: who else, in your minds, has actually improved significantly in their craft (not talking message here, just actual skill at cartooning)? I know Bors has come a long way (not surprising given his age), and I feel like Allie's art is cleaner and more appealing than it used to be, but other than that, I'm drawing a blank.

GhostofJohnMuir
Aug 14, 2014

anime is not good
I always see Latuff pointing out how the United States ignores a bunch of people in need or this most recent one on India and Pakistan as less "why doesn't America do something about this," and more "America is lying about it's motivations." Notice the prominence of the nuclear weapons, it's an obvious call out of how the US talks up non-proliferation, especially when it comes to Iran, but doesn't give a poo poo for certain countries. I can understand why people don't agree with all of his work, but I'm not sure why a bunch of people become gibbering morons when they're exposed to it.

RacistGuidingLight
Apr 5, 2009

by FactsAreUseless
Pink Floyd sucks.

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sub supau
Aug 28, 2007

Latuff is good not because he's right, but because he's really good at his craft.

I kinda feel like Allie could just about be a good cartoonist if he were less spiteful and willfully dense, actually.

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