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TinTower
Apr 21, 2010

You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.

Lt. Danger posted:

Doesn't this make the Lib Dems the Scarecrow?

And Nigel Farage is Dorothy, who just wants to find his way home.

Also, awesome quote, BM. :)

e: 43 AD: the Roman provincial capital of Londinum is established. Residents of Islington were understood to have been very upset when they built a road up to the North, complaining about their property prices and gardens and what not. :itisaHS2joke:

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Zephro
Nov 23, 2000

I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...
"I come from online communities," nice. Did you tell them you mod D&D on the somethingawful dot com forums? Wold they have understood if you did?

I'm just teasing, big congrats!

Zephro fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Jan 18, 2015

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.

Lt. Danger posted:

Doesn't this make the Lib Dems the Scarecrow?

TinTower posted:

And Nigel Farage is Dorothy, who just wants to find his way home.

Quick an' dirty:

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
well i don't like that at all.

LemonDrizzle
Mar 28, 2012

neoliberal shithead
Natalie Bennett was on the Marr show talking about how she wants to abolish trident, have a referendum on EU membership, and establish a universal basic income: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b050j0fs/the-andrew-marr-show-18012015

Warning: program also contains several minutes of Clegging. The interview with Bennett starts at around 20:00, the Clegging starts at 32:20 or so. There's also a debate about the TV debates where everyone gangs up on Clegg at around 52:00.

LemonDrizzle fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Jan 18, 2015

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

LemonDrizzle posted:

Natalie Bennett was on the Marr show talking about how she wants to abolish trident, have a referendum on EU membership, and establish a universal basic income that is not actually universal (rich people need not apply; "rich" left undefined): http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b050j0fs/the-andrew-marr-show-18012015

Warning: program also contains several minutes of Clegging. The interview with Bennett starts at around 20:00, the Clegging starts at 32:20 or so.

I forgot which politics thread I was in, read Natalie as Naftali, and got very confused.

winegums
Dec 21, 2012


TinTower posted:

And Nigel Farage is Dorothy, who just wants to find his way home.


Our Nige is a girl who comes to a place she doesn't belong, upsets the status quo, MURDERS the indiginous population, then goes seeking benefits from the state (wizard)?

EDIT: At least he's going back where he came from.

winegums fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Jan 18, 2015

goddamnedtwisto
Dec 31, 2004

If you ask me about the mole people in the London Underground, I WILL be forced to kill you
Fun Shoe

Hallucinogenic Toreador posted:

I saw him interviewed on news 24 and although he apologised for the Birmingham comments he insisted he was right about London. Watch out for the Sharia police I guess.

There were those nutters around Whitechapel a couple of years ago - basically 6-8 men wandering around occasionally telling women they were slags for wearing short shirts and posting it on Youtube. That got a lot of traction in the US press as proof of how Shariah was here and how they should nuke Mecca with a bomb made out of bacon or whatever masturbatory fantasy it is they have.

Side note: While the men responsible were arrested and ASBO'd (and, to the best of my knowledge, there hasn't been a repeat) there was a conspiracy theory that tells you far more about the ultra-paranoid state of TH local politics than about the possible motiviations of the men. The theory going around the community (none of whom knew, or at least claimed not to know, the men involved) that they were agents provacateur from Brick Lane Mosque and/or the local Labour Party trying to stoke up trouble for East London Mosque (a number of the incidents happened just next to ELM) and the independent/Respect crew. As far as anyone knows these guys were just arseholes regardless of religious/political leanings, but of course in the atmosphere locally, nationally, and internationally it got blown up into so much more.

(I'm having brain fade here, there was a word before "atmosphere" in that last sentence that I really can't remember - the word "fetid" kept coming to mind but that's wrong, anyone know what I was thinking of?)

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
I managed to miss this completely but America made it into a Big loving Deal? laff.

e: am I sleepwalking into the arms of an Islamofascist Theocracy?? :ohdear:

EmptyVessel
Oct 30, 2012

goddamnedtwisto posted:

(I'm having brain fade here, there was a word before "atmosphere" in that last sentence that I really can't remember - the word "fetid" kept coming to mind but that's wrong, anyone know what I was thinking of?)

febrile?

kingturnip
Apr 18, 2008
Working in Tower Hamlets in the last year, I've seen more muslim-on-muslim shouting matches than muslim-on-nonbeliever.
'Why aren't you wearing a burqa?' 'Why are you talking to boys/girls?' 'Why do you shave your face?' (Probably others, too, I don't speak Arabic or Bengali).

CancerCakes
Jan 10, 2006

If you can persuade gamer personalities to stop obsessing over wow and do something productive then you can harness a lot of wasted potential. Maybe gamify citizen journalism with an app or something (only half joking).

Isn't China rumoured to have an army of teenage hackers?

Renaissance Robot
Oct 10, 2010

Bite my furry metal ass

CancerCakes posted:

If you can persuade gamer personalities to stop obsessing over wow and do something productive then you can harness a lot of wasted potential. Maybe gamify citizen journalism with an app or something (only half joking).

That is an excellent idea with zero possible downsides.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

winegums posted:

Our Nige is a girl who comes to a place she doesn't belong, upsets the status quo, MURDERS the indiginous population, then goes seeking benefits from the state (wizard)?

EDIT: At least he's going back where he came from.
Thought I'd wandered into Auspol for a second.

Ireland Sucks
May 16, 2004

goddamnedtwisto posted:

There were those nutters around Whitechapel a couple of years ago - basically 6-8 men wandering around occasionally telling women they were slags for wearing short shirts and posting it on Youtube. That got a lot of traction in the US press as proof of how Shariah was here and how they should nuke Mecca with a bomb made out of bacon or whatever masturbatory fantasy it is they have.

They also attacked some drinking dudes and got put in prison for it. It would have been fair game for Emerson to bring it up with a bit of context.

goddamnedtwisto
Dec 31, 2004

If you ask me about the mole people in the London Underground, I WILL be forced to kill you
Fun Shoe

That's the fella.


Ireland Sucks posted:

They also attacked some drinking dudes and got put in prison for it. It would have been fair game for Emerson to bring it up with a bit of context.

I think (a little worryingly) this is some different guys to the ones I was talking about, although as can be seen above my memory is going straight to senile-town in my dotage.

baka kaba
Jul 19, 2003

PLEASE ASK ME, THE SELF-PROFESSED NO #1 PAUL CATTERMOLE FAN IN THE SOMETHING AWFUL S-CLUB 7 MEGATHREAD, TO NAME A SINGLE SONG BY HIS EXCELLENT NU-METAL SIDE PROJECT, SKUA, AND IF I CAN'T PLEASE TELL ME TO
EAT SHIT

Ireland Sucks posted:

They also attacked some drinking dudes and got put in prison for it. It would have been fair game for Emerson to bring it up with a bit of context.

He wouldn't have brought it up because 'three idiots went around causing trouble and got done for it' doesn't quite evoke the image of shadowy hordes conquering entire European cities

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.
Labour and the Lib-dems have started on their pledges to attempt to sway voters. Both are on the subject of mental health, with Milliband focussing on child mental health, and Clegg on suicides.

Lab posted:

Labour says it will "end the scandal of neglect" of child mental health issues if it wins May's general election.
Leader Ed Miliband will use a visit to a mental health group to say greater emphasis is needed on prevention, early intervention and better support.
It forms part of his plans to improve mental health provision in England.
Mr Miliband will say the proposals would save NHS money and improve care. Ministers have said they are working to improve mental health care.
[...]
"This government's failure and false economies on mental health need to be replaced with smart investments that will save money and put our NHS on a sustainable footing so it can meet the challenges of the 21st Century as well as it did the last," he said.

This coming just after news that the overall spending on child mental health has been cut over the last four years.

Lib posted:

Deputy PM Nick Clegg says many suicides are preventable and wants hospitals to aim to end all such deaths.

The approach is based on a successful scheme in the US city of Detroit, where the suicide rate among patients in the scheme fell by 75% within four years.
In 2001, it embarked on a wide-ranging programme that included improved staff training, increased contact with patients and better education for the families of people who were deemed to be at risk.

Inspired by what happened in Detroit, Merseycare NHS Trust in Liverpool is now embarking on a similar strategy.

It is going to:
  • Create a Safe from Suicide Team, a 24/7 group of experts which rapidly and thoroughly assesses patients who are having suicidal thoughts
  • Improve the care of people who present with self-harm injuries at accident and emergency units, offering them therapies on the spot and following up with them when they go home
  • Improve data collection on patients to get a better understanding of how and where patients are most at risk of suicide and then targeting resources at them.

What Mr Clegg calls a "new ambition" for the NHS comes as mental health services are under increasing pressure, with demand soaring, budgets falling and patients regularly complaining about poor care.
While not denying the stresses on the system, the deputy prime minister insists that his goal of drastically reducing suicides is achievable.

Marjorie Wallace, chief executive of the mental health charity Sane, said there was plenty to consider first.

"Any reduction in suicides pledged by the government will never be achieved until it is accepted that psychiatric beds and units must be restored or replaced, and that we do not rely on overstretched crisis teams.
"As we have been told, you can't keep someone on suicide watch in the community."

Con posted:


---

Cameron has said that companies that benefitied from the fall in oil prices should raise their pay to the living wage.

"BBC posted:

"Obviously I want to see companies' success passed through in terms of wage increases.
"It has to be done in a way that's affordable, and in a way that companies can continue to grow, we need to see productivity increase."

Mr Cameron said companies "that can afford to pay the living wage should".

He said: "It's good and helps to reduce the welfare bill."

He added: "Falling oil prices is going to benefit a lot of businesses and a lot of countries and we want to see those benefits passed through in all the ways they can be."

Miliband responded:

quote:

"They have denied the cost of living crisis. They have been woefully out of touch with the daily struggles of families.

"They have rubbished the idea that people are worse off. Even this week, George Osborne was saying we were set under him to be 'the richest country in the world', and that his economic victory is complete.

"But we wake up this morning to hear that the prime minister thinks 'Britain needs a pay rise'.
"People across the country will have been choking on their cornflakes.

"Five years of denial, complacency and failure on living standards, and less than four months before an election, he claims to have woken up to the problem.
"You can't wipe out five years of failure on living standards with pre-election pleading.
"You can't magic away people being £1,600 a year worse off by trying to take credit for falling oil prices."

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Jan 19, 2015

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
"More focus on early intervention" in mental health is exactly what the tories did when they wanted to cut costs in the mental health service without saying that. I know because I was a long term 'service user' at the time, and my nurse explained to me why I, and a bunch of other long-term patients, wouldn't be getting much help any more.

They just shift staff over to early intervention away from long term support, so overall support for those who are worst off is reduced, but stats can be padded with increased efficiency in dealing with larger numbers of comparatively minor cases.

LemonDrizzle
Mar 28, 2012

neoliberal shithead

Oberleutnant posted:

They just shift staff over to early intervention away from long term support, so overall support for those who are worst off is reduced, but stats can be padded with increased efficiency in dealing with larger numbers of comparatively minor cases.
Isn't the general point of early intervention to catch minor cases and treat them before they have the chance to develop into something more serious?

hookerbot 5000
Dec 21, 2009

LemonDrizzle posted:

Isn't the general point of early intervention to catch minor cases and treat them before they have the chance to develop into something more serious?

I guess it would be nice if they could do both though.

I had a pretty good experience with the childrens mental health team, even with living in the back of beyond. I was worried about my 12 year old so we made an appointment with a doctor, got a referral to the mental health team and he started having a six week block of weekly meetings with a psychiatrist all in less than a month. It seems to have made a difference too, he's a lot less anxious and tightly coiled.

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009

LemonDrizzle posted:

Isn't the general point of early intervention to catch minor cases and treat them before they have the chance to develop into something more serious?

Doesn't do much for people who are already hosed.

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Oberleutnant posted:

Doesn't do much for people who are already hosed.

Well, if the Tories know anything about anything it's kids who are already hosed.

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
Without going into long-winded details, I knew a guy who will probably be in the mental health service for his entire life. He never said what was wrong, and I never asked, we just both used to meet the same woman from Mind at the same time (the aim being to socialise us). That Mind office had its contract bought out or cancelled or whatever by the tories back in late 2010, and the local office shut down. That was his long-term rehabilitative care gone; out the window. After that all he could get was the drugs he was prescribed from the community mental health team and maybe, if he was lucky, get a fortnightly 30min appointment with a nurse to ask him how he was feeling.
The Mind unit would go to his place every week and get him to do really simple but productive poo poo like go outdoors and interact with people. I can't overemphasise how important those little things are, but the NHS local mental health teams simply don't have the resources or time for it, even before they were put on early intervention focus.

All mental health problems aren't the kinds of problems you can solve by catching them early. Some people are born with, or later develop, some really crippling issues that they might never recover from, and the care that those people receive is unquestioningly compromised by shifting resources towards early intervention.

I was really loving lucky to have just started work as all the long term care was withdrawn, and was at the point I could stand on my own two feet (just barely). I lost touch with the guy I knew, but the last I heard is that the lady who was working with us both, despite having been transferred from Hampshire to Sussex (after the close of the local office) was cooking the books in order to be able to travel back to Hampshire and maintain contact with him.

That shouldn't be how this poo poo works.

LemonDrizzle
Mar 28, 2012

neoliberal shithead
In addition to becoming the richest major economy in the world, we're also going to be the "jobs factory of Europe" and will achieve "full employment" by reducing the benefit cap and restricting migrants' access to welfare. So sayeth Dave, so shall it be done, inshallah.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11353784/David-Cameron-says-Britain-is-the-jobs-factory-of-Europe.html

quote:

Britain will have the highest employment rate of any major world economy, David Cameron will promise, as he says Britain will be the ‘jobs factory of Europe’ by limiting immigrants’ access to welfare.
David Cameron will promise “full employment” for Britain, as he announces a series of manifesto commitments designed to reduce unemployment to the lowest among the G7 countries.
As well as committing to control immigration, the Prime Minister will promise to lower the benefit cap, as he insists that Britain is “coming out the other side.”
The Prime Minister will insist the Conservatives are the party of small businesses, as he reaches out to traditional Labour voters. Mr Cameron is determined to make the case for jobs and growth, in response to Labour claims that voters are being hit by the rising cost of living.
“We’re the party of the roofers and the retailers; the builders and the businesswomen,” he will say on a visit to the east of England. “Other parties preach about this sort of stuff, but we’re the ones who really deliver.”

Mr Cameron wants to ensure that Britain has the highest rate of employment among the G7 countries. At the moment, British employment is at 72 per cent, having risen from 69 per cent in 2010. The UK is currently fourth behind Canada, Japan and Germany, which has the highest rate at 74 per cent. Mr Cameron wants to overtake Germany.

The EY ITEM Club's winter forecast predicts that GDP will grow by 2.9% in 2015, up by 0.5% compared with its previous estimate in October.

CUT WELFARE + poo poo ON MIGRANTS = JOBS + MONEY

how is it that it took us so long to discover this magical formula?

Phoon
Apr 23, 2010

I don't understand

communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
Meanwhile:

The wealthiest 1% will soon own more than the rest of the world's population, according to a study by anti-poverty charity Oxfam.

quote:

The charity's research shows that the share of the world's wealth owned by the richest 1% increased from 44% in 2009 to 48% last year.

On current trends, Oxfam says it expects the wealthiest 1% to own more than 50% of the world's wealth by 2016.
:unsmigghh:

ukle
Nov 28, 2005
Serious question.

Can anyone remember any promises the Tories have ever kept once they are in power? Its got to be going back to pre Thatcher era, as I assume this outright lying on election promises and saying the world will be candy and roses and we will all poo poo money is down to her, as I remember it being similar back in her time.

This is not to say Labour don't do the same, its just the Tories take it up to a notch and it is laughable and completely unbelievable if you have any brain cells.

namesake
Jun 19, 2006

"When I was a girl, around 12 or 13, I had a fantasy that I'd grow up to marry Captain Scarlet, but he'd be busy fighting the Mysterons so I'd cuckold him with the sexiest people I could think of - Nigel Mansell, Pat Sharp and Mr. Blobby."

You can trust their promises on prosecuting the poorest and most vulnerable in UK society because they love ramming those through. It won't have any of the benefits that they claim it would but they'll do it.

Phoon
Apr 23, 2010

How will restricting migrant benefits create jobs how

Disinterested
Jun 29, 2011

You look like you're still raking it in. Still killing 'em?

ukle posted:

Serious question.

Can anyone remember any promises the Tories have ever kept once they are in power? Its got to be going back to pre Thatcher era, as I assume this outright lying on election promises and saying the world will be candy and roses and we will all poo poo money is down to her, as I remember it being similar back in her time.


quote:

Lord, make me an instrument of your peace,
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
Where there is injury, pardon;
Where there is doubt, faith;
Where there is despair, hope;
Where there is darkness, light;
Where there is sadness, joy.

Hard to say Mrs. Thatcher didn't pull through. :allears:

Mrs Thatcher was more or less exactly what people should have expected when they voted for her. She was obviously loony tunes.

hookerbot 5000
Dec 21, 2009

Phoon posted:

How will restricting migrant benefits create jobs how

Because they won't come here to steal our jobs (I'm assuming the welfare he's talking about is in work benefits like tax credits).

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

hookerbot 5000 posted:

Because they won't come here to steal our jobs (I'm assuming the welfare he's talking about is in work benefits like tax credits).

No, any welfare. They come here to steal jobs because they know there's a safety net if they don't get one. Take away the net and these lazy freeloading parasites will find somewhere else to work like a dray for below minimum wage. This will create vacancies for British people to work like a dray for below minimum wage, thus reducing unemployment.

mfcrocker
Jan 31, 2004



Hot Rope Guy

Phoon posted:

How will restricting migrant benefits create jobs how

*~free market magic~*

Phoon
Apr 23, 2010

It's astonishing that they're directly linking the two things because it makes no loving sense

namesake
Jun 19, 2006

"When I was a girl, around 12 or 13, I had a fantasy that I'd grow up to marry Captain Scarlet, but he'd be busy fighting the Mysterons so I'd cuckold him with the sexiest people I could think of - Nigel Mansell, Pat Sharp and Mr. Blobby."

I hate to keep banging on about it but it does seem Malthusian at its core: the surplus population will infinitely consume any welfare system until it is exhausted and cause them all to starve so its better to simply give them nothing and divert those resources into industry which will allow some of them to have gainful sustained employment.

Disinterested
Jun 29, 2011

You look like you're still raking it in. Still killing 'em?

namesake posted:

I hate to keep banging on about it but it does seem Malthusian at its core: the surplus population will infinitely consume any welfare system until it is exhausted and cause them all to starve so its better to simply give them nothing and divert those resources into industry which will allow some of them to have gainful sustained employment.

Insane Malthusian logic, despite being totally debunked, still underlies a lot of the way people think because it's quite intuitive. If you explain the propositions of industrial capitalism to a lot of its ordinary proponents they often think they're fanciful and magical:

'What do you mean that potential growth is practically infinite!? The most important thing is to just be richer than the other guy. Not enough to go round? Well, the most important thing is for us to make sure we've got ours'.

Literally almost everyone is still a closet mercantilist and Malthusian in denial.

hookerbot 5000
Dec 21, 2009

namesake posted:

I hate to keep banging on about it but it does seem Malthusian at its core: the surplus population will infinitely consume any welfare system until it is exhausted and cause them all to starve so its better to simply give them nothing and divert those resources into industry which will allow some of them to have gainful sustained employment.

But isn't surplus labour important to capitalism as it allows employers to keep wages low and stuff? And it must be in the best interest of the capitalist overlords that the surplus population, while obviously not enjoying being unemployed too much so they are keen to get ahead and strive, aren't actually all starving and dead when they are needed.

LemonDrizzle
Mar 28, 2012

neoliberal shithead

Phoon posted:

It's astonishing that they're directly linking the two things because it makes no loving sense

we have transcended meaning and now exist in buzzwordspace

you cannot hope to appreciate or comprehend our infinite glory

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mfcrocker
Jan 31, 2004



Hot Rope Guy

hookerbot 5000 posted:

But isn't surplus labour important to capitalism as it allows employers to keep wages low and stuff? And it must be in the best interest of the capitalist overlords that the surplus population, while obviously not enjoying being unemployed too much so they are keen to get ahead and strive, aren't actually all starving and dead when they are needed.

Everything goes out the window on the run-up to an election. Bullshit gets turned up to 11.

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