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I'm planning my first buy into a 30k Alpha Legion army and am a little overwhelmed by the number of available units there are. I'm definitely grabbing the Praetors kit and like 30 Tactical Marines to make a couple squads out of for starters; what else is a good basic thing to have? I was thinking maybe a volkite Tactical Support Squad in a Rhino, or maybe a Mortis Contemptor with 2 assault cannons. I'd really like some Lernaean Terminators but they don't have models yet so I guess I'll wait on them. Also, any suggestions on units worth stealing with the AL rite of war?
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Jan 28, 2015 00:37
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I was going to complain about the Ghost Ark then I realized that it has 2 Gauss Flayer Arrays, that have Independent Targeting, Salvo 5/10 ( which doesn't matter since it's a vehicle so it's always 10). Mainly because again, Warrior squads are 10 models minimum, and Immortals cannot take the Ghost Ark as a Dedicated, but then I realized it was a AV13 just gun boat for 105 points. They did gently caress up though and make it 10 models, so you can never actually join a Character to a Warrior squad and have him start in a Ghost Ark which is kind of lovely and dumb. Oh Wow, Triarch Stalkers are excellent now. Unit size - 1- 3 125 points Heat Ray Quantum Shielding Living Metal Move through Cover Targeting Array All friendly non-vehicle units with in 6 inches of at least 1 Triarch Stalker add 1 to their ballistic skill. Unless they are making Snap Shots. Options Particle Shredder Twin Linked Heavy Gauss Cannon Hollismason fucked around with this message at 01:13 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 00:53
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Hollismason posted:I was going to complain about the Ghost Ark then I realized that it has 2 Gauss Flayer Arrays, that have Independent Targeting, Salvo 5/10 ( which doesn't matter since it's a vehicle so it's always 10). Mainly because again, Warrior squads are 10 models minimum, and Immortals cannot take the Ghost Ark as a Dedicated, but then I realized it was a AV13 just gun boat for 105 points. The defenses on the model got better, the weapons got better, and it's cheaper than before. I'll take that I can't put a Cryptek in there now, especially since they're no longer the cheap special weapons platform they were before. Almost everything about the new codex is either a huge buff or a side-grade. Minor issues can totally be accepted because the thing looks like it owns metal bones. Considering the original was mid-to-top tier competitively, this thing is really looking like its on the level of Tau and Eldar now. All hail non-Imperial forces!
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Jan 28, 2015 01:05
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Yeah I was unenthused when I read that then was like Oh wait it's a AV 13 Objective Secured , 20 Gauss shot gun boat. Triarch Stalkers are an excellent choice now. Their Vehicle Squadron so 4 inch Coherency and give a 6 inch bubble of +1 Ballistic and AV13 all around, plus living metal. Two Triarch STalkers 3 H. Destroyers 400 points on the nose. 2 Heat Rays 3 Las Cannons that are Ballistic 5 Preferred Enemy and can Jump Shoot Jump from behind them. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 01:14
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Renfield posted:It's next to useless - the 'Prismatic Blur' 12" a turn movement means you'd only get a better move on average dice on turn 5 or more, flip belts already ignore terrain; extra attacks are ok, but hes got 6 already so not that big a bonus That's not true? 4d6" movement should average 14", though obviously it's possible to roll lower. Blitz also lets you move over impassible terrain and enemy units, whereas the Flip Belt does not. Mango Polo posted:So based on the Wraithflight wording... I guess they can charge into cover without any penalty, making the whipcoils (+3I) very sweet? I don't believe they can- it was worded the same way before but they were still slowed down, and similar wordings for other units and unit types have worked the same way. Hollismason posted:Oh man just realized how awesome Deathmarks are now, Yay an actual defense against Centurionstar. Maybe I'm not seeing it- how do Deathmarks help against Centstar? They get to "intercept" them when the Gate over near you, but they still have to deal with Invisibility and/or Shrouding on the unit and their "wound on a 2+" is a one-use thing now. PierreTheMime posted:The defenses on the model got better, the weapons got better, and it's cheaper than before. I'll take that I can't put a Cryptek in there now, especially since they're no longer the cheap special weapons platform they were before. Almost everything about the new codex is either a huge buff or a side-grade. Minor issues can totally be accepted because the thing looks like it owns metal bones. It's definitely better than the other 7E books by a long stretch, but I wouldn't call it anywhere near Tau, Eldar, Space Marines, Tyranids, or Imperial Guard (which are basically the top-tier codices right now.) The three units that the old Necron book was relying on- Command Barges, Annihilation Barges, and Night Scythes- all got SIGNIFICANTLY worse in several ways each, from price to upgrades to firepower. Doesn't make them useless, and it was probably good for game balance overall, but it means that their most powerful options have been cut out from under them. There's a number of other good options in the book that look to be more than useable, but no "zomg broken" options that are gonna push the army to the top of the tournament meta and most of the army's best ways of dealing with the top armies (especially Wave Serpents, Flyrants, and White Scars) are gone. Wraiths are good, but they're just 3+ saves at the end of the day. Loss of Haywire and AP1 on Warscythes mean Knights are a bigger problem than ever before. No good delivery vehicles means that even though Lychguard are pretty good, they likely won't matter. There don't look to be very many garbage units in the codex, which is nice to see, but as I've said before, GW's "rebalancing" issues are all gonna be for naught so long as the Big Five still exist in their current form.
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Jan 28, 2015 01:24
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AbusePuppy posted:
They only help against the drop pod variety which is the kind I'm constantly facing. Not the standard normal style, also it only works in the movement phase so no deep striking then shooting demons that were summoned. http://valientesguerreros.blogspot.com/ Some more leaked images Triarch stalker etc.. AbusePuppy posted:
The points actually come out to about the same if you still want to do the old Barge Lord, Lots of Fliers, Wraiths, Annihilation Barges. The increased durability of the Wraiths I feel nets you a few more points and more wounds. 6 Wraiths 5th edition 12 T4 Wounds 210 5 Wraiths (42ppm correct?) 7th edition 10 T5 Wounds 210 Bargelord (5th ) , base cost : 170 Bargelord (7th) , Base Cost : 135 Destroyer Lord 5th : 125 Destroyer Lord 7th : 110 Nightscythes 5th 100 Nightscythes 7th (130? or 140) Minimum Troop cost Warriors (5th) : 65 Minimum Troop cost Immortals (7th) : 85 Annihilation Barge 5th : 90 Annihilation Barge 7th : 120 I mean the same troops and costs are there, you'd have to shift some points but really the old Cronair / Wraithwing still sort of works with all the point shifts. As for dealing with Flyers, well Tomb Blades are pretty amazing. Twin Linked Gauss and the point value they have is insane. 20 Twin Linked Gauss at ST5 AP4 , that ignores cover, will statistically strip points from Wave Serpents, and will kill Flyers that are not swooping. Meanwhile their immune to the shooting from those two units, they've got a 3+, 5++, T5. The math get's better if you add in a Destroyer Lord, but not by much. Biker armies are going to be kind of tough there's not a lot of AP3 Flamer template weapons. High Toughness models with Shrouding are going to be difficult like T7+. The amount of MSU the army can put out with the Decurion Detachment is pretty good as well. It sounds weird but the fact that's a option is pretty good , in tournaments that aren't using kill points. Also, depends if people let you use the Decurion. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 01:26
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Hollismason posted:They only help against the drop pod variety which is the kind I'm constantly facing. Not the standard normal style, also it only works in the movement phase so no deep striking then shooting demons that were summoned. quote:The points actually come out to about the same if you still want to do the old Barge Lord, Lots of Fliers, Wraiths, Annihilation Barges. Wraiths are a bit better (no more being ID'd by S8/9 weapons), but their main problem was and still is being ground down by normal guns. T5 will help with that some, though, and they remain a fairly good unit that basically just got slightly better. Whip Coils took a nerf, though. quote:As for dealing with Flyers, well Tomb Blades are pretty amazing. Twin Linked Gauss and the point value they have is insane. I think there's definitely some solid stuff in the book and they actually boosted up most (though not quite all) of the weaker units so that they are actually useable, which is good to see. Sadly, C'tan and Monoliths still look like garbage, but most other stuff seems to be at least playable. Nine Lychguard and a Cryptek is a fairly badass unit that can put severe damage on most things it fights and isn't too expensive for that many bodies, either (290pts).
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Jan 28, 2015 02:53
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Barge Lords did lose some power but gained the +1 WS +1BS that they really needed. Also 7th Edition Bargelord Bargelord w/ Wraithscythe (15points is what I've heard), Nightmare Shroud (35) , Solar Thermasite (25)?, Phylactery (15). 2+ Armour Save Reroll failed saving throws of a 1 5+ It Will not Die 5+ Ressurection Protocol ST 8 Warscythe Total : 210 What was the cost of the older decked out Bargelord , I think mine sometimes pushed upward of 245 to 260. Here's the big question if the Barge Lord is treated as one model I wonder if Solar Thermasite increases the ST of the Tesla Gun on a Barge Lord. Flyrant's eventually have to go to Gliding mode. I'd have to see the statistics on a Flyrant versus a squad of Tomb Blades w/ Ignore Cover Gauss Blasters. Oh and someone did suggest the Aegis Defense line with Quad Guns manned by Tomb Blades with Nebuloscopes to kill Flyers. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 03:21
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DO IT TO IT posted:I'm planning my first buy into a 30k Alpha Legion army and am a little overwhelmed by the number of available units there are. I'm definitely grabbing the Praetors kit and like 30 Tactical Marines to make a couple squads out of for starters; what else is a good basic thing to have? I was thinking maybe a volkite Tactical Support Squad in a Rhino, or maybe a Mortis Contemptor with 2 assault cannons. I'd really like some Lernaean Terminators but they don't have models yet so I guess I'll wait on them. Also, any suggestions on units worth stealing with the AL rite of war? No kidding dude. There are lots of options. Contemptor with a pair of assault canons, autocanons, or lascanons arms is a solid choice. Make sure to get an apothacary or two for your squads. A support squad in a rhino with magnetized arms (flamers, plasma, or volkites) is also a decent choice. Good units to steal: Iron Havocs, Siege Terminators, Gal Vorbak, Pyroclasts, Dark Fury Assault Squads, Mor Deythan, Gorgons, Immortals. Just depends on your style of play.
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Jan 28, 2015 03:27
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BULBASAUR posted:No kidding dude. There are lots of options. Contemptor with a pair of assault canons, autocanons, or lascanons arms is a solid choice. Make sure to get an apothacary or two for your squads. A support squad in a rhino with magnetized arms (flamers, plasma, or volkites) is also a decent choice. Good call on the apothecaries, I hadn't thought of that. It's definitely nice that you can take 1-3. I tend to like a melee focus while leaving the shooting to tanks and dreads, so I'll probably try to build into something along those lines over time. I may have to steal a Dark Fury squad in that case because they seem pretty nice. At the same time though, I'm trying to come up with idea that take advantage of the Alpha Legion rules. One thing I'm unsure on that someone here might know: are Headhunter Kill Teams any good? I don't quite see the use of them. Without any context, I feel like Seekers seem better.
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Jan 28, 2015 04:12
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Has there been any info on Tomb Spyders? Cheaper, Better, Same, Worse?
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Jan 28, 2015 05:41
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TKIY posted:
Oh mother gently caress yes!
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Jan 28, 2015 06:01
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Tequila Ranger posted:Has there been any info on Tomb Spyders? Cheaper, Better, Same, Worse? Supposedly they are pretty much exactly the same, although I think they can't be taken in squads? Not positive about that. The formation for them lets you pick Fleet, Shred, or Reanimation Protocols for all the Canoptek guys within 12" of the Spyder once per turn.
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Jan 28, 2015 06:28
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It would be strange if they changed their squad size now wouldn't it? I've read nothing on the unit entry no leaks images etc.. Read the rules for Fabricator Array that's bout it. Someone asked that exact question in this thread http://thetyranidhive.proboards.com/thread/48760/new-necrons-codex?page=17
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Jan 28, 2015 06:37
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Do bargelords have access to the same wargear others have? I recall a not-stormshield option that might work since it says does not have a line excluding barges like the other invuln item. Maybe that shield is on a different list. There is also a not-stealth upgrade for vehicles, so jink and that is 3+ cover.
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Jan 28, 2015 06:42
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will blow your mind.
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Yes, Bargelords have access to all the Wargear items, however it specifically states on the item that gives them a 4++ that it does not extend to the Barge. However the Barge does get It Will not Die from Phylactery.
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Jan 28, 2015 07:15
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WhiteOutMouse posted:Do bargelords have access to the same wargear others have? I recall a not-stormshield option that might work since it says does not have a line excluding barges like the other invuln item. Maybe that shield is on a different list. I'm mostly waiting for confirmation on how many shots a C'tan fires. It makes the C'tan vary from awful to decent. Also, the exact text on Quantum Shielding, just to see with my own eyes a million Gaunts cry out in horror.
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Jan 28, 2015 07:32
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Need some help: I'm wrapping up my dark admech detachment, and I want some cool looking cyber famliars/servo skulls. Anybody here have any interesting ideas on how to pull that off? I've been trying to find something that works and have been stumped.
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Jan 28, 2015 08:05
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Less grumpy robit talk, more space clown talk please.
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Jan 28, 2015 08:14
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The Dispersion Shield (which gives a 3++) is only available to Lychguard. Likewise, Shadowlooms (which give Stealth) appear to be for Tomb Blades only.
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Jan 28, 2015 08:16
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I thought the lychguard shield was on a list that crypteks got as well. But it is possible that overlords dont get tp pick from it. At least that makes sense based on their fuling for the 4++. I wonder if the destroyer lords will get access to 4++ or the 2+.
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Jan 28, 2015 09:09
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WhiteOutMouse posted:I thought the lychguard shield was on a list that crypteks got as well. But it is possible that overlords dont get tp pick from it. At least that makes sense based on their fuling for the 4++. I wonder if the destroyer lords will get access to 4++ or the 2+. They do things like put something in a a big list of equipment and then put* *can only be chosen by Militarum Tempestus squads or whatever. So everything ends up being in the proper equipment list even if it's only ever an option for one unit. It's consistent but in a really dumb way that clutters it up when you're trying to look at what other units can take.
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Jan 28, 2015 10:16
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Harlequin Troupe £24 for 6, Solitaire £16. It doesn't look like the Death Jester or Shadow Weaver can be made from the standard Troupe box, so I'd guess there will be a second release the following week, maybe with the new vehicle?
Lungboy fucked around with this message at 10:31 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 10:28
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Death Jester already has a model at the moment, it might not get a new one. Same for the Shadow Weaver.
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Jan 28, 2015 10:34
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Shadowseer, oops  Ah yes, so they do. Finecast though, so hopefully they might also get an update to plastic. Then there's room for a Great Harlequin and a Mime, plus Jetbikes, although those last 3 are pure wishlist.I guess I'm just hoping that this release does really well and prompts GW to make a Genestealer Cult release.
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Jan 28, 2015 10:37
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Just compulsively pulled the trigger on a box of Wraiths with the accompanying paints I need to do a nice dark blue Necron force. FML.
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Jan 28, 2015 11:03
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I think if I wanted to run necrons, I'd paint them bronze or gold and blue. Try to emulate the look of Tutankhamun's death mask.
Star Man fucked around with this message at 11:10 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 11:08
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Someone in this thread had awesome bronze and turquoise Necrons a while back. Germ maybe?
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Jan 28, 2015 11:17
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Something I've thought about doing is getting a box of each faction's basic troops and try to come up with a neat color scheme. And just for something to do.
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Jan 28, 2015 11:23
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Star Man posted:I think if I wanted to run necrons, I'd paint them bronze or gold and blue. Try to emulate the look of Tutankhamun's death mask. Don't forget to use liberal amounts of epoxy resin, and just scrape the excess off  Star Man posted:Something I've thought about doing is getting a box of each faction's basic troops and try to come up with a neat color scheme. And just for something to do. That's an unbound army, call it the Galactic Peace Corps, forge that narrative 
NTRabbit fucked around with this message at 11:27 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 11:24
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NTRabbit posted:Don't forget to use liberal amounts of epoxy resin, and just scrape the excess off I don't get it 
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Jan 28, 2015 11:28
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Lungboy posted:Someone in this thread had awesome bronze and turquoise Necrons a while back. Germ maybe? Can't remember the poster, but yeah that was a cool color scheme. Stippled turquoise with bronze. e.: Stalkers are cheaper by 15 points (125), TL heavy gauss is cheaper by 5 (10), they come in squadrons and the formation is pretty good. Spyders are the same price but the upgrades are cheaper (TL particle beamer is just 15 now) though scarab farm is dead. Wraiths are wraiths. I'm still thinking about the Canoptek Harvest formation. The spyder needs to be within 12" to confer the perks to the scarabs and wraiths, which is pretty drat limiting. This is a wonderful time for canoptek fuckery 
Mango Polo fucked around with this message at 12:12 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 11:32
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Star Man posted:I don't get it http://io9.com/king-tuts-burial-mask-has-been-irreversibly-damaged-1681085211 NTRabbit fucked around with this message at 11:37 on Jan 28, 2015 |
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Jan 28, 2015 11:33
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Mango Polo posted:Holy poo poo. What's the point of 3 points for an upgrade that everyone will take automatically? Just include it in the cost and be done with it.
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Jan 28, 2015 12:18
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So the entry at the bottom... What's a "Starweaver"?
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Jan 28, 2015 12:24
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Probably open-topped, maybe assault.
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Jan 28, 2015 12:34
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I have a pile of Harlequins that badly need some paint: those are all brand new models. Topknot phobists beware. The Starweaver is likely just a new name for the Venom. Which is a Venom before that was a Dark Eldar transport at all or had a model. White Dwarf recommended making something like this many years ago:  Probably something like this: 
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Jan 28, 2015 12:39
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ijyt posted:Probably open-topped, maybe assault. Open-topped always counts as assault. I wonder if Hellions as a bodyguard for a Solitaire wouldn't be a complete waste of points. I desperately need an excuse to field some.
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Jan 28, 2015 12:47
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The solitaire must be alone, so they would not be a bodyguard in the sense as you might expect. You could buble wrap your guys around it to prevent an unwanted asault but the bonus cover would not do anything for it because of 3++. But if you want helions I'm sure there are people who have ideas ohn how to field them now adays without the expensive friend.
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Jan 28, 2015 13:13
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WhiteOutMouse posted:The solitaire must be alone, so they would not be a bodyguard in the sense as you might expect. You could buble wrap your guys around it to prevent an unwanted asault but the bonus cover would not do anything for it because of 3++. Rage.
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Jan 28, 2015 13:24
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