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I've been working part-time (usually around 30 hours a week) at my current job as a direct support professional since last May, and the only raise I've received is from 9.50/hour to 10.00/hour after I finished my probationary period. My boss has asked me to take care of the bookkeeping for our program's cash now, which I'm happy to do. Since it's a new responsibility and I've been working there for over half a year, I'd like to ask for a raise: not much, maybe just another 25 cents. What's the best way to ask for a raise without coming off as greedy? (Honestly I would never have thought to ask, except my mother beat me over the head with statistics about how women often tend not to ask, so at least I'm escaping that trend.)
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Feb 5, 2015 00:29
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GanjamonII posted:I missed it in the original post but I said something like 'I thought minimum was $x which I was OK with ' or something like that so already kind of indicating it would be my minimum. You're doing fine. You've told them what you currently make, but if they believe the market is lower they could think you're loving with them. Salary ranges are bullshit, as is posted elsewhere, the company hears the lowest number and you hear the highest. You need to decide what the job is worth to you and how willing you are to pass it up. "The position looks exciting and I like the people I would be working with. I would be happy to accept your offer if the salary/compensation was increased to $number." Don't goof off with this "minimum acceptable" crap. Remember that whatever number you give them they most likely will counter with less. As likely as companies are not to go through the process of looking for someone else they want to hire over 5k, there are people who are equally likely to accept $new_hire_offer - 5k. Know the minimum you'll accept, start higher and just talk back and fourth, be polite but clear about the numbers. If they are 10k below your current but have a better work environment (which is sounds like they do) try to squeeze more vacation. To me an extra week of vacation is like gold. Pinball posted:I've been working part-time (usually around 30 hours a week) at my current job as a direct support professional since last May, and the only raise I've received is from 9.50/hour to 10.00/hour after I finished my probationary period. My boss has asked me to take care of the bookkeeping for our program's cash now, which I'm happy to do. Since it's a new responsibility and I've been working there for over half a year, I'd like to ask for a raise: not much, maybe just another 25 cents. What's the best way to ask for a raise without coming off as greedy? (Honestly I would never have thought to ask, except my mother beat me over the head with statistics about how women often tend not to ask, so at least I'm escaping that trend.) I don't want to scare you, but asking for more money always sounds greedy. It is a stupid conception in our society that asking for more is "bad", which is convenient for companies that do not wish to pay more. You've been there 6 months and already had a raise. Do you get yearly reviews? Perhaps it'd be best to ask when reviews are and how best to beat your boss's expectations. When reviews come around bring up your earlier discussion then ask for more, if they don't just give it to you anyway. Boot and Rally fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Feb 5, 2015 |
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Feb 5, 2015 01:32
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Hello lovely people of the offer thread! After successfully helping me snag an extra $5k a year, I'm now in a new predicament I've only seen mentioned briefly in the thread. Here's the time line: April 2014: Hired at $50k with $5k bonus at end of the year December 2014: Receive $5k bonus, praise, and a $2.5k raise 2 weeks ago: Current boss is leaving for another department. This week: Find out boss' position needs to be filled. She's already suggested me to take over, I have experience with the role, and I had an awesome interview with the guy who would be my boss (currently my boss' boss' boss) Tonight I received the (sadly expected) lowball offer of $60k for the role, with no mention of a bonus. Checking on Glassdoor, the salary range for San Francisco is $86k- $148k, and even the national range is higher, with $62k on the low end. As I love working for the company, I'd rather not have to jump ship a few years down the line in order to make a reasonable living in this area. Does the following sound reasonable without throwing in the pay ranges? "Hi Hiring Manager, Thank you for the offer. I'm pleased that you'd like me to join the Manager Team, however I was surprised and disappointed to see the proposed salary of $60,000, well below the average salary for this position. Given the increase in responsibilities with this new role, the relevant experience I bring to the table, and reduction in annual bonus, I would like to see a higher salary offer before I accept the position."
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Feb 5, 2015 07:48
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Are you looking for a major increase? If you want more than probably 10%, you're going to need to counter with a number. If you know your old boss well enough to ask him what he made when he first started that would give you a lot of insight into how much the company pays.
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Feb 5, 2015 10:15
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Korovyev posted:"Hi Hiring Manager, You don't really have any leverage. They know what you make and you have no other offers. I don't know anything about the job but it sounds like a significant step up if you were happy with 50k before but have been offered a job that moves to 86k-148k. How much prior experience do you have with the role? Do you have any reason to believe you are worth the middle of that range? You've only been there a year, if you switched fields or something you may be in "dues paying" mode. If you're confident in that salary range you might be able to secure 80-90k, but it is going to feel like a big risk if you really like the company that much and want to move up. Without another offer your options are: 1) Take an extra 2.5k a year and a promotion. 2) Do not take an extra 2.5k and do not accept promotion. Since the company initiated the promotion they have no reason to believe you have other offers. You can try to bluff them to force more money, but that introduces the possibility of 3) Unemployment Consider shooting for a smaller bump, say to 70k (they know you, that is worth something), getting a year of experience and coming back at review time with another offer to force the issue. If you want big raises you need leverage and you need to be prepared to walk. Before you move on to try and squeeze more money, find out if there is a bonus. That is a really easy question: "My current position includes a bonus, does the new one?". Finally, I think you've mixed up where to apply the emotion in your HR dealings. Emotion is for talking about the job. When talking about money you are a robot that crunches numbers, beep boop beep. Once a number is out there, you can't move it without another number. They aren't going to come up in salary because you asked them to try again. This is the employee equivalent of HR asking for "your minimum acceptable" and isn't productive, provide them a number. E: This is a thread about negotiating but money isn't everything. If you have a job you love and can obtain your financial goals, there is no shame in going 9-5 to pay the bills and spending your free time crafting artisanal dildos. We talk about how to get more money in the event that you move jobs, not because we feel everyone needs to be churning through positions to make that skrilla. Boot and Rally fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Feb 5, 2015 |
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Feb 5, 2015 16:11
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Boot and Rally posted:Consider shooting for a smaller bump, say to 70k (they know you, that is worth something), getting a year of experience and coming back at review time with another offer to force the issue. If you want big raises you need leverage and you need to be prepared to walk. Before you move on to try and squeeze more money, find out if there is a bonus. That is a really easy question: "My current position includes a bonus, does the new one?". Excellent points and I'll start with the bonus question. I'd be thrilled with $70k, as the company has an excellent history of always giving raises, however I'm not sure the best way to include that in the above theoretical conversation" My inspiration is the following anecdote from http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2014/07/02/327758712/the-company-where-everyone-knows-everyone-elses-salary quote:Earlier this year, Chris Jadatz took over the duties of someone who'd left the company. The person who had left was making $95,000 a year. Jadatz was making $55,000. "It made me feel definitely underpaid, as if maybe I was being looked over," he says.
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Feb 5, 2015 17:04
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Korovyev posted:Excellent points and I'll start with the bonus question. I'd be thrilled with $70k, as the company has an excellent history of always giving raises, however I'm not sure the best way to include that in the above theoretical conversation" Well, if you know the salary of the dude who is leaving, you can do what the guy in the article did and split the difference. quote:"Hi Hiring Manager, You could go softer: quote:"Hi Hiring Manager, So, to walk back what I just said, you don't need to sound stern or stiff, but you shouldn't appeal to emotion. E: I just realized an upside for your position. If they tell you no, they run the risk of having to hire two new people. Hiring a new person can cost $3500+. It isn't a particularly strong position, but it is something to think about if you need a bit of confidence in asking for more money. Also remember, if you want 70, ask for 75. Boot and Rally fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Feb 5, 2015 |
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Feb 5, 2015 17:15
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Korovyev posted:I'd be thrilled with $70k Then ask for it! Frame it as a good deal: "Based on my preliminary research with Glassdoor.com, the bottom end of the salary range of this position is $86k. While I don't have experience in this management role, both I and <former manager> think I'd be a good fit. Given the additional responsibilities, but in consideration of this being my first managerial role, I'd be happy to accept at $70k, and we can revisit my performance in a year to gauge my compensation relative to the market." Boot and Rally's advise is spot on. Also never underestimate how much more stressful it is to manage other people.
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Feb 5, 2015 19:39
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Thank you all for the fantastic advice as always! Got clarification that the job included a 3-5% bonus based on salary, which is way less that the current flat $5k. I spoke with my boss who immediately told me that I should negotiate(since she saw the offer letter) and try to throw in things like parking spots or extra days off if they can't do $$. Went in with the following response: "Hi Hiring Manager and HR, My initial offer letter included my current bonus rate which I'd like to also have added to this offer. I'm very excited to join the Manager Team and happy you have considered me for the position. Given the increase in responsibilities with this new role, relevant experience managing a CRM system, and history with the Sales Team’s needs, I was hoping to see compensation of $75k to reflect the increase in value that I will be bringing to (the Company) and the Sales Team." I'm saving Dwight's response for the rebuttal that will possibly ensue, as HM is the head of sales and loves to haggle. 
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Feb 5, 2015 20:48
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Good response
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Feb 6, 2015 03:43
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X-Post from the Interview ThreadNo Butt Stuff posted:Follow-up. Additional Question: The role would've been advertised as an Analyst, how would you go about the negotiation of a) responding to whatever offer and asking for an additional couple thousand (or more if it's not a great offer) because it's sourcing and they'll never respect you if you don't, regardless of the offer and b) wanting to know if they'd hire it with a different title, specifically Business Performance Metrics Manager? They have multiple manager roles that I've seen that don't have direct reports, but I feel like keeping the title Analyst for more years isn't really what I want on my resume 10 years from now. If they offer it at Sr Level, do I just say, "what about this title" and if at Jr do I say, what about bumping it up to the Sr level (And it should be Senior based on what they want the person in this role to do) and use this title instead? I don't want to come off as entitled, but I'm capable of doing what they ask while many people aren't, and they went out of their way to fly through this process with me. To clarify: I expect the actual offer mid-next week.
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Feb 6, 2015 18:00
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No Butt Stuff posted:X-Post from the Interview Thread If I remember your other posts they are basically poaching you. This gives you a relatively strong position as you can always stay where you are, if you are happy with it. You need to decide what it would take to get you to leave your current job: how much money and how much title. a) It sounds like the industry expects you to ask for more, so just ask for more. You should know what your are worth and how low their offer is relative to that. Positions with large salary bands but also long lifetime people can be tricky. 80-140k but some people have been there 15 years means that at 2 year it can be big ask to go for 120k. You seem like a superstar, so you might be worth it. b) Titles can be trickier as they are visible. This means that a company risks alienating present employees hoping to move up by hiring into the positions above them. Obviously this can and does happen, but in some sense it is easier to get more money than title. I don't know anything about your industry, are titles important? Would it be worth it to ask for a tiny amount more money but really put your foot down on the title? Is the number of people with the title you want much smaller than the number of people with your title? If so, it might be worth it to use your leverage to get the title and worry about money when your review comes up in a year or two. From the experience in this thread it is clear that you can always (some would argue should always) ask for more as the chances of an offer blowing up are extremely small, if you've done your homework. As for the "how", the form letter style material a few posts up are pretty universal. I've not any experience in asking for more title, so I'll leave it to more experienced people on whether or not to lump it in and ask for money and title together or separate. My feeling is to put it all together because no one likes a string bettor. Boot and Rally fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Feb 6, 2015 |
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Feb 6, 2015 18:38
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Boot and Rally posted:b) Titles can be trickier as they are visible. This means that a company risks alienating present employees hoping to move up by hiring into the positions above them. Obviously this can and does happen, but in some sense it is easier to get more money than title. Titles are a funny thing. In some companies/industries they mean a whole heck of a lot, and in others they're essentially just made up. Tech and software companies I've worked/consulted for give away regal-sounding titles like candy because they're meaningless and free. Guinness fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Feb 6, 2015 |
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Feb 6, 2015 18:49
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Success! Asked for $75k, got $65k + $10k bonus yearly. Boot and Dwight- I owe you a drink next time you're in San Francisco for helping me achieve almost an almost 50% raise with one promotion.
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Feb 6, 2015 21:48
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What's everyone's thoughts on negotiating with a non-profit organization that's unionized? My previous job was at a non-profit so I'm familiar with their budgetary restrictions and pay practices, but I've never dealt with a unionized position before. The role is a full-time 1 year contract that is renewed at the end of the year, upon which I'd be considered a 'regular' permanent employee. Once I become a 'regular' employee, I get good benefits and vacation time (4 weeks paid), but for the first year I get 2 weeks paid vacation and spottier benefits coverage that slowly kicks in increments after certain probationary periods are met. I know that their budget restrictions will likely make salary negotiations impossible, but I'd like to get more vacation time in my first year if possible. How should I go about this? Since everything is spelt out clearly in the union agreement, including starting salaries based on job classifications, yearly wage increases and benefits and vacation entitlement, is it still possible to negotiate for extra? I'm at the point where they have sent me a formal offer and are already planning my on-boarding and start date, but I haven't signed any papers yet. tl;dr Am I being an idiot for not even trying to negotiate on salary for a unionized position?
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Feb 6, 2015 22:28
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Does the union agreement spell out compensation for contractors?
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Feb 6, 2015 22:36
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You should try to egotists, but I would guess that all that stuff is spelled out in the union contract.
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Feb 6, 2015 22:45
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Xandu posted:Does the union agreement spell out compensation for contractors? Kind of. It states that contractors are covered by all regular employee benefits and rights except where stated otherwise. They specifically say that contractors are not eligible for the 'regular' vacation benefits, and specify a standard 4% vacation pay based on total compensation. Starting salaries fall under regular employee rights, and are all labelled according to classification on a chart with yearly increases and external hiring bonuses based on prior years of experience.
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Feb 6, 2015 23:01
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Worth a try.
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Feb 6, 2015 23:05
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Korovyev posted:Success! Asked for $75k, got $65k + $10k bonus yearly. Boot and Dwight- I owe you a drink next time you're in San Francisco for helping me achieve almost an almost 50% raise with one promotion. Congratulations! 
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Feb 6, 2015 23:30
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Korovyev posted:Success! Asked for $75k, got $65k + $10k bonus yearly. Boot and Dwight- I owe you a drink next time you're in San Francisco for helping me achieve almost an almost 50% raise with one promotion. Congratulations! While the encouragement we can offer is valuable, the best content in this thread is from people coming back to report their experiences following the advice we give, which is real hard data that shows it works.
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Feb 7, 2015 17:20
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e/I'm dumb and gave away my negotiating power.
jasawnc fucked around with this message at 12:48 on Feb 9, 2015 |
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Feb 7, 2015 20:22
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jasawnc posted:I normally just lurk and have read some great advice from you all, so thanks in advance to any you can offer me. That seems pretty low for a Network Admin, but if that's something you are interested in you might still want to negotiate for experience. I know a lot of guys that make that doing tier 1 desktop.
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Feb 7, 2015 20:41
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e/I'm dumb
jasawnc fucked around with this message at 12:45 on Feb 9, 2015 |
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Feb 7, 2015 20:46
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If you said you were interested already, it's going to look really dumb to try to negotiate now. You already gave away your negotiating power. Playing unrelated offers off of each other won't work and will make you look even more dumb.
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Feb 7, 2015 21:05
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jasawnc posted:and create a few database related apps Unless these are super duper trivial "apps" that can be accomplished in a < 100 line bash/powershell script, this is starting to sound like the "Assistant Network Admin" title doesn't quite apply... When I think Assistant Network Admin I think the guy that keeps the wifi running and manages the backups, because bitch work always gets given to the assistant admin.
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Feb 8, 2015 00:19
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e/I'm dumb
jasawnc fucked around with this message at 12:45 on Feb 9, 2015 |
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Feb 8, 2015 03:21
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Do not ask to negotiate. There is definitely room to negotiate on benefits, salary is a little iffy as mentioned.
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Feb 8, 2015 07:36
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Looking for a little advice on asking for a raise at work. I work in a local government office. I'm coming up on my two year anniversary. I've been through two COLA increases as well as two pay-for-performance periods. In each of the PFPs (happen around Sept/Oct) I've received a 1.1% increase. PFP increases may range between 0.5%-1.5%, but I'm guessing that 1.5s, 1.4s, and even 1.3s rarely if ever happen. I also received two organizational awards (certificates only, no pay bonus) last fall for work I've done. I'm very happy with this job and my boss knows it. We get along well. He is aware that I may likely be leaving in roughly two more years thanks to my wife's work, so it's not like I'm out looking for other offers to slap on his desk and ask him to match. Anything I ask for would be strictly on my own merits. Here's why I want to ask for a raise now. We are in the process of hiring two new entry level employees. This is following on the heels of a reorganization. To give a basic sketch of how this shook out, we had been organized with two A employees (highest paid, most senior, etc.), one B, and four C employees (entry level). I am a C and came in pretty near the bottom of the C pay range. Last year, the two A employees left for other opportunities. We have since reclassified a couple positions such that now we have four As and three Cs. The former B and the other three Cs were all promoted to A (the other Cs deserved it, they all had 7-10 years with the organization). This means that we are currently hiring two new Cs, making me the most senior C. If that was confusing, here's a schematic: code:I guess my questions are: 1) Am I completely off base in thinking that I should be exploring this? 2) What is the best way to approach my boss about this? We have a regularly scheduled 1-on-1 meeting next Wednesday...should I let him know beforehand I want to talk about my compensation? Happy to answer any clarifying questions. Thanks for your input.
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Feb 11, 2015 05:14
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My experience with government work is that the only way to get anything beyond the default "performance" raise (usually under the max offered) is to get a new title, which depending on your jurisdictions rules, might require getting a new position posted and going through a open competitive process. Good luck on even getting that 1.5% though. When I worked for a state agency, our managers were forbidden from giving out 3's (the best) on performance reviews because that mandated a certain raise by law that they didn't have budget for. I'd certainly ask, but unless there are built in escalators in your job track, you can count on poo poo raises forever unless a boss at your job quits (and that never happens lol) and you happen to be in the right place to replace them. Needless to say, that was the motivation for me to gtfo. If you want true pay increases for performance, don't work in government Edit: that response was very pessimistic. Reading it again I'd definitely ask about filling the title/pay of the folks who left as their numbers might still be in the budget somewhere. Bosses in govt jobs usually understand concerns like the one you have. It doesn't usually cost them anything, so you should go in and push for it saying that you want to stay around because you like the job so much. I'd point out your concern for room to grow in the future. My experience is that these conversations are much easier in government because most people (including your manager) understand the frustration of the difficulties in getting substantial raises. There will be no hard feelings or animosity so you need to go in calm and relaxed knowing that oxsnard fucked around with this message at 07:15 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 07:10
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Cross posting from the interview thread: I'm applying for an engineering job through a company's career website and I have to generate an online profile with them. There's a box for minimum salary requested... They don't list the salary range in the job description on the company website but I did find the job posting on Monster (the company name was kept anonymous but the text was almost identical so it wasn't hard to sleuth that one out) and they listed a range of $X-$Y. I'm thinking about putting down the average of the $X and $Y numbers I saw on Monster. Also considering the upper range, idk. I hate having to give the first number since it hurts future negotiations especially since there's so much more than just salary that goes into compensation. What would you goons do?
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Feb 12, 2015 20:19
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If you found a salary range offered, put the highest number.
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Feb 12, 2015 20:49
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Either put zero or the highest number as anything else handicaps you before you start.
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Feb 12, 2015 21:34
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Negotiating protip: You're going to be haggled down from whatever number you throw out, whether it's the top of the range or the bottom. You might get lucky and they'll just take the number you say, but they'll never negotiate up.
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Feb 12, 2015 23:58
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I just didn't want to put down a number so high that they toss my application. My experiences are a good match for their description but I'm a few years short of their desired level (7 vs 10 desired). I think I'm going to put the upper limit though since its not clear whether they meant to include a bonus or not, hopefully I'll get a shot at an interview and negotiate from there. Thanks for the feedback all
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Feb 13, 2015 00:38
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Thanks to the folks who provided some advice earlier. I was able to come to an agreeable salary with a new organization. Its 3.75% lower than what I earn now (but they actually give out raises/COL.. In 6 years at current place I've gotten 3 one of which was 1%), but the work seems like it will be more interesting/fulfilling, the benefits are better, better work environment and I've been looking for a position like this locally for several months now. I'm pretty drat excited. I did feel odd taking a small pay cut, but truth be told I just want a change more than I want the extra money. Just waiting on them to complete the paperwork internally, but it looks like its going ahead (fingers crossed). One last question - I want to take a week off between old job and new job. Will have family visiting, and I haven't had a zero stress vacation in years (always answering emails, phone calls, stressing over work) so this feels like a valuable opportunity. I don't want to look like a slacker but I definitely want to unwind a little and make sure I'm coming in with a fresh mindset. Especially as the up coming 2 week knowledge transfer/completing outstanding tasks period is going to be stressful enough. How do I broach that with the new employer? Just ask them if X works for them as a starting date? Or explain my desire to take a week? I don't want to lie and say I'm giving my current employer an extra week as that seems like starting the whole relationship off on the wrong foot.
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Feb 13, 2015 14:18
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Ask them to start on X date and don't mention a reason unless they ask.
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Feb 13, 2015 14:30
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Just read through this whole thread this week. I have a phone screen/initial interview on monday with an extraordinarily large chemical company for a job in texas. I have a job in oil/gas and make a pretty nice salary now. I like my work but this seemed like a good opportunity. Given the job market in Texas right now I'm reasonable confidant I could get a 10k raise no problem. Problem is that in order to justify moving I'd need something in the 20k range which might be on the upper end of possibility for my speciality (environmental engineering). What number should I throw out when they invariably ask? Again I don't need the job so I'm mostly in shoot for the moon territory here
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Feb 13, 2015 21:54
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oxsnard posted:Just read through this whole thread this week. I have a phone screen/initial interview on monday with an extraordinarily large chemical company for a job in texas. I have a job in oil/gas and make a pretty nice salary now. I like my work but this seemed like a good opportunity. Given the job market in Texas right now I'm reasonable confidant I could get a 10k raise no problem. Problem is that in order to justify moving I'd need something in the 20k range which might be on the upper end of possibility for my speciality (environmental engineering). You should try to avoid the question if at all possible. If you do need to give a number then you should give one that is higher than what you want, so above 20k, since you'll be expected in most cases to come down from the starting number. You also should try to figure out what sort of salary to expect either from online sites (glassdoor, etc) or network contacts.
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Feb 13, 2015 22:46
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I saw this and thought of this thread: http://dilbert.com/strip/2015-02-12 I don't have anything to add, other than saying I like this thread and it helped me navigate a multiple job offer situation a few months ago.
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Feb 14, 2015 00:34
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