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Nintendo Kid posted:And also you didn't have to get your rear end across the Rockies if you were on the West Coast, which was a pretty big thing for people dealing with destroyed travel and poo poo. Avoiding a personal Donner party is a pretty big incentive.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:13
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So if the Devil appeared before you - the one with the pointy horns and tail - and offered you a million dollars in one hand while his other hand clutched a pitchfork, you think a lot of people would take it? I don't have any problem with authoritarianism but we're not talking Hitler here. We're talking a guy who, when you look at him, makes you realize he'd love nothing more than to burn millions of people and laugh and laugh at their writhing agony.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:28
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NikkolasKing posted:But why would any normal person choose to go to Flagg? The thing about Flagg is that, just like IT, people felt their evil when talking to them. No matter how much old Randy smiled and promised you the moon, anyone who ever talked to him comments on how he gives them a chill or something to that effect. No matter what he does he radiates malevolence and negativity. Power, protection, security and charisma. The same things that lead anyone to follow a fascist. Also, to the guy that liked It and wants a next reccomendation, but isn't sure about the Dark Tower, I'd go with Pet Semetary or possibly Cujo.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:35
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People take the path of least resistance. Yes, people would choose a leader that is Flagg over going cold, hungry, alone and possibly sick. They would then justify the crazy or cruel stuff as "things that happen to other people" and look away.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:38
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NikkolasKing posted:So if the Devil appeared before you - the one with the pointy horns and tail - and offered you a million dollars in one hand while his other hand clutched a pitchfork, you think a lot of people would take it? Mitt Romney won about 61 million votes. 
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Feb 10, 2015 22:44
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NikkolasKing posted:So if the Devil appeared before you - the one with the pointy horns and tail - and offered you a million dollars in one hand while his other hand clutched a pitchfork, you think a lot of people would take it? Provided that they're not required to personally do anything too horrible and all they've really got to do is just accept the fact that bad things happen to people? Yes, absolutely. No question at all about it. If you're decently comfortable in your situation with favorable prospects maybe it would be a bad deal, but there are millions and millions of people who would leap at the chance. They could pay off all their student loans. Feed and clothe their kids. They could afford to live somewhere that's not a pestilential shithole in a horrible neighborhood. Own a reliable car instead of an oil-burning heap that's got 30 years and 500k+ miles on it. Get an education. Get a chance to get off that wheel where you work dead end jobs just to keep afloat without the time and energy and money to really improve the situation. It's very easy to refuse that offer when you've already got those things. It's a much different story when you do not. Yes, there would absolutely be takers. There would be a loving line. I'd probably be in it.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:49
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Nintendo Kid posted:Mitt Romney won about 61 million votes. It's so weird that voting isn't mandatory there. Anyway, I've just started The Gunslinger on my Kindle. I got up to book 4 in 2005, but never finished the series. It's long past time I tried again!
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Feb 10, 2015 22:54
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Again you're missing the point. I have no problem with the idea people would work for even the most brutal of dictatorships if it meant improving their lives. The horrors in the Third World or even here in America can't and shouldn't be overlooked. If any of them jumped at the chance to work with [insert dictator here] I would never judge them or condemn them. Well I might but I'd give them a lot of leeway. But Flagg is not just some despot, he is the Devil's Imp. He is the embodiment of evil. It's not a matter of life and death, it's a matter of souls. I'm gonna guess there' a Heaven and Hell in this verse and quite frankly I'd shoot myself in the head before joining Flagg because a mortal death, mortal pain, is nothing compared to an eternity in Hell. So if my options are starve to death now or suffer for the rest of existence...my options are pretty clear. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Feb 10, 2015 |
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Feb 10, 2015 23:02
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NikkolasKing posted:Again you're missing the point. I have no problem with the idea people would work for even the most brutal of dictatorships if it meant improving their lives. The horrors in the Third World or even here in America can't and shouldn't be overlooked. If any of them jumped at the chance to work with [insert dictator here] I would never judge them or condemn them. Well I might but I'd give them a lot of leeway. You've got to remember that not everyone believes in heaven or hell. Crazy dreams with some creepy dude who offers safety for servitude or some creepy old lady in a god drat cornfield who offers trials and hard times. That and the whole crossing the Rockies thing.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:06
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NikkolasKing posted:Again you're missing the point. I have no problem with the idea people would work for even the most brutal of dictatorships if it meant improving their lives. The horrors in the Third World or even here in America can't and shouldn't be overlooked. If any of them jumped at the chance to work with [insert dictator here] I would never judge them or condemn them. Well I might but I'd give them a lot of leeway. First, nothing in the Stand implies or leads to the conclusion of an afterlife. Second, even if there was, there are plenty of people who are strong believers in heaven and hell that still do obviously lovely things. Finally, it is very easy to claim that only people who deserved it were crucified/tortured/etc. Flagg doesn't appear to most as the devil, but as an attractive, intensely charismatic individual who may be ruthless but keeps everything in order.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:17
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I recall not one instance where anybody so much as looked at Flagg without shivering or feeling sick. I'm making a stab at finishing The Stand and I'm continuing where i left off, with Dayna's death.I cannot recall one single encounter with Flagg where the person didn't feel unsettled by his eyes or his grins or...anything really. Flagg can do nothing without making people feel like they're gonna die. And that's the difference between Randal Flagg and any despot you care to name. Flagg, in every action he takes, radiates malevolence. Because he is malevolence incarnate. The only thing people are grateful to him for is not killing them horribly. Evil should not wear a big sign and that's what Flagg does. He oozes evil and there is no way I buy anyone siding with him unless they themselves acknowledge they don't care and are willingly malicious.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:39
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NikkolasKing posted:I recall not one instance where anybody so much as looked at Flagg without shivering or feeling sick. I'm making a stab at finishing The Stand and I'm continuing where i left off, with Dayna's death.I cannot recall one single encounter with Flagg where the person didn't feel unsettled by his eyes or his grins or...anything really. Flagg can do nothing without making people feel like they're gonna die. And that's the difference between Randal Flagg and any despot you care to name. Flagg, in every action he takes, radiates malevolence. Because he is malevolence incarnate. The only thing people are grateful to him for is not killing them horribly. The thing is the random millions of people who move to Vegas don't all actually hang out with or see him on a regular basis. They have no need to, any more than you need to meet the governor of the state you're living in right now, or the mayor of your city.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:48
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NikkolasKing posted:I recall not one instance where anybody so much as looked at Flagg without shivering or feeling sick. I'm making a stab at finishing The Stand and I'm continuing where i left off, with Dayna's death.I cannot recall one single encounter with Flagg where the person didn't feel unsettled by his eyes or his grins or...anything really. Flagg can do nothing without making people feel like they're gonna die. And that's the difference between Randal Flagg and any despot you care to name. Flagg, in every action he takes, radiates malevolence. Because he is malevolence incarnate. The only thing people are grateful to him for is not killing them horribly. Flagg's central court, the people who hang out with him, consists of people like Henreid and Trashcan Man who are too hosed-up to consider running away and are personally loyal to him for raising them up. That's part of the point of the final Vegas sequences. Henreid and Trashcan Man don't know any better than to do what they do. Everyone else, meanwhile, is willing to compromise with pure evil in order to not be hungry, or to have electric lights and heat again. Which is why they're condemned by God, because they sold their souls for a lightbulb.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:48
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NikkolasKing posted:I recall not one instance where anybody so much as looked at Flagg without shivering or feeling sick. I'm making a stab at finishing The Stand and I'm continuing where i left off, with Dayna's death.I cannot recall one single encounter with Flagg where the person didn't feel unsettled by his eyes or his grins or...anything really. Flagg can do nothing without making people feel like they're gonna die. And that's the difference between Randal Flagg and any despot you care to name. Flagg, in every action he takes, radiates malevolence. Because he is malevolence incarnate. The only thing people are grateful to him for is not killing them horribly. You're kinda forgetting that everybody who goes to Flagg's side is some combination of a) mentally ill b) vulnerable c) career criminal or d) opportunist. Trash Can Man dreams of Mother Abgail but she scares him and he scares her. The Kid is insane. Lloyd realizes what Flagg is but is in such a bad situation, he has no choice but to go with him. Julie's stupid and most likely an abuse victim. Harold's unable to let go of his past. Nadine was directly manipulated all her life. There's people in Vegas who realize how evil he is but think it's the winning team. Better to be with him than against him. Stray kids running around because its the first place to take care of them.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:01
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NikkolasKing posted:quite frankly I'd shoot myself in the head before joining Flagg because a mortal death, mortal pain, is nothing compared to an eternity in Hell. Suicide is a mortal sin!
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Feb 11, 2015 02:02
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Finished Revival last night and really enjoyed it! Was definitely not expecting that ending. Spent the whole book wondering when it would get Lovecraftian because of the quote at the beginning and was not disappointed. Some really spooky imagery, I thought. I thought it was the scariest King has been in a while. I didn't really find 11/22/63 or Doctor Sleep scary at all so it was nice to get that thrill again, even if it was only really in the last few chapters. I feel like I've been so desensitized to written horror, and I think a lot of that has to do with reading It when I was a preteen. Nothing has really lived up to the pure terror I felt reading that book. Maybe I just need to reread like the rest of the thread has been doing haha.
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Feb 11, 2015 03:15
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Troposphere posted:Finished Revival last night and really enjoyed it! Was definitely not expecting that ending. Spent the whole book wondering when it would get Lovecraftian because of the quote at the beginning and was not disappointed. Some really spooky imagery, I thought. I don't think 11/22/63 was supposed to be scary.
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Feb 11, 2015 03:17
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GreyPowerVan posted:I don't think 11/22/63 was supposed to be scary. The vision of the future was kind of spooky. And now that I think about it, very similar to Revival's ending.
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Feb 11, 2015 03:28
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Only King tangentially, but are the Dark Tower comics any good? I picked up Gunslinger Born and started reading it, and it's pretty good but really just a comic translation of Wizard and Glass. There are a ton of others, are any of them any good?
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Feb 11, 2015 03:43
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Medullah posted:Only King tangentially, but are the Dark Tower comics any good? I picked up Gunslinger Born and started reading it, and it's pretty good but really just a comic translation of Wizard and Glass. There are a ton of others, are any of them any good? They're alright. They flesh out a fair bit of Roland's backstory, like the battle at Jericho Hill, but at all times it's important to remember that they weren't written by King.
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Feb 11, 2015 03:49
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Is The Stand miniseries any good? Is the guy who plays Flagg at least good? I'm really determined to finish the book this time but I'd like to watch the TV adaptation too if it's worth it.
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Feb 11, 2015 05:36
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NikkolasKing posted:Is The Stand miniseries any good? Is the guy who plays Flagg at least good? It's Jamey Sheridan who you might remember as the police chief on Law and Order CI (that's the only thing I remember him from v0v.) He was pretty good/creepy I guess. Good ensemble cast for the time. It suffers the same problems as the book towards the end but it has a strong start, imo.
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Feb 11, 2015 05:46
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The production values are weird (a lot of exterior locations are sets) and the dialogue is cheesy as gently caress, but the cast makes it pretty great. Rob Lowe is Nick Andros, he steals the whole show. Gary Sinise is also awesome as Stu. There's some other pretty good casting, like Ed Harris, and the rear end in a top hat old doctor from Scrubs playing Frannie's dad.
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Feb 11, 2015 05:59
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Joyland is 99p for Kindle in the UK at the moment: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00MLDUBEE/ref=docs-os-doi_0
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Feb 11, 2015 14:05
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Hedrigall posted:The production values are weird (a lot of exterior locations are sets) and the dialogue is cheesy as gently caress, but the cast makes it pretty great. Yes the casting was pretty strong. Ray Watson as Glen Bateman and Matt Frewer as Trashcan Man was pretty good too. I don't remember Ed Harris in it (I had to Google that). I feel stupid for being excited for both The Stand and IT movies. Given the history of King movies I am bound to be let down. I have the most hope for the IT movies since Fukunaga is directing (his 6 minute continuous shot in True Detective was amazing), and I like that the plan is for it to be 2 movies. That said The Stand in 4 movies? Seems overkill. What does excite me is it seems these movies are being made my people who seem truly influence by these books. That said I wonder if both will get made. They are still listed as in development with only the directors attached.
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Feb 11, 2015 14:18
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NikkolasKing posted:Is The Stand miniseries any good? Is the guy who plays Flagg at least good? Do you like denim?
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Feb 11, 2015 15:52
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savinhill posted:Do you like denim? I really think that guy rocked his portrayal of Flagg, denim included.
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Feb 11, 2015 15:57
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Good to be back in this thread. Havent read King since Full Dark, No Stars but Ive read reviews that Revival was pretty good and it has been! Just under 100 pages left so ive got quite a bit to go but was anyone else disappointed that (towards the end spoilers) Jacobs' pawn to get Jamie to visit him was Astrid? I mean yea that was his first and all but he hadnt seen her in 50 years. I wouldve cared a lot more if it was Bree or a family member or hell even Hugh. I havent been spoiled on the ending yet so things probably will ratchet up VVVYea thats probably part of the underwhelmed feeling VVV the_american_dream fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 16:24
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the_american_dream posted:Good to be back in this thread. Havent read King since Full Dark, No Stars but Ive read reviews that Revival was pretty good and it has been! I thought it was incredibly odd and felt way too obvious "plot device"ish than anything else.
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Feb 11, 2015 19:37
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Well I finally finished it. It took me like two years but I finished The Stand. Favorite characters were Nick, Glenn and Flagg Although, in a lot of ways, Larry is the star of the book. I hated him at first but he really comes into his own. His development is one of the high points of all three books. I think the first Book was the best to be honest. Captain Trips. The ending was...abrupt. A lot of it feels rushed. All that build up to Nadine being Flagg's "bride" and he just randomly kills her in a fit of rage? I get King was really trying to hammer home the ineffectiveness of evil and how it's self-destructive and all that but it still feels like a huge waste. Poor Trashcan Man though. But I really liked Flagg and I'd like to see more of him. I might start The Eyes of the Dragon. Or maybe I should take a break from all the cosmic stuff. I'm surprised so many people seem to recommend and like Pet Sematary. Then again, I shouldn't judge it by the movie.
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Feb 11, 2015 21:42
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NikkolasKing posted:Well I finally finished it. It took me like two years but I finished The Stand. Yeah, there's a lot of subtle stuff about Louis Creed's doubts and urges that the movie excises - possibly rightly so - in the name of adaptation, and some scares that are chilling on the page, but fall flat in the movie, because existential angst and dread, as explained by the book's narrator, doesn't translate well sometimes! The book is a favorite of mine, because it gets under my skin, but I have no desire to see the movie again. This litreactor column here: http://litreactor.com/columns/book-vs-film-vs-unmade-film-pet-sematary is full of spoilers for both as it compares them, and there's a quote towards the end that kind of lends us at least the possibility of hope that the upcoming new movie adaptation is a fresh take on the book, not a mere remake of the movie.
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Feb 11, 2015 22:00
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Many thanks due to the goon in this thread (can't remember who, was it Nate Fisher?) who mentioned Ticktock by Koontz thereby indirectly inspired this new thread: Wikipedia book trivia: In a fit of rebellion, he eats 2 cheeseburgers http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3700491
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Feb 12, 2015 21:59
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just came here to post revival was really good and everyone who's given up hope on him should check it out. very good take on weird fiction.
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Feb 13, 2015 01:18
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WattsvilleBlues posted:Joyland is 99p for Kindle in the UK at the moment: Was this any good? I just finished Mr Mercedes, and for a book that I didn't really like for the first 25% or so of it, it got really good and I ended up really liking it. I'm looking for something else to read, and I'm torn between something else new (Joyland or Revival) or one of the classics that I never got around to reading (Pet Sematary, The Shining, IT).
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Feb 13, 2015 04:57
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I was a little surprised to read: http://www.ew.com/article/2015/02/12/james-franco-star-stephen-king-time-travel-series quote:Hulu has found a star for its first big drama series, signing James Franco to topline its time-travel thriller 11/22/63. I didn't picture Jake Epping to look like Franco, but I think he can pull it off. It will be good to see him returning to more serious roles.
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Feb 13, 2015 05:09
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I'm pretty sure the point of most of King's novels is that if a pitchfork-wielding cash-dispensing devil shows up at your door, you should not be afraid of him or the decisions you make, but you should be loving terrified of your neighbors. I was thinking about Stephen King books last July when one of my car's tires blew out on the way to a work thing. I managed to navigate it into a little non-gated condo development that looked to be about 20 units clustered around a square parking lot. I got the car into one of the non-reserved spots and had a lot of time before help arrived. After like 15 minutes, a police car came by. They'd been called by one of the residents of the condos. This is around 1 pm on a Thursday afternoon, mind you. The cops actually seemed kind of sheepish about the whole thing. After they left I was just looking into all the curtained windows surrounding the parking lot, wondering who had made the call. The kind of person who would do that, that's a character from a Stephen King novel.
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Feb 13, 2015 05:42
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OldSenileGuy posted:Was this any good? I just finished Mr Mercedes, and for a book that I didn't really like for the first 25% or so of it, it got really good and I ended up really liking it. I'm looking for something else to read, and I'm torn between something else new (Joyland or Revival) or one of the classics that I never got around to reading (Pet Sematary, The Shining, IT). I really liked Joyland, more so than revival, and I'd say that it is more in line with Mr Mercedes. That said, IT and the shining are among the best things I've ever read.
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Feb 13, 2015 08:55
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joepinetree posted:I really liked Joyland, more so than revival, and I'd say that it is more in line with Mr Mercedes. That said, IT and the shining are among the best things I've ever read. The audiobook of Joyland is really good as well. My only complaint is that maybe they could've done without the slight supernatural tint to it, but I get that's the driving force behind the whole plot. Still, it shows how good that King can be that I'm on the other side of the world and I can picture exactly everything he writes about.
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Feb 13, 2015 11:31
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joepinetree posted:I really liked Joyland, more so than revival, and I'd say that it is more in line with Mr Mercedes. That said, IT and the shining are among the best things I've ever read. Seconding It and The Shining.
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Feb 13, 2015 11:55
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NikkolasKing posted:So there's something I want to comment on and then ask you all about. Sometimes people interpret that instinctual fear as just a thrilling tingle and it is alluring.
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Feb 13, 2015 15:15
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