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Knowing bible facts (aka OT genocides and ancient legal codes) =/= knowing about Christianity.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:48
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Starving Autist posted:No true ok
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Feb 10, 2015 22:50
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DarkCrawler posted:I'm just not of the mind that religion needs to be challenged everywhere. It doesn't in itself hurt anything. It's simply not relevant in the realities of law, science, morality, anything in the physical world, and as long as it can be kept apart from those, what is the harm? Most religious people I know seem to be able to do exactly that. I missed this from earlier, I really hope you were just being cute here. If so, well played.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:52
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Miltank posted:Knowing bible facts (aka OT genocides and ancient legal codes) =/= knowing about Christianity. Its cool how all the bad stuff done by Christians, in the name of Christianity, doesn't count as Christianity, when you define the terms so that this is all a meaningless tautology.
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Feb 10, 2015 22:55
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Starving Autist posted:Its cool how all the bad stuff done by Christians, in the name of Christianity, doesn't count as Christianity, when you define the terms so that this is all a meaningless tautology. Yeah, we've gone over this. They argue its all down to 'correct interpretation' and Christians that do evil are just 'interpreting the Bible incorrectly' No True Christian, etc.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:06
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Miltank posted:Knowing bible facts (aka OT genocides and ancient legal codes) =/= knowing about Christianity. These are the questions from the quiz that pertain to Christianity. (At least the more limIted public version that is 15 questions long, rather than the 32 question one that the stats are based on.) quote:Which Bible figure is most closely associated with leading the exodus from Egypt? As you can see, they've very general and basic questions about mainstream Christian knowledge. What do you expect, to recognize as a legitimate basis of criticism? Let me guess, always something one step more esoteric, always one level further than what's been presented, right? I take it you have a survey that shows that atheists understand only Badger of Basra's monstrous strawman Christianity and not the real one. Link please?
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Feb 10, 2015 23:10
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CommieGIR posted:Yeah, we've gone over this. They argue its all down to 'correct interpretation' and Christians that do evil are just 'interpreting the Bible incorrectly' People take different things out a religion because they aren't robots and you only seem to focus on the bad ones.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:35
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It's because you want to disapprove of it and look for reasons to do so.
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Feb 10, 2015 23:36
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Wait wait wait how could I miss this from the Pew poll, atheists and agnostics know more about the Bible and Christianity than Christians do 
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Feb 11, 2015 00:06
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drilldo squirt posted:It's because you want to disapprove of it and look for reasons to do so. Disprove? How do you disprove faith? No, more neutralize the idea of a 'Kind and loving omnipotent being'. But as I've said in this thread and Kyries thread: In reality, I don't give two shits what religion you hold dear as long as it stays out of schools and government. I just like debating about religion on a joke forum. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 00:10
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vessbot posted:Wait wait wait how could I miss this from the Pew poll, atheists and agnostics know more about the Bible and Christianity than Christians do Satan wrote the bible to trick people out of being Christian 
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Feb 11, 2015 00:15
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CommieGIR posted:Disprove? How do you disprove faith? What aspects of God do you find impossible? E: the Christian God as you understand him. Miltank fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 00:15
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Miltank posted:What aspects of God do you find impossible? His existence. Also, I find it improbable, not impossible. Impossible implies I can disprove god, I can't.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:18
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Miltank posted:What aspects of God specifically do you find impossible? For starters, that he is in some fundamental way the same as a branch of African ape that came about through evolution by natural selection 13 billion years after he created the universe. (A male one, specifically) vessbot fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 00:19
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drilldo said "disapprove" btw, did you not catch that? I was a little confused by your post.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:20
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I found Mr. Wiggles' long source post about communion to be incredibly off putting in a way that is almost revelatory to me, even though it is all stuff I already knew. It seems so out of touch and formalized. Anything of value that could conceivably come from this process is surely a diminution of the value that could come from stripping it away and approaching the sense of wonder and shared humanity it alludes to more directly.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:30
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Miltank posted:and yet, religion ended slavery.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:40
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SedanChair posted:I found Mr. Wiggles' long source post about communion to be incredibly off putting in a way that is almost revelatory to me, even though it is all stuff I already knew. It seems so out of touch and formalized. Anything of value that could conceivably come from this process is surely a diminution of the value that could come from stripping it away and approaching the sense of wonder and shared humanity it alludes to more directly. Which is why for most Protestant groups it's purely a ceremonial act.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:41
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One religious motherfucker.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:42
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CommieGIR posted:One religious motherfucker.  This guy was. Although he used to keep the god chat out of parliament a lot of the time because people found it tiresome and moralising.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:44
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Starving Autist posted:Its cool how all the bad stuff done by Christians, in the name of Christianity, doesn't count as Christianity, when you define the terms so that this is all a meaningless tautology. I love hearing the whole "Stalin and Pol Pot are proof that atheism causes wars!" poo poo, but then when you talk about actual Christians doing bad things (be it the crusades, inquisition, or producing bullshit textbooks in Mississippi), it's all "no no, you can't say all Christians are bad because of the ones with the bad interpretation! Those Christians don't count!" Pot, Kettle, etc.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:45
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Disinterested posted:
I wonder why. Its like the one rear end in a top hat at work who wants to proselytize during business hours and won't leave you alone despite saying you are not interested. Or worse, you are already Christian and he wants to convert you to his specific sect. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 00:47
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At least kyrie's gimmick is funny.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:50
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Disinterested posted:At least kyrie's gimmick is funny.  Considering I think he honestly hoped to convert people to Catholicism, good for you?
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Feb 11, 2015 00:51
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I don't agree, but I don't see what's unfunny about the idea of a person trying to do that in DnD. We could replace you with a bot that scrapes r/atheism.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:53
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The claim that Christianity ended slavery is especially hilarious when you consider that explicit approval of slavery is one of the few things the old & new testaments agree upon completely.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:54
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It is fine for you to believe such things E: but I disagree.
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Feb 11, 2015 00:55
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Disinterested posted:I don't agree, but I don't see what's unfunny about the idea of a person trying to do that in DnD. We could replace you with a bot that scrapes r/atheism. Think of it like the assists stat. You may not have made a lot of baskets but how many shots did you set up?
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Feb 11, 2015 00:58
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Miltank posted:It is fine for you to believe such things neat, any biblical quotes you'd like to back that up with?
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Feb 11, 2015 01:07
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SedanChair posted:Think of it like the assists stat. You may not have made a lot of baskets but how many shots did you set up? Context dude. Anyone can put up big numbers against a lovely team, it's the good assists that matter on ESPN.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:11
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Starving Autist posted:The claim that Christianity ended slavery is especially hilarious when you consider that explicit approval of slavery is one of the few things the old & new testaments agree upon completely. Paul who was once called Saul, from Tarsus who chrsitians call the apostle posted:The law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine that conforms to the gospel concerning the glory of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:15
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Crowsbeak posted:Yeah real approval right there of the practice. I think it really is that someone knows alot about the Christianity they constructed. Incidentally this was one of the verses used to justify the abolitionism that you deny was in any way influenced by Christianity. Trading slaves is not equivalent to keeping them, a practice explicitly condoned elsewhere in the NT.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:18
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Starving Autist posted:Trading slaves is not equivalent to keeping them, a practice explicitly condoned elsewhere in the NT. But the abolitionist movement was borne out of a original movement to ban the trading of slaves.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:20
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And nobody's 'trading' the slaves made such by the instructions in Deuteronomy 20Deuteronomy 20:10-14, NIV posted:10 When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. 11 If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. 12 If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. 13 When the Lord your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. 14 As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the Lord your God gives you from your enemies. 15 This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:21
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Nice to see where Attila got his playbook from.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:24
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zeal posted:And nobody's 'trading' the slaves made such by the instructions in Deuteronomy 20 "Yeshua, aka Jesus, AKA the Christ, according to Matthew" posted:38 ¶ Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: Jesus being God kind of makes the whole idea of murdering your enemies a bad thing now. Now I know that didn't stop the Catholic church in the 1000s using that to justify the crusades.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:25
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OwlFancier posted:Nice to see where Attila got his playbook from. Well those are only God's Own Rules for slaughtering the heathen far afield. For those in the promise land the terms of engagement are slightly stricter: Deuteronomy 20:16-18 posted:16 However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. 17 Completely destroy[a] them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you. 18 Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the Lord your God. Whatever you do to them that walk or crawl in your conquered cities though, be mindful of the fruit trees. Deuteronomy 20:19-20 posted:19 When you lay siege to a city for a long time, fighting against it to capture it, do not destroy its trees by putting an ax to them, because you can eat their fruit. Do not cut them down. Are the trees people, that you should besiege them?[b] 20 However, you may cut down trees that you know are not fruit trees and use them to build siege works until the city at war with you falls. --- Crowsbeak posted:Jesus being God kind of makes the whole idea of murdering your enemies a bad thing now. Now I know that didn't stop the Catholic church in the 1000s using that to justify the crusades. Yeah, nice of the fleshly embodiment of the supposedly all-powerful creator being that transcends time and space to change his mind on the subject of wholesale rapine and massacre a few centuries later. A little too late for the Amorites though. e: Or for all those firstborn Egyptian peasants whose parents didn't get the high-sign to daub their doors on the appropriate night.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:31
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zeal posted:Well those are only God's Own Rules for slaughtering the heathen far afield. For those in the promise land the terms of engagement are slightly stricter: Yep and he did and later as the Church Fathers realized all were accepted to Heaven. If God changed his mind its a good thing.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:47
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Crowsbeak posted:Jesus being God kind of makes the whole idea of murdering your enemies a bad thing now. Now I know that didn't stop the Catholic church in the 1000s using that to justify the crusades. I don't think its stopped any Christian denomination ever, except for the Amish (and Mennonites?) I guess. Crowsbeak posted:Yep and he did and later as the Church Fathers realized all were accepted to Heaven. If God changed his mind its a good thing. So he is not all-powerful, all-knowing omniscient loving creator then? God being fallible would be a pretty big thing, I think, at least in the version of Christianity I was raised in. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Feb 11, 2015 |
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Feb 11, 2015 01:53
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GAINING WEIGHT... posted:I love hearing the whole "Stalin and Pol Pot are proof that atheism causes wars!" poo poo, but then when you talk about actual Christians doing bad things (be it the crusades, inquisition, or producing bullshit textbooks in Mississippi), it's all "no no, you can't say all Christians are bad because of the ones with the bad interpretation! Those Christians don't count!" They are probably pointing out how that kind of thing goes both ways, duder.
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Feb 11, 2015 01:58
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