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please gas this incredibly lovely thread
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Feb 23, 2015 03:28
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Or just post actual content. For example, Sage just reviewed another Ninja Anime, Ninja Cadets. It's poo poo. http://blip.tv/sagereviews/anime-abandon-ninja-cadets-7163406 Meanwhile, SF Debris covers Sub Rosa, also known as the Star Trek episode where Crusher gets boned by the ghost of her grandma's lover. http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/t266.php
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Feb 23, 2015 03:32
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Like a lot of gamers and developers, you're falling into the trap of separating game mechanics from narrative. Even the simplest video games have narrative tendencies. Gameplay mechanics are the dominant narrative element of video games. LIke how GTA games pretend to be crime epics when then their dominant mode is actually anarchic violence. Yeah, I don't know, I may have committed myself to an untenable position, but that still seems like something you're doing and not a narrative you're reading. Like, I could say the same thing about tic tac toe or that cup-and-ball thing or any other children's toy. Just because there are ways of reading the dynamic of a child's interaction with a toy, that doesn't make the toy narrative. There's a phenomenological relationship between me and a narrative in a novel, too, and sociological/economic relationship between me and the book as a commodity, but those are distinct from the narrative inside the book. Am I saying that narrative is something I associate with other forms? Yes. Am I saying that just because I think video games are boring and really unsatisfying in narrative terms? Maybe.
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Feb 23, 2015 03:53
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Jack Gladney posted:Yeah, I don't know, I may have committed myself to an untenable position, but that still seems like something you're doing and not a narrative you're reading. Like, I could say the same thing about tic tac toe or that cup-and-ball thing or any other children's toy. Just because there are ways of reading the dynamic of a child's interaction with a toy, that doesn't make the toy narrative. There's a phenomenological relationship between me and a narrative in a novel, too, and sociological/economic relationship between me and the book as a commodity, but those are distinct from the narrative inside the book. Am I saying that narrative is something I associate with other forms? Yes. Am I saying that just because I think video games are boring and really unsatisfying in narrative terms? Maybe. OK I'm just gonna say: I don't get into poetry. I think it's kinda boring, I have kind of an idea what's supposed to make it great, but it's never given me any kind of satisfaction that I couldn't get better from other art forms. But I accept that poetry can be considered art, and that I'm just not into it.
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Feb 23, 2015 04:14
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Jack Gladney posted:Yeah, I don't know, I may have committed myself to an untenable position, but that still seems like something you're doing and not a narrative you're reading. Like, I could say the same thing about tic tac toe or that cup-and-ball thing or any other children's toy. Just because there are ways of reading the dynamic of a child's interaction with a toy, that doesn't make the toy narrative. There's a phenomenological relationship between me and a narrative in a novel, too, and sociological/economic relationship between me and the book as a commodity, but those are distinct from the narrative inside the book. Am I saying that narrative is something I associate with other forms? Yes. Am I saying that just because I think video games are boring and really unsatisfying in narrative terms? Maybe. "I don't like it, there for it is not art!"
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Feb 23, 2015 05:20
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Cyron posted:"I don't like it, there for it is not art!" Yeah, Gladney, this is really all you're saying. Like, a two year old playing with a simple toy totally does have a narrative. I mean, sure, it's probably not going to teach that kid some earthshaking truth about identity or capitalism or something, but there's still a simple story going down in that interaction between a little kid and a simple system. Art's a tricky thing to define, but saying that just because a thing is juvenile it isn't art isn't a terribly meaningful or useful assertion - and saying that a medium as a whole is not art because it includes a lot of simple or juvenile works is even less so. If you want to think something is badly made or has a bad message that's fine, but this hemming and hawwing about what is or isn't art period just isn't really useful.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:36
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Video games are a combination of children's cartoon, and mass-produced children's toy. Is the Transformers cartoon art? Is an Optimus Primal toy art?
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Feb 23, 2015 05:37
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yes and yes
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Feb 23, 2015 05:38
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Yes to both, unironically.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:38
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boom boom boom posted:Is the Transformers cartoon art? Is an Optimus Primal toy art? Yes and yes? They were made on the cheap and with mass market viability as the primary concern sure, but that doesn't mean you can't take meaning from them. Like, you can think a thing is boring or dumb or badly made or malicious and it can still be art. Edit: Beaten like Optimus Prime's corpse.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:39
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boom boom boom posted:Video games are a combination of children's cartoon, and mass-produced children's toy. Is the Transformers cartoon art? Is an Optimus Primal toy art? and you are why parents buy their kids M rated games and get mad about the content. never have kids you will be poo poo at raising them. and yes to both, it cheep art, but still art.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:39
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Arguably, anything that can tell you about the perspective of the creator is art.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:41
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Vicas posted:yes and yes IronicDongz posted:Yes to both, unironically. Spiritus Nox posted:Yes and yes?. Cyron posted:and yes to both, it cheep art, but still art. Ok, so video games are art. I don't see what the argument was.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:43
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Pretty much. Art created within a capitalist systems with capitalist motives (that is, most of it) is still art
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Feb 23, 2015 05:44
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Vicas posted:Pretty much. Art created within a capitalist systems with capitalist motives (that is, most of it) is still art Of course, no one is saying that art created by a capitalist society is as good as art created by a feudal society. I don't think anyone would be foolish enough to try to argue that.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:50
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Spiritus Nox posted:Yeah, Gladney, this is really all you're saying. Like, a two year old playing with a simple toy totally does have a narrative. I mean, sure, it's probably not going to teach that kid some earthshaking truth about identity or capitalism or something, but there's still a simple story going down in that interaction between a little kid and a simple system. Art's a tricky thing to define, but saying that just because a thing is juvenile it isn't art isn't a terribly meaningful or useful assertion - and saying that a medium as a whole is not art because it includes a lot of simple or juvenile works is even less so. If you want to think something is badly made or has a bad message that's fine, but this hemming and hawwing about what is or isn't art period just isn't really useful. Art is purposiveness without purpose, like I said earlier. Narrative art, though, is not the same thing as making a narrative about a child playing with a toy. Like, you can read my interaction with an episode of television or a novel or whatever and make a narrative about my interaction with the text, but the text is itself also a narrative. The narrative is a text to read, and also an object to narrativize in whatever terms we like: anthropological, economic, historical, biographical whatever. A busy box or an Optimus Prime doll is a thing in the world that a child manipulates, and the act of manipulation can be read in a number of ways: biographical, developmental, cultural, economic, whatever. But Optimus Prime is an object that the child engages. I don't see how Tetris is any different from Optimus Prime in that dynamic: any narrative that follows from Tetris is the narrative of my manipulation of Tetris. If the narrative is always about my engagement with the game, that seems very different from the kind of narrative we typically assume when we talk about narrative. Like, stories are also things out there in the world but they are also stories about the world, but I don't get how a video game is a story and not just a thing out there in the world.
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Feb 23, 2015 05:55
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I'd just like to say, as a game dev, the reason we as an industry care about games being art is because for most of my life time (born in the 80s here), there has been the constant threat of our products being banned or legally censored for content. If they're art, they're considered free speech and have the same protections as any lovely movie or book gets. If they're products, they don't get poo poo. Legally, thanks to a SCOTUS decision, they are considered art. Arcsquad12 posted:Meanwhile, SF Debris covers Sub Rosa, also known as the Star Trek episode where Crusher gets boned by the ghost of her grandma's lover. Come on people, this is low hanging fruit! This was the episode about GHOST SEX. ...actually, I still haven't watched much of SF Debris, so I guess it says something about how much I hate this episode to come and watch him tackle this. I... really need to watch the rest of his stuff. Any recommendations on where to start?
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Feb 23, 2015 06:07
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Rebochan posted:...actually, I still haven't watched much of SF Debris, so I guess it says something about how much I hate this episode to come and watch him tackle this. I... really need to watch the rest of his stuff. Any recommendations on where to start? Maybe his Star Trek film reviews? You can watch them straight through because he reviewed them in order. I occasionally put them on for noise because his commentary is just enjoyable to listen to.
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Feb 23, 2015 06:13
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Rebochan posted:Come on people, this is low hanging fruit! This was the episode about GHOST SEX. As far as his TV reviews go just pick episodes that you recognize and stood out to you when you originally watched them, both good and bad. Unlike a lot of Internet Critics he does equally well at explaining why good media works as he does at tearing down bad media so don't be afraid to watch his reviews of good episodes/movies/etc. For Star Trek specifically he also has a few playlists centered around plotlines, alien races, or specific characters you can give a shot. Mr.Radar fucked around with this message at 06:51 on Feb 23, 2015 |
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Feb 23, 2015 06:46
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ZorajitZorajit posted:Maybe his Star Trek film reviews? You can watch them straight through because he reviewed them in order. I occasionally put them on for noise because his commentary is just enjoyable to listen to. Speaking of Star Trek, people always reference the Plinkett Star Wars reviews but I like his Next Generation ones a lot. He goes into why, in general, the movies are a departure from the typical characteristics of the crew and the philosophical side of the show in favor of goofy comedy and ACTION moments. I only watched some of the original series and more of TNG but I get a kick out of them anyway. Here's the first parts of the series:ST Generations, First Contact, Insurrection, Nemesis
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Feb 23, 2015 06:56
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Whoolighams posted:Speaking of Star Trek, people always reference the Plinkett Star Wars reviews but I like his Next Generation ones a lot. He goes into why, in general, the movies are a departure from the typical characteristics of the crew and the philosophical side of the show in favor of goofy comedy and ACTION moments. I only watched some of the original series and more of TNG but I get a kick out of them anyway. people forget that while some of the TNG movies where enjoyable, it was a prototype to what '09 and Into Darkness turn Star Trek into.
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Feb 23, 2015 07:09
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Cyron posted:people forget that while some of the TNG movies where enjoyable, it was a prototype to what '09 and Into Darkness turn Star Trek into. You're suggesting more than one?
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Feb 23, 2015 07:17
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People completely forget the Plinkett TNG reviews, which is funny because there's a number of callbacks to them in the Star Wars reviews. The TNG reviews are also pretty significant in that they came first, so you can actually watch the Plinkett character evolve, and it makes the gimmick make more sense. Plinkett started out as a self-deprecating satire of fanboy criticisms, and the serial killer angle is part of that; but gradually he evolves into simply being the voice of Mike Stoklasa, with the serial killer schtick hanging on as an artifact from when you weren't supposed to take Plinkett's opinions completely seriously. And while I find the schtick funny, I'll definitely concede criticisms that it really doesn't make sense for reviews where Plinkett is just Mike's mouthpiece.
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Feb 23, 2015 07:20
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Cyron posted:people forget that while some of the TNG movies where enjoyable, it was a prototype to what '09 and Into Darkness turn Star Trek into. '09 Is very much a reaction to the 'darker, edgier' movies of Next Gen, right down to the villain basically being Shinzon and having a similar ship, and being characterised as insane because of how lovely 'the future' turns out to be. Star Trek is literally under attack from canon, from what it will become, and it escapes by being a good version of what those films were trying to be, flaunting canon in favour of effective storytelling and original-series-inspired themes of adventure mixed with pretty incisive criticism of the characteristics of Kirk, one of the most well-recognised characters in television. Into Darkness is in many ways about 'the past', dealing directly with all the baggage that made it bad the last time. Remember Wrath of Khan and how popular that was? Remember how Nemesis was just trying to ape that, and recapture that 'magic'? In trying to 'milk Khan' for big evil scary ships, starfleet 'creates a monster'. It's ridiculous how on-the-nose the film's story is about being an ersatz for the executive decisions of the series as a whole. I'd have really liked a version of STID where Kirk stays dead and the whole canon is shifted permanently and they have, I dunno, Chekov or Uhura become the new captain, but that would never ever happen. Maybe when they let me reboot it in 20 years.
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Feb 23, 2015 07:28
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Mr.Radar posted:As far as his TV reviews go just pick episodes that you recognize and stood out to you when you originally watched them, both good and bad. Unlike a lot of Internet Critics he does equally well at explaining why good media works as he does at tearing down bad media so don't be afraid to watch his reviews of good episodes/movies/etc. For Star Trek specifically he also has a few playlists centered around plotlines, alien races, or specific characters you can give a shot. I enjoyed his analysis of The Hogfather film as well since he's a big Terry Pratchett fan and really knew what he was talking about.
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Feb 23, 2015 07:53
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Star Trek 09 makes a lot more sense once you realize that it is basically an audition tape for the directorial chair of Star Wars. The entire movie just has a lot more in common with that franchise in terms of aesthetics, plot and characters than it has with the one it is ostensibly rebooting. Other than that, it isn't a terrible movie, really just another unremarkable remake that failed to do what it was supposed to, i.e. cementing its franchise in the current popculture. e X fucked around with this message at 08:32 on Feb 23, 2015 |
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Feb 23, 2015 08:02
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Rebochan posted:Come on people, this is low hanging fruit! This was the episode about GHOST SEX. See if he's reviewed any other bad episodes you hate and watch those reviews. And bad movies. And bad other stuff. He has quite a body of work built up over the years. If you ever suffered watching an episode like A Night in Sickbay or Threshold or any other entries in the worst of Trek take those for a spin. e X posted:Star Trek 09 makes a lot more sense once you realize that it is basically an audition tape for the directorial chair of Star Wars. The entire movie just has a lot more in common with that franchise in terms of aesthetics, plot and characters than it has with the one it is ostensibly rebooting. Why does this make so much sense?
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Feb 23, 2015 09:14
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DStecks posted:
For once an advantage to being in Australia! Usually the stuff's blocked here and not in the US. It's.... it's raining dykes. Every single time I think that Chris-Chan has reached the limit of his insanity, there's something even greater and more terrible than ever before. Thank you Dstecks for reviewing this. I appreciate your insane level of commitment. Although the end of the review is making me terrified that you'll eventually be a professional Chris-chan impersonator. poparena posted:Threw up a quick review of Redwall by Brian Jacques, the medieval-light-fantasy-but-with-rodents book where mice are white people and rats are the Huns. Wow, 1986? I had no idea it was that old! I thought it came out in the mid-to-late 90s for some reason. I always thought it was pronounced "azmo-day-us". Redwall is...I'm ashamed to admit how much I liked it. There's something comforting about the formula. However, it's extremely, punishingly formulaic and kind of racist. Redwall as a series also frequently suffers from what I'll call "ensemble television show syndrome" - where the main character is always the most boring one, and you wish one of the supporting characters were the protagonist instead. I didn't reread Redwall that much myself because Matthias is so dull. Oh and holy poo poo I hated anything involving those stupid babies/"dibbuns". Throw them into the sun, I say! Much like how Matthias can do whatever the plot requires him, the animals are always the size that the plot requires them to be. It's amazingly inconsistent. Although I will note that Redwall is the first book of the series (even though chronologically it's somewhere in the middle), and it's the only book that has a horse in it. I think Brian Jacques realised that horses were just too amazingly out of scale to the rest of the story, and they were never mentioned again. There's a couple of characters throughout the series who aren't really good or evil - Mossflower features an eagle who preys on both the bad guys and the good, but doesn't seem to do so out of particular malice, more because...well..he's an eagle. And that's another thing that doesn't make sense. Some of the characters have motivations which are more human, and other characters act far more like animals and don't have a morality, like the eagle. It's kind of embarrassing to compare Redwall to Watership Down, for instance, or even those slightly absurd "the prophecy!" David Clement Davies books about wolves and deer. They're lower on the anthropomorphism scale (the animals are basically...animals in their pure form, but can communicate with each other and sometimes with other species) but they really do use the animal's biology and social structure and relationship with humans as narrative tools. I haven't read the guardians owl series but I'm sure, as an animal loving kid, I would have loved it.
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Feb 23, 2015 10:05
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I really do have to suggest the Mouse Guard comics again. It's like Redwall if Redwall was way way better in just about every single way.Infamous Sphere posted:Much like how Matthias can do whatever the plot requires him, the animals are always the size that the plot requires them to be. It's amazingly inconsistent. 
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Feb 23, 2015 10:32
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boom boom boom posted:And Plinkett isn't bad, Plinkett's great! The analysis is pretty incisive and thought provoking, agreed. However, the basement rapist skits.... boom boom boom posted:Better than Fifty Shades of Gray and Breaking the Waves and all the other poo poo kids nowadays are into.  Don't you tell me, sonny, I'll tell you!
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Feb 23, 2015 12:38
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IronicDongz posted:I really do have to suggest the Mouse Guard comics again. It's like Redwall if Redwall was way way better in just about every single way. Well, I suppose you are an expert.
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Feb 23, 2015 12:46
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Infamous Sphere posted:Much like how Matthias can do whatever the plot requires him, the animals are always the size that the plot requires them to be. It's amazingly inconsistent. Although I will note that Redwall is the first book of the series (even though chronologically it's somewhere in the middle), and it's the only book that has a horse in it. I think Brian Jacques realised that horses were just too amazingly out of scale to the rest of the story, and they were never mentioned again. The first book had a few odd references to the real world; the horse and human-sized cart Cluny uses to transport his army, obviously, but I believe there's also a reference to how Cluny himself came from Portugal.
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Feb 23, 2015 13:17
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:The analysis is pretty incisive and thought provoking, agreed. However, the basement rapist skits.... I don't remember any rape in the Plinkett reviews.
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Feb 23, 2015 15:38
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I was watching my twitter feed for the Oscars and it was pretty funny how pissed off Bennett got whenever Birdman won anything especially Best Picture.
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Feb 23, 2015 15:55
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boom boom boom posted:I don't remember any rape in the Plinkett reviews. Oh good were back to this. Is obviously sexually charged serial killing skits preferred?
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Feb 23, 2015 16:08
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Before we go through that derail again, had to check RLM's twitter to see if they would take one last snipe at boyhood losing https://twitter.com/redlettermedia/status/569726440897277953 quote:Apparently not the best film of the 21st century so far...
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Feb 23, 2015 16:29
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Optimist with doubt posted:Oh good were back to this. Is obviously sexually charged serial killing skits preferred? I don't remember them being obviously sexually charged either. The guy's a serial killer, I'm not sure why that's not enough.
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Feb 23, 2015 16:39
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It's a pitch perfect impression of people who don't like the prequels.
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Feb 23, 2015 16:49
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I am kind of happy boyhood lost just for the red letter media video about it and it will be amazing.
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Feb 23, 2015 16:50
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All of a sudden a guy can't murder a woman without everybody thinking it's some sort of sex thing
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Feb 23, 2015 16:53
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