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Pork Pie Hat posted:As a brief aside from fees/nuke-chat, are the best choices for a DM style boot now they've moved to China Solovair or Grinders? I know we've had this discussion before but it has been a while and I've forgotten what the thread wisdom was. What's wrong with China?
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Feb 27, 2015 14:19
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Solovair make nice shoes but Idk why you'd want DM style when there are much better options
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Feb 27, 2015 14:22
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Pissflaps posted:What's wrong with China? I had some China made DMs and they were not very well made. I mean, there's loads wrong with China, but specifically, poorly manufactured shoes.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:24
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Pork Pie Hat posted:I can't believe we've gone a whole day without anyone even mentioning that Scotland got beaten by Afghanistan at the cricket World Cup. I'm waiting for the England-Afghanistan game tbh
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Feb 27, 2015 14:38
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Disinterested posted:If you think this is what GiP is like I have a nasty surprise for you. Never said you were roleplaying as GiP well. Needs more racism with your nuclear boners.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:54
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V. Illych L. posted:India/Pakistan's nuclear arsenals are both terrifying abominations that should be dismantled ASAP lest something very bad happen I don't know who doesn't agree with this. If you don't have proper command and control you need to not have the bomb, just for your own good. It's not making you any safer if effectively your bomb could be used without civilian approval. Not to mention the Pakistanis have an arrangement to ship bombs to Saudi if they ever ask for them.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:58
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EmptyVessel posted:Never said you were roleplaying as GiP well. Needs more racism with your nuclear boners. Exactly.
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Feb 27, 2015 14:58
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EmptyVessel posted:Never said you were roleplaying as GiP well. Needs more racism with your nuclear boners. Well since people have been talking about invading the french https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZUKEVU-TwM
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Feb 27, 2015 15:03
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Disinterested posted:Not to mention the Pakistanis have an arrangement to ship bombs to Saudi if they ever ask for them.
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Feb 27, 2015 15:09
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Renaissance Robot posted:Sounds like as close as you can get to balls out class war without erecting guillotines. Personally I would cling onto nuclear capability like death, because it's a useful stick to swing around if you need to, or at least a useful stick to glance suggestively at on occasion. Some nuclear submarines seem like almost the most cost effective way to do it really. Given that they're far, far better at the whole deterrant aspect than a massive standing arsenal is on an island the size of the UK. A land based method needs enough silos to not get taken out easily, whereas a few submarines can be effectively impervious to any first strike and still gently caress up whoever did it. The thinking behind it is essentially a nation-sized deadman switch on nuclear Armageddon. Which seems like a useful thing to have. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 27, 2015 15:15
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OwlFancier posted:The thinking behind it is essentially a nation-sized deadman switch on nuclear Armageddon. Who the gently caress is going to nuke us e: You know what else is useful to have? Doctors
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Feb 27, 2015 15:28
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The only thing worse than nuclear war is nuclear warchat. At least nuclear war ends.
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Feb 27, 2015 15:33
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Nah, it's useful to identify those who are committed to preserving Thatcher's legacy, for future reference. Hell, they're even using the same anti-French argument given by one of her few supporters at the time.
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Feb 27, 2015 15:42
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Regarde Aduck posted:
that there is no difference in our threat to being invaded by a nuclear power with or without Trident it's not difficult.
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Feb 27, 2015 15:47
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Anyone arguing the cuban missile crisis please note the only reason it was ever more than a political stareoff was because Dr Strangelove is based on a true story and Americans are loving mental all the time, every time.
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Feb 27, 2015 15:53
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Boing posted:Who the gently caress is going to nuke us The Benevolent Supreme Communist Democracy of North Korea in a alternative univerise where North Korea is actually a credible threat. Boing posted:e: You know what else is useful to have? Doctors Nah. I still prefer that we use that money to create Mechs. Pork Pie Hat posted:I can't believe we've gone a whole day without anyone even mentioning that Scotland got beaten by Afghanistan at the cricket World Cup. Scotland sucks at sports and we know it. Extreme0 fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 27, 2015 16:22
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Disinterested posted:MAD works. It's as simple as that.
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Feb 27, 2015 16:35
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Yeah I'm sure no-one nuts will ever gain power in a currently nuclear state. Hey look the goalposts moved.
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Feb 27, 2015 16:37
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Yeah I'm sure no-one nuts will ever gain power in a currently nuclear state. In a world where nuclear weapons have been eradicated, what's to stop this post-nuclear state nut from building one?
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Feb 27, 2015 16:52
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Boing posted:Who the gently caress is going to nuke us Which we could help pay for by not conducting stupid wars in the middle east. Security for the UK is good, destabilizing other nations is bad. Of all the stupid poo poo the military spends money on, maintaining a token but effective nuclear force seems like the least stupid. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 27, 2015 16:52
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Fees chat prompted me to check my balance on my student loan. 8 months to go and I'm all paid off  People need to bootstrap themselves into having started university before top up fees, like I did.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:01
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I've never bothered checking mine but I imagine gently caress all has been paid off
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Feb 27, 2015 17:05
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They send me a nice letter every year to let me know I still owe them the 11k or so I borrowed.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:17
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I don't get the whole student fees debate really. They're not real loans in any way and to be honest I might as well owe the SLC however much in monopoly funbucks. I have literally not even checked my account since I graduated and never intend to.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:20
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ThomasPaine posted:I don't get the whole student fees debate really. They're not real loans in any way and to be honest I might as well owe the SLC however much in monopoly funbucks. I have literally not even checked my account since I graduated and never intend to. Well there is a slight issue that if they are truly intended to be unrepayable, it's going to be wonderful fun in 40-60 years time when the SLC starts demanding however much money off the government in unrepaid loans, or alternatively, we have whatever problems ensue from people defaulting on their loans en-masse. Tuition fees are extremely prohibitive, and student loans as a solution to that are a farce, because if the student loans are inconsequential then tuition fees wouldn't be charged, the money has to come from somewhere. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 27, 2015 17:34
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OwlFancier posted:Well there is a slight issue that if they are truly intended to be unrepayable, it's going to be wonderful fun in 40-60 years time when the SLC starts demanding however much money off the government in unrepaid loans, or alternatively, we have whatever problems ensue from people defaulting on their loans en-masse. Yep, it's a terrible system. I'm not disputing that. But as loans they're utterly painless and I always get a little annoyed when the media misrepresents the issue by declaring STUDENTS HAVE ALL THE DEBT. I mean yes they do in a way but not really. I'm always incredulous at people who say they 'wanted to go to uni but didn't want to be saddled with the debt' as if post-graduation it's all bailiffs knocking your door down and taking your cat.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:39
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ThomasPaine posted:Yep, it's a terrible system. I'm not disputing that. But as loans they're utterly painless and I always get a little annoyed when the media misrepresents the issue by declaring STUDENTS HAVE ALL THE DEBT. I mean yes they do in a way but not really. I'm always incredulous at people who say they 'wanted to go to uni but didn't want to be saddled with the debt' as if post-graduation it's all bailiffs knocking your door down and taking your cat. It won't affect you personally, probably, unless the government finds some way of altering the conditions of the loan post-hoc which would be fairly terrifying, but it's not a sustainable solution. And the debt is going to bite somebody in the arse somewhere down the line, just in several decades when the government than established the policy will all be dead from too much child buggering.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:42
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Surely those who never pay them back are the minority though ?
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Feb 27, 2015 17:44
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I just checked mine. They only update it at the end of every tax year - wtf? I've still got about 12k left, after I take off what I've paid since April last year. At this rate I'll still be paying it into my 30s 
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Feb 27, 2015 17:47
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I have a jobcenter thing where i need photo ID The only photo ID I have is an expired passport. They should accept that, right?
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Feb 27, 2015 17:57
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I'm not sure if this calculator is accurate, but if it is then basically if you had a 3 year course and you immediately leave university and find a £25,000 job and keep that job indefinitely while having your pay rising to £50,000 then yeah you'll pay back your loan in 24 years. If you had a 4 year course then there's basically no chance unless you're going into a very highly paid field.
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Feb 27, 2015 17:58
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Hijo Del Helmsley posted:I have a jobcenter thing where i need photo ID You know nothing, Jon Snow. (By which I mean no, they won't. Unless they don't notice. Which they might not.)
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Feb 27, 2015 18:00
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I'm 25 and last year started a new job earning around £15k so am now paying back my loans at a rate of about seventeen pence per year. Don't really care, though.
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Feb 27, 2015 18:18
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Hijo Del Helmsley posted:I have a jobcenter thing where i need photo ID They probably will as long as you can be recognised from the photo.
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Feb 27, 2015 19:09
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Part of the problem with student loans is that the maintenance loan doesn't even cover rent basically anywhere any more so I bet you have a moderately high number of people who drop out of uni after 2-3 years depending on their course due to parents losing jobs or whatever who suddenly have £30k debt and no degree to show for it. Even if it isn't like a real loan its still an issue. Of course increasing the maintenance loan just means people end up in even more debt I'm unfamiliar if there are systems in place for getting grants to students who this happens to or if they'd be enough though
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Feb 27, 2015 19:32
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March will be my last payment on my student loans that I got from 95-99. I was the last year of the government grant, so was actually PAID money to goto uni in the UK. Get your mind around that. So my overall total isn't as high as you young 'un's, I pity my brother who will never be able to pay his off until next decade assuming nothing changes.
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Feb 27, 2015 19:37
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Bozza posted:Fees chat prompted me to check my balance on my student loan. 8 months to go and I'm all paid off Bootstrap yourself into living on the Isle of Man. No fees for UK universities, and I believe they even have grants, although that may have stopped. You also (used to, at least) get an extra £500 a year if you go to Liverpool, because they don't like people going too far away and getting exposed to dangerous modern influences. fake edit: I just checked, and there's been a ~£2500 student contribution to the tuition fees since 2010. You can get a government loan to cover it though. Basic grant is £4500 per year, or more if you go to London.
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Feb 27, 2015 20:03
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My current >200 quid a month payments have got me to dip just under the 40k barrier last august  Dropping fees to 6k is a fairly savvy move in the long term. Because so few people will earn enough over their careers to pay the whole thing back the last 3k of the tuition fee is effectively subsidised by the government anyway
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Feb 27, 2015 20:03
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That's all true enough (as are the arguments that this is effectively a graduate tax, albeit a fairly lovely one), but I always worry that the people most likely to be scared off university by DEBT are people from poorer backgrounds, who are going to have a very different view of being thousands of pounds in debt than someone from a family that sees debt as a mortgage plus a handy way to get a new car every couple of years. Or maybe that's a bit patronizing, I dunno.
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Feb 27, 2015 20:12
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I don't think poor people are strangers to debt.
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Feb 27, 2015 20:14
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