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I'd just like to say that I like Tiggum. I don't care much for the things he says but I like him. I could read you guys arguing with him all day long. Anyway, Dragonball Xenoverse is fun. It has a few minor annoyances though, like how the game throws me out in some lovely arena instead of near the quest counter while I'm farming dudes. And the RNG. Some missions have hard to beat optional goals that result in extra fights that drop the stuff you want. Except even if you complete the goal, there's only a small chance you'll actually activate the encounter. Because gently caress you. I like the game though. I got to beat up a five year old and his dad.
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Mar 2, 2015 07:20
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Tiggum posted:Where do people even get this idea? Skyrim is not like that. Skyrim isn't, which is one of its major flaws, but the previous Elder Scrolls games were. Morrowind especially was huge on it being your experience. That you aren't being put in someone else's shoes and given a bit of control over how they respond, you're playing a character that you created and playing it your way. It's the reason that Elder Scrolls protagonists have absolutely no stated background, because it's not their place to tell you what your character's like. Skyrim was really the only Elder Scrolls game that declared that your character is actually someone special (disregarding stuff regarding CHIM, of course). Morrowind might have you play part in a prophecy, but it's pretty clear that you're only in that position because you're the schmuck that bumbled in at a convenient time and didn't get himself killed. You're not even the Chosen One in Oblivion, you're some guy that helps the Chosen One, a role you were given solely because of a clerical error. Skyrim's the odd one out, the only one that actually declares you to be someone special, rather than letting you decide that yourself. You might be a loving idiot, Tiggum, but you've stumbled onto a good point here. Excepting spinoffs, which I can't speak for, Skyrim is the only Elder Scrolls game that declares you to be anything more than Some Random rear end in a top hat. I feel like a lot of Skyrim's problems can link back to the root cause of this one: Bethesda over-focused on what they wanted to do. They seemed to design the entire game with a specific sort of player in mind, a far more defined experience than the previous games. And that's actually not a good idea for Elder Scrolls games, because of how much they owe to that history of self-defined gaming. A lot of people are going to fall outside of that intended playstyle, and every time they get faced with the fact that their character's not facing the racial treatment they probably should be, every time the main quest forces them into a guild questline that doesn't match what their character is, every time they realize that magic is poorly-balanced compared to melee combat, it reflects badly on the game. It's the same problem Rockstar is facing. They want to make a more focused game, but they're working on the vanguard of a very player-powered genre.
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Mar 2, 2015 07:22
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For the love of whatever go ahead and put Tiggum on ignore and move the gently caress on. This 'conversation' wasn't fun to read the first time it happened, much less so the twentieth.
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Mar 2, 2015 07:30
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Tiggum posted:Where do people even get this idea? Skyrim is not like that. I had a similar dilemma with buying a kindle recently. I smashed my old kindle in a car door, and it broke but good. I loved that kindle, and I loved the buttons on the side to scroll through the pages. I went to amazon to replace it, but now they just make them without buttons; they're all touch screens. So now my choice is to either not get one or get one and bitch about the buttons I don't have. I know what I'm buying, but I also know that I'm missing what I've come to love from the product. 
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Mar 2, 2015 07:31
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Captain Lavender posted:I had a similar dilemma with buying a kindle recently. I smashed my old kindle in a car door, and it broke but good. I loved that kindle, and I loved the buttons on the side to scroll through the pages. You could always
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Mar 2, 2015 07:37
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:I always love stories about parents playing video games. My dad got really into Mario 64 with me (my first game - didn't have any consoles or w/e until I was 6) and I remember him getting really into it. Like, we both took it in turns trying to beat the final boss and failing, until one morning I got up before school and wandered downstairs to find him sitting in the study with a huge mug of coffee feverishly attacking Bowser and going "I got the bastard, son, I finally got him". It was great! And then he had a heart attack a few days later but he beat Bowser so whatever. I always like them, too. My mam, born 1957, beat every PS1 Tomb Raider, F.E.A.R with all the expansions, the Suffering and both No One Lives Forevers. I vividly remember being off ill on bank holiday while my parents took turns trying to get through the London levels of Tomb Raider 3. My mam is the best. EmmyOk posted:They should hardly change it for what you admit is a small market? I never had trouble hitting them, granted I'm in my early 20s and not a game developer. I wonder if this will change in coming decades, my Dad used to play any shooter going but recommendations of Batman and Portal are now met with 'Son, I'd love to, but I have the reactions of a 58 year old.' Specialist 'old' difficulty coming in the next 15 years.
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Mar 2, 2015 13:15
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Tiggum posted:Where do people even get this idea? Skyrim is not like that. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wujJnlsJh4&t=57s Skyrim half-assedly pays lip service to this in its main quest. (also the rest of that video fits in this thread nicely).
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Mar 2, 2015 13:37
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khwarezm posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wujJnlsJh4&t=57s This guy does great at articulating all the points I was trying to get to. Morrowind knows what it is; Skyrim's pretending to be something else. While he only mentioned it once in passing, and not positively at that, I think Oblivion deserves a bit of props on this one. If Skyrim was in denial, Oblivion was just confused, but it understood where its strengths should be. It paces the main quest better, understanding that you're gonna gently caress off and do something else at some point and not pretending that any of what's going on is urgent. Oblivion handles the actual resolution better, too. It might have a lot of the other issues that Skyrim's had, but at least when you finished the quest, the entire reason you did the quest in the first place got resolved. You set on the main quest in Skyrim to deal with the dragon attacks, but those don't stop once you beat Alduin. All you did was save a realm that was entirely disconnected from the one you spent the rest of the game in, that you only learned was even in danger (or existed) right before you saved it.
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Mar 2, 2015 14:11
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:I always love stories about parents playing video games. On break from college years and years ago, I got called over by my neighbor to set up their new computer. The retailer threw in a joystick, few games for the kids, and some other programs as a bonus for shopping local. Among them was Terminal Velocity, a really fun arcadey flight combat sim. My neighbors' kids were running around in circles yelling excitedly as they watched the progress bar crawl across the screen: "IT LOOKS SO COOL!" When it was done, they went nuts and were fighting over who got to play first. Their mom said to make it fair so nobody hogged it, they'd each play for ten minutes, and if someone else wanted a turn, he had to hand it over. I watched the first couple cycles while I chatted with the adults, and we were all shocked when mom (a nice gal but a total square who'd seemingly never had a minute of fun in her life) said she wanted a turn. We watched in awe as she got really into the game, laughing as she blew up enemies or evaded pursuers. Then, she missed a guy as he flew by and blew up a tree instead. "OH MY GOD! I JUST BLEW UP A TREE!" She turned to us slowly, as if she'd seen a ghost. "IS THAT OKAY!?!?!" /non-content I'm playing Dark Souls for the first time and hoooo boy that framerate in Blighttown. What the gently caress, FromSoft?
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Mar 2, 2015 14:41
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In Dying Light there are three different types of XP/levels and while it works for a while the whole system kind of falls apart by the middle of the game. Its broken down into Survivor (which you get from doing quests and supply drops) Agility (from running around the environment) and Power (from killing enemies.) The problem is how much Survivor and Power XP scales to where you are in the game but Agility doesn't. You'll end up getting 400-500 XP for killing an enemy or 10,000 for completing a quest but still be getting 5-10 for climbing a building.
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Mar 2, 2015 14:41
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On the topic of parents playing video games... When I was really really little, like, 3, my mom got a SNES with Final Fantasy and Super Mario World. I used to say I'd want to play, so she'd give me a controller that wasn't plugged in and then I'd think I was playing while she was kicking rear end and taking names. She still loves Mario to this day.
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Mar 2, 2015 15:00
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Regarding parent chat: How many of us are big gamers and are also parents. If we play our cards right WE could be the cool parents! Tiggum is actually acting like Clarence Thomas. He refuses to see the context in which the games are marketed, and how they have historically behaved. Even if everything you say is correct (I don't think it is), you're ignoring how it actually fits into the narrative. TES games let you customize literally every aspect of your character from the size of their ears to the type of fighter they are. The criticism on the quest mechanics of railroading you into being something you don't want to be is problematic and really I think bad game design. Like this, in the Fire Emblem game for the Nintendo DS you have a ton of classes. Later on at the end of the game it is REQUIRED that you have a magic user of a certain skill to have a certain item to defeat the boss. If you don't have any mages high enough level to do it, you're hosed. So you're FORCED to level up a mage, even if you don't want to use them. Thats an example of railroading that I think hurts the game. It tells the story the way they wanted to sure, but its not a very good way to introduce that mechanic when you HAVE to do it. Same thing with Skyrim. You don't get to "deal" with the mages, you HAVE to become one. You HAVE to join. You don't have to do this with other aspects of the game. The control is yanked away from the player; they no longer get to be their specific Dragonborne, they have to become the "magic man" as you say. Which is a valid thing to do, but not a good thing to do. It brings the game down. Also I don't know why people are mad about Tiggum chat, its literally what the thread is for I thought.
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Mar 2, 2015 17:01
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I'm convinced both of them are you, you turd-in-the-punchbowl
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Mar 2, 2015 17:03
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Jastiger posted:whatever all this was go jump in a lake
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Mar 2, 2015 17:19
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I don't know if it's just my touchscreen going wonky but the Fruit Ninja parts of class trials in Dangan Ronpa 2 keep misreading my slashes making it way way harder than it should be. Also I'm about 2 hours into Tales of Hearts R and the plot is just terrible. I'm not expecting Shakespeare or anything from my anime swordmans RPGs but there hasn't been a single event or cutscene that didn't make me cringe.
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Mar 2, 2015 17:24
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Jastiger posted:Also I don't know why people are mad about Tiggum chat, its literally what the thread is for I thought. No the thread is about things dragging games down. It's right in the title you  lord
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Mar 2, 2015 18:06
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Jastiger posted:Same thing with Skyrim. You don't get to "deal" with the mages, you HAVE to become one. You HAVE to join. You don't have to do this with other aspects of the game. The control is yanked away from the player; they no longer get to be their specific Dragonborne, they have to become the "magic man" as you say. Which is a valid thing to do, but not a good thing to do. It brings the game down. Once again, no you really don't. Stuff like the Companions or the Blades faction quests are better examples, where you absolutely cannot progress in any way without doing certain things (that a lot of people may not want to do) and there's no way to work around it. You either do it or ignore the questlines. Kimmalah has a new favorite as of 22:05 on Mar 2, 2015 |
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Mar 2, 2015 21:57
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Kimmalah posted:Once again, no you really don't. I'm having trouble parsing this. No you really don't what?
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Mar 2, 2015 22:29
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Jastiger posted:I'm having trouble parsing this. No you really don't what? "No you really don't" need to continue posting
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Mar 2, 2015 22:41
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Jastiger posted:I'm having trouble parsing this. No you really don't what? He's saying, no you really don't need to join the college, which is technically true because you can just go talk to the OTHER npc they will direct you to when you do join, skipping the college segment entirely. A similar example would be skipping the Galaxy News Radio quests in Fallout 3 because you talked to the Doctor at Rivet City before going to ask Three Dog where to get information about your Dad; Three Dog directs you to go talk to the doctor but since she's an NPC in the game world you can just go do that at any time.
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Mar 2, 2015 22:45
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GOTTA STAY FAI posted:"No you really don't" need to continue posting I don't understand why you're so hostile. Its on topic about what is bringing down Skyrim. CJacobs posted:He's saying, no you really don't need to join the college, which is technically true because you can just go talk to the OTHER npc they will direct you to when you do join, skipping the college segment entirely. A similar example would be skipping the Galaxy News Radio quests in Fallout 3 because you talked to the Doctor at Rivet City before going to ask Three Dog where to get information about your Dad; Three Dog directs you to go talk to the doctor but since she's an NPC in the game world you can just go do that at any time. Ah well that makes sense then. Content: Dragon Age: Inquisition I'm a rogue, why do I need to be super high level to pick the lowliest of locks! I feel like I"m locked out of tons of super awesome content because I can't pick locks. (in reality probably is just more crafting recipes)
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Mar 2, 2015 23:12
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Jastiger posted:Content: Dragon Age: Inquisition I'm a rogue, why do I need to be super high level to pick the lowliest of locks! I feel like I"m locked out of tons of super awesome content because I can't pick locks. (in reality probably is just more crafting recipes) If it's anything like DA:O there is a mod where you can just bash the lock open, alongside the titty and dog penis mods.
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Mar 2, 2015 23:18
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Jastiger posted:I don't understand why you're so hostile. Its on topic about what is bringing down Skyrim.
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Mar 2, 2015 23:33
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CJacobs posted:He's saying, no you really don't need to join the college, which is technically true because you can just go talk to the OTHER npc they will direct you to when you do join, skipping the college segment entirely. A similar example would be skipping the Galaxy News Radio quests in Fallout 3 because you talked to the Doctor at Rivet City before going to ask Three Dog where to get information about your Dad; Three Dog directs you to go talk to the doctor but since she's an NPC in the game world you can just go do that at any time. Only Skyrim's is a little more farfetched, because the doctor in Fallout is in one of the game's big cities, somewhere you would reasonably go if left to your own devices. The NPC in Skyrim, Septimus Signus, is in a cave tucked away in the most obscure corner of the map that you have no reason to ever go to otherwise. Skipping ahead in Fallout 3 requires exploration in a fairly natural direction. Skipping ahead in Skyrim requires either specific foreknowledge, or being so insanely over-explorative that you will find a small cave in a remote corner of the map with nothing else in it.
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Mar 3, 2015 00:27
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Oh so here's a thing that brings down skyrim that isn't this. That everyone's immortal. I mean, I'm the dragonborn right? I should be high king. It's just a hassle to open up the console, turn people off from being essential, then murdering them. Bonus points: you could also just murder the mages guild if everyone was mortal. No more mages.
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Mar 3, 2015 00:28
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Thing dragging down Skyrim and most modern sandbox games: it's a sandbox where you can't move anything because the developer likes it where it is and most of the toys are broken
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Mar 3, 2015 00:45
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Nuebot posted:Oh so here's a thing that brings down skyrim that isn't this. That everyone's immortal. I mean, I'm the dragonborn right? I should be high king. It's just a hassle to open up the console, turn people off from being essential, then murdering them. Yeah, this was my biggest gripe with Oblivion, and it's just gotten worse. I liked playing Morrowind, sometimes getting a bit too trigger-happy with random wanderers, and being told 'Dude, you screwed up the time-line. Reload, or be forever cursed to live with some quests broken'
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Mar 3, 2015 00:50
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Jastiger posted:Content: Dragon Age: Inquisition I'm a rogue, why do I need to be super high level to pick the lowliest of locks! I feel like I"m locked out of tons of super awesome content because I can't pick locks. (in reality probably is just more crafting recipes) You don't have to be super high-level, you just need to unlock the perk. Should be easy once you get a few agents. There's usually pretty decent stuff behind the locked doors. The thing that drags DAI down for me is the entire Winter Palace mission.
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Mar 3, 2015 00:55
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Crow Jane posted:You don't have to be super high-level, you just need to unlock the perk. Should be easy once you get a few agents. There's usually pretty decent stuff behind the locked doors. While it was honestly enjoyable the first time around I am not looking forward to doing it a second time. Unless I can intentionally gently caress it up and not get a game over.
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Mar 3, 2015 01:11
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As others have said (and it kind of applies to the discussion about skyrim and "roleplaying" versus railroading), the Winter Palace is kind of the Fade of DA:I.Who What Now posted:While it was honestly enjoyable the first time around I am not looking forward to doing it a second time. Unless I can intentionally gently caress it up and not get a game over. You can gently caress it up in the sense that when you get to the end you can decide who to gently caress over, and so long as you never hit 0 approval you can keep playing. For me, the biggest problem with it is there's very much a right and wrong way to get through the Winter Palace, and the right way is just "pick the middle dialogue option." If you pick the upper option, you are being too earnest, and lose points. If you pick the bottom option, you're being too aggressive, and lose points. Lose too many points and you lose the game. Your buffer is set by your race--all you need to do is not hit zero, but if you're playing the character the way the rest of the game encourages you too, it's entirely possible to enter a conversation chain, finish it, and immediately after being told to "enjoy the rest of the party" you are thrown out of it and the game is over. There are other things that can get you more points, but honestly they're not very fun either, and don't make nearly as much of an impact as just picking that button. A big part of the marketing and the rest of the game is that you can pick whatever option you want to portray the character you want (within those obvious limitations, of course--you are always the head of an organization dedicated to destroying a powerful adversary and his allies), so coming to a section where that's frankly discouraged is jarring and honestly plain boring. In context your character is just having to say whatever he needs to and having to adjust your "RP" for the sake of the mission is on its face not a bad idea, but the fact that pressing one button becomes the only "don't lose" solution is bad game design. It's like if you were playing Alpha Protocol and the "Bauer" and "Bourne" buttons could make you Game Over while the "Bond" button was the only one allowed. marshmallow creep has a new favorite as of 01:18 on Mar 3, 2015 |
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Mar 3, 2015 01:11
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Thing dragging down most Skyrim and most open-world sandbox rpgs: just completely garbage mechanics. Sure, I could engage with all these cool sub-systems and role-playing options, but all that would get me is more floaty, tedious combat. None of these games have anything approaching "good" combat mechanics.
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Mar 3, 2015 01:52
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I've said it before and I'll say it again: Kingdoms of Amalur. The game was a weird mess in a lot of ways, but the combat was really solid.
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Mar 3, 2015 01:55
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I've played that game. The combat was still really boring and bad. It only stood out because of the incompetence of its peers imo. Although, tbf I only tried playing as a wizard.
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Mar 3, 2015 02:00
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Trick Question posted:I've played that game. The combat was still really boring and bad. It only stood out because of the incompetence of its peers imo.
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Mar 3, 2015 02:02
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Trick Question posted:Thing dragging down most Skyrim and most open-world sandbox rpgs: just completely garbage mechanics. Sure, I could engage with all these cool sub-systems and role-playing options, but all that would get me is more floaty, tedious combat. None of these games have anything approaching "good" combat mechanics. e: I thought the shooting in FO3/FO:NV was poo poo (and it is a huge part of why I never finished FO:NV), but less bad than Skyrim's combat. Elysiume has a new favorite as of 03:00 on Mar 3, 2015 |
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Mar 3, 2015 02:47
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FactsAreUseless posted:Did you prefer the content in the northern or southern half of the map? I didn't even acknowledge Falkreath, and Riften is too backwards for this Dragonborn. Better off without em. FactsAreUseless posted:I've said it before and I'll say it again: Kingdoms of Amalur. The game was a weird mess in a lot of ways, but the combat was really solid. The combat was fun, and other games should take the queue to make all mixes viable. But as someone else said, it only stood out because nothing else was really in the same league.
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Mar 3, 2015 05:33
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I played Skyrim for north of 150 hours on one file and I don't think I ever set foot in Falkreath. I remember trundling all the way from the east to the west for some quest and getting a prompt that I discovered Falkreath. I hesitated for a moment and just turned elsewhere and walked away because I was loaded with quests at the moment and I knew if I went in some jerk was going ask me to help tie his shoes. Good game. Lots of things I like about it, enough story related things that drag it down. I'm not sure why the stormcloaks would ever let me, a khajiit, join their ranks. I feel like Bethesda shouldn't be afraid to lock away content based on the kind of character you're playing. I dunno. I never did finish the main quest.
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Mar 3, 2015 06:16
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Kaubocks posted:I played Skyrim for north of 150 hours on one file and I don't think I ever set foot in Falkreath. I remember trundling all the way from the east to the west for some quest and getting a prompt that I discovered Falkreath. I hesitated for a moment and just turned elsewhere and walked away because I was loaded with quests at the moment and I knew if I went in some jerk was going ask me to help tie his shoes. ACTUALLY, 
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Mar 3, 2015 06:33
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All these posts complaining about Skyrim and nobody posting about the worst one (OK the lackluster combat is high up there too): The terrible UI Want to drink a potion? Scroll through this list! Want to activate a spell? Navigate this menu! want to switch between two different sets of dual wielded weapons? well gently caress you!
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Mar 3, 2015 07:18
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Away all Goats posted:All these posts complaining about Skyrim and nobody posting about the worst one (OK the lackluster combat is high up there too): The terrible UI I tried playing Morrowind on console and couldn't stand it for long enough to find Caius Cossades, tried playing Oblivion on console and couldn't stand it past Kvatch, bought Skyrim for PC and have like 860 hours on it. Mods and KBM make a massive difference for TES games.
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Mar 3, 2015 08:02
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