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oh are we on the "obama is no different than bush, bad things don't happen anywhere unless the us does them" kick?
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Mar 4, 2015 06:15
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I don't see what's smart about that. Iran has democratic institutions ready for a revamp. Saudi Arabia has a monarchy in an uneasy truce with a theocracy fueled by oil revenues, which are slowly dropping. Iran is the pro pick here. I think most people would prefer a strategic alliance with Iran over the one we have with the Saudis, frankly. Including the brass. You got equivalently bad regimes where one of 'em is competent and one of em is a weirdly baroque welfare state that uses its incredibly expensive military as a dumping ground/hobby club for bored, unemployable minor noblemen. It is too bad switching to the Iranians would make it incredibly difficult to maintain a decent working relationship with every non-saudi sunni regime in the ME
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Mar 4, 2015 06:15
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Raskolnikov38 posted:please tell me this part of a game It's marx madness.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:15
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Venom Snake posted:Bibi literally campaigned for Obama's replacement. That's some prime loving right there. How many Americans did he kill in the process? Are you reading yourself? Jesus loving Christ, get some loving perspective.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:15
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Volkerball posted:we're talking about a country that currently has soldiers and militias in syria and iraq slaughtering civilians and propping up dictatorial regimes, and that helped overthrow the government in yemen to set up another one. and that's just within the last few months. ksa like, gave bahrain money and gave guns to the islamic front. you're really teeing us up for a usa comparison here
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Mar 4, 2015 06:16
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Volkerball posted:oh are we on the "obama is no different than bush, bad things don't happen anywhere unless the us does them" kick? a nuclear iran would stabilize the middle east
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Mar 4, 2015 06:16
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Is this thread going to be the unliscensed basement fight club for other thread slapfights. ILL SEE YOU IN THE CHAT THREAD
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Mar 4, 2015 06:17
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lets here assume that volkerball, an idiot, believes that iran is Evil and will nuke Israel because Reasons which will never be explained
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Mar 4, 2015 06:17
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Volkerball posted:i don't think we should be friends with any sectarian government thats response to opposition politics is to kill everyone, personally Agreed, we must stop all support to Israel. Volkerball posted:oh are we on the "obama is no different than bush, bad things don't happen anywhere unless the us does them" kick? No, were on the "don't throw stones if you live in a glass house". I mean, funding TERRORISM!? Outrageous! *quietly sweeps the entire cold war under the rug*
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Mar 4, 2015 06:17
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cuba is still listed as a state sponsor of terrorism lol~
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Mar 4, 2015 06:18
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TEAYCHES posted:a nuclear iran would stabilize the middle east A successful deal with Iran will lead to stability without them having nukes. So it seems better than what you're... offering? Suggesting? I don't know. It sure as hell is better than Bibi's "we could get a better deal and everybody can have a pony." zoux posted:Is this thread going to be the unliscensed basement fight club for other thread slapfights. When hasn't it been? 
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Mar 4, 2015 06:18
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Volkerball posted:lmbo I'd be interested in hearing why you think I'm wrong. 
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Mar 4, 2015 06:18
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Badger of Basra posted:cuba is still listed as a state sponsor of terrorism lol~ Is that terrorism Baseball-related?
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Mar 4, 2015 06:18
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zoux posted:Is this thread going to be the unliscensed basement fight club for other thread slapfights. *pushes over your books*
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Mar 4, 2015 06:18
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TEAYCHES posted:a nuclear iran would stabilize the middle east yes giving iran an even bigger dick to swing with it as it fucks around in the disasters the US left will surely stabilize the region
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Mar 4, 2015 06:19
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Absurd Alhazred posted:How many Americans did he kill in the process? Are you reading yourself? Jesus loving Christ, get some loving perspective. Israel has killed more Americans than Iran has. I'm not saying Israel is as bad as Iran, but Israel has no high ground to stand on if they want to talk about who is a bigger friend to the US. Iran at least knows that they can't gently caress with us because they are 10 steps away from an Invasion with all the chickenhawks in congress.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:19
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TEAYCHES posted:lets here assume that volkerball, an idiot, believes that iran is Evil and will nuke Israel because Reasons which will never be explained Iran is Lawful Evil, dumb people just think it's Chaotic Evil. (Cefte thinks it's Lawful Good because Cefte is a silly-billy)
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Mar 4, 2015 06:19
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someone should tell bibi not to let the perfect be the enemy of the good, doesn't he know anything about modern democrats
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Mar 4, 2015 06:19
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TEAYCHES posted:lets here assume that volkerball, an idiot, believes that iran is Evil and will nuke Israel because Reasons which will never be explained i don't think they'll do anything to israel. the issue to me is that the left and dems are moving towards this reconciliation with iran idea, and it's largely based around a really stupid premise: that iran is cool and good, and if we be friendly to them, cool and good things will happen. we can totally crush terrorist groups who rose up specifically over oppression from iran and its proxies by just helping iran oppress them harder. a sustainable, long term solution that will in no way end poorly.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:20
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Badger of Basra posted:cuba is still listed as a state sponsor of terrorism lol~ general staff wonks still salty over Angola
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Mar 4, 2015 06:21
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Volkerball posted:i don't think they'll do anything to israel. the issue to me is that the left and dems are moving towards this reconciliation with iran idea, and it's largely based around a really stupid premise: that iran is cool and good Bzzzzt, wrong. It's based around the idea that you can do business with them. Not that we've ever done business with an evil regime ever in the past no sir.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:21
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grauniad headline: Are all atheists simply angry, or just the ones to whom you're listening? who loving let that go through
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Mar 4, 2015 06:21
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Volkerball posted:i don't think they'll do anything to israel. the issue to me is that the left and dems are moving towards this reconciliation with iran idea, and it's largely based around a really stupid premise: that iran is cool and good, and if we be friendly to them, cool and good things will happen. we can totally crush terrorist groups who rose up specifically over oppression from iran and its proxies by just helping iran oppress them harder. a sustainable, long term solution that will in no way end poorly. Our current iran strategy is a failure, im for detente
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Mar 4, 2015 06:21
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Raskolnikov38 posted:yes giving iran an even bigger dick to swing with it as it fucks around in the disasters the US left will surely stabilize the region because iran is a natural regional power and has have a sphere of influence like any other powerful nation on this dumbass world
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Mar 4, 2015 06:22
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People want to reconcile with Iran because the Cold War is over and acting like we have some sort of obligation to hate certain countries is loving stupid.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:22
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"the ones to whom you're listening"????????
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Mar 4, 2015 06:22
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Volkerball posted:i don't think they'll do anything to israel. the issue to me is that the left and dems are moving towards this reconciliation with iran idea, and it's largely based around a really stupid premise: that iran is cool and good, and if we be friendly to them, cool and good things will happen. we can totally crush terrorist groups who rose up specifically over oppression from iran and its proxies by just helping iran oppress them harder. a sustainable, long term solution that will in no way end poorly. confronting the iranians with hostility and militarism, going with the israelis and assuming iranians are awful villains in the bibi sense, that is the worst possible outcome for nation that is not that
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Mar 4, 2015 06:23
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Majorian posted:Bzzzzt, wrong. do you support doing business with evil regimes, or is it cool to just be like "well, we've done it before, so it's w/e"
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Mar 4, 2015 06:23
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TEAYCHES posted:because iran is a natural regional power and has have a sphere of influence like any other powerful nation on this dumbass world You probably shouldn't post in the Eastern Europe thread, people there see the phrase "sphere of influence" as a profanity.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:23
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I don't really believe in evil regimes
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Mar 4, 2015 06:23
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Venom Snake posted:Israel has killed more Americans than Iran has.  quote:I'm not saying Israel is as bad as Iran, but Israel has no high ground to stand on if they want to talk about who is a bigger friend to the US. Iran at least knows that they can't gently caress with us because they are 10 steps away from an Invasion with all the chickenhawks in congress. So you're saying Iran is better because it's been terrorized more? The policy you're pushing is for the US to be an equal-opportunity terrorizer, then?
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Mar 4, 2015 06:24
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zoux posted:I don't really believe in evil regimes I mean except israel
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Mar 4, 2015 06:25
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if the Iranians are not developing nukes, they should, because if they don't the United States and Israel might consider a war.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:26
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Volkerball posted:do you support doing business with evil regimes, or is it cool to just be like "well, we've done it before, so it's w/e" Who cares if they are evil, yeah obviously the solution to an evil regime is to isolate it and sanction it into oblivion, because the Korea's have been united for 50 years now. You can work with a government with out directly endorsing it's actions. You can also use said new found relations to push the country in a better direction.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:26
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Volkerball posted:do you support doing business with evil regimes, or is it cool to just be like "well, we've done it before, so it's w/e" We are doing business with Saudi Arabia. The way in which we are doing business with them gives them 0 motivation to change. Any attempt at liberalization would collapse their whole social structure. Meanwhile, Iran has democratic institutions. It has regular elections, and term limits. Some autocrats stay in power, but they can be pushed back into a Supreme Court-like role with the appropriate public pressure. They have better potential to become a democracy than Saudi Arabia does. Their economy is also much more diverse, and one part of the push towards nuclear power is to reduce dependence on oil. As Middle Eastern partners stand, they're a good choice.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:26
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Mar 4, 2015 06:27
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Obama couldn't even say mean things to Maliki when he was purging opposition politicians. Starting a war with Iran is something he is not capable of doing.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:27
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TEAYCHES posted:if the Iranians are not developing nukes, they should, because if they don't the United States and Israel might consider a war. we must secure the existence of our nukes and a future for persian children
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Mar 4, 2015 06:27
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Absurd Alhazred posted:
No, I'm saying that Iran doesn't gently caress with the US because Iran isn't actually run by insane lunatics like Bibi would have you believe.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:27
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Let's stop fighting and party like it's page 1999 tonight.
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Mar 4, 2015 06:27
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